plsmith
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posted on February 12, 2004 08:35:48 AM new
" ...one thing that has proven extremely helpful to one of the local spas here is dedicating one day a month to free services to cancer patients. "
That is such smart, good business. Really enjoyed that post, Fenix. 
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stopwhining
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posted on February 12, 2004 09:37:01 AM new
i just returned from the far east-many unemployed people in hong kong,displaced by mainland chinese .BUT,mainland chinese firms need managers to manage the huge work force,so those hk managers who have management skills and willing to travel get good job and good benefits working in china.
English is also a language not well spoken among mainland chinese,since they deal with foreigners so much,those who are well versed in both chinese and english shine.The hong kong chinese once again get jobs.
life is interesting,when one door shuts,other doors open.
back in 80s recession,american cattlemen found that beef jerky is a sought after snack in asia,so spice it up and make beef jerky a la oriental style,which means plenty of soy sauce.
japanese are curious of american indian arts and cultures,so what do you know,indian artifacts and jewelry sell well in japan.
some jobs cannot be moved overseas,if you have a plumbing problem,you cannot send your house to india,same with window washing or housecleaning or babysitting or piano lessons.
-sig file -------the lobster in the boiling pot of water who tries to prevent the others from climbing out.
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Helenjw
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posted on February 12, 2004 10:08:34 AM new
" ...one thing that has proven extremely helpful to one of the local spas here is dedicating one day a month to free services to cancer patients. "
Right. I suppose that's really good advertising. I wonder if it's also IRS deductible.
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stopwhining
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posted on February 12, 2004 10:21:32 AM new
helen,
if there is anything to deduct from?
i have a feeling this iranian spa is going under.
-sig file -------the lobster in the boiling pot of water who tries to prevent the others from climbing out.
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Helenjw
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posted on February 12, 2004 10:29:34 AM new
I am suspicious whenever I see a business offering "free" services...to anybody.
I understood that Fenix was talking about a spa in her neighborhood...not Iran.
[ edited by Helenjw on Feb 12, 2004 10:33 AM ]
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plsmith
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posted on February 12, 2004 10:40:46 AM new
Why, Helen? Does it make the services less valuable if they are considered a charitable donation (and can be claimed as such on tax forms) ?
Or is it that you suspect the "free" services offered to some will result in your paying higher fees to cover the costs of them?
Were there lumps in your oatmeal this morning?
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Helenjw
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posted on February 12, 2004 10:58:45 AM new
Pat. I simply question the seemingly altruistic service offered by this business.
I am interested in whether or not the media publicity or advertising is an IRS deductible expense.
Do you believe that the spa business is simply suffering a loss.
This, Pat is a question about a business practice that interests me. I have no ulterior motive such as you suggest. I don't use spas.
Helen
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plsmith
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posted on February 12, 2004 11:16:40 AM new
I have no idea if that particular spa business is suffering a loss, nor does it matter to me if that is/is not tied to its free day of services for cancer patients. I think it's a great idea and I would imagine that if it was a lucrative business and/or tax ploy, many more service-oriented companies would be taking advantage of it.
Also, I gathered from the way Fenix worded her post that the publicity surrounding "free day" has been generated in the form of human-interest stories; ergo, underwritten by the local newspapers that are always on the lookout for such "fluff".
I wasn't "implying" anything in my first two questions, btw; you didn't answer them, anyway.
I don't use spas, either; what difference does that make? Is it relevant?
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stopwhining
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posted on February 12, 2004 11:35:06 AM new
helen,
i am referring to our local spa run by iranian,i doubt if they have considered donating one day service free to cancer patients or just anyone.
10 k rent plus salary plus utilities and insurance is what they have on their mind,balance it with dwindling client base.
-sig file -------the lobster in the boiling pot of water who tries to prevent the others from climbing out.
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Helenjw
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posted on February 12, 2004 11:55:00 AM new
First Question"Why, Helen? Does it make the services less valuable if they are considered a charitable donation (and can be claimed as such on tax forms) ?"
Why should the quality of the services of this business be affected by the cost or taxable status. I explained the reason for my question. I am simply interested in that business practice and how it affects profits...not quality of service.
Second Question"Or is it that you suspect the "free" services offered to some will result in your paying higher fees to cover the costs of them?"
"I don't use spas, either; what difference does that make? Is it relevant?"
My response "I don't use spas", was in answer to your remark..."Or is it that you suspect the "free" services offered to some will result in your paying higher fees to cover the costs of them?"
Bolding mine to clarify.
Since I don't use spas, that would did not motivate my first question but it is an interesting possibility as far as my interest in the practice is concerned.
Helen
[ edited by Helenjw on Feb 12, 2004 11:56 AM ]
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Helenjw
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posted on February 12, 2004 11:59:51 AM new
stopwhining
We are discussing a spa that Fenix mentioned on the previous page located in her neighborhood in the U.S.
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stopwhining
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posted on February 12, 2004 12:00:24 PM new
do i smell a cat fight coming?should i bring out my popcorn??
-sig file -------the lobster in the boiling pot of water who tries to prevent the others from climbing out.
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plsmith
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posted on February 12, 2004 12:30:11 PM new
Nah, Stopwhining, this isn't even a blip. Helen and I have shown time and again that we can play in the dirt and then go teeter-totter happily.
Sorry, Helen, I should've reworded my second question thus:
Or is it that you suspect the "free" services offered to some will result in other customers paying higher fees to cover the costs of them?
You've said several different things (and I'm pasting 'em here in order so you can get a sense of my confusion) :
"I am suspicious whenever I see a business offering "free" services...to anybody. "
"I simply question the seemingly altruistic service offered by this business.
I am interested in whether or not the media publicity or advertising is an IRS deductible expense. "
"I am simply interested in that business practice and how it affects profits...not quality of service. "
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Helenjw
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posted on February 12, 2004 12:45:49 PM new
Pat,
I think that you and most other posters reading this thread understand my comments.
Maybe *your* oatmeal had lumps today, Pat.
Don't be such a chicken ****.
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plsmith
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posted on February 12, 2004 12:55:33 PM new
No, Helen, I really don't get it! Call me a dumb ****
Let me try asking one more time, just because you're such a good sport:
What aspect(s) of this free service being offered to cancer patients do you think lends itself to tax-breaks? And, if a free mudbath is somehow 501c eligible, why is that any different (as in, more significant) than cash donations made to non-profits (and written-off down the road) ?
I hate oatmeal...
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Helenjw
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posted on February 12, 2004 01:23:14 PM new
Pat,
The thing that I *don't get* is why I posted that question about taxes on this chat board. Why oh why didn't I just pick up the phone and dial the IRS.
I'll try just one more time to tell you what I was thinking. The thread is about "Making Ends Meet". Does it make sense that a business trying to make ends meet would give away money in the form of cash - or services with no concern about the substantial loss that a day's profit might incur?
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Fenix03
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posted on February 12, 2004 01:25:00 PM new
Just for clarification...
Services are not tax deductable. Tangible items used in the service are (the masque, mud, any single use materials) but not the service itself. Also, in order for them to be able to deduct even the materials costs they would have to be donating the services thru a legally registered charity organization which they do not.
They started the monthly tradition after seeing how a friend of one of the employees who was going thru chemo reacted to having a day of being treated as a woman rather than a cancel patient.
The spa was financially secure at the time they started the tradition but one of the results of the positive publicity they have gained from this practice is that as other similar business are seeing a drop off in clientel they still have a full book. It was started as an altruistic endevour and don't think they actually got publicity for it until a story during cancer awareness month a couple years ago. Of course though after the news pieces more people knew about their services and had their name in their head so it ended up being free advertising.
My friend that donates services does it because she came out of recovery and knows how hard it is to get your feet back on the ground and how uplifing such a simple thing as a great manicure and a new do can be for your self image.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
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Fenix03
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posted on February 12, 2004 01:34:06 PM new
::i doubt if they have considered donating one day service free to cancer patients or just anyone.
10 k rent plus salary plus utilities and insurance is what they have on their mind,balance it with dwindling client base.::
This mentality has always amazed me. I had a client that I was working with trying to help the market their business. Everything I suggested to them, even things as simple a target distribution of flyers in the area they turned down because of the expense (we are talking less than $400 here folks). I kept asking how he thought he was going to build a successful business if no one knew he was there.
Good marketing is finding a way to get the biggest bang for your buck and in the case of the spa - all it would take is a discreet call to the stations and at least one would show up and I think that when you figure the actual cost to the spa vs the value of a profile on a evening news broadcast you are definately getting a huge bang for the buck.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
[ edited by Fenix03 on Feb 12, 2004 01:36 PM ]
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plsmith
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posted on February 12, 2004 01:46:17 PM new
Ohhhhh... okay, now I get it, Helen. Heck, you stick to topics in a way I don't. I go with each individual post and rarely confine myself to interpreting them within the context of the entire thread.
"The thing that I *don't get* is why I posted that question about taxes on this chat board. Why oh why didn't I just pick up the phone and dial the IRS. "
Ah, but if you had, we would've missed this delightful exchange... 
Fenix, thanks for those details. I do think it's a great idea and if it's helped this salon stay in business, I say "Good!"
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stopwhining
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posted on February 12, 2004 01:49:01 PM new
true,you need to spend money to make money.
there are various ways to spend that advertising dollars,it could be senior special on thursday of the week.
it could be mom and daughter day where one of them is free.
it could be winetasting party .
it is just getting harder and harder to run a business profitably,only time will tell.
-sig file -------the lobster in the boiling pot of water who tries to prevent the others from climbing out.
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Helenjw
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posted on February 12, 2004 03:18:13 PM new
" I can tell you that one thing that has proven extremely helpful to one of the local spas here is dedicating one day a month to free services to cancer patients"
However the spa was able to receive significant help while providing free services to cancer patients is remarkable. I agree with Pat..That's "good".
Helen
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plsmith
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posted on February 12, 2004 03:19:37 PM new
See, Stopwhining? Helen and I are off to the teeter-totter now...
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Helenjw
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posted on February 12, 2004 03:25:43 PM new
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Helenjw
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posted on February 12, 2004 03:49:57 PM new
Pat,
I'm looking forward to listing your various comments and answers to questions out of thread context. What a cool technique.
Ha ha ha.
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