posted on October 4, 2002 03:28:25 PM newJerry Falwell calls Islam's prophet a 'terrorist' "NEW YORK (AP) -- The Rev. Jerry Falwell says "I think Muhammad was a terrorist" in an interview to be broadcast Sunday on the CBS program "60 Minutes." "In response to Falwell's remarks, Ibrahim Hooper, spokesman for the Council on American-Islamic Relation in Washington, said: "Anybody is free to be a bigot if they want to. What really concerns us is the lack of reaction by mainstream religious and political leaders, who say nothing when these bigots voice these attacks."
Nothing new there, of course. Mainstream Christians have been preaching Hate Speech for some time.
Ministers preach war on Islam "On his "700 Club" TV broadcast last week, Robertson said he disagreed with Bush: "I have taken issue with our esteemed president in regard to his stand in saying Islam is a peaceful religion. It's just not. And the Koran makes it very clear, if you see an infidel, you kill him." "Robertson's views echo earlier remarks by Rev. Franklin Graham, son of the fabled Billy Graham, calling Islam "a very evil and very wicked religion." "And on "Crossfire," Robertson's sidekick, Rev. Jerry Falwell, joined the chorus. While declining to condemn Islam directly, he made it clear that, in his view, Islam produces nothing but trouble."
posted on October 4, 2002 03:54:56 PM new
Where Falwell and Robertson are concerned, hate-speech has been their stepping-stone to free publicity for decades. Muhammed has merely joined the short list of inflammatory subjects this tag-team of bigots routinely attacks: gays, black muslims, feminists.
For all we know, some bean-counter in their evangelical empires alerts them that ratings are slipping, donations are sloughing off and then - BINGO! - we get a new vitriolic rollcall of who's going to hell because of their beliefs.
Jerry and Pat are showmen, first and foremost -- just like Bret The Hitman Hart and Bubba Ray Dudley.
posted on October 4, 2002 03:57:59 PM new
Well that approach does seem to be working well for other business interests. And since the trend is toward a merger of Church and State..................................
posted on October 4, 2002 04:02:44 PM new
An extreme religious right view against Islam (or whatever religion)is what causes wars. Nobody speaks out against them because a lot agree. Normal people like us just sit and watch... like a tennis match.
posted on October 4, 2002 04:12:20 PM new
"An extreme religious right view against Islam (or whatever religion) is what causes wars."
A widely held belief, Krafty, but untrue. Here's a snippet from an article you might enjoy:
Wars are often blamed on political, ethnic, and religious animosities, but war is more often the inflamation of these conflicts -- and war is usually about resources: land, transport routes, and above all, resources. What's the most valuable resource in the modern world? Oil.
posted on October 4, 2002 04:57:18 PM new
Pat, you should know by now I just say stuff. But my point was that these radical thinkers always want the world to be run by the laws they choose. Their extreme thinking is what causes breakdowns. The al qaeda wasn't after oil or land when it attacked the U.S. It was their religion that brought this on.
By a Washington Post Staff Writer
Thursday, October 3, 2002; Page A02
Early this year, Pat Robertson denounced the Bush administration's "faith-based" initiative, warning that the program is a "Pandora's Box" that could make legitimate religious charities dependent on government and finance cults that "brainwash" prospective adherents.
Today, Operation Blessing International, a Virginia Beach charity created by Robertson, is to get $500,000 in the first wave of grants to be distributed under the faith-based initiative, which gives federal money to religious organizations that provide social services.
<snip>
The $500,000 grant award to Operation Blessing is one of 25 to be announced today by Health and Human Services Secretary Tommy G. Thompson. The money comes from what the administration calls the Compassion Capital Fund,which has $30 million available this year.
<snip>
Officials of Operation Blessing said the money will be used to help coordinate hunger programs with 120 local groups across the country, and to help the local organizations gain increased access to corporate and institutional donors.
<snip>
Lynn also cited media reports, that "investigators with Virginia's Office of Consumer Affairs wanted to prosecute Robertson in 1999 for making deceptive appeals about [Operation Blessing] but were overruled by the attorney general's office."
posted on October 4, 2002 06:28:53 PM new
The Bibles of most of the major religions contain words of vengeance, killing etc. somewhere in their pages. How these words are interpreted is what determines whether radical branches form. Christians, Jews and Muslims are not all peaceful people. For anyone to classify an entire religion as warlike is wrong. Even if Muhammed was a vengeful person, it certainly is wrong to classify all Muslims as such. The radical Christian right is and has been guilty of spewing some of the worst hatred this country has seen.
posted on October 4, 2002 07:28:54 PM new
Good Lord Helen... what a colourful article! It's like kids in grown up bodies. Can someone here please explain why the Jews are hated so much, in a million words or less?
I agree stusi. It's the radicals that give their religion a bad name.
posted on October 4, 2002 07:31:50 PM new
Hi Krafty. I think the excuse is that they "killed Jesus" but I think it's really because so many of them seem to do so well where money is concerned. Really, I don't know. Just an easy hate target I guess.
posted on October 4, 2002 07:44:07 PM newOfficials of Operation Blessing said the money will be used to help coordinate hunger programs with 120 local groups across the country, and to help the local organizations gain increased access to corporate and institutional donors.
Sounds like that money is dedicated to administrative costs. LOL!
posted on October 4, 2002 08:03:24 PM new
Hi rawbunzel & Antiquary!
Thanks for explaining rawbunzel. I thought Caesar killed Jesus. (??) So everyone's mad cause they're rich. Nice to know there's not many shallow people around.
posted on October 4, 2002 08:04:03 PM new
>Where Falwell and Robertson are concerned, hate-speech has been their stepping-stone to free publicity for decades.
And what of the children? What of those American adults and teens who linger on every word they spew and sift through it to make sure that the meaning is absolutely clear to them? If one of these goes out and kills a Jew, a Muslim, or a homosexual, whose fault is it really? Should these religious leaders be allowed to preach their hate speech to millions of ardent followers and believers each day?
Before we go pointing our fingers at other extremeist fundamentalist governments around the world and use it for justification for bayoneting their children in the name of a righteous war, we had better look to our own fundamentalist hatred-driven government first.
posted on October 4, 2002 08:20:16 PM new
Borillar-I don't think Falwell and Robertson are exactly "mainstream".
rawbunzel- I think Ann is getting more and more radical as her celebrity and pocketbook grow.
posted on October 4, 2002 08:27:09 PM new
I'm assuming this is a follow-up to the "mainstream christian leaders who advocate violence against Muslims thread" Still don't think your there yet bud, unless of course YOU see someone advocating hunting muslims in these statements.
posted on October 4, 2002 08:40:53 PM new
Oh come on DeSquirrel... he's just pointing out the total hypocracy here. The "popular" evangelists who are so stuck on a very fine interpretation of the Bible are no better than the terrorists. A person that wants to kill someone for their beliefs on homosexuality, abortion, etc., is no different than the average Muslum. (Imo of course.)
I never saw one of this wackos advocate violence against people. Saying gays are "living in sin" or "Mohammed was a terrorist" is no where near making our esteemed poster's point in this or the other thread that Western religions are "just as guilty" in calling for violence.
posted on October 4, 2002 09:06:57 PM new
Good point Helen! He's a leader and he's a Christian. He advocates violence.
Ministers may not actually come right out and call for violence,Desquirrel, but somehow some christians are getting the idea that it is ok to kill gays or to kill abortion doctors or others that do not fit their way of thinking. I wonder where they are getting the message from? Many,many people have been killed in the name of God.
Actually, the only group that doesn't seem to advocate violence is the left wing liberals.
just a little joke..don't get those feathers ruffled
posted on October 4, 2002 09:12:13 PM new
>Where Falwell and Robertson are concerned, >hate-speech has been their stepping-stone >to free publicity for decades.
"And what of the children? What of those American adults and teens who linger on every word they spew and sift through it to make sure that the meaning is absolutely clear to them?"
Borillar, in all honesty, I can't figure out how you segued from my initial remark to your broadbased speculation about how those deranged thousands ( - not hundreds of thousands) who watch Pat and Jerry interpret their views. Let's face it -- if someone is either so enrapt by their teachings, or so indiscriminate in their television viewing habits that they glom onto half an hour of The 700 Club, there's no amount of logic or right thinking that's going to realign their perspective.
The only point I sought to make in my initial post is that Falwell and Robertson might just as well be Hannity and Colmes, or Sharpton and Jackson or Kuby and Sliwa. Theirs is a show; who is affected by it (and its message) is an ancillary issue worthy of a separate thread, imo.
Krafty, since Robin has already answered your question satisfactorily for you, I won't address it. I do want to point out, though, that your ability to "just say stuff" is one of your more endearing qualities -- just as my inability to post without at least one link and some accessory abrasiveness is a less than endearing quality of mine.
posted on October 4, 2002 09:27:11 PM new
I subscribe to the notion that a nut is a nut and the arguement that so and so made the nut do something has absolutely no weight for me.
If they find the nut in MD likes chocolate, it doesn't mean Ben & Jerry's advocates serial killing.
posted on October 4, 2002 09:33:31 PM new
Lord help me, DeSquirrel, in between my search for an honest answer to Krafty's question about Jews, you've made me laugh out loud.
posted on October 4, 2002 09:46:04 PM new
George probably sings this as he walks around the White House.
onward christian soldiers
marching as to war
with the cross of jesus
going on before
christ, the royal master
leads against the foe
forward into battle
see his banners go
onward, christian soldiers
marching as to war
with the cross of jesus
going on before
like a mighty army
moves the church of god
brothers, we are treading
where the saints have trod
we are not divided
all one body we
one in hope, in doctrine
one in charity
onward, christian soldiers
marching as to war
with the cross of jesus
going on before
onward then, ye people
join our happy throng
blend with ours your voices
in the triumph song
glory, laud and honor
unto christ, the king
this through countless ages
men and angels sing
onward, christian soldiers
marching as to war
with the cross of jesus
going on before
posted on October 4, 2002 10:03:56 PM new
Which "west" and which "east", DeSquirrel? Those demarcations have such an unruly way of shifting these days...
Helen: shut up. If you resort to singing again in this thread, your ability to search for lyrics on google will be forever encumbered by a default result of "Micheal Rowed The Boat Ashore".
But my point was that these radical thinkers always want the world to be run by the laws they choose. Their extreme thinking is what causes breakdowns. The al qaeda wasn't after oil or land when it attacked the U.S. It was their religion that brought this on.