posted on March 31, 2003 09:49:03 AM new
"The site seems to prove my theory about lonely people needing a group to support a cause."
Colin, KD was asking if there are some people that really believe and follow this radical thinking. I provided a site that proves there are, and I'm sure there are more than this one message board.
Take the time to read more there. They don't just talk about end times, they are very political. Yes, they're extremists, but you can't ignore the fact that they're out there. I believe they do influence this administration.
posted on March 31, 2003 11:01:44 AM new
""We have chosen to kill others in order to survive, by our own reckoning. Is that moral, or not?"
donny, by whose morals are you equating this to?"
Twelvepole, that was in reference to an earlier post by Linda, when the discussion had wandered away from specifics and touched on morality in general; it was the definition of morality she had made.
It's not mine, and not really hers either, I think, just the kind of thing one gets into when discussing ideals.
posted on March 31, 2003 03:30:46 PM new
not an ideal [existing only in the mind]...but values [morals one practices]. Morals are a value not an ideal. [correction made - typing error...sorry]
twelvepole:
This was my original statement:
"There have been many people who have been desperate, who would never choose to steal, kill, or etc....others in order to survive. To me it's one's 'moral beliefs'. Nor speaking religious moral beliefs here...must moral in general."
To which donny asked:
How do you reconcile those views of morality in regards to the U.S. waging war on Iraq, remembering that our first justification for waging war on Iraq was our assertion that they were a threat to our safety? We have chosen to kill others in order to survive, by our own reckoning. Is that moral, or not?
Just wanting to be clear on WHAT I said, not how it was interpretted.
[ edited by Linda_K on Mar 31, 2003 03:56 PM ]
posted on April 1, 2003 09:22:57 AM new
Linda, you always are so verbal, but when I provide a site about the the Religious Right, and their take on the war, the Rapture, and the administration you have nothing to say.
You said all the quotes here were twisted words and lies about this large radical qroup. Yet, there they are in black and white. Do you really believe they have no influence on Bush?
posted on April 1, 2003 09:39:53 AM newLinda, you always are so verbal, but when I provide a site about the the Religious Right, and their take on the war, the Rapture, and the administration you have nothing to say. Why should I have anything to say about it? I know there are those who believe in this. Does that mean I do? I've never heard Bush say that he does, or IF he does what parts he agrees with or doesn't agree with. Do you expect me to speak for his beliefs?
You said all the quotes here were twisted words and lies about this large radical qroup. Yet, there they are in black and white. Do you really believe they have no influence on Bush? Yes, I said the writer of that article had twisted a lot and was lying. What does that have to do with 'the rapture'? Not all religious people believe the same way, just like not all people vote the same way.
If you'd like to have a discussion over what was in that original post, I'd be glad to discuss that article with you.
The question is not what a man can scorn, or disparage, or find fault with, but what he can love, and value, and appreciate. J. Ruskin
[ edited by Linda_K on Apr 1, 2003 09:41 AM ]
posted on April 1, 2003 09:43:23 AM new
chococake - Better yet...why don't you post Bush's own words where HE states how/what he believes about the rapture. That way, rather than making accusations about this beliefs, we could all read what those beliefs are exactly.
The question is not what a man can scorn, or disparage, or find fault with, but what he can love, and value, and appreciate. J. Ruskin
posted on April 1, 2003 09:50:51 AM new
Linda, no where did I say Bush believed it, there you go twisting again. KD's question was were there really people out there that believed it. I just showed there were. My question to you was do you think this far right religious thinking group, and their leaders have influence in this administration?
posted on April 1, 2003 10:23:43 AM new
chococake - When we go to war in Iraq we will do so to summon the Messiah. That is what the Christian right believes.
Using this statement from KD's first post for discussion purposes. It states 'that is what'.....
It has twisted what the Christian right believes, is what I'm saying.
It implies Bush is taking us to war for this reason.
I'm saying The Christian right does believe end times will come. They give many examples of things they believe will happen before this occurs. What is not true is that anyone [human person] can summon the Messiah by their actions, nor that ALL Christians believe this.
As I said before, almost everytime our world has a crisis, people believe this could be the beginning of the end times. I believe JW's believe this too. But maybe it's the Morman. Anyway...other religious people also believe in the 'end times' concept. To very different degrees.
Your last question to me was: My question to you was do you think this far right religious thinking group, and their leaders have influence in this administration? I don't know to what degree, if at all, they influence our President. He's influenced by many groups. If you are asking if he's influenced by the most radical right-winged religious people, and has made this decision to take our country to war BECAUSE of this, I'd say most likely not.
Again pointing out that all democrats don't fall in only one 'area' of beliefs on issues. Some are way to the left, some more moderate, a few who lean more to the right. But they're all democrats. Just like all Christians fall in different catagories. They're not all very, very far right.
What I'm saying is that for those who wish to blame Bush for doing this BECAUSE of their twisted views/lack of understanding what end times are all about, is wrong. Now, if Bush tells us himself he believes that, then that's a whole different ball game. But he hasn't said that, other's a saying it. Just like the writer of the article did in their last paragraph.
-----------------------
The question is not what a man can scorn, or disparage, or find fault with, but what he can love, and value, and appreciate. J. Ruskin
posted on April 2, 2003 05:28:40 AM new
chococake,
I hope you didn't get the idea I didn't enjoy the site. It was a good laugh. It's the type of thing I'm always looking for. That and "Last Supper" paint by number kits.
To compare the President to most of these nuts would be a mistake. It's the type of mistake or faults statement that a few Bush haters on these boards try to put forth all the time.
posted on April 2, 2003 07:04:22 AM newTo compare the President to most of these nuts would be a mistake. It's the type of mistake or faults statement that a few Bush haters on these boards try to put forth all the time.
When discussing Bush and world events today, nobody should feel a need to use false statements to elaborate on the truth.
BTW...I read yesterday that Bush asked the troops to pray for him.
posted on April 2, 2003 07:09:04 AM new
There's nothing wrong with that. Nothing weird, nothing different than most American's are doing to their God.
The question is not what a man can scorn, or disparage, or find fault with, but what he can love, and value, and appreciate. J. Ruskin
I see on your page...reverendcolin.com that you are also praying for our leaders.
As you suggest, "A prayer for all our government leaders because they're assholes and know not what they're doing"
Since you say "all", I suppose you include George?
You are so often disparaging the "little people". I think you are a "big people" trying to be a "little people". In other words, I think you know how to spell.
posted on April 2, 2003 08:47:05 AM new
"A prayer for all our government leaders because they're assholes and know not what they're doing"
colin!!!!!!!!! an anti- establishment, anti-American, lefty, communist.
You Colin,,are the deceiver???
Come hear pretending to be a Patriot, and a Man of the cloth.
What is your true agenda.
posted on April 2, 2003 09:13:49 AM new
Wow, talk about something out of context... if you would of bothered reading the top of the page, it states that those prayers are sent to him... looks as if he just posted what was emailed to him...
Of course he could of used censorship and not posted anything that could be found offensive... doesn't look like he did...
posted on April 2, 2003 09:40:58 AM new
chococake, I don't know what the heck most are talking about here now, but the original post was this, at the end:
[b]What worries me is that we may be going to war to fulfill what a few deluded
people believe to be biblical prophecy. And what really worries me is that we have
a President who might believe this nonsense, too.[/b]
See, I don't know if the President believes 'this nonsense', nor do I think he has anyone in his admin. that is 'pushing' for the end of the world.
I believe the 'end times' and Revelations. BUT I don't know when it will be, nor does anyone else.
I didn't go to the site you linked. I am not that radical to have a stopwatch counting the days or minutes of the end times. Could be tommorow, but then could be 20, 50, 100 or more years from now. No person living knows.
Art Bell Retired! George Noory is on late night coasttocoastam.com
posted on April 3, 2003 04:51:01 AM new
Austy, Helen and all. Yes, I have dissenters in my family too. I'll post most anything on my site. I'm open to opposing views. Even the Pinko stuff You all enjoy so much.
Helen I was glad to see on another thread you finally came out of the closet and admitted you were a Socialist. I still think your politics are farther left.
"I learned about Ruskin in art school and I admired him for his social interest and work in that field. You see, being a socialist is not bad, Linda. I really like your quote!"
posted on April 3, 2003 07:24:46 AM new
NTS - No, but I've been having problems with it too. Put your [/b] inside the "." [period] though - like: Our country is the greatest[/b].
The question is not what a man can scorn, or disparage, or find fault with, but what he can love, and value, and appreciate. J. Ruskin
"Be kind. Remember everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle." - Harry Thompson
"I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it." - A Few Good Men
This topic is 9 pages long: 1new2new3new4new5new6new7new8new9new
