posted on January 22, 2005 12:24:07 PM new
No...logansdad. I don't believe K-2nd graders need anything 'peddled' to them...except the three "R's". No wonder children aren't learning the basics in school....no matter how much money we throw that way. They're getting all this liberal 'peddling' pushed their way...that's BS and that's what's keeping teachers time away from teaching the 'survival' basics to them.
Let moral values be instilled in the home...if they don't get it there...it's not the liberals business anyway. But to constantly waste our tax dollars with this dribble is outrageous.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Four More Years....YES!!!
posted on January 22, 2005 12:30:26 PM new
"If you happen have a problem with the what the school district is teaching your child, then it is up to you as a parent to teach your child what you want your child to learn, not to be spreading your views onto other parents"
Wrong, you need to get more involved in education. Your child cannot learn from both the school district and you. If you don't like what the school district is teaching may I suggest "Home Schooling". There you can teach "your" values and yours alone. You can take them to the library and get only the books you want your child to read. Video's the same. You can block the TV stations that you deem inappropriate. You need to get involved with your child's education not blame others....but of course that is the easy way out....don't blame me blame the school district.
posted on January 22, 2005 12:30:29 PM new
What problem do I have with the video? None...and as my post highlighted...it's the agenda that the 'teachers' are given.
Read what I highlighted..that's the agenda I object to. Gay/lesban sex is not the 'norm'. Teaching tolerance is one thing....but as ususal the liberals want to indocratinate our youngest school aged children to believe it's normal is not. There are many different value systems in America. Teaching only one side....which totally is against families and normal family relationships is totally out of bounds, imo.
The left has little tolerance for the religious views of many. For the moral decisions each family is entitled to make on their own. No....it's the liberals that what what they support to be the ONLY things taught in schools.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Four More Years....YES!!!
posted on January 22, 2005 12:33:59 PM new
One problem with that Libra.
The liberals fight not only school vouchers....giving the most needy children a choice for a better education....but they pass laws to make homeschooling illegal. CA is a good example. Can't have more conservative parents homeschooling their own children....no...then they won't get the funding and liberal agenda the left wants them to have.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Four More Years....YES!!!
posted on January 22, 2005 01:26:08 PM newIf you don't like what the school district is teaching may I suggest "Home Schooling". There you can teach "your" values and yours alone.
Libra that is exactly I said before. I said if the parents do not like what the school district is teaching then the parent should do home schooling.
Absolute faith has been shown, consistently, to breed intolerance. And intolerance, history teaches us, again and again, begets violence.
---------------------------------- "Give it up for George W. Bush, the best friend international jihad ever had."
posted on January 22, 2005 01:46:14 PM newTeaching tolerance is one thing....but as ususal the liberals want to indocratinate our youngest school aged children to believe it's normal is not.
Linda then you do not understand the definition of tolerance. Here is a dictionary definition below:
1. The capacity for or the practice of recognizing and respecting the beliefs or practices of others.
2. Leeway for variation from a standard.
a. The permissible deviation from a specified value of a structural dimension, often expressed as a percent.
b. The capacity to endure hardship or pain.
Tolerance is the ability to accept the practices of others. It is not saying you have to agree with those practices. These are two different issues, which you fail to understand.
As far as this indoctrination that you want to believe is happening...please explain. What school tells children to go out and have a homosexual lifestyle. Please name one for me. This is more of your paranoia.
There are many different value systems in America.
Wow something we agree on.
Teaching only one side....which totally is against families and normal family relationships is totally out of bounds, imo..
And only teaching the views of the religious right is the correct way. That is what you are saying Linda. If you want your child to learn the Christian way, then you should be sending your child to a private or religious school. If you send him/her to a public school system, they should learn both sides. Again you are trying to say your way of raising a child is the more correct way. If you want to teach your child the "religious way" then you also need to be teaching your child everything about the Bible not just those parts that you want to accept and believe. Jesus preached tolerance. Where did Jesus say have tolerance for those that are fat, blind, handicapped, or speak a different language, but you can abuse those that are homosexual. Since you are very knowledgeable about the Bible I am sure you can point that out to me.
Here is just one example of your views Linda: Florida say gay couples can be foster parents, but when it comes to adopting a child they have a problem with it because it is not in the best interest of the child. So it is OK for a child to live with a gay couple until a more suitable home is found, but if those same parents what to provide a permanent home for the same kid, then suddenly the state of Florida has a problem with. It make no sense. The child would be living in the exact same home with the exact same set of parents.
Absolute faith has been shown, consistently, to breed intolerance. And intolerance, history teaches us, again and again, begets violence.
---------------------------------- "Give it up for George W. Bush, the best friend international jihad ever had."
posted on January 22, 2005 02:01:30 PM new
Linda you refer to "walking in the shoes of others" but you have constantly dismissed what I have to say. You keep saying it is all made up "what ifs". You will never learn why gays fight for what we are fighting for today with that attitude.
Linda what if it was your son, the soldier, that was bludgeoned to death in his barracks simply because he was gay.(Please do a search on Barry Winchell (sp)). How would you feel if you were that son's mother?
Since coming on this board, I have been attacked simply because I am gay and what I may or may not do in the privacy of my own home. I knew that was going to happen, but if it meant somebody could understand a homosexual a little better than so be it.
Absolute faith has been shown, consistently, to breed intolerance. And intolerance, history teaches us, again and again, begets violence.
---------------------------------- "Give it up for George W. Bush, the best friend international jihad ever had."
posted on January 22, 2005 02:03:00 PM new
unclebrian is ME!
Sorry, I was logged in under the wrong account. I don't usually post under that one.
But anyone who says Mr. Rogers spews intolerance isn't quite right in the head. If there was a 'Man Of The Century' for the 1900's, he'd be in the top ten list.
--------------------------------------
Replay Media - The best source for board games, card games and miniatures on the web! http://www.replaymedia.com
posted on January 22, 2005 02:05:57 PM new
This is a question I proposed to Libra in another thread that I hope she will answer. If there is someone else that would like to provide an answer that would be fine as well. Once I get answer I will let you know why I asked.
Libra, let me ask you this. What proof did your husband need to provide his employer for you to get on his health insurance? If you husband is on your health insurance from work then what proof did you need to provide to your employer to show you were both married?
Second what did you need to provide to the Church or state when you applied for a marriage application?
Absolute faith has been shown, consistently, to breed intolerance. And intolerance, history teaches us, again and again, begets violence.
---------------------------------- "Give it up for George W. Bush, the best friend international jihad ever had."
posted on January 22, 2005 02:10:55 PM new
LOL logansdad....you don't practice what you preach at all.
I know what tolerance is...and I do my best to be tolerant of others whose lifestyles go against my upbringing and my adult beliefs.
But when people like yourself....work to shove what I am against...gay marriage...down my throat...put your agenda even more into our young children's minds...then yes, you'll hear me screaming from the rooftops about how I am against their agenda.
Schools are to teach the basics...or they should be. The liberal teachers unions have seen fit to waste all the time they do on subjects like this. Values/morals etc should be left to the individual families. To do otherwise is just what the left claims is oh-so-wrong with the religious right. The liberals want to only teach their version of how things should be. Let's teach them the things they need to survive at taking care of themselves in adulthood and totally leave out the moral teachings....because neither side is going to let up on fighting the other when it comes to programming our children AGAINST our own personal beliefs.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Four More Years....YES!!!
posted on January 22, 2005 02:16:48 PM new
Oh and logansdad...I REALLY would appreciate it if you would STOP saying this is my view especially on something I'VE NEVER EVEN COMMENTED ON. I think that's a fair thing to ask. You have a habit of twist what I say anyway...but at least get it straight on what I have and haven't stated my views are.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Four More Years....YES!!!
posted on January 22, 2005 02:22:15 PM new
Replay, I never said Mr Rogers promoted hate. His program was a family orientated show. I am not denying that. I was just suggesting that Linda get here own TV show and promote her values if she did not like what being shown on TC today.
Absolute faith has been shown, consistently, to breed intolerance. And intolerance, history teaches us, again and again, begets violence.
---------------------------------- "Give it up for George W. Bush, the best friend international jihad ever had."
posted on January 22, 2005 02:30:18 PM new
I know what tolerance is...and I do my best to be tolerant of others whose lifestyles go against my upbringing and my adult beliefs.
But when people like yourself....work to shove what I am against...gay marriage...down my throat...put your agenda even more into our young children's minds...then yes, you'll hear me screaming from the rooftops about how I am against their agenda.
Nobody is shoving anything down your throat or up your ass for that matter. What is comes down to it that you just don't like what you are hearing. And what the heck is your agenda Linda. Do you know not think that what you are doing ("then yes, you'll hear me screaming from the rooftops about how I am against their agenda" is promoting your agenda.
Schools are to teach the basics...or they should be. The liberal teachers unions have seen fit to waste all the time they do on subjects like this
This is exactly what I mean Linda. You want schools to teach only those things that you believe in. THIS IS YOUR AGENDA. What gives you the right to think YOUR AGENDA is the appropriate one. You are just another religious bigot who believes their views are superior to anyone else on the planet.
In my opinion you do not practice tolerance and your statement above is proof.
Absolute faith has been shown, consistently, to breed intolerance. And intolerance, history teaches us, again and again, begets violence.
---------------------------------- "Give it up for George W. Bush, the best friend international jihad ever had."
posted on January 22, 2005 03:02:59 PM new
Logansdad I am sorry I thought I answered that question.
#1. Nothing, no proof. When I was employed I filled out an application and said that I was married and gave my husbands name and SS number. Of course my last name and his are the same. I filled out nothing for the insurance co. it came automatically. Victory Hospital, Waukegan, Illinois.
#2. My Birth Certificate....
Does that answer your questions. Now why did you ask those questions?
_________________
posted on January 22, 2005 03:19:26 PM new
::but they pass laws to make homeschooling illegal. CA is a good example. ::
Of what? I have a friend that has home schooled both of her kids thru high school. There is a curiculum that they must follow and periodical tests that must be done and turned in in order to verify that the kids actually are being schooled as opposed to a parent just claiming that they are home schooling because they can't be bothered to get to their kids to school.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
posted on January 22, 2005 03:19:48 PM new
logansdad - Take a deep breath and think....
I've said I think only the three "R's" need be taught...and you object to that as MY agenda Don't think you'll ever get much support on that issue.
And since I don't watch Mr. Rogers....or any other children's show....why you'd bring my name into that is beyond me.
Tolerance works both ways logansdad.
Yes, giving teachers the guidelines to have child pledge, without their own parents knowledge of same, is pushing your agenda. Being gay is not the 'norm'. And saying otherwise doesn't make it fact.
The fact that you won't accept others see things differently does prove you lack tolerance.
I think you're entitled to your opinion/value system as am I. You teach your own children your belief system and we others will do the same. The fact that they just aren't the same....never will be....is not the point of tolerance. Tolerance doesn't = agreement/validity/acceptance of anything other than people think differently. It's NOT about agreeing with the agenda. Calling names isn't going to change that for anyone here.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Four More Years....YES!!!
posted on January 22, 2005 03:26:42 PM new
fenix - Homeschool as it is everywhere else in the US. Parents choosing not to enroll their own children in the public schools.
The liberals are such controllers....they just won't admit it. Control all the school children...don't recognize parental rights....fight against voucher that give the most needy children a better education. Why? Because of a system that has had millions and millions of dollars thrown at it....no accountability until this President changed that.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Four More Years....YES!!!
posted on January 22, 2005 03:27:40 PM newand you object to that as MY agenda
Teaching the 3 R's is not your agenda. That is not what I am objecting to. I am objecting to you wanting teachers to teach only what you feel is morally right. "The liberal teachers unions have seen fit to waste all the time they do on subjects like this". That is what I feel your agenda is.
Absolute faith has been shown, consistently, to breed intolerance. And intolerance, history teaches us, again and again, begets violence.
----------------------------------
"Give it up for George W. Bush, the best friend international jihad ever had."
[ edited by logansdad on Jan 22, 2005 03:28 PM ]
posted on January 22, 2005 03:38:35 PM new
logansdad - I don't really think you can tell ME what I think and what MY agenda is. You really don't know me. You only see me arguing with you about gay marriage and the continuing leftist agenda's...as I see them.
To be more clear....I said I would support a return to only the basic's. Got that? But while it remains as it is...I shall argue/fight with all my might that our very young grade schooler's mind's are indocrinated with this garage.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Four More Years....YES!!!
posted on January 22, 2005 03:38:53 PM new
#1. Nothing, no proof. When I was employed I filled out an application and said that I was married and gave my husbands name and SS number. Of course my last name and his are the same. I filled out nothing for the insurance co. it came automatically. Victory Hospital, Waukegan, Illinois.
#2. My Birth Certificate....
Does that answer your questions. Now why did you ask those questions?
Libra, thanks for answering the questions. Here is why I asked.
This year was the first year my employer offered same sex domestic partner benefits. When open enrollment came around, I signed my partner up under my insurance through work. About a week after the open enrollment period was over. I was told I needed to provide proof of my domestic partner status. I needed to provide 3 of the following:
a copy of a mortage showing joint ownership, proof we have been living together for more than a year, a will showing my partner as the beneficiary, something that we share household expenses, a marriage certificate from a state allowing same sex marriages. There were a couple more items on the list but I can not remember them right now.
I asked because if I was straight and married the company would have taken my word that the other person I was registering was my wife.
Just as I thought. You needed to provide less information to the state in order to get a marriage certificate than I needed to provide to my employer in order to get insurance.
This is just an example of the things straight couples take for granted when they get married.
Absolute faith has been shown, consistently, to breed intolerance. And intolerance, history teaches us, again and again, begets violence.
---------------------------------- "Give it up for George W. Bush, the best friend international jihad ever had."
posted on January 22, 2005 05:56:38 PM new
Hilarious! linduh says,
""I shall argue/fight with all my might that our very young grade schooler's mind's are indocrinated with this garage. ""
Hittn' the sauce again , linduh?
"Argue/ fight with all your might"?...bullship...you haven't even attended a PTA meeting.
I think "indocrinated" means indoctrinated but with "garage " ?
OK Now I might be "twisting" your words, but that sentence means something like you will fight to fill grade schooler's minds with a garage......why would you do that ?
posted on January 22, 2005 07:25:22 PM new
I agree with the questions that were asked of you. Since you are unable to get a marriage license you need to prove that both of you are committed to each other and not just someone who lives next door to each other and needs insurance.
I have a marriage license to prove that I am married you had no proof of a same sex partner. They were not descriminating against you they were just protecting themselves.
Now there was an example of brothers marrying each other so one could have the benefits of the other. Wouldn't you ask those questions if you were the employer. If you truly have a same sex partner and if you have proof of your same sex partner then I don't know why you are upset. If you have no proof I would suggest you get something.
Showing a birth certificate to get a marriage license is for proof that you are an american citizen and that is all.
posted on January 22, 2005 07:39:13 PM new
Teacher's associations do not set curriculum policy. No matter what you've been led to believe, they just don't. Curriculum is set by district action, following state and federal guidelines.
Teachers are damned if they do, and damned if they don't. If they avoid issues regarding values, they are labeled as "amoral", if they attempt to include values in their curricula, it's sure to get somebody or other up in arms because it's the "wrong" values.
I have no problems with home schooling per se. But most states make it difficult to home school a child because they can't spend the resources necessary to make sure those kids are actually being taught something. In my state, all a parent needs to do is come to school, withdraw their kid, sign a homeschool form, and off they go. There is no follow up, no testing of those kids, nothing. Talk about kids being left behind!! Parents who are just mad at the school for some perceived slight to their kid will bring the kid back in a semester or two, because they find out that they really don't know squat about teaching reading and math, much less history and science. Those who are serious about an alternative education for their children typically band together with other families and at least attempt to follow state grade level expectations. More power to them, as far as I'm concerned.
I don't know how many times in the last quarter century of teaching I've had to spend countless hours with a "homeschooled" kid who came back to school, almost hopelessly behind in basic skills.
____________________________________________
Dick Cheney: "I have not suggested there's a connection between Iraq and 9/11..."
[ edited by profe51 on Jan 22, 2005 07:50 PM ]
posted on January 22, 2005 07:49:30 PM new
I failed to mention, my school keeps track of students we know live in the area who are being home schooled. Each year prior to standardized testing times, we send out letters to those families offering to administer the tests to their kids. You'd expect that those parents would be interested in seeing how their kids compare on a district, state and national level, wouldn't you? Surely they'd like to have that information if for no other reason than to help their kids get into good colleges, should they decide to go. Well, guess what? Yearly, we get only a handful of those kids whose parents take us up on our offer. I suppose they figure a solid history of excellence on national standardized tests doesn't really matter when it comes time to get into a good school...or maybe they're just teaching them to flop Whoppers, and it's of no consequence.
____________________________________________
Dick Cheney: "I have not suggested there's a connection between Iraq and 9/11..."
posted on January 22, 2005 08:32:33 PM new
Linda never did I say I was being discriminated against. That is your interpretation of what I said.
Libra, while it is true you have a marriage license, you needed far less proof that you and your husband were living together and wanted to share the rest of your life together in order to get that piece of paper. You and your husband could have met on the street 10 minutes prior to walking before a judge and asking for that marriage license. As you said all you needed was a driver's license (I assume you also needed some witnesses).
I had no problem supplying my employer with the necessary documents because I had "the proof" I needed and if I didn't I was going to result to plan B. But it did iritate me because as you said you did not even need to supply your employer with the marriage certificate, they just took your word on your marriage status.
Perhaps this is the problem with the institution of marriage these days...It is too easy to get a marriage license and even easier to get a divorce.
I used this as an example of what straight married couples take for granted once they get that "married" classification and why the gay couples are fighting for the same equal status. Thanks Libra for sharing your information.
Absolute faith has been shown, consistently, to breed intolerance. And intolerance, history teaches us, again and again, begets violence.
----------------------------------
"Give it up for George W. Bush, the best friend international jihad ever had."
posted on January 22, 2005 08:36:45 PM new
Linda: I don't really think you can tell ME what I think and what MY agenda is.
Linda when did you become gay? You must be gay if you know all about the gay agenda and what we plan on doing. Since you know all about the gay agenda please point it out to me and the rest of us her because I was absent the day this was discussed at the National Gay Agenda meeting.
I will make you a promise. You stop acting like you know what the gay agenda is and I will stop thinking I know what your agenda is.
This is the second time you have brought up the term "indoctrination". I would like to know what you mean by this.
Absolute faith has been shown, consistently, to breed intolerance. And intolerance, history teaches us, again and again, begets violence.
----------------------------------
"Give it up for George W. Bush, the best friend international jihad ever had."
[ edited by logansdad on Jan 22, 2005 09:21 PM ]
posted on January 23, 2005 01:51:58 AM new
Maybe if linduh's hangover isn't too bad this morning she can answer my post
Hilarious! linduh says,
""I shall argue/fight with all my might that our very young grade schooler's mind's are indocrinated with this garage. ""
Hittn' the sauce again , linduh?
"Argue/ fight with all your might"?...bullship...you haven't even attended a PTA meeting.
I think "indocrinated" means indoctrinated but with "garage " ?
OK Now I might be "twisting" your words, but that sentence means something like you will fight to fill grade schooler's minds with a garage......why would you do that ?
is promoting your agenda.
