posted on March 5, 2004 07:15:50 AM new
I don';t see much tere about Kerry. It's all about Bush. As usual, Democrats have no positions, no arguments. Just hatred for Bush.
From the article:
"In the 2004 election, we must defeat Bush no matter what. "
"If We Don't Defeat Bush II in 2004, This Country Will Go Down the Tubes"
"Defeating Bush and electing John Kerry President in 2004 must be our number one priority.'
'we must awaken American voters to the realization that Bush has done"
"vote for anybody but Bush"
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We do not stop playing because we grow old. We grow old because we stop playing -- Anonymous
posted on March 5, 2004 07:20:54 AM new
Bush will win so you might as well suck it up and learn to live with it.
Unless something drastic happens I just can not Kerry pulling it off.
Thats life in the fast lane.
posted on March 5, 2004 07:44:22 AM new
I'm afraid you're right. Bush probably will win. Unfortunately, if he does, many Americans won't be able to "live with it"--they'll be dying with it in Iraq or whatever other war Bush gets us into during the next four years. Of the rest, well, we'll have to "learn to live" with the ever increasing debt that Bush is piling up, a growing number of rights being infringed upon, and the increasing animosity of other nations being pushed around by his administration.
Oh, joy
******
Censorship, like charity, should begin at home; but unlike charity, it should end there --Clare Booth Luce
posted on March 5, 2004 08:26:56 AM new
so smart guys, seeing as you know the future, tell me and others why Satan Bush will win....let's hear some real solid reasons............
posted on March 5, 2004 09:08:45 AM new
Solid reason -
Look at the people on this board.
They will accept almost any silly explaination for obvious lies and are quick to accept any personal loss of freedom if they are promised security. There are huge numbers of people who adore authority and are in awe of these people like they were little gods. I have to say they were well conditioned to unthinking obediance by the schools. Bunch of hall monitors and suck ups in adult life too.
But realistically - it is a choice like which eye you would like to get poked out.
No matter which you pick the big companies and super rich will get the lion's share of the economy as always and it will simply be a choice of how badly you get raped.
Nobody is going to make any sweeping changes.
Even as far as Iraq - nobody is going to pull out suddenally now that there is a commitment.
I'd love to see some basic changes but it isn't going to happen.
An example - they are asking for our real estate taxes 6 months early this year here in MI and in the three county area they say about 7,000 people will lose their homes because of being unable to pay.
I'd like to see a constitutional ammendmanet to remove all primary family dweelings from the tax roles so a retiree is secure in their home. As it is right now you never own your home. You simply rent it from the government.
posted on March 5, 2004 09:27:23 AM new
"tell me and others why Satan Bush will win"
Because of asinine statements like that. I'm sure you are a very intelligent person, but statements like that make you appear to be a complete idiot. Who's worse the Democrat or the complete idiot that supports him? This is not meant as a personal attack, but you should really pay attention to how your hatred shows so obviously.
If you could logically explain WHY KERRY IS BETTER, I might be pursuaded. See the other thread about all my complaints about Bush. He aini't perfect. He's not even all that good. But Kerry stands for NOTHING.
All I see is the Dems Hating Bush. Give me something better and I might switch.
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We do not stop playing because we grow old. We grow old because we stop playing -- Anonymous
posted on March 5, 2004 09:32:59 AM new
gravid
This is what it all comes down to.
But realistically - it is a choice like which eye you would like to get poked out. No matter which you pick the big companies and super rich will get the lion's share of the economy as always and it will simply be a choice of how badly you get raped.
This I can agree with. I makes no differance what I think or do as the big money always wins.
Right now it looks good for Bush and I can not see this changing anytime soon.
I would like to see a ballot that states "none of the above" but that is not going to happen in my lifetime.
posted on March 5, 2004 10:12:33 AM new If We Don't Defeat Bush II in 2004
When did you Canadians get the RIGHT to vote in American elections Sky?
"An old, long-whiskered man once said to Teddy Roosevelt: 'I am a Democrat, my father was a Democrat, my grandfather was a Democrat.' Roosevelt then said: 'Then if your father had been a horse thief and your grandfather had been a horse thief, you would be a horse thief?'" --Will Rogers
posted on March 5, 2004 10:25:46 AM newThey will accept almost any silly explaination
That may be true in some cases, gravid. But I don't believe that's the norm.
I see it as people saying, "Okay...the dems are blaming Bush for this and that." But then when they tune in and listen to what Kerry's offering.....he's only blaming what's been done. He says he will get American's back to work. But have you heard him say HOW he's going to do that? I haven't. The list goes on and on.
So rather than being 'sheep/hall monitors' as so many have been accused of being, why can't some people see those that those same people are judging that Kerry [dems] are offering few solutions to most of the issues he/they bit$h about.
posted on March 5, 2004 10:56:22 AM new
bear asks if i am canadian....says who, what proof do you have that i am canadian.....let's see some proof....and if you use the email as proof.....think again...that's if you can think...which i know you can't.......
as for using " Satan Bush "...it is a well know fact that Bush is a Satanist..." Skull and Bones " membership...read up the skull and bones....the man is a christian like i am Bill Gates...........
Laughter Of The Gods
The more I look at the chaotic mess George W. Bush is making in every blessed corner of the world, the more I am inclined to take a closer look at the God in whose name he claims to be making it.
Just who IS this God that chats up brazen hypocrites and zealots in our midst -- whipping them into a frenzy of pharisaic attempts to strangle democracy at home and abroad? This awesome creature is on a murderous rampage in the Middle East, Africa, South America and -- as Donald Rumsfeld would say -- east, west, north and south somewhat. Armed and jackbooted, Bush's flinty-hearted Diety bears no resemblance to the compassionate and forgiving God in whom Christians have put their faith for more than two millenia.
More and more innocents are being herded onto the world's killing fields by the deliberate actions of a Christian nation -- in the name of its Christian God. What blasphemy! If Christians are unable to recognize the difference between good and evil; if they cannot see that those we crush under our heel are also God's creation -- then all those hours spent in Sunday School, church services, summer camp and "all day singing and dinner on the grounds" picnics were a sorry waste of time. The nature of a man is revealed by the company he keeps. Those who preach that maiming and killing terrified men, women and children is "God's will" -- who cover up the slaughter of their own citizens and who topple other regimes by force or farce -- are evil men who cavort with evil gods. And every single Christian in this country knows it.
The Beast may not yet be loosed upon the world, but his minions are having one hell of a good time, and laughing their asses off in the process. By joining forces in a destructive "means justifies the ends" crusade to both control and convert the world, the Neoconservatives and Religious Right have created a playground for wicked gods. Each needs the other to achieve its goals. And the glue that holds them together is a man whose own words indict him as the proverbial village idiot who has no clue about either means or ends, but who serves at this point in history as both the enabled and the enabler.
The Neocons
I have written so much about this ungodly bunch I sometimes feel like a rabid Sam Kinison, standing in the breach, screaming into the wind. Except for God's coat-tails they intend to ride in on, the Almighty does not enter into their equation for world domination.
Their names are familiar -- Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld, Richard Perle, Paul Wolfowitz, William Kristol, Michael Ledeen...They tower contemptuously above God, their plan for a new world order far grander than His, and their fingerprints are all over the tens of thousands of innocents who have been killed, injured or horribly maimed.
They are everywhere -- from the Project for a New American Century (PNAC) and other right-wing think tanks such as the American Enterprise Institute (AEI) -- to the Pentagon, State Department and White House. And, in their own words, they have only just begun.
Ledeen is possibly the most dangerous and influential neocon of all the Iran-Contra madmen who are back in power. In his book, Machiavelli on Modern Leadership, Ledeen says, "Creative destruction is our middle name. We do it automatically...It is time once again to export the democratic revolution."
"God," Ledeen explains, "understands that all men are evil, and the only way to achieve peace is through total war." Ledeen believes "the sparing of civilian lives cannot be the total war's first priority...The purpose of total war is to permanently force your will onto another people."
In the unlikely event that Americans emerge from their stupor before Ledeen and his New World Order is upon them, I hope they realize that following the hostile and unfamiliar God for whom Ledeen speaks would be kind of like walking a mad dog on a leash...
The God People
The Religious Right is also obsessed with power and control, and the majority of its members are living proof that, like the ancient Euripides wrote -- "Whom the gods wish to destroy, they first make mad." God walks with them; talks to them and issues militant edicts to us through them. Most are Republicans -- proud "born again" Christians who speak deleriously of "God's will and the blood of Jesus Christ" -- but their true religion is cold, hard politics.
They walk the halls of Congress, and are by far the most powerful voting bloc in America. When they speak, presidents listen -- constitutional amendments are proposed, freedoms are lost, liberties dry up...
According to a project by TheocracyWatch.org, " The Rise of the Religious Right in the Republican Party," they propose bills that are "anti-women, anti-labor and anti-civil rights. Their legislation opposes finance campaign reform; environmental protection; gun control; social justice for the poor; public education; teaching evolution; human sexuality; and a separation of church and state." The report says their bills "show a disregard for the U.S. Constitution, and finally, Democracy itself. Bills coming from the Religious Right favor the wealthy and large corporations. The ultimate political goal is to make this country a Christian nation." (Emphasis added)
We smile and shake our heads at the outlandish claims of TV evangelists Pat Robertson, to whom God confided recently that "Bush will win the 2004 election in a blowout," or Jerry Falwell, who believes the "idea that religion and politics don't mix was invented by the Devil to keep Christians from running their own country." We even giggled when Attorney General John Ashcroft assured graduates at Bob Jones University that "America has no king but Jesus."
Trust me -- these people are not funny.
For example, Tom Delay, Texas Republican and House Majority Leader, once told a group of evangelical Christians that God was "using him" to promote a biblical worldview. "Only Christianity offers a comprehensive worldview that covers all areas of life and thought -- every aspect of creation," DeLay said. "Only Christianity offers a way to live in response to the realities that we find in this world. Only Christianity." (Emphasis added) Like his counterparts, DeLay believes that fundamentalists should "overturn the separation of church and state and bring government under religious control."
And listen to Gary Potter, president of Catholics for Christian Political Action -- "When the Christian majority takes over this country, there will be no satanic churches, no more free distribution of pornography, no more talk of rights for homosexuals. After the Christian majority takes control, pluralism will be seen as immoral and evil and the state will not permit anybody the right to practice evil."
But few are more frightening than Oklahoma Senator James Inhofe who strode to the Senate chamber shortly after 9-11 to announce that the attacks were punishment by God because we were not sufficiently in awe of Israel. Inhofe said God told him Israel is "entitled" to the West Bank, and the U.S. should not pressure Ariel Sharon to stop killing Palestinians.
According to Inhofe, God angrily slung three airliners full of unsuspecting souls into the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, incinerating more than 3,000 innocent citizens, and furiously rammed another plane into the Pennsylvania countryside -- because America was not sufficiently subservient to Israel. Inhofe believes America got what it deserved, and we should heed God's "wake up call" lest He strike us again...
Brother James Inhofe -- just one reason we sleep with the lights on in Oklahoma...
The Chosen One
From Jesus is my philosopher to God is my co-pilot, George Bush has been nothing if not ghoulishly entertaining. Far more talented writers than I have gone completely berserk while attempting to explain what makes Bush tick. It's simple, really. The answer is Nothing. Nothing makes him tick. That's why he's the perfect foil for the warhawks and religious zealots.
Bush is a swaggering, paranoid, hubristic bully, consumed by an irrational sense of his own worth. Just your normal, run-of-the-mill Texas good ol' boy Republican -- with money. After carousing, falling down drunk, and failing at every business enterprise his daddy set up for him -- at the tender age of 40, Bush was "born again" and became the Lord's own most visible high-stepping 12-stepper. Fourteen years later, he was President of the United States. In his defense, I have to say Bush is acting no differently than any other 14-year-old spoiled bully would be expected to act under the same circumstances...
And he's a Believer. Bush believes what they tell him he believes, such as he was chosen by God to lead the Christians in a righteous war against Islam. Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia even blames God for his own deadly vote that thwarted democracy in 2000 and seized power from the people. Believing that Bush is serving by divine appointment, Scalia wrote in a May 2002 article, God's Justice and Ours that the government has a higher authority granted to it by God. He said unequivocally, "Government carries the sword as the minister of God, to execute wrath upon the evildoer..."
Much of Scalia's, and therefore Bush's, belief is based on, and his core speeches drawn from, the 13th Chapter of Romans, which admonishes citizens to "obey the government, for God is the one who has put it there." Punishment is swift and sure for those who refuse to "obey" the laws of the land, for the scripture says, "the policeman is sent by God to help you. But if you are doing something wrong, of course you should be afraid, for he will have you punished. He is sent by God for that very purpose..."
Bush shrugs aside wimps like Matthew, Mark, Luke and John who can't seem to get beyond love, kindness, helping the vulnerable, caring for the needy and the sheer compassion expounded by Jesus in His Sermon on the Mount, and seem to prattle on endlessly about salvation. Bush is also wont to deep-six most "Thou Shalt Nots," because, in Romans 13, it clearly says all ten commandments "are wrapped up in this one -- to love your neighbor as you love yourself..." It is the only law Christians need to obey -- other than, of course, those of the government and its Ashcroftian Mr. Policeman whom God has sent to punish them...
Americans who look at Bush and see either compassion or morality are severely suffering from optical delusion. This is a man who sets himself up as a purveyor of truth and knowledge, but who sees "thugs and killers, brutal dictators and barbarians" behind every tree, and is committed to not let "terriers and rogue nations hold this nation hostile." This is a man who declared war upon Islam --calling it a "crusade" -- from the pulpit of the National Cathedral rather than the Oval Office. This is a man who enjoys what he is doing in God's name, and who promises that he will not stop killing until the entire world is "safe."
The world cringes as George Bush, militant neocons and the completely mad religious right steer the Bush Ship of State toward the jagged shoals. God has left the building.
Is it any wonder the lesser gods are shrieking with laughter...?
written from an Oklahoma freelance writer, and a former US Army Public Information Officer
[ edited by skylite on Mar 5, 2004 11:01 AM ]
posted on March 5, 2004 11:01:42 AM new
skylite - Those type of arguments mean nothing....since more are aware Kerry also professes to be a 'man of faith' and is also a member of the Skull and Crossbones group.
How do you see it matters with one and not with the other?
posted on March 5, 2004 11:23:06 AM new
linda you are a woman i assume, maybe not.......my concern is you are being duped by people who care about themselves, money is their God...always was and will be...research linda, if you care....they use Christianity as a cover, for Satanist ways...i am not religious, but when people use religion to stifle free expression and at the same time murder children, which you linda condone, that to me is satanist...when christian politicians talk of war and preach Jesus in the same breath, my question is " WHEN AND WHERE IN THE BIBLE DOES JESUS SAY IT IS TIME TO KILL " AGAIN WHERE DOES JESUS SAY IT IS JUSTIFIFIED TO KILL ???? anybody want to answer that one.....
The Rise of the Religious Right in the Republican Party
posted on March 5, 2004 11:31:50 AM new
Now this I find scary! Does the term nut job mean anything? Raving lunatic is another.
But few are more frightening than Oklahoma Senator James Inhofe who strode to the Senate chamber shortly after 9-11 to announce that the attacks were punishment by God because we were not sufficiently in awe of Israel. Inhofe said God told him Israel is "entitled" to the West Bank, and the U.S. should not pressure Ariel Sharon to stop killing Palestinians.
According to Inhofe, God angrily slung three airliners full of unsuspecting souls into the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, incinerating more than 3,000 innocent citizens, and furiously rammed another plane into the Pennsylvania countryside -- because America was notsufficiently subservient to Israel.Inhofe believes America got what itdeserved, and we should heed God's "wake up call" lest He strike us again.
posted on March 5, 2004 11:34:05 AM newlinda you are a woman i assume You are correct.
my concern is you are being duped by people who care about themselves My concern is that you don't see this being the same no matter if they're reps or dems.
money is their God Money makes the world go 'round. All business people, politicans, etc....value money. Maybe too much...but that's no different between the two parties.
they use Christianity as a cover Skylite - what part of ALL our modern day Presidents have been Christian's don't you get?
but when people use religion to stifle free expression and at the same time murder children, which you linda condone, that to me is satanist Stifle free expression is a pretty broad statement...maybe you'd like to narrow it down?
And on murder.....let's get something straight here. I have NEVER said I condone the murder of children. PERIOD. Are you referring to abortions that those mainly on the left think are okay?
when christian politicians talk of war and preach Jesus in the same breath, my question is " WHEN AND WHERE IN THE BIBLE DOES JESUS SAY IT IS TIME TO KILL " AGAIN WHERE DOES JESUS SAY IT IS JUSTIFIFIED TO KILL Maybe you might want to email Kerry's office and ask him why, as a 'man of faith/Christian' he voted for the last Iraqi war?
posted on March 5, 2004 11:50:05 AM new
hey linda darling, i don't need to ask Kerry, it's your God Bush and his gang that keep talking about Jesus and war in the same breath which you Linda adore...you republicans are a scary group, my fear is that North America will be another Aushwictz concentration camp runned by zealots in the name of God, but really Satanists,...and you Linda will be one of those i think, that's if you don't wake up soon and smell the coffee,
i feel sorry for you Linda, you are probabily a decent person, but alas, many like you are just expendable for these rich elite,who don't even care about you, they are just using you, laughing all the way to the bank, got you confused and brainwashed....but you will see linda what i am saying is true, and you will remember Skylite.....it will come back to haunt you when my prophecies come true......
[ edited by skylite on Mar 5, 2004 11:50 AM ]
posted on March 5, 2004 12:01:05 PM new
No, skylite what I will remember about you is your hatred of a President, and most likely anyone religious, that has so blinded YOU that you cannot be objective on the issues.
Did it bother you so much when clinton was bombing those countries, and according to you killing children? Somehow I think I already know your answer.....it was okay then....but it's different somehow now.
Did it bother you clinton carried a Bible around with him most of his life? That he went to church all the time, that hillary went to Bible study in government buildings? Do you think they learned a different religion than President Bush has?
You give different standards to one than to the other. And that's what I'll also remember about you.
posted on March 5, 2004 06:08:55 PM newwhat part of ALL our modern day Presidents have been Christian's don't you get?
We know they've been Christian. The point you are missing, or perhaps approve of, is the fact that alone amongst all our presidents Bush is trying to make his brand of Christianity the law of the land. Only he is trying to change the Constitution to reflect his religious views. Only him.
Personally, I don't give a rat's patootie what religion our presidents follow now,in the past or in the future. They could be Christian, Jewish, Moslem, Hindu, Rastafarian or follow Voodoo for all I care. As long as they keep it to themselves and not try tomake the rest of us kowtow to it.
******
Censorship, like charity, should begin at home; but unlike charity, it should end there --Clare Booth Luce
posted on March 5, 2004 06:25:32 PM new
"They could be Christian, Jewish, Moslem, Hindu, Rastafarian or follow Voodoo for all I care. As long as they keep it to themselves and not try to..."
Once again, I don't think you understand the point of religion. It's not something you can turn off. It's part of WHO YOU ARE.
Clinton was a lip-service Christian, which is obvious from his various affairs. Bush simply BELIEVES in his religion.
And don't say it's a Republican thing. Jimmy Carter is one of the most religious men to ever hold the office.
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We do not stop playing because we grow old. We grow old because we stop playing -- Anonymous
posted on March 5, 2004 06:38:00 PM new
Many of our presidents have been very religious. However, they managed to refrain from trying to make everyone follow their particular sect. Our presidents have been Episcopalian, Presbyterian, Methodist, Baptist, Unitarian, Disciples of Christ, Dutch Reformed, Quaker, Catholic and Congregationalist/United Church of Christ, yet none of them tried to foist their brand of religion off on the rest of the country. See the difference?
Edited to stick spaces in, darn this keyboard!
******
Censorship, like charity, should begin at home; but unlike charity, it should end there --Clare Booth Luce
[ edited by bunnicula on Mar 5, 2004 06:39 PM ]
posted on March 5, 2004 07:12:51 PM new
I'm not sure. Why would God allow all these different religions to have such a high office in his holy nation? Which one is correct?
posted on March 5, 2004 07:26:28 PM new
Bunni: I'm not sure what part of his religion is Bush "foisting off" on us? Are you talking about gay marriage?
Every single version of Christianity on the face of the earth calls it a sin. And so do most non-Christian faiths.
Gravid: "Which one is correct?" They are all the same, barring a few minor details. If God exists, he's not going to nitpick over what kind of clothes people wear.
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We do not stop playing because we grow old. We grow old because we stop playing -- Anonymous
posted on March 6, 2004 08:15:47 AM new
Why Americans Must Vote For Kerry - vs- why his Democratic running mates thought you shouldn't.
[excerpts taken from the AP today]
John Kerry's been described as a waffler who blathers, a son of privilege who won't stand up to millionaires, a Washington insider who's a handmaiden to special interests and an inconsistent candidate whose word is no good.
All of that comes from fellow Democrats who ran against Kerry in the presidential primary race but now are pledged to help elect him president.
Here is what Wesley Clark had to say about Kerry (and fellow rival John Edwards) on Feb. 5: "The American people don't want another Washington insider who never plays it straight. They don't want a follower who makes decisions by licking his finger and sticking it up in the wind."
Edwards, known as the nice guy in the campaign, soft-pedaled his criticisms, but nonetheless was happy to cast the four-term Massachusetts senator as "somebody who spent most of their life in politics" and unlikely to bring about needed changes. Stressing his own working-class upbringing, Edwards argued on Feb. 24, "this is something that crowd in Washington just doesn't get."
Here's a sampling of what Dean had to say about Kerry in earlier days:
- "President Kerry. Please, spare us."
- "He's going to turn out to be just like George Bush."
-"John Kerry is part of the corrupt political culture in Washington."
-"It appears that his word is no good."
-"I'm just incensed by his hypocrisy."
Other Democratic also-rans now backing Kerry include Missouri Rep. Dick Gephardt and Connecticut Sen. Joe Lieberman. That would be the same Gephardt whose mailings said Kerry is "no friend to family farmers" and the same Lieberman who called Kerry a "waffler."
-------------
There are some of their words describing Kerry. Either they weren't being truthful when they made these statements [and many more] or they really believed what they said. Can't have it both ways, as they say.
Of course now - they're backing him - anyway.
Re-elect President Bush!!
[ edited by Linda_K on Mar 6, 2004 08:19 AM ]
posted on March 6, 2004 08:24:48 AM new
bunni - The point you are missing, or perhaps approve of, is the fact that alone amongst all our presidents Bush is trying to make his brand of Christianity the law of the land. Only he is trying to change the Constitution to reflect his religious views. Only him.
Okay, I agree that all presidents have their own agendas and work to support the views of those who put them in office....but then I'd be interested in understanding just how you see clinton's signing of DOMA differently please. To me the purpose was the same, keeping the defination of marrige 'one man and one woman'.
posted on March 6, 2004 08:47:39 AM new
You are making the assumption that I approved of what Clinton did regarding DOMA. I didn't.
As for the National Prayer Day thingie--well, I didn't think government should be doing that either--however you will notice that it was intended to be an interfaith observance. Not just Christian prayer, but Moslem, Jewish, Sikh, Hindu, Wiccan, etc. In fact, any religion that used prayer. Clinton wasn't pushing to have his religion's prayers forced on everyone.
******
Censorship, like charity, should begin at home; but unlike charity, it should end there --Clare Booth Luce
