posted on July 9, 2002 12:56:30 PM new
Linda_K
Oh yes...those tin foil beannies. Didn't used to think they were needed here, but I'm beginning to believe they're a required item now.
posted on July 9, 2002 12:58:43 PM newBTW, to whoever said that $50-60,000 is barely a living wage in California...HOGWASH. Most can and do live quite well on much less. And I live incredibly comfortably on the $49,000 I make now
That's nice, Bunnicula. But you are unmarried, no family. Try paying health premiums and raising kids on it. Oh and I suppose you already own your own home? Have you checked the rental market and home prices lately?
posted on July 9, 2002 01:22:39 PM new
Now....don't you guys/gals go picking on cows. I love cows...some of the sweetest faces you'll ever see. We used to have four living on the acreage near us. They'd come to the fence and we'd feed and pet them. Somebody took them away to the slaughterhouse.
posted on July 9, 2002 01:23:59 PM new
LOL! When I posted I kept my fingers crossed and hoped that KRS would post right after me so that my cow would dump on him with each swish of his tail.
posted on July 9, 2002 01:32:41 PM new
stockticker
LOL! When I posted I kept my fingers crossed and hoped that KRS would post right after me so that my cow would dump on him with each swish of his tail.
"his tail?"
Repeat after me, cows are females (hers), bulls and steers are males (his).
posted on July 9, 2002 01:42:42 PM new
No krs, family health benefits aren't paid for by most departments. SOME departments pay 100% for the officer ONLY. Not his/her spouse or children. Most departments offer a "cafeteria style" health benefit package where a specific amount is given toward health care. After the employees premium, the remaining amount can be applied to family members. It's never enough to cover the spouse and children. CalPers recently announced a healthcare premium increase for next year of 25%! You think the City Employers are going absorb that cost in their next collectibe bargaining go rounds? Don't think so.
posted on July 9, 2002 01:51:37 PM new
Odd, your posted chart shows that the only department that does not pay for family health care is the City of Orange.
posted on July 9, 2002 02:01:11 PM new
No. You're not reading it correctly. The City of Orange does not offer "cafeteria style" health benefits. In other words, the healthcare ppremium portion paid by the city is for the employee ONLY. Any amount left over (if any) can't be used for dependents. It goes back to the city. If you read the chart carefully, you will see under "offer dependant health" that most departments "offer" these cafeteria style health benefits. Alpine appears to be the only city on the chart who offers 100% paid medical to dependants. It's probably through Kaiser.
posted on July 9, 2002 02:23:07 PM new
After all this the only thing I am sure of is KatyD should never be a cop. I can see she would slam krs on the hood and beat the snot out of him with her baton on sight.
posted on July 9, 2002 02:24:22 PM new
I was going to say 'isn't Kaiser operating down there?' because their plans for self or self and family are so attractively priced to employers that it would take a willfull act of denial for any city to NOT offer the package.
Almost every employment situation for police in the state of California is an attractive one if compared to the miserable state of the profession in many other major urban areas in the country, setting aside idyllic rural mayberrys.. It would seem to me that we would have the cream of the crop and so have a lower percentage of occurances such as this most recent one. Either that is not the case, or the publicity aroused by such things is far greater than in other places. Is it that episodes like this beating are such a common thing in places like NYC or Baltimore that they raise relatively little fuss for being a matter of course? I don't know. But the way things are now, the police in this state should bear an even higher responsibility if only because any errant behaviors will be more likely to be in the news. No police agency an suffer the loss of the public trust, nor can individual officers. Without that trust their own risk is increased as the example given by maui makes clear. Given that, why is there such a high level of tolerance amongst the police for the action of the bad boys? I would think that the people with the largest interest in rooting out such creeps would be the police themselves - right down to the line officer, the guy in the cars.
gravid
After all this the only thing I am sure of is KatyD should never be a cop. I can see she would slam krs on the hood and beat the snot out of him with her baton on sight.
posted on July 9, 2002 04:16:30 PM new
Yes, that cop will lose his job. And good riddance to him. Being a cop is an extremely stressful job, and someone who reacts abusively should not be in that position. The trouble is, all the testing in the world can't predict with 100% certainty who will react like that when the adrenalin surges.
Methane free post You have the right to an informed opinion -Harlan Ellison
posted on July 9, 2002 07:25:07 PM new
KatyD, we've had this discussion before. The same opinions were expressed. Take it on a case-by-case basis. Your opinion sounds like this to me: "That violinist couldn't have made a mistake. Because my husband is Yitzhak Perlman!" It makes no sense to defend people you don't know because your husband is in the same profession.
We all understand that policing is a dangerous profession. That in no way justifies what Hepburn rightly called attempted murder.
I don't buy the idea at all that a low salary (for the sake of the argument) in any way justifies this kind of treatment. You work at a job. You think the pay is too low, so you steal from the company. Stealing is stealing! If you think your pay is too low, get another job. You don't go around beating the crap out of citizens and then hiding behind a badge.
At at one point the SJ police arrested one of these drug dealers...he died on the way to the hospital. Everyone screamed about police brutality....bs...he was found to have been high on PCP, swinging from a tree with a knive, and had threaten the life of a young boy riding his bike home.
The source of this information being, the very police officers in whose custody the suspect died. Hans Christian Andersen couldn't come up with a better fairy tale.
Anyone who reads the news or watches the reports on Oakland, CA. would realize that the police have their hands full trying to protect and serve there.
The juror I heard interviewed following the verdict said the cops' lies were transparent, ridiculous and insulting. We're not talking about a rogue cop. We're talking about an entire police department in a major metropolitan city. San Francisco is the same. LA is the same. I've already mentioned the excessive number of "suspects" killed by cops in San Jose. I have no reason to believe the situation is different elsewhere.
But let a cop say a four-letter word to a criminal and it is plastered all over the country page one....
Pretty lame attempt to minimize the FACTS IN EVIDENCE about this particular case. Your cop who got shot should have called for backup. He got killed because he was stupid.
but just as when 5 people witness an accident...they all see it a little differently....
That may be so. Yet there is little doubt what opinion will be formed after a jury views the tape. The abuse is so flagrant, there is really no question about it. But what of the countless cases where someone didn't happen to be standing nearby with a video camera?
Did someone mention East Palo Alto? There recently WAS a case of one good cop there. He blew the whistle on several veterans for brutality, falsifying evidence, tampering with evidence, etc. The cop was fired for insubordination. He took the matter to trial and the city spent 10 million bucks trying to keep him from rejoining the force, even after a grand jury had ruled in his favor. The last I heard, the cop was being paid to stay off duty, and he was still fighting it. (Your tax dollars at work.)
[edited to add, a grand jury ordered the city of EPA to reinstate the officer. He's receiveing pay, but the department won't allow him on active duty. He's still fighting to get his job back.]
Okay, let's say for the sake of the argument that the other cops "kinda" restrained the one doing the hitting. Hello!? Public street in broad daylight? Were they thinking, "hey this is wrong" or were they thinking, "hey, somebody's gonna see us? "
You guys have no idea of what it takes to stop an experienced street fighter.
In this case the suspect was already restrained and not resisting.
So I don't try to tar every police officer with the same brunch because of a few bad apples....
Is that a late breakfast, or an early lunch?
Being a cop is an extremely stressful job, and someone who reacts abusively should not be in that position.
It's that kind of making excuses for CRIMINAL BEHAVIOR that allows it to continue. The cop should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law, and the rest who failed to act or report it should be terminated. As for the rest, wake up people, this happens every day, all the time. Any cop that gets up in the morning and says, "I hate my job, so I'm going to go kick some n*****'s ass" belongs in jail, not patrolling the streets.
posted on July 9, 2002 08:25:53 PM new
The police now have the gas station surveilance tapes in their crime lab isolating the parts that may have earlier footage of the event.
My question is- What difference does it make what happened earlier ? I don't care what the kid did earlier, he was hand cuffed and subdued even before he was slammed on the car, it makes absolutely no difference what he did before. There is nothing to justify beating a suspect once he is cuffed and subdued.
Saw a cop on TV tonight that is a member of Cops Against Police Brutality group. He said the same thing I did, i.e., that the cops at the scene should also be arrested for not arresting that cop on the spot.
posted on July 9, 2002 08:47:14 PM new
They said the tape has 10 different camera angles on it, but not all are relevant. They are isolating and enhancing the views that may show the events previous to the beating.
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I love cows...some of the sweetest faces you'll ever see. We used to have four living on the acreage near us. They'd come to the fence and we'd feed and pet them. Somebody took them away to the slaughterhouse. 
