posted on November 7, 2000 06:30:38 AM new
I use personal shopper to notify me when certain items are listed for sale. Today I received a notice for an item and clicked on the link and instead of viewing the item page, I received this message:
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Dear User:
Unfortunately, access to this particular category or item has been blocked due to legal restrictions in your home country. Based on our discussions with concerned government agencies and eBay community members, we have taken these steps to reduce the chance of inappropriate items being displayed. Regrettably, in some cases this policy may prevent users from accessing items that do not violate the law. At this time, we are working on less restrictive alternatives. Please accept our apologies for any inconvenience this may cause you, and we hope you may find other items of interest on eBay.
Thank You.
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I am in Canada, so I have to assume that the Canadian government has forced eBay to do this? Or what else? This is unsettling...
The item is a stamp from World War 2. I am not sure exactly what it is because I can not access it...
And I am not sure if I can post the item number. I can not notify the seller because I can not access the item listing... (Moderator ... input???)
So, anyone else in Canada (or elsewhere?) stumbled on this before?
posted on November 7, 2000 07:01:41 AM new
Most likely a Nazi item, and most likely a SNAFU on eBay's part. Sounds like German users are blocked from certain items, but this is the first I've heard about Canada being on the censorship list?
posted on November 7, 2000 08:06:38 AM new
I very much doubt this censorship has anything to do with a ruling by the Canadian government. As a matter of fact, I doubt our government is even aware that eBay exists - they're still fighting over issues that were 'current' 100 years ago
posted on November 7, 2000 08:26:44 AM new
Hello cimfra
This is eBays feeble attempt to censor Nazi realted items from being displayed in Germany, France, and possibly Great Britain.
Do you have your browser set to display the language character sets of either German, Russian, or French?
If you will delete or turn off any of the character sets mentioned above and reset your browser you will find that you will have access to the 4078 category listings without a problem.
Another dumb move by eBay to protect itself from International lawsuits. Gives me flashbacks several months ago when eBay forbid the listing of guns.
When eBay forbid the listing of Guns, sellers and buyers flocked over to several Niche or Vertical auction sites that specialized in guns and ammo.
It holds true with the Nazi items. It will be just a matter of time before eBay bans Nazi items. Suggest that German Militaria collectors take a serious look and migrate over to Militaria Collectibles Auction Haus. They can be found at http://www.Militaria-collectibles.com
They do not have International restrictions and will not allow Germany, France, or any other country to control their site or the Internet.
posted on November 7, 2000 08:40:17 AM new
Good advice tolz. I don't think it's fair to lump German militaria collectors with Nazis or what happened over 50 years ago. Personally, I'd love to get my hands on a flyable BF-109 with Swasticas painted on the wings --- and this has nothing to do with what it was designed for
I wonder when eBay will start banning all those great Tamiya plastic kits of German WWII (The Big One) tanks and guns ...
posted on November 7, 2000 09:39:36 AM new
Thanks for your reply tolz
I am French but I live in Canada. My browser is indeed set to French characters as default. That must be the reason...
Strange way to restrict access to eBay.
I am NOT a Nazi item collector. The item came out through keywords search with personal shopper. But even then, I truly find that amazing that restriction would be based on language...
posted on November 7, 2000 10:29:26 AM new
CIMFRA: "I truly find that amazing that restriction would be based on language..."
Why? Quebec is king at restricting all kinds of things based on language...
Canada has some of the toughest anti-hate laws in the world. There are illegal words when spoken in public, one may go to jail. I qualify the statement... they also must be spoken with intent on causing trouble.
As for Germany, they are in a difficult position when it comes to reminders of the past and German law prohibits the Swastika from being shown.
If this is eBay's way of showing cultural sensitivity, fine but It probably has more to do with legal liability and eBay's future in Europe.
posted on November 7, 2000 10:50:39 AM new
Hello genie9
The restrictions are not based on a language. They are based on a Geographical area. EBay has coded restrictions based on browsers and operating systems that use French and German language. If the users will apply the steps outlined above, they can still access the 4078 categories.
You are correct, as eBay moves into certain International segments, they will have to abide by the laws of other countries to avoid legal problems.
posted on November 7, 2000 10:54:31 AM new
But, if eBay says they don't (can't) police their site and they cannot be held liable for items that are bought and sold there ("we're only a venue", why would they be concerned about liability at all? Could it be that one of the major stockholders has a personal hangup about these militaria collectables?
PS - genie9 ... a >slight< exageration there about Canada and it's different cultures ... I suggest you may want to retract that statement before the 'you know what' hits the fan
posted on November 7, 2000 03:13:18 PM newif eBay says they don't (can't) police their site and they cannot be held liable for items that are bought and sold there ("we're only a venue" ), why would they be concerned about liability at all?
I think it's kind of like the local flea market knowingly allowing a vendor to sell knockoff goods (copyright infringement). At least in these parts, liability's pretty clear.
posted on November 8, 2000 04:51:28 AM new
Right on HCQ, but eBay doesn't see it that way. It has been proven time and time again that eBay ignores infringing items even after they have been notifed. They would rather turtle into their "we're only a venue" shell than upset a power seller
posted on November 8, 2000 05:17:22 AM new
"German law prohibits the Swastika from being shown."
Makes no sense, of course, when the swastika appears on an American Indian artifact or as a 1920s "good luck club" symbol. Unfortunately some people think that even these are Nazi related (see 483311988).
posted on November 8, 2000 08:32:05 AM new
I want to provide some Information regarding teh situation in Germany.
I am Ebay powerseller dealing with German stamps. The situation that I get no acess to ebays German stamp section lasts since last Friday. I wrote several Emails to the customer suppost and received one response. In this response they didnīt give me any explication regarding this step, but asked me for some techical issues regarding my PC system software and so on. In the newsboard (chat/policies/useragreement)there is also an comment by a member of Ebays customer support. He considered this step should be an error. Although I sent two days ago already an answer regarding the technical questions Ebay asked for, the situation hasnīt changed. Since Friday a few hours German stamps have been accessable, bur since Monday evening European time the entire stamp and coin section Germany is blocked permanently. I can view my own items and I canīt receive bids on it. First I thought it would be blocked worldwide, since I found also message from US and Canandian users who could not view items. That is totally inacceptable and I am sure itīs unlawful. I am convinced it is Ebays own law.
First of all Ebay charged itīs sellers with insertion fees, but will loose many bidders. As far as I know there are no restrictions regarding Nazi era stamps in US law.
That none acess policy- made without any announcements and comments- is not only regarding in Ebays opinion "questionable WWII stamps" but the entire German stamp section. And thatīs not acceptable. Nobody would turn off electricity in a big building if one or two persons would have not paid their bills. But thatīs what Ebay is doing with German stamps and coins.
I canīt believe it, since exactly the same stamp items of the WWII era can be sold without any restriction in Germany at Ebay Germany too but not at Ebay com.
In all major German stamp auction houses in Germany you can buy and sell 3rd Reich stamps withiout any problems. There are dozens of stamps included in the image parts of those catalogues showing eagle and swastica. I studied already the text of German §86,86A and several judgements. There is no case registered which would prohibit stamp selling activities of this era. You can offer also "real Propagandmaterial" for instance colour cards and books of this time
but you must mention and publish the conditions of German law §86,86A The buyer is obligated in this case to use the items only for historical and scientifical purposes.
Thatīs the situation, but Ebay is obviously creating its own law. Would appreciate a mail within this dicussion forum if my auctions are accessable in the US or in Canada or not, because Ebay gave me no response to this question.
Thanks for your help
posted on November 8, 2000 09:12:12 AM new
mgk - I am seeing your stamps on my PC (Canada). I would bid to see if that works, but I am not a stamp collector
I would, however, like to bid on some genuine Cuban cigars, but I seem to recall hearing somehere that an organization somewhat larger than eBay (so far anyway) has a problem with that too
Many years ago when I dabbled in plastic modelling, I recall some kits coming out of Germany that did not have authentic swastica decals included. I was able to find sheets of these in the USA to complete my projects. Although this symbol conjures up all kinds of bad memories about what it stood for 60 years ago, I do not believe it's use for military memorablia should be censored by anyone.
Anyway, good luck to all you folks who collect Nazi memorablia - I sincerely hope you are able to find what you want ...
posted on November 8, 2000 09:17:45 AM new
Hi, I'm from Canada. I have a Swa**** Stamp to sell on eB** but somehow my de*-*** are all be*** delet** by the Cana***ian Gove****ent Detective Ag****! Help, they are *** to get me!
posted on November 8, 2000 09:59:41 AM new
Thanks for your friendly message and thanks for checking out if my auctions are acessable RB!
A few sentences regarding my business.
I am not considering myself beeing trader of Nazi Memorabilia, but stamp seller.
For my opinion itīs a part of German postal history. And here itīs only a small fraction. The market for stamps past 1950 is very weak, right here and also in Northern America, thatīs the only reason I prefer to sell stamps of the period of 1950 and before.
For me the Nazi era is also combined in my mind with genocid, racism, cruelty and horror, but nevertheless a part of German history which can not be erased.
But to ban stamp selling activities is ridicolous for me, since here in Germany - and I consider the Germans in the big majority to be sensitive in these questions-
nobody of the government or the public is caring about stamps and pictured swasticas on them. But ebays handle it as we in Germany are saying "like a mouse would be an elephant". They have my full support to ban out Neonazi activities, real Propagandistical material and so on, but I canīt understand their step to block acess to the entire German stamp section choiceless which era. As a swastica on a stamp would be a virus infecting people at once when viewing it.
As I told already it seems to be their own interpretation of German law and that message should make people making believe that their step would be a reaction on those national laws. But it is somehow strange to buy in the public those issues in Germany
and to be restricted at Ebay.
posted on November 8, 2000 02:45:46 PM new
I wish everyone in the stamp collecting arena the best of luck whatever is depicted on their stamps, to and from where ever they sell.
I extend this also to those who sell literature and historical documents that fall into these controversial areas. I collect literary works that were banned at one time or another, for various reasons from authors such as Miller, Nin, Joyce etc.
For accessing auctions from Canada~ I can access all auctions Ive pulled up so far, though I dont really have a particular interest in items with Swastika's on them and don't usually come across them.
, why would they be concerned about liability at all? Could it be that one of the major stockholders has a personal hangup about these militaria collectables?
