posted on January 30, 2005 08:19:00 AM new
Maureen Dowd had a nice article, it plainly stated successful men do not want to compete at home as well as the office...
Women will never be equal as long as they are singled out with special treatment and laws...
You can't say I want to be equal and at the same time say I want special treatment because I am a woman...
posted on January 30, 2005 08:23:32 AM newWomen will never be equal as long as they are singled out with special treatment and laws...
You can't say I want to be equal and at the same time say I want special treatment because I am a woman
This is 100% correct, in my opinion. There is no room for a double standard, and women will have to choose.
[ edited by maggiemuggins on Jan 30, 2005 08:23 AM ]
posted on January 30, 2005 08:57:48 AM new
Ha! isn't it funny how for ten thousnad years men didn't give a rat's ass how unequal things were for women but when they do start getting a little equality the tiny men start pounding on their bony chests and making pronouncements about how women should act.
For ten thousand years MEN got special treatment and there were laws persecuting women. Now, all of sudden we can't single out WOMEN for special treatment !!??????? Or have laws PROTECTING them ???!!!!!
YUP, the shoes changing to the other foot and listen to the babies whine
They just don't get it....they don't make the rules anymore and any woman who listens to that trash is brain dead.
Men don't HAVE to compete at home, or anywhere else, if they'd just quit COMPETING.
[ edited by crowfarm on Jan 30, 2005 09:00 AM ]
posted on January 30, 2005 09:34:06 AM newWomen only have the power men allow them to have
I am curious why men would continue to have a need to hold power over women? Why? The only answer that I can come up with is that they had it good as lord and master and don't want to give it up..
For those ten thousand years women knew their place in life... at home serving their man... raising their children
But.. you see.. men couldn't uphold their end of the bargain.. couldn't or wouldn't support their women and families.. a women's role had to evolve and change to make the necessary adjustments to care for themselves and their young.. as men fell short on the job..and in todays time, the need for a physically stronger sex is no longer..
women now do both their traditional role and that of the male as well..... we are strong.. we are invincible.. we are woman!!
posted on January 30, 2005 10:18:40 AM new
Most men in this world are dominant by nature, it is nothing to "give up" no more than a woman is mostly subservient due to maternal instincts...
Women want equallity and unconditional relationships, however they are the first to make conditions...
When the was last time you told your man... no sex tonight because "..."
right there you now have put conditions on the relationship...
Most men do not equate sex with love... it is just part of the relationship...
Women equate sex with love... I think because once again they want a commitment from a male to help raise any children...
posted on January 30, 2005 10:52:11 AM new
I agree with you maggie, since men have been unable (unwilling?) to hold up their end (as traditional roles go) women have had to adapt.
linda k, I would vote for fred in a minute as well. I agree with almost everything he (?) said.
twelve- My mom says with what I got, I can get as many of what you got as I want......so on your knees!
posted on January 30, 2005 11:25:03 AM newMaureen Dowd had a nice article, it plainly stated successful men do not want to compete at home as well as the office...
I agree with VERY little MD ever says...but I'd agree with her above statement. Part of the reason for the breakdown in the American family, imho.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Four More Years....YES!!!
posted on January 30, 2005 12:05:07 PM new
It's good to know, linduh, that you were a good little subservient doormat for your husband.....beats the hell out of acting like an adult, able to take care of yourself.....lots easier........
I repeat , if men don't want to compete at home then they should quit.
Why do they feel the need to make everything a competition...men like that must be real assholes to live with.
If they're too stupid to quit and just act like decent human beings that's their fault...they should work on that.
posted on January 30, 2005 12:14:38 PM newjust act like decent human beings....
I wonder if more than one person here even THINKS *you* have any way of recognizing or understanding just what 'decent human beings' act like. That was funny.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Four More Years....YES!!!
posted on January 30, 2005 12:19:19 PM new
Most men in this world are dominant by nature, it is nothing to "give up" no more than a woman is mostly subservient due to maternal instincts...
I dont think subservient is the right word. Nurturing maybe?
Men love women and most women I've ever known, loved to be loved by men (and envied by other women). We've all seen men subservient to their wives/partner, whose performance at his job or whatever could easily belie that. The same for women.
The breakdown inmho, is just a plain lack of respect and partnership skills. Most relationships are 60-40. 50-50 is pure myth. But the ones that do make it work, it fluctuates alot. That's probably the difference.
posted on January 30, 2005 12:19:57 PM new
And because a women isn't the type who wants to neuter her 'man'....doesn't mean she's a subservient doormat either. lol
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Four More Years....YES!!!
posted on January 30, 2005 12:31:04 PM new
From one extreme to the other......
"
And because a women isn't the type who wants to neuter her 'man' "
You mean a man is "neutered" if he can't strut around beating his chest and shouting orders to the little woman......bet you were sooooo cute in your widdle apron.
And I bet the big strutting "superior" "man" doesn't mind when the little subservient woman brings in another income!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
No, they don't....it's so nice of them to "let" the little woman work....but of course, she wouldn't HAVE to if he made enough money....wimpy slacker.
posted on January 30, 2005 12:43:07 PM new
Boy...you must have had some pretty terrible relationships with men to view them the way you do. If not...I sure don't understand your constantly putting them down. You go on and on about all these terrible men and what they do.
I don't know what kind of men you've chosen to be in your life...but they aren't anything like those that are/were in mine.
How sad for you.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Four More Years....YES!!!
posted on January 30, 2005 01:06:36 PM new"...successful men do not want to compete at home as well as the office..."
Successful men usually don't want ANYTHING to do with what's happening at home. They think if they work, that's all they have to do. I wish they'd compete with me over who does the dishes, laundry, shopping, grocery shopping, vacuuming, taking out the garbage, cleaning the litter box, cleaning the windows, making meals, making sure there's enough heating fuel and gas in the car, picking up the dry cleaning, shovelling, raking, gardening, dusting, feeding the birds,... I haven't even touched on the subject of raising kids yet...
Men never leave the womb. If a woman stopped doing all the things she does for a man for one week (that includes sex), he'd collapse within 24 hours, so who's REALLY in charge?
posted on January 30, 2005 01:11:49 PM new
How sad, linduh, that you failed to notice that I NEVER said those men were in my life.
Those are the kind of men YOU profess to like.
Maybe YOU'VE had a relationship with every man you've ever known but I haven't...I selected them carefully and they don't include those who have to swagger about to prove what "big men" they are.
You have very neanderthal-like ideas of what a man is....how sad...you've never known a decent intelligent man....because none would put up with you.
And in your twisted torture, war, death, bloodshed, loving viewpoint how would YOU ever know what a decent human being was ???????
You like torturing children! Is that YOUR idea of a decent human being ???????
posted on January 30, 2005 01:12:31 PM new
KD - I believe it's exactly the same with successful women. They don't do the things you mention either...they hire it done.
And are you or are you not making your own choice to stay home? Did someone force you to?
And again...when both partners want to work...want the material things that having two 'successful' incomes brings....there is also the major drawbacks when trying to raise a family...without a housekeeper/nanny/daycare/etc.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Four More Years....YES!!!
[ edited by Linda_K on Jan 30, 2005 01:16 PM ]
posted on January 30, 2005 01:18:25 PM new
"""""KD - I believe it's exactly the same with successful women. They don't do the things you mention either...they hire it done. """"""
posted on January 30, 2005 01:19:53 PM new
What kind of "man" would put up with you crowfart? and I use that term loosely with the males that must of been in your life...
Kraft, those men that you speak of have trophy wives
posted on January 30, 2005 01:20:28 PM newyou failed to notice that I NEVER said those men were in my life.
So...either you're never around any men....or you're making false judgements about men when you don't know any who act the way speak of. Either way...you're, imo, a true man hater. But maybe that's not quite true either....maybe you're just hateful in general...towards men and women.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Four More Years....YES!!!
posted on January 30, 2005 01:28:30 PM new
Linda, I should've removed the word successful because just having a job means you're a success these days!
When you and your husband both worked, did he share in the responsibilties at home, like the ones I mentioned? If he did, you're lucky because most men think their only responsibilty is to work and take care of the remotes. Yet, while women work, look after the kids and the house while trying to fit in enough time for their own lives, they're still seen as the weaker sex... but only by men.
posted on January 30, 2005 01:42:56 PM new
KD - When you and your husband both worked, did he share in the responsibilties at home, like the ones I mentioned?
I've mentioned that when we were first married...I supported us while he went to college. Yes, he did most all the household chores then because he'd get home early from classes.
edited to add: And once our family was raised...and I returned to work...he also did more than 1/2 his share. If you feel a need for it to be measured. At that time, he encouraged me to stay home...to enjoy the freedom of raising the kids..do my own thing. But I wanted to get back to working....and he supported me in that wish.
If he did, you're lucky because most men think their only responsibilty is to work and take care of the remotes.
I've always said I was very blessed to have found him. But this also applies to my friends too. When the children were being raised they were the ones most responsible for maintaining the household. After the children were mostly grown...the roles reversed and the men do tons to help. Even more so after they retired.
Yet, while women work, look after the kids and the house while trying to fit in enough time for their own lives, they're still seen as the weaker sex...but only by men.
Again I guess it comes down to whose decision it was for the wife to stay home...his/hers/a mutual decision. My personal experience has been that it's not always the wife that stayed home....she worked and the husband either worked at home...or didn't work...HE took care of the home and children.
And I do believe in some ways we are the weaker sex. But we're just stronger in different areas where men aren't so strong. Men tend to approach life in a more logical way...women in a more emotional way. Not always mind you.
And imo, in this day and age NO women is forced to stay home - it's a choice....usually a mutual choice between husband and wife. What we are beginning to see, again on the whole, though is they're also beginning to realized they can't do it all...career, home, relationship with husband unless they make and unusually high income and someone can be paid to do all that needs to be done for a family to function well.
Women are only human...and there's only so many hours in the day....something suffers when both are seeking careers while trying to raise a family.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Four More Years....YES!!!
[ edited by Linda_K on Jan 30, 2005 01:47 PM ]
posted on January 30, 2005 01:45:11 PM new
kraft, you must be somewhat up there in age because most kids now growing into adult hood donot have too much of that environment (life's experience) to come into a marriage with. Kids now have grown up seeing their mothers working and hiring help, etc., Men are probably still generally more lazier when it comes to getting necessities done and women do seem to take up that responsibility as a given, but I'm not sure its viewed as it was 30,40 years ago. men have come a long long way.....
posted on January 30, 2005 01:56:45 PM new
::And I do believe in some ways we are the weaker sex. But we're just stronger in different areas where men aren't so strong::
Ack Linda. In mo, I think women are only viewed as weaker because they have the greater capacity to love. why that is I do not know, but maybe in a sense it has to do with emotional 'smarts' as you suggest, or perhaps the female gene.
As far as physically, men are predominately stronger....but have you ever watched that show fear factor that crowfarm accuses you of enjoying? lol. That probably a joke/oxymoron because it is geared for a younger generation audience...but man! you see some of those women perform the stunts (and I dont mean eating worms and crap) but those stunts they do on top of bridge cages and stuff--better than the men sometimes!!
posted on January 30, 2005 01:57:44 PM newNo, they don't....it's so nice of them to "let" the little woman work....but of course, she wouldn't HAVE to if he made enough money....wimpy slacker.
So then, let's see, if a man is the primary breadwinner, it must be because he's a knuckle dragging, beer swilling, misogynistic neanderthal who won't "let" his wife achieve her true human potential...but if he doesn't earn enough to support her, he's a wimpy slacker.
Now I get it.
____________________________________________
Dick Cheney: "I have not suggested there's a connection between Iraq and 9/11..."
posted on January 30, 2005 02:15:03 PM new
dblfugger - Ack Linda.
chuckling at your ACK!!!
In mo, I think women are only viewed as weaker because they have the greater capacity to love.
I kind of agree and disagree. I think women do have an easier time of showing their love, outwardly than men. But I believe men love just as much....they just keep it more to themselves. We women are usually more verbal than men tend to be...that's why it appears more pronounced...greater.
I believe both men and women bring 'different', but important benefits to a relationship. I don't understand the need to be competative with one another. I've always viewed it as working together for the benefit of the family unit...not some type of war between the sexes.
why that is I do not know, but maybe in a sense it has to do with emotional 'smarts' as you suggest, or perhaps the female gene.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Four More Years....YES!!!
posted on January 30, 2005 02:40:08 PM new
Linda, maybe I did not word that right about "greater capacity." and it can be viewed as more pronounced. I know men have as much capacity - its been recorded as such by them for years - but I suppose I am sexist in I that I sort of believe there is a design to it as to why women bear children and men do not. Not that women who dont birth children are any less, or men cannot nurture children insubstancicially,....but it is still ultimately the design we are stuck with that way, and surely the gender with the greater responsibility would be more endowed to perform that responsibility better?? You know they are digging into all these genes and may be able to offer us a definitive answer in 10-20 years.
oh well. Maybe that is not making sense to any one but me. But it is like, the designer or creator will always have more affinity(love)to their designs than the producers and others involved with it because it is ultimately "theirs" and if you birth something (especially human species) surely you will be the...
oh never mind.
out to pasture for a bit...C'U's all laterz...lol!
[ edited by maggiemuggins on Jan 30, 2005 08:23 AM ]
