I've been watching the latest twists and turns in the saga of Pvt. Jessica Lynch with growing bemusement, if not outright amusement. It's a classic example of a story that's been spun so many ways it's lost all narrative coherence -- and is collapsing back into the disconnected shards of reality from which it was originally created.
What's impressive, though, is the way Lynch herself is emerging from the wreckage of a phony story as a real person -- and a woman who seems determined to be the subject, not the object, of her own life. The finger that pulls the string, instead of the top that gets spun.
Needless to say, the people formerly doing the spinning aren't too happy to find their top now has a mind of its own. Having "saved" Private Lynch, the conservative propaganda machine is now looking for a way to destroy her. Turning Jessica Lynch into Jane Fonda may prove a little bit harder than convincing the true believers we've always been at war with Eurasia. But perhaps not much.
So now Private Lynch has to be lynched, a job which the vast right-wing conspiracy has taken up with gusto. A reader wrote in yesterday to tell me that attacking Lynch has suddenly become the topic de jour on conservative talk radio:
One guy just called in and said "Lynch is a disgrace and proof that women shouldn't be in the military."
One caller says he "wanted to punch her teeth out."
posted on November 10, 2003 07:39:18 AM new
Her gun jammed when she tried to fire it. ANd no, it didn't jam because she's a woman--others in her group had the same problem. The guy who kept the mortar crew from firing at them had to wallop his gun after every shot to keep it firing (he was interviewed on 60 Minutes this weekend).
Censorship, like charity, should begin at home; but unlike charity, it should end there --Clare Booth Luce
posted on November 10, 2003 11:07:58 AM new Her gun jammed when she tried to fire it
Bull Ship, she stated she NEVER FIRED A SHOT not I TRIED TO FIRE BUT MY WEAPON JAMMED
The guy who kept the mortar crew from firing at them had to wallop his gun
In the military you do not carry a GUN. You carry a weapon and Walloping? is not an approved method of clearing a jam or stovepiped cartridge.
In his first interview (months ago on 60 Minutes) he never mentioned having to clear his weapon of jams. He did say he fired at multiple targets to prevent the mortar crew from firing upon his crew members.
Say what you will about the continuing saga of Jessica Lynch but all the details will never be known,
She acknowledges she doesn't know what happened to her from the time she was injured to the crash to the time she awakened in the hospital.
I do believe the the recording to her rescue was intended to be used in her best interest but should not have been used as publicity stunt as it was.
Misrepresentation by the media is typical left wing spin to distort the facts.
"Another plague upon the land, as devastating as the locusts God loosed on the Egyptians, is "Political Correctness.'" --Charlton Heston
posted on November 10, 2003 11:29:38 AM new http://abcnews.go.com/sections/Primetime/US/Jessica_Lynch_031106-1.html
"But Lynch confirms that was not the case. She tells Sawyer she was just a soldier in the wrong place at the wrong time, whose gun jammed during the chaos. "I'm not about to take credit for something I didn't do," she tells Sawyer in the interview, airing Tuesday, Nov. 11."
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/11/06/60minutes/main582354.shtml
"But after that first shot, his rifle jammed. He had to pound on it with the palm of his hand, after every shot, to get the next bullet loaded into the chamber. He kept on re-loading and shooting. "I was kind of getting a rhythm down, count like seconds and then look up," he explains. "And you could see somebody else trying to load it. So, I was starting to count, and when I'd get to the number, I'd look up. And somebody else would be trying to load it, and I'd shoot. I did that probably seven times total. I counted the last time, and when I looked up, there wasn't nobody there." "
Censorship, like charity, should begin at home; but unlike charity, it should end there --Clare Booth Luce
posted on November 10, 2003 01:34:12 PM new
Whose responsibility was it to keep their weapon clean & ready to fire? Each soldier, whether on the front line or in a chow line is solely responsible. If his/her weapon jammed, it was because it wasn't properly cleaned.
Just like a liberal to blame a weapons non firing capability on anyone but the one that needs to accept responsibility.
And you think Sawyer gave a fair and unprompted interview? Hardly, this was the typical left handed media interview, intended to sway public opinion. I would imagine more that half of Lynch's comments were edited to provide only a partial response & that the complete statement was not provided to the watching public.
"Another plague upon the land, as devastating as the locusts God loosed on the Egyptians, is "Political Correctness.'" --Charlton Heston
posted on November 10, 2003 01:59:56 PM new
So just to clarify Bear. The government released one version. the media publicizes it and it is the gods honest thruth. The actual participants give their version, one les glorified than the governments, the media publisizes it and it all left wing media spin? b I'm curious as to why you feel that the participants are lying.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
posted on November 10, 2003 02:32:39 PM newthe media publicizes it and it is the gods honest thruth
What is it that makes you that if the media publicizes it, it is the god's honest truth?
The media only publicizes what they think will increase their circulation. You think the media never lies? I seem to remember a recent scandal in one of the New York papers where one of their reporters made up stories & plagiarized others.....
What is the old saying.......Never believe what you read and only half of what you see?
"Another plague upon the land, as devastating as the locusts God loosed on the Egyptians, is "Political Correctness.'" --Charlton Heston
posted on November 10, 2003 04:18:56 PM newWhose responsibility was it to keep their weapon clean & ready to fire? Each soldier, whether on the front line or in a chow line is solely responsible. If his/her weapon jammed, it was because it wasn't properly cleaned.
Normally I'd agree with you, but when more than one person's gun jams one begins to wonder about the weapons themselves. How many other soldiers are having this problem & we aren't hearing about it?
Just like a liberal to blame a weapons non firing capability on anyone but the one that needs to accept responsibility.
For one thing, I am not a liberal. For another I was not placing blame, but rather answer your chauvanistic statement "Not a surprise, woman in combat could expect nothing more" in response to Lynch's saying that she hadn't fired a shot. There was a reason why she hadn't, wasn't there?
And you think Sawyer gave a fair and unprompted interview? Hardly, this was the typical left handed media interview, intended to sway public opinion.
Hmmm. An interview in which Lynch states categorically that 99.9% of what the military said about her & her situation was tripe and that she refused to take hero status that rightfully belonged to someone else in her unit isn't "fair?" Just can't make some people happy. When it first hit the news many ex- & current soldiers b#tched that she shouldn't be called a hero. Now that she says she isn't, she still gets b#tched at? Jeez!
edited to add a needed "n't"
Censorship, like charity, should begin at home; but unlike charity, it should end there --Clare Booth Luce
[ edited by bunnicula on Nov 10, 2003 04:31 PM ]
posted on November 10, 2003 04:56:03 PM new
::What is it that makes you that if the media publicizes it, it is the god's honest truth? ::
I don't but you sure seem to have bought into the first version, the media publicized government version. When the actual participant started talking and you start hearing it from the horses mouth you start doubting them, calling them liars, and saying that it is a media conspricy - why is it that this same conspiracy theory did not apply to the original story? When the story matches your philosophy its not a problem but when it contradicts your personal beliefs then it's all some left wing conspiracy.
Kind of like when everyone was jumping all over the Saudis saying that they were hiding their support of Bin Laden and friends but now when even our own officials are stating that the Saudia are actually a target (which anyone who has done any research or reading has known for awhile) they have nothing to say. Look back at all the long anti Saudi threads and then look at and see how many have replied to the one regarding the announcements concerning the weekends attack.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
posted on November 10, 2003 06:06:10 PM new
Weapons jam. That is not the point. The media was woken up at 4am and gathered together to carry a store which they did verbatim as provided by the military's public information officer in the field.
In the days days and weeks various other participants tell varying versions of the story.
This is simply a modern day Roshamon, no more no less. Lynch is an ordinary person who got caught in the wrong place at the wrong time. Just like a roller coaster once the ride starts you don't get off till it stops. It was not her idea to volunteer to be a tool of propaganda. If you don't want her to speak candidly from her point of vantage you should not have anointed her a hero.
Republican, the other white meat!
posted on November 10, 2003 08:52:29 PM new
fenix03
Your the one that first stated The government released one version. the media publicizes it and it is the gods honest thruth.
Now you say I don't but you sure seem to have bought into the first version.
Which is it? What is is your queation?
Buy into the first theory? I don't think all the facts will ever be known. There were on impartial 3rd party observers on site when it happened.
Buni
[i]Whose responsibility was it to keep their weapon clean & ready to fire? Each soldier, whether on the front line or in a chow line is solely responsible. If his/her weapon jammed, it was because it wasn't properly cleaned.
Normally I'd agree with you, but when more than one person's gun jams one begins to wonder about the weapons themselves. How many other soldiers are having this problem & we aren't hearing about it?[/i]
The M16 / M4 is one of the worlds most reliable weapons. It has been combat tested for over 35 years. It has been proven that when kept clean it will function properly.
I have seen them dropped into mud & other substances (AKA crap) & picked up, the round in the chamber ejected & a new round fed & start firing immediately.
Just like a liberal to blame a weapons non firing capability on anyone but the one that needs to accept responsibility. For one thing, I am not a liberal. For another I was not placing blame, but rather answer your chauvanistic statement "Not a surprise, woman in combat could expect nothing more" in response to Lynch's saying that she hadn't fired a shot. There was a reason why she hadn't, wasn't there?
Back up your hormones & reread my comments, I never stated "Not a surprise, woman in combat could expect nothing more
From the excerpts that have been published of her book, I tend to believe she is making an attempt to use the situation only of gain financially.
"Another plague upon the land, as devastating as the locusts God loosed on the Egyptians, is "Political Correctness.'" --Charlton Heston
posted on November 10, 2003 09:30:08 PM new
RE:” the worlds most reliable weapons”
I know zero-nothing of weapons, but what I do know is that US helicopters had more problems in Iraq than Australian because Australian Helicopters were better suited to dessert storm and sand conditions with issues like contaminants (ie. sand) in air intake.
Is it just possible bear that poor suitability to sandy conditions is not limited to certain aircraft.
Just a question, after all, I wouldn’t even know what type of rifles our soldiers use.
posted on November 10, 2003 09:40:55 PM newBack up your hormones & reread my comments, I never stated "Not a surprise, woman in combat could expect nothing more
Excuse me. I meant to say "a" statement, not "your" --it was 12 I was responding to.
From the excerpts that have been published of her book, I tend to believe she is making an attempt to use the situation only of gain financially.
No, she could gain way more financially if she went along with the original government spin. A percieved hero gets the red carpet all over the place.
The M16 / M4 is one of the worlds most reliable weapons. It has been combat tested for over 35 years. It has been proven that when kept clean it will function properly
"The weapon has failed us at crucial moments when we needed fire power most. In each case, it left Marines naked against their enemy. Often, and this is no exaggeration, we take counts after each fight, as many as 50% of the rifles fail to work."2
The technical data that came out of the congressional investigation showed that the M16 jammed because it’s "cyclic rate" was too high. That was due to a letter-of-the-law application of technical specification. Weapons designers speak of automatic rifles as "resonant mechanisms," in which several different cycles must all work in harmony. One of the factors in determining these cycles is the explosive characteristic of the gunpowder.
http://www.pquinn.com/psq/m16r.html
"Good afternoon.
I stumbled upon your article over lunch, and I was suprised to find your article on the M16A2 vs the AK74 While I may be the first to tell you, I'll scream it. YOU'RE RIGHT! I'm thrilled to know that I'm not the only person on this planet that thinks that gun is overrated. Tell all those other peons that stick up for that peice of trash to go get bent. The damn thing jams twice a clip, if ANY sand gets in it, it shits itself, and there's at least 50 other design flaws within the gun itself."
http://209.157.64.200/focus/f-news/969732/posts
"Now U.S. troops who have picked up AKs on raids or confiscated them at checkpoints are putting the rifles to use — and they say they like what they see. Some complain that standard U.S. military M16 and M4 rifles jam too easily in Iraq’s dusty environment. Many say the AK has better “knockdown” power and can kill with fewer shots."
Censorship, like charity, should begin at home; but unlike charity, it should end there --Clare Booth Luce
Former prisoner of war Jessica Lynch said the U.S. military was wrong to manipulate the story of her dramatic rescue and should not have filmed it in the first place.
The 20-year-old private told ABC's Diane Sawyer in a "Primetime" interview to air Tuesday that she was bothered by the military's portrayal of her ordeal.
"They used me as a way to symbolize all this stuff," she said in an excerpt from the interview, posted Friday on the network's Web site.
"It hurt in a way that people would make up stories that they had no truth about," she said.
posted on November 11, 2003 06:30:53 AM new
So perhaps when she thought she had been raped but couldn’t remember, she was just confused;
She had only been screwed, ie.exploited.
Also bear, RE:” the worlds most reliable weapons”
In light of bunnicula’s link, will you partake of humble pie.
Or only through your dying lips.
posted on November 11, 2003 07:05:47 AM newAlso bear, RE:” the worlds most reliable weapons” In light of bunnicula’s link, will you partake of humble pie. Or only through your dying lips.
I stand by my words. I have seen the abuse the M16 can withstand. I have staked my life on it. Have any of you? (Other than Twelve).
You take care of your weapon & it takes care of you.
Anyone can post links to REPORTS of non functioning weapons. Can any of those reporters or any of you give first hand eye witness to the reliability of these weapons.
Sure the solderers can pickup an AK and use it. Then they throw it away, they aren't responsible for it & don't have to clean it.
When they do use the AK's, they are taking a major risk, though. The sound of a AK firing is totally different from a M16. Why is this a problem in combat? Because your enemy's primary weapon is the AK47. So an American soldier firing a AK is risking being fired upon by his own side because those others don't know it is an American firing the weapon.
"Another plague upon the land, as devastating as the locusts God loosed on the Egyptians, is "Political Correctness.'" --Charlton Heston
[ edited by BEAR1949 on Nov 11, 2003 07:08 AM ]
posted on November 11, 2003 07:29:57 AM new
she is going to show her nude body in some publication /website??
everyone hustles??right??
-sig file -------The thrill is gone!!
posted on November 11, 2003 07:52:05 AM newPatrick was called the real hero and he had an unworking weapon.
"But after that first shot, his rifle jammed. He had to pound on it with the palm of his hand, after every shot, to get the next bullet loaded into the chamber. He kept on re-loading and shooting. "I was kind of getting a rhythm down, count like seconds and then look up," he explains. "And you could see somebody else trying to load it. So, I was starting to count, and when I'd get to the number, I'd look up. And somebody else would be trying to load it, and I'd shoot. I did that probably seven times total. I counted the last time, and when I looked up, there wasn't nobody there."
Everybody knows about Jessica Lynch, but nobody knows about Patrick.
"And he did an amazing thing," Johnson says. "He saved our lives. If that mortar had hit that vehicle we were underneath, we'd be gone. And so would Jessica, because it would have been a chain reaction. It had all that fuel, we'd be dead."
posted on November 11, 2003 08:07:55 AM new
This is the link for that story of the unworking weapon that Bear requested...Bunnicula provided it in a comment above.
posted on November 11, 2003 08:26:23 AM new
Oh, but Helen, didn't you know?!? They are, of course, lying! It was a "typical left handed media interview, intended to sway public opinion." And probably "more that half of (his)comments were edited to provide only a partial response & that the complete statement was not provided to the watching public."
I'm surprised at you, Helen--everyone knows that...
Censorship, like charity, should begin at home; but unlike charity, it should end there --Clare Booth Luce
posted on November 11, 2003 08:48:57 AM new
The key word is "dirt"
causes many weapons jams...also mishandling
Bear probably did use that weapon Helen, at least he has done something, other than b*tch, for his country...
Pretty easy to say that from the comfort of your own home, never having made more of a scarifice other than worrying the neighbors might find out your a liberal.
posted on November 11, 2003 09:02:09 AM newtypical left handed media interview, intended to sway public opinion.
I'd be one to agree with that. Especially since CBS just did a wonderful hatchet job depicting Ronald Reagan. Even they admitted it was a little over the top and decided [because of pressure - clap clap ] to put in on Showtime instead.
---------------
Jessica was used
Larry Flint, of porno fame and fortune, supposedly has some topless pics of her partying with some friends before being sent over to Iraq.
[ edited by Linda_K on Nov 11, 2003 09:05 AM ]
posted on November 11, 2003 09:06:12 AM newYou people still don't understand the principal. You keep your weapon clean, your weapon is your life, you take care of it before ALL ELSE & your weapon takes care of you. This rule of life applies to REMFS as well as front line troops.
The statement he had not fired a weapon in seven months is pure BS. All troops. prior to shipment to Iraq were REQUALITIED with their weapons. (For those who don't know the termology, requalifying means going to the firing range, firing the weapon & meeting a minimun score. Those qualifying with a higher than minimum score are rated as Marksman or Expert)
In Jessica own words:
What you trained for [maintenance and supply] obviously wasn't what happened. We had to do the whole weapons qualification again to make sure that we knew how to operate a weapon, but also we did a lot of training with gas masks. In a sense we were ready, but we weren't ready for an ambush attack.
If your weapon hadn't jammed, you would have been ... Firing, of course. But it would still have been nervous and scary.
Did she even try to clear the weapon? Most likely not, or she would have said so. After all in weapons training & qualification you are taught to clear any stoppages. So she just ducked her head & hoped for the best.
As to Jessica not being rewarded for he book deal:
Lynch and Bragg will split a $1 million advance, with any royalties going to Lynch. Anything to stir up controversy & make people buy the book, would increase her earnings.
"Another plague upon the land, as devastating as the locusts God loosed on the Egyptians, is "Political Correctness.'" --Charlton Heston
[ edited by BEAR1949 on Nov 11, 2003 09:08 AM ]
[ edited by BEAR1949 on Nov 11, 2003 10:45 AM ]
I Agree with bear 100%, you have to keep you weapon clean, you are tought this 1005 in the milatary, and for the bloke that said he did'nt us his gun for 6 months is lieing throw his teeth. My husband is in the milatary, every 3 months he has to train with gun's
So for people pulling bear to bits, until you no what your talking about, i would be quite.
[ edited by Linda_K on Nov 11, 2003 09:05 AM ]