posted on June 27, 2004 07:01:55 AM new
Shrek 2 or Fahrenheit 9/11?
Re-defeat Bush
------------------------------
June is Gay Pride Month
------------------------------
All animals are created equal, but some are more equal than others.
Change is constant. The history of mankind is about change. One set of beliefs is pushed aside by a new set. The old order is swept away by the new. If people become attached to the old order, they see their best interest in defending it. They become the losers. They become the old order and in turn are vulnerable. People who belong to the new order are winners.
James A Belaco & Ralph C. Stayer
posted on June 27, 2004 07:02:45 AM new
I saw "Day After Tomorrow" last week.
Fun movie, neat effects, STUPID logic. 3-1/2 Stars from me.
If you can't evacuate New York because of the bad weather, how's a guy supposed to WALK there (In enough snow to completely bury and hide a shopping mall from view) from Washington DC in a couple of days?
--------------------------------------
We do not stop playing because we grow old. We grow old because we stop playing -- Anonymous
posted on June 27, 2004 07:06:34 AM new
And yes, I *DO* know what you were really asking. If I wanted to support some Fat lazy good-for-nothing lying fat-cat, I WOULD go see Garfield The Movie.
--------------------------------------
We do not stop playing because we grow old. We grow old because we stop playing -- Anonymous
posted on June 27, 2004 07:17:59 AM new
Doesn't anyone wonder why the Republicans are trying to keep this film from being seen if it's all lies?????????
posted on June 27, 2004 07:24:15 AM new
For the same reason the liberal mainstream news media is so successful. The average American believes anything they see on screen.
Both sides take advantage of this fact.
--------------------------------------
We do not stop playing because we grow old. We grow old because we stop playing -- Anonymous
posted on June 27, 2004 07:27:47 AM new
I had planned on seeing it this weekend. But ran out of time. Still undecided between that, the notebook, ummm...there was another one or two also looked interesting but if I dont write them down I forget....oh white chicks! Supposed to be very funny
posted on June 27, 2004 07:36:37 AM new
Geeze, who has time? Between bike riding trips, parades that I have to march in, festivals that I have to tend booths in (D. Kucinich is up for re-election to Congress and I've been volunteering for some time now), etc., etc., etc., I'm lucky I even get to see my family. Not that that's always a bad thing, LOL! I spent yesterday at the Scottish games proudly wearing my heritage and laughing at the men in kilts that are too short for them. One did bend over and lift up his kilt during the games. Yes, they do wear underwear! LOL!
I do want to see Fahrenheit 9/11 and Shrek 2, though.
posted on June 27, 2004 07:54:19 AM new
Who goes to movies. Not me. I will NOT pay to see some stupid movie stars acting out parts and getting high wages.
I am not in a position or do I want to be to pay the HIGH prices at the box office. People complain that they are making minimum wage then spend their money on foolishness. The Actors and Actresses do not need or will they get my money. I haven't been to a movie or seen a movie in over 5 years and I intend not to go for a long time. I have better ways to spend my money. (necessities)
I hear Fahrenheit 11 is nothing but Liberal propaganda. Something more for crowfarm to Crow about. Tell us all about it I know your dieing to. Lucky us
posted on June 27, 2004 08:21:55 AM new
hey Cheryl, you know what else I got at that sale? A really cute scottish plate. Dowling? Downing? Forget, and have it wrapped in with the other stuff. (Figures I am either too early or too late to list things when they are in fresh in the public's mind somewhere!) But its an unusual plate from the 50ties-I think.
oh well, I'm sure somebody of Scottish heritage will think it's interesting when I get to listing it!
posted on June 27, 2004 08:45:12 AM new
haven't seen 9/11, probably won't until it's on DVD...Mr. Moore doesn't need to preach to the choir... I watch movies to have fun and escape for a bit... Harry Potter, on the other hand, was well worth the trip to town..
___________________________________
When a dog howls at the moon, we call it religion. When he barks at strangers, we call it patriotism. - Edward Abbey
posted on June 27, 2004 09:29:12 AM new Republicans react to 9/11 movie in Indiana...
But the overwhelming majority of moviegoers would sooner vote for Michael Moore than return Mr. Bush to office for a second term. They may not be Mr. Moore's most wished-for audience, but he would be heartened to know that at least a few Republicans emerged from theaters on Friday on wobbly pins.
"All the offhand remarks they caught Bush making, he wasn't very presidential," said Jerry Murrell, a retired stockbroker in Carmel and a Republican who voted for Mr. Bush in 2000. Mr. Murrell said that he had grave doubts about the war in Iraq, and that after seeing "Fahrenheit 9/11" his next vote "is going to take a lot of thought."
And in Pensacola, Fla., Monica Moody, a 20-year-old restaurant hostess who described herself as a conservative Republican, proved to be Mr. Moore's perfect target.
"Oh my goodness, I cried," Ms. Moody said. "I'm still trying to process everything. It really makes me question what I feel about the president. I'm still going to respect him as our president, but it makes me question his motives. Of course, I think that's the whole point of the film, to question his motives. But after watching it, I do question my loyalty to the president. And that's scary for me."
And an interesting discussion of these comments here.
posted on June 27, 2004 09:36:52 AM new
Helen, it was good to see so many young people seeing the movie, and, like Ms. Moody, waiting to see it BEFORE commenting on it.
posted on June 27, 2004 10:40:22 AM new
I went to see Fahrenheit 9/11 on Friday evening. The first evening show was sold out, so I had to wait for the next one. The theatre was packed. I had been planning to wait until today to see it, but I was reading that Republicans and other conservative groups were working to have the plugged pulled on the movie and I was afraid that if I didn't see it Friday I might not get to see it at all.
First off--yes the film is slanted. But I knew that it would be going into it. That only made me watch the film with a more critical eye.
And there are things to be critical about. The film is manipulative with viewers emotions. There are a couple of things I am sure were staged: the two Marine recruiters for instance--how likely is they would have allowed Moore to tag along with them like that, or been as blatant about their tactics if they had?
BUT: the most interesting thing is that most of the stuff in the film are things that are known by anybody who has read and remembered things Bush has done for the past four years. It's just that Bush & Co. have twisted and turned so much during that time that it is hard to remember, and some just don't want to.
Regarding the war in Iraq: Moore does blatantly play emotions--he shows an idyllic life in Iraq before our invasion thatdoesn't ring true. However, the hatred we are raising in that country against ourselves is not staged. We are shown soldiers that believe in what they are doing--but unlike our nightly news, we are also shown soldiers who don't know why they are there, don't want to be there, hate what they are doing, and have choice words about Rumsfeld and Bush.
It has its problems, but all-in-all this is a powerful film. It got an ovation when the screening ended, which is something that doesn't happen all that often.
Something to note: it seems my fears of not being able to see the film are a reality for some people in this country. I was reading the "Having Your Say" about this film on BBC News this morning and found this:
"I haven't seen the movie and probably won't get a chance to see it. You see in South Dakota (Republican stronghold) the movie conglomerates have decided not to show the film. The reason they gave was that it is a documentary film and documentary films do not do as well as films like "Spiderman". They claim that there was no politics behind the decision. I find it interesting that the film was given an "R" rating and that conservative groups are trying to stop advertisements for it claiming that showing Bush in the ads makes it a political campaign advertisement!!!
Pete, South Dakota, USA"
____________________
We are not afraid to entrust the American people with unpleasant facts, foreign ideas, alien philosophies, and competitive values. For a nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people. -- John F. Kennedy
posted on June 27, 2004 10:57:26 AM new
bunni says, "First off--yes the film is slanted. But I knew that it would be going into it. That only made me watch the film with a more critical eye.
And there are things to be critical about. The film is manipulative with viewers emotions. There are a couple of things I am sure were staged: the two Marine recruiters for instance--how likely is they would have allowed Moore to tag along with them like that, or been as blatant about their tactics if they had?""
Bunni, why would the recruiters object...they were recruiting in broad daylight in public...any one had the right to film them.
""BUT: the most interesting thing is that most of the stuff in the film are things that are known by anybody who has read and remembered things Bush has done for the past four years. It's just that Bush & Co. have twisted and turned so much during that time that it is hard to remember, and some just don't want to.""
That's very true, bunni, and there are so many more who just haven't taken the time to look more deeply into issues or think none of this affects them. Yes, I knew a lot of this but did miss things like bush's inaugural procession being egged...just HOW deeply the Bushs and the bin Ladens are in bed together...there's so much I think I have to go see it again!
How about the "businessmen's" meeting where they were all so happy about how much money they could make on the war...like a pep fest before the big game.
posted on June 27, 2004 11:03:11 AM new
In my town, Panama City, FL, also know as The Redneck Riviera or LA (lower Alabama), the theaters say they are not going to show it. It is going to be shown in Destin FL which is right down the road; so if you are vacationing in this part of the state spend your $$$ in Destin, which is considered more progressive than Panama City, even by the people who live here.
posted on June 27, 2004 11:05:49 AM new
Thanks for the rundown on the movie Bunni. That's unreal about S. Dakota. So it's come to 'mandatory blindness' as a means of control? As sad as it is, people that NEED to be controlled deserve what they get. Let's just hope the leaders outweigh the followers in the next election.
posted on June 27, 2004 11:19:36 AM new
A friend of mine, while viewing the documentary, struck up a conversation with a student sitting in the next seat. The student said it was a class assignment and she had to do a paper on it. At first, it was just suggested viewing by her teacher but after the teacher got letters from Republicans telling him not to suggest it, he did the right thing ...he made it an assignment!
HA! That sure back-fired on Big Brother!!!!!!
posted on June 27, 2004 02:24:57 PM new
I will offer a less admiring review of Moore's film filled with untruths...and his own 'twists' of the facts.
And Richard Clarke, Bush's former chief of counterterrorism, has come forward to say that he, and he alone, took the responsibility for authorizing those Saudi departures.
This might not matter so much to the ethos of Fahrenheit 9/11, except that--as you might expect--Clarke is presented throughout as the brow-furrowed ethical hero of the entire post-9/11 moment. And it does not seem very likely that, in his open admission about the Bin Laden family evacuation, Clarke is taking a fall, or a spear in the chest, for the Bush administration. So, that's another bust for this windy and bloated cinematic "key to all mythologies."
posted on June 27, 2004 02:36:52 PM new
It is obvious (no great surprise) that you did not see the movie. Clarke is on camera for no more than a moment and is not presented as a key player (as he was not). Prince Bhandar seems to have more influence on this administration than many of Bush's key advisor's.
All that was shown for the most part is a compilation of stock interviews and file footage (as Mooore was denied a visa to Iraq) and a very clear point of view.
It is safe to say Moore believes as most Americans have come to believe that this war was a ploy to advance the agenda of the current right wing administration.
Unlike myself who has no platform to reach large numbers Moore does and I am thankful for it.
The right blanketly claims the movie does not portray the truth but does not seem to be able to rebut any of the facts presented and relies on the faithful to remain in denial.
posted on June 27, 2004 03:21:37 PM new
I have a feeling that as the top grossing film of the weekend - a lot more theatres will be adding it this weekend. Friday night it out grossed it nearest competitor by $1 million despite being on 1/3 less screens.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
posted on June 27, 2004 03:28:52 PM new
I question how believable any of Clarke's testimony is. In March he implied to the 9/11 commission that he authorized the flights based on approval from higher levels (the commission was left with the impression that the approval came from the White House).
Also, the GOP are trying to get Clarke's 2002 testimony declassified. It seems that back then he was effusive in his praise of how well Bush & Co. were doing in regards to Terrorism prior to 9/11. Yet this past Wednesday he changed his story and said they were paying almost no attention to the subject. Condy Rice is foaming at the mouth rebutting his testimony... http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/03/26/clarke.flap/
Seems this guy can't get his story straight.
____________________
We are not afraid to entrust the American people with unpleasant facts, foreign ideas, alien philosophies, and competitive values. For a nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people. -- John F. Kennedy
posted on June 27, 2004 03:29:14 PM newIt is obvious (no great surprise) that you did not see the movie.
You are correct....I wouldn't give a penny of my money that would benefit anyone like Michael Moore.
But I am able to offer a review from a 'left leaning' site who has a different opinion on how his 'facts' aren't really 'facts'. And not just on the ONE issue I choose to copy and paste either.
The author addresses the many areas where Moore's presentation of his so-called 'facts' are proven to be incorrect. Invalid.....lies.
posted on June 27, 2004 03:34:33 PM new
which site is that, Linda?
____________________
We are not afraid to entrust the American people with unpleasant facts, foreign ideas, alien philosophies, and competitive values. For a nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people. -- John F. Kennedy
