posted on February 10, 2004 03:42:03 PM newYesterday, my friend Jane told me some close friends of hers might have to sell their house because they can't afford the upkeep. Tonite, a couple of my neighbours stopped by and told me they've got their house up for sale. Same thing - they just can't afford the taxes and the cost of the upkeep.
Well....if we pass a National Health Insurance program many of your US friends will be in the exact same shape. But your democrat/liberal friends here are pushing for it. Some here appear to not be bothered by the extremely high taxes you Canadians pay for the privilege of enjoying socialism.
posted on February 10, 2004 03:54:30 PM new
i just heard ca based fluor corporation,an intl construction and engineering company with big projects around the world is moving to india,they are scouting homes for their senior managers,a skeleton crew will remain in calif.
with a few hundred million people joining the workforce from india and china,this low wage no wage trend will be long and painful for us and the western europeans.
-sig file -------the lobster in the boiling pot of water who tries to prevent the others from climbing out.
posted on February 10, 2004 03:58:10 PM new
Cheryl, I thought about you when making my post above, and lumped you in my mind into that narrow quadrant of decent folks who wind up in bankruptcy proceedings through no intentional acts of their own.
Perhaps, though, given our current climate of corporate corruption and the blind eye our guvmint turns toward such matters, you might as well go live like a queen (charge plenty of cash on your way) and become just another one of those who smirks knowingly when your next bankruptcy judge rules you free and clear in a couple of well-spent years.
What's that? You have too much pride, too much integrity, to commit such a legal crime? Do you really want to wallow in "just getting by" honorably, knowing that citizens and corporations all around you are having it off bigtime on some imaginary "insurance" dime? Hah! The more fool you...
posted on February 10, 2004 04:22:51 PM new
No thanks. If I am going to be a crook I can do it big time not nickel and dime every seven years.
I was offered a job at $300k a year no tax - paid in cash and turned it down because it was crooked.
I sleep at night with no worry about being a slime ball. I may drive an old Honda instead of a new Mercedes - but is it really worth it to know you are a crook? And I say that not as a crook by some exotic legal reasoning but by my own moral sense. I can't make a living bring misery to others.
posted on February 10, 2004 04:35:52 PM new
plsmith
I thought about maxing all my cards before filing, but couldn't do it in good conscience. It took 6 months to save up enough money to even file for it. Thankfully, I didn't have to borrow money to file bankruptcy.
I will no longer use credit cards. I have my debit card and and that's it.
Well....if we pass a National Health Insurance program many of your US friends will be in the exact same shape
Linda
Part of my bankruptcy includes hospital bills I could not pay because I don't have health insurance. Heart disease and cancer run in my family, but can I afford to go get check ups for that? No, I cannot. You must have health insurance. That's the only reason I can see for you making such a big deal out of other's being able to get it. There is no excuse for the healthcare system in this country. It's shameful. We are the only industrialized nation that doesn't provide healthcare to it's citizens. But, that's another thread.
posted on February 10, 2004 04:46:55 PM new
Well, that just proves you're rare, Gravid.
Krafty made the point above a while ago that people who aren't in on the scam are destined to become victims of it (or something) ; my personal philosophy/belief system has extrapolated that notion to a realization that I wouldn't want to live in a world where the only way to "get ahead" was to cheat/take advantage of/etc. The fact that we seem to have arrived at such a juncture -- economically, morally, personally -- would tend to suggest that I'm not long for this world.
Better FedEx that case of Thin Ice if you find it, heh...
Edited to add: Right, Reamond. There were "career" bankrupts at the proceedings I attended. Incredible as it may seem, the majority of persons seeking "relief" when I sat in were second or third-time visitors to the court, and their debts were outrageous. And they were charged-off, wholesale.
If you've got the time, go sit in on bankruptcy hearings in your area; as I said, it's a most illuminating exercise...
Further edited to add: The way bankruptcy seemed to work best (for those with no scruples) was to have the whole family/extended family in on the act. Cousin Joe files one year, sister Sue files the next, Grandpa Jim files the third, and so on, so that there's a revolving, constantly renewable supply to the family trough of people who're no longer flagged as "risks" -- even though it is common practice amongst credit card issuers to ignore even those who've recently filed against them and aggressively seek their repeat business. Maybe we are dolts for not scamming the insurance companies who underwrite this crap...
[ edited by plsmith on Feb 10, 2004 04:53 PM ]
[ edited by plsmith on Feb 10, 2004 05:00 PM ]
posted on February 11, 2004 12:19:14 PM new
A new bill was introduced in Congress, which isn't unusual -- thousands are each year. Here's what is NOT usual: CNN Money reports that,
"'The Zero Down-Payment Act of 2004' would allow Federal Housing Administration (FHA) to offer a zero-down-payment product for first-time home buyers. 150,000 people who otherwise would not meet current FHA standards would qualify for this type of zero-down-payment mortgage... 'A lot of consumers have the income to make mortgage payments...but can't overcome the hurdle of a down-payment,' said a Sr. VP at the Mortgage Bankers Association".
Ironically, in an adjacent article CNN Money says that mortgage defaults are rising: "The market for foreclosed homes has grown in many parts of the country in recent years, thanks to unemployment and less stringent lending practices."
After reading this, you can’t help but ask one question. Given the uncertainty of job growth, record-high levels of consumer debt, increasing number of mortgage defaults, and pages of other "shaky" economic data, is this the time to relax lending rules even more than they already are?
posted on February 11, 2004 12:35:34 PM new
Almost every couple my wife and I know was helped by one or both sets of parents to buy their home.
Other than ourselves we know one other couple who saved a down payment and bought a home entirely on their own merits.
At one time back near the turn of the last century home mortgages were simply unknown. No bank wanted that sort of business and it was considered a social embarrassment if you had a loan to buy a home. It just wasn't done. And if you were a member of the lower classes that managed to get a home loan it was such a big deal when you paid it off you held a party and burned the hated mortgage note.
posted on February 11, 2004 12:39:45 PM new
that explains why many foreclosures and distressed properties are FHA homes.
it has always been my understanding coming up with that 20% down is never easy,i often wonder where do people come up with the 20% down for a big house since our savings rate is so low??
-sig file -------the lobster in the boiling pot of water who tries to prevent the others from climbing out.
posted on February 11, 2004 01:41:21 PM new
20% ?? You can get conventional loans right now with 1-3% down. You have to pay PMI under 20% though.
edited to add- There were mortages at the turn of the century right up to the depression. The only thing was the mortgages were 5 or 7 years and were not amortized to be paid off in 5 to 7 years, the mortgages were continuosly re-newed.
The long term mortgages were part of the banking reforms.
[ edited by reamond on Feb 11, 2004 01:43 PM ]
posted on February 11, 2004 02:51:45 PM new
thanks to ginnie mae and fannie mae.
they make it possible for the banks to lend and lend again.
if down is 1-3%,thats smaller than closing costs!!
i am hearing report that all over the country as the builders can build bigger and better houses in subdivsions for less,the older houses in less desirable locations are losing values.
makes me wonder with more jobs leaving the countries,can we still count on our house to appreciate ,like what i saw in the 80s when oldies cashed in their old houses in nj and ny and take the money to florida,buy a condo and bank the rest.
-sig file -------the lobster in the boiling pot of water who tries to prevent the others from climbing out.
posted on February 11, 2004 02:53:34 PM new
And if they decided they didn't want to renew they could take the house real easy. That is why it was so hated to have a mortgage. You could be required to pay the balloon. better know your banker and trust him as a straight guy. Would you trust your current bank that far?
Some things really are deflating.
Other things are still suffering inflation.
The trick is knowing what.
I know a guy that just got burnt BIG because he was offered a 'deal' on some exotic cars.
Now he is driving a Ferrari he couldn't afford because he didn't dump it as fast as the other three he took a loss on. The guy who sold them say the market soften.
I'm sweating trying to figure if I should go sell some gold right now or wait for the election.
Anybody wanna give me some free advice?
posted on February 11, 2004 03:17:04 PM new
if you need the money,no one can wrong you for selling.
but long term trend of gold is UP.
thru out the 80s and 90s when we have inflation,gold was in the gutters.
i finally learn why,as long as us dollar is a safe haven,it is better to hold us dollar than gold.
now of couse with the huge deficit and the fact we dont know when we can pull out of iraq,and jobs are leaving the country and we are a nation of spenders not savers,the greenback is not as attractive as before.
besides the euro is gaining strength,why i dont know,the europeans have the same problem with india and china as we do,except they are not spending on war.
how are you holding your gold-gold buillion,gold nuggets or gold mining company shares??
-sig file -------the lobster in the boiling pot of water who tries to prevent the others from climbing out.
posted on February 11, 2004 05:07:11 PM new
have you looked into selling your saudi gold on ebay,it is my experience middle eastern jewelry is much sought after on ebay,but whether you will get the right price is another matter.
as chinese become more affluent,they want to buy gold jewelry,18k and up.
indians like gold as well,but when they said gold,they mean gold with precious stones such as ruby and saphire and pearls,and they prefer 22k and up gold.
-sig file -------the lobster in the boiling pot of water who tries to prevent the others from climbing out.
posted on February 11, 2004 05:35:17 PM new
I picked out a few nice 30+ and 40+ gram pieces and listed them for about 15% over spot and got not a nibble. Nothing I have tried to sell on eBay lately has done well and at one time I was selling a couple thousand a week.
I don't really need to sell them - they were a freebie - inherited anyway but of course if I think gold has peaked out I'd like to unload them rather than hold for a long uncertain time.
My wife just doesn't like the stuff at all. It's old lady jewery to her except for a few really delicate screw back earrings with turquise, carnelian or pearls. Ethnic looking stuff. I was tempted to just have it recast as one eyeball knocking anchor chain for myself but I have a square loop in loop 18Kt chain my wife gave me for our 25th anniversary I almost never take off. I usually make three loops and wear it like a bracelet if I have a chest x-ray or something but they made me take it off to go in surgery. I find I have an almost superstiteous dislike of taking it off.
posted on February 11, 2004 06:08:36 PM new
thats ebay for you,you listed them over spot and they want it below spot.
there is a shop on rubylane called ethnice treasures,she sells ethnic jewelry and has connection in north africa,may be you can ask her if she wants them.
no,i dont think gold has peaked.
but i notice the middle eastern people in this country are not doing well,their small business are hurting and they are having money problem.
-sig file -------the lobster in the boiling pot of water who tries to prevent the others from climbing out.
posted on February 11, 2004 06:42:19 PM new
We had a small gold store near us in Troy MI that sold mostly to the Indian community and it was by appointment only - 22 and 24Kt stuff. Don't know how they got in but three armed robbers cleaned them out a couple months ago.
That was just when we thought things were starting to settle down. Another big firm before that in a Troy office building would only buzz you in if they liked the looks of you, but the silly people had glass doors and when the robbers came they just opened up with a full auto weapon and destroyed the doors in one short burst. Oops. It sort of amused me they refused me entry one time when I was looking to buy an anniversary gift for my wife. Guess I looked like a bad un.
posted on February 11, 2004 07:24:28 PM new
Stop - where are you and what types of businesses are you referring to?
I think many businesses are having problems right now but I can tell you Chaldean community around here is kicking butt when many others are having problems. They have great business modules. Their businesses are outside the area where most of the community has chosen to live so that they draw from other communities while also drawing from those within their community who are fiercly supportive of each other.
My favorite mom & pop type grocery store is owned by a Chaldean family. I have continued shopping there despite having moved farther away because they go the extra mile. They place the special orders, the do the special cuts and when pomegrante season was dying down one of the brothers stashed a few away for me in the back to service my addiction and then made sure they had plenty of plain Pom (I don't like the combo versions...yukky swwet!) on hand when the supply dried up.
Most of the businesses I deal with regularly are Latino or Chaldean owned. Hands on dealing with the owners who give it the personal touch is still a valued comodity. There are a lot of high end restaraunts moving in downtown with the new ballpark opening this season and the infamous Gaslamp District which has somewhere in the vacinity of 60 restaurants in a 8 block area but the hardest place to get into almost every night is a store front sushi bar four blocks away with the neighborhood mascot homeless guy sleeping 4 feet from the door becuase great product and great people will win out every time.
(By the way - for whoever it was that said they watched Sci Fi Channel - the guy in the Mad House ads with the facial tattoing and muliple piercings owns a tattoo shop next door to said Sushi bar - I freaked when I saw him in that ad but it does explain why he has been MIA the past month or so)
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
posted on February 11, 2004 07:25:13 PM new
i have been to a jewelry store on higher floor of a commercial building in hong kong.they will first look at you tru the peeping hole,and then you walk into the first room and there are 2 armed guards sitting around and the jewerly is in the second room/
i hope the indians have insurance.
-sig file -------the lobster in the boiling pot of water who tries to prevent the others from climbing out.
posted on February 11, 2004 07:48:52 PM new
fenix-
i am outside houston but i run all my errands in the city.the busiest street running east and west of the city is called westheimer rd,lined with shops and strip malls,many of the storefronts are empty.
my hair guy is middle eastern and he just cant make it on his own,his overhead is like 2500 a month and he is inside an office building,who is going to find him.
his regular customers who are middle eastern family of 3-5 used to get haircuts from him,they are moving out of town and so right there he does not just lose one customer,he lost the whole family.
so now he went to work for an iranian couple who runs a fancy spa and beauty salon,the whole work,they even have alcove for dining,they will order the food for you and you can eat there and get wrapped,manicure,pedicure,sauna and massage etc.
unfortunately i dont see any customer??i guess back in the 80s with the fall of shah of iran,many upper class iranians came here and they can afford to spend a few hundred dollars pampering themselves.but where are they now??
houston is very diversed with ethnic neighborhoods-vietnamese,chinese,mexican and indian and middle eastern.most of their business really come from their own people,not the white americans.some places it is cash only,no credit cards.
what is chaldean?sounds like shakespeare??
the biggest problem for retailers is rent,you must make enough to pay rent first,sometimes if you are luckt to meet rent,there is just not much left to take home.
yes they do have a cc swiping machine but they said it is borken and they tape over it,boo,they cancel their account and now they will risk taking personal checks.
-sig file -------the lobster in the boiling pot of water who tries to prevent the others from climbing out.
posted on February 11, 2004 08:22:47 PM new
Stop - Chaldean are Catholic Iraqis. I honestly do not know the origin of the name. I have had some very interesting conversations with a couple of them. While they are all glad that Saddam is no longer in control they all seem to share a common giggle at the idea that he was in bed with Bin Laden. My favorite comment was "Don't they know that nobody trusted him, he was an evil man loyal and helpful only to himself."
As for your friend with the salon - you are right that he had a very bad location. Although salons value their regulars they live and die by walk-in unless they have a very big name. One of my clients owns a salon downtown and when her side of the street was blocked off for two months because of road and sidewalk upgrades she had a 70% drop in business. Luckily she has a very understanding landlord. Also when the economy drops so does luxury items like hair and nails. Every six week trim and color touch ups becomes every couple months or so and acrylic fills wait 3 weeks rather than 2. It's a rough business and I don't envy anyone in it. Your friend is not alone but the one thing they need to do is find a marketing concept that brings in a more diverse crowd while still being available to their core customers.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
[ edited by Fenix03 on Feb 12, 2004 01:15 AM ]
posted on February 11, 2004 08:29:13 PM new
I don't know how close you are to the family that owns the spa but I can tell you that one thing that has proven extremely helpful to one of the local spas here is dedicating one day a month to free services to cancer patients. they have networked with some of the local cancer wards for reccomendations for people that could use a little good old fashioned pampering. The patients are given a day where they get pampered and treated like queens, an opportunity to get together with others who are going thru the same ordeal and the spa has benefitted from a great deal of positive publicity for these days from local news services. My friend donates services to women coming out of recovery programs that are setting them up with job interviews and such. There are a couple services that provide outfits for interviews and such, she helps them with hair and nails and then ends up with full time regular clients who are very loyal to those that helped them find a hand up.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
posted on February 12, 2004 06:21:57 AM new
the iranian spa salon is on westheimer in the same shoppping centre as la madeleine ,an upscale french eatery.
my hairguy used to have a store facing the street,thats how he got my attention,but the landlord wants the space for a CPA firm,so he moved to inside building.now the cpa firm deal fell thru and another salon is moving in,so he figured this is the end of his business.
but now he is working for an upscale place and the rent is 10k,he is telling his clients who follow him that they now have to pay more,would you pay more for the same service just because the guy went to work for someone else??
at one time,he talked about using his home garage to do business with the middle eastern clients who cant afford to pay salon prices,so he has a two tier system going.
you want to hear how frugal people have become,a german lady in chicago will bring her own hair color to a mexican lady and have her apply it in her garage for 8 dollars.
yeah,mess up other people's garage and get better application for 8 bucksZ!!
anyone who thinks price of services and goods are going back to the 80s better think again.
-sig file -------the lobster in the boiling pot of water who tries to prevent the others from climbing out.
posted on February 12, 2004 06:45:11 AM new
fenix,
dedicating one day to pamper cancer patients may turn the regular clients off,i dunno.iranian princes and princesses are pretty snobbish people.
-sig file -------the lobster in the boiling pot of water who tries to prevent the others from climbing out.
posted on February 12, 2004 07:42:13 AM new
gravid-- If you think the economy is in a deflation mode, sell the gold as its price will deflate too. Cash will actually gain value as prices decline. I would also sell off any assets that could deflate and bank the cash.
If you think the economy will go into inflation, hold the gold as it will increase in value as cash actually loses value.
I'm betting on deflation. I sold all my gold at $390.
The deficit spending, unemployment, and record low interest rates all point toward deflation. If the economy were moving in the "right" direction, inflation would be a problem and interest rates would have already started going up. Businesses are not borrowing money either.
I see as similar to 1929 only due to the Fed and other regluatory agencies, it is slow motion.
We have excess capacity in nearly every sector. Either we need to consume more or the economy detracts and prices deflate.
I don't think more consumption will occur as the American consumer appears to be tapped out.
Even the tax cuts did little to help. They caused a small blip and ran the deficit way up.
There is an outside chance that these third world countries that we are exporting jobs to might kick in and start consuming. But it could not be much because they simply do not have enough disposable income to consume like we do. They wouldn't be buying American goods either-- theu simply can not afford them.
Prices and wages can only go down in this economy.
posted on February 12, 2004 08:12:48 AM new
Last Friday, the Department of Labor (DOL) reported the January unemployment rate at 5.6%, "down from recent highs of 6.3% in June 2003." Economists sighed that hiring in January was slower than expected... but stocks rallied on Friday anyway.
Let's take a closer look at these labor statistics. A New York Times column observed yesterday:
"Since the recovery officially began in November 2001, [payroll survey] employment has actually fallen by 0.5%, while the working-age population has increased about 2.4%. The only seemingly favorable statistic is the unemployment rate, which has recently fallen to 5.6%... But how is that possible, when employment has grown more slowly than the population, or even declined? The answer is that people aren't counted as unemployed unless they're looking for work, and a growing fraction of the population isn't even looking."
Bingo. USA Today adds: "[Annualized], about 4.7 million Americans want jobs but are not looking for work, up from 4.6 million in January of 2003."
True, in their January 2004 report, the DOL doesn’t count "not looking" Americans as unemployed: "The number of persons who were marginally attached to the labor force totaled about 1.7 million in January... These individuals wanted and were available to work... They were not counted as unemployed because they did not actively search for work in the 4 weeks preceding the survey."
Interesting. Why wouldn’t the DOL count them? Add these 1.7 million “marginally attached” to the official number of 8.3 million, and you get 10 million jobless. That's a 6.7% unemployment rate! Quite a difference from the official 5.6% statistic.
But let’s not dwell on the reasons for the DOL's "fuzzy math." In his upbeat report before Congress, Mr. Alan Greenspan touted the "impressive gains'' of the U.S. economy. So the real question is, why, oh why, aren't companies hiring if the economy is doing so well?
The reason for no new jobs? Companies are easily meeting demand with the U.S. employees they have. Also look at the U.S. factory capacity utilization, it is low. Companies are also holding back creating any jobs in the US until they are certain that the jobs can not be moved to a cheaper labor market. Why go through the hiring and lay-off expences when the job will end up in China or India anyway ?
