Twelvepole
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posted on December 2, 2003 08:37:53 AM new
Looks as if Arnold is going to fullfill one of his campaign promises...
California Assembly voted to repeal the law following the Senate...
NO driver's license for illegals
WHOO HOOO
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bunnicula
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posted on December 2, 2003 09:10:04 AM new
Good!
Censorship, like charity, should begin at home; but unlike charity, it should end there --Clare Booth Luce
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BEAR1949
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posted on December 2, 2003 09:24:58 AM new
It's about time...
"Another plague upon the land, as devastating as the locusts God loosed on the Egyptians, is "Political Correctness.'" --Charlton Heston
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Linda_K
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posted on December 2, 2003 10:07:46 AM new
GREAT NEWS!!! Keep going Arnold.
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CBlev65252
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posted on December 2, 2003 10:34:21 AM new
I (shudder) have to agree with twelve on this one. Like I've said, there is a point at which my liberalism changes course. This is that point.
Cheryl
http://tinyurl.com/vm6u
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replaymedia
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posted on December 2, 2003 11:19:24 AM new
I don't know of anyone who supported this.
It was a VERY transparent attempt to increase the Hispanic vote for Gray Davis. Fortunately, it didn't work.
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Replay Media
Games of all kinds!
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fenix03
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posted on December 2, 2003 01:22:14 PM new
I supported it. Anyone who has ever been in an accident with an uninsured motorist should have supported it. The main function of granting drivers liscenses to illegals was to enable accessibility to insurance, thus protecting the public.
Since that is about the only right one gains by holding a drivers liscense I'm not sure what the uproar is all about.
One thig that is plainly demonstrated here however is the mindless lemming mentality of our state reresentatives. They overwhelmingly passed it, now they are overturning their own law just a few months later right along with the car tax issue which robbed every counnty in this state of additional budget slated to the police and fire departments.
This state has no backbone.
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If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
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Helenjw
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posted on December 2, 2003 01:47:19 PM new
Licensing also helps law inforcement indentify criminals. In our area, most crime is solved by auto connections such as tag and license ID.
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replaymedia
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posted on December 2, 2003 02:18:54 PM new
"Licensing also helps law inforcement indentify criminals."
So when these ILLEGAL immigrants apply for a license, they should be carted off immediately. See how easy that makes the policework?
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Replay Media
Games of all kinds!
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Helenjw
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posted on December 2, 2003 02:44:06 PM new
Your smart ass answer doesn't contribute anything to the discussion. If millions of illegals continue to live and work here as they probably will, they will continue to drive here illegally, without ID or insurance...Is that what you want?
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CBlev65252
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posted on December 2, 2003 03:05:04 PM new
Helen
I don't know about California, but here you don't need a license to get insurance. It's quite expensive though. I do understand your take on all of this. I also understand that the process to become "legal" in this country is terribly long and frustrating. DJK is working on a bill that would make the process easier. My take on the whole matter is that if we give illegals all the benefits we have in this country as legal citizens, where is the incentive for them to become legal? It is easier, IMO, to know where the loyalties of a legalized citizen lay than one who never intends to become legal. Somewhere down the line each and everyone of us had a relation who came to this country from somewhere else and who worked hard to become legal citizens. Why should we now decide that these illegals should have more privledges than any of our ancestors did upon arriving here?
Cheryl
http://tinyurl.com/vm6u
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Helenjw
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posted on December 2, 2003 03:19:55 PM new
You have an idealistic take on the problem, Cheryl and I appreciate that. I am trying to understand the practical aspect though, right now... with this issue of a driver's license. As you know, uninsured motorists are costly and insurance premiums will rise.
There will not be a mass exodus simply because legal driver's licenses are not available here. The people of this country will be adversly affected by this decision and not the immigrants.
Helen
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CBlev65252
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posted on December 2, 2003 03:35:45 PM new
You are right about one thing, Helen, I do have a pretty idealist take on a lot of things. My motto? Can't we just all get along?  It comes in pretty handy especially when the family is gathered around the holidays! 
Cheryl
http://tinyurl.com/vm6u
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replaymedia
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posted on December 2, 2003 03:35:59 PM new
It was NOT a "smartass answer." it's a completely valid point. Here you have people walking into a DMV and confessinbg to a crime. Why shouldn't somthing be done about it?
If you are in ILLEGAL immigrant, what motivation is there to make you REALLY want to get a driver's license anyway?
Sooner or later, we'll get an administration that will decide to do something about all those illegals. Who do you suppose the first ones to be deported will be? The ones the government knows about.
The next thing you know, they'll want drug dealers and prostitutes to register for licensing. It's ALL illegal. Either clean it up or ignore the problem, but this kind of legislation is just plain stupid.
Laws are laws. Enforce them or eliminate them. This kind of dancing around the issue only makes the USA look stupid.
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Replay Media
Games of all kinds!
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colin
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posted on December 2, 2003 03:44:45 PM new
Replay.....I’m with you all the way on this one.
BTW who said giving them a license would have anything to do with insuring a vehicle? You must be living in a dream world.
I once heard it said that 30 percent of the drivers in Fla. don't have a license let alone insurance. Fla. has just as many problems with ill eagles on there roads. Texas too.
Amen,
Reverend Colin
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fenix03
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posted on December 2, 2003 04:12:08 PM new
Colin - as usual you pass judgement on things you know nothing about. One of the original arguements that brought the bill into play was the legality of citing a driver for driving without a liscense or insurance if they are denied the ability to attain either by ommission.
Cheryl - In California you cannot get insurance without a valid drivers license. As for giving them rights - there are no rights other than to drive and purchase insurance that are given to any individual, legal or otherwise by virtue of a drivers alone.
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If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
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CBlev65252
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posted on December 2, 2003 04:16:27 PM new
So then, what makes California think that by giving them a driver's license they'll get insurance? To get plates all you have to say is "yes, I have insurance" then sign a worthless piece of paper. I'm all for requiring proof of insurance BEFORE plates are issued or renewed.
Cheryl
http://tinyurl.com/vm6u
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Twelvepole
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posted on December 2, 2003 04:52:32 PM new
The root of the problem is not being addressed, it seems that some people want to just appease anyone or anybody to keep the right thing from being done.
AIN'T LIFE GRAND...
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BEAR1949
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posted on December 2, 2003 05:57:51 PM new
The original idea of issuing DL's to illegals in CA was to give them a "legal" American identification card. With this universal form of American identification it would give them the semblance of legal status.
As illegals they should never have been given the opportunity to get a DL and yes they should have been arrested & deported immediately.
"Another plague upon the land, as devastating as the locusts God loosed on the Egyptians, is "Political Correctness.'" --Charlton Heston
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fenix03
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posted on December 2, 2003 06:53:45 PM new
:: To get plates all you have to say is "yes, I have insurance" then sign a worthless piece of paper. I'm all for requiring proof of insurance BEFORE plates are issued or renewed.::
Maybe in Ohio but in California you have to show documentation from the insurance company to register or renew a vehicle.
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If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
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fenix03
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posted on December 2, 2003 06:56:26 PM new
Whaay I am finding interesting here is that no one is commenting on the fact that the same representatives that voted for this law jst a few months ago are now voting against it. No one seems to find it abhorant that the state reps are passing laws based on the singular whim of whomever the govenor at the time ay be.
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If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
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Linda_K
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posted on December 2, 2003 07:09:09 PM new
fenix - IMO, the CA legislature finally heard what the voters said.
So it's not so much that they willy-nilly follow whatever the governor [at the time] wants as they're lookin' to keep their own jobs...BY listening to what the majority wants.
Most followed a liberal agenda and now can clearly see the voters are FED UP with a lot of decisions they and Davis made.
It's self preservation, imo.
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Linda_K
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posted on December 2, 2003 08:14:44 PM new
fenix - Where you the one that has previouly stated one has to show a SS card in order to register to vote in CA?
Reason I ask is because I just did a review of the DMVs site, FAQs section and this is all it said:
The Help America Vote Act (HAVA), enacted by Congress in October of 2002, states that individuals registering to vote for the first time in the state/jurisdiction, must provide either a valid California driver's license or state ID card number.
Applicants who do not have either can provide the last four digits of their Social Security number. If the voter provides a driver?s license or state ID number when he/she registers to vote, and the number can be matched to a state record, then the voter will not be required to show ID when he/she votes.
Otherwise?
If an individual registers by mail, has not previously voted in an election for federal office, and votes in person, the voter must show photo ID or a document that indicates both the voter's name and residence address.
If an individual registers by mail, has not previously voted in an election for federal office, and votes by mail, the voter must submit a copy of a photo ID or a document with both the voter's name and residence address.
So...to me, an illegal in CA only has to show a drivers license to be able to vote? Had this ruling stood as passed, then those illegals who received drivers licenses would have been able to vote quite easily. No?????
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fenix03
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posted on December 2, 2003 08:32:10 PM new
Linda - that was not me that originally said that but I would have hoped that non citizen driver licenses would have had some type of indication of that status on the card which would have eliminated that issue.
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If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
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buyhigh
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posted on December 2, 2003 08:51:11 PM new
To register a car in your name in Calif , you do have to furnish documentation of insurance but there are many insur. companies who sell insurance here requiring only one months payment at a time. Many people just pay for the 1st month and that is it. The DMV never checks and the insurance companies do not inform the DMV that the indiv. is no longer insured. Insurance by the way is very expensive here and probably not affordable for the average illegal alien. Also you do not need insurance to get a driver's license.
buyhigh
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fenix03
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posted on December 2, 2003 10:02:49 PM new
That's probably a good thing since getting insurance does require having a drivers license.
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If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
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bunnicula
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posted on December 2, 2003 11:30:11 PM new
Illegal aliens don't belong here, period. And they certainly shouldn't be given driver's licenses. It's the first step down the road toward another amnesty. Remember the amnesty that Reagan (iirc) gave illegal aliens in the 80's?!? It "legalized" illegals who'd been here for a while & was supposed to put an end to the illegal problem. So what happened? We've got more illegal aliens now then we ever have. All screaming that they have rights: rights to medical aid, rights to education, rights to welfare benefits, rights to housing--you name it they want the right to it. Last year, there were even illegals bringing lawsuits for crying out loud. Why? Because some had died in the desert coming into this country illegally, and they lawsuit said watering stations should be provided in the desert for the convenience of people entering our country illegally!!!
Well, they have no rights--they are here illegally. And no, I don't feel responsible for their children--the parents are responsible for bringing them here in the first place. Illegals are a massive drain on our economy for all the talk of how "they take jobs no American would." Try visiting schools in Southern California. And emergency rooms. And social service offices. All clogged with illegal aliens, sucking up services while the system totters under their weight.
And, no, I am not a racist. If someone is in this country legally, I say great & I don't give a rat's patootie where they're from or what color their skin is. But that's just the problem. More & more folks in this country can't seem to understand the difference between "legal" and "illegal."
edited to replace a "t" with an "r"
Censorship, like charity, should begin at home; but unlike charity, it should end there --Clare Booth Luce
[ edited by bunnicula on Dec 2, 2003 11:31 PM ]
[ edited by bunnicula on Dec 2, 2003 11:32 PM ]
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Helenjw
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posted on December 3, 2003 06:04:33 AM new
Without border control, the number of undocumented immigrants will not change. Licensing drivers whether they are in the country to stay a week, a month or several years will not affect the problems that you are having with services in California. How would licensing change the illegal status of immigrants. The millions of undocumented immigrants will still be here, driving illegally. Refusing to issue driver licenses will serve no purpose other than to make a political statement.
Helen
[ edited by Helenjw on Dec 3, 2003 06:16 AM ]
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CBlev65252
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posted on December 3, 2003 07:26:45 AM new
Applicants who do not have either can provide the last four digits of their Social Security number. If the voter provides a driver?s license or state ID number when he/she registers to vote, and the number can be matched to a state record, then the voter will not be required to show ID when he/she votes. Otherwise? If an individual registers by mail, has not previously voted in an election for federal office, and votes in person, the voter must show photo ID or a document that indicates both the voter's name and residence address. If an individual registers by mail, has not previously voted in an election for federal office, and votes by mail, the voter must submit a copy of a photo ID or a document with both the voter's name and residence address. So...to me, an illegal in CA only has to show a drivers license to be able to vote? Had this ruling stood as passed, then those illegals who received drivers licenses would have been able to vote quite easily. No?????
No one has answered Linda's question about voting. Does anyone know?
Cheryl
http://tinyurl.com/vm6u
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Twelvepole
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posted on December 3, 2003 08:50:43 AM new
It is what the majority of people wanted Helen, their new Governor is keeping campaign promises... see no pleasing you... even if an elected offical keeps campaign promises you find something to #*!@ about...
Besides when was the last time you lived in CA?
Prop 187 passed overwhelmingly, was subsequently over turned, but shows how people of CA feel about illegal immigrants.
Whether a politcal statement or not, it will still have people thinking.
AIN'T LIFE GRAND...
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