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 Bear1949
 
posted on October 7, 2007 05:19:51 PM new
and the Modern-day "Mercenary"

The mere mention of private military companies is enough to panic the liberals of American society and leave them loudly shrieking about fascism, totalitarianism, murder, or thuggery.

There have been scores of private military companies and security firms employed by the Department of Defense and the State Department in Iraq since the war began. The most famous of all the “professional military, law enforcement, security, peacekeeping, and stability operations firms” is the North Carolina-based firm of Blackwater USA.

In addition to Blackwater, other significant private security/military companies, sometimes called "Mercs" for Mercenaries, include DynCorp, Erinys, Aegis Defense Services, Kroll Inc., ArmorGroup, Hart, Steele Foundation, Global Risk Strategies, and CACI.

According to the Pentagon, private military companies are subject to both military law and to more recent statutes governing the conduct of contractors who deploy with U.S. Troops.

So far this year Blackwater has guarded 1,873 convoys, out of which there were 56 shootings, or less than 3% of all assignments. Last year, the company had 6,254 missions and 38 incidents.

Since the beginning of the Iraq War, 27 Blackwater contractors have been killed while guarding U.S. officials and no U. S. diplomat had lost his life on missions protected by Blackwater. Overall, some 428 security contractors have been killed in Iraq and an unknown number wounded.

There are no definitive public figures for the number of missions that have been completed by armed private contractors in Iraq or how many shooting ''incidents'' they may have been engaged in.

The usual suspects have smeared such companies as whores of war, fascists, SA, Freikorps, soldiers of fortune, and even as some sort of Praetorian Guard. And while such grasping analogies are fun for the attention grabbers, partisan hacks, professional pundits, and uninformed rabble rousers, they are poor historical comparisons at best. Hysteria and histrionics attracts attention to a cause and makes great headlines but in the real world they make a poor contribution to the debate on public policy.

Private military companies are in fact a new and unique twist on an old idea: private citizens engaging in warfare as partners with their government against a common enemy. They are the ultimate outsourcing in the global War on Terror and an integral part of the United States ability to wage counterinsurgency and counter-terrorism operations throughout the world.

It seems to me that the latest media frenzy about private military companies and Blackwater in particular, is just another attempt to politically damage President Bush and to undermine the overall mission in Iraq. The sudden ''outrage'' now being expressed on Capitol Hill and in the press about Blackwater, and private security contractors in general, seems to be little more than the latest manufactured outrage of the week. (Remember the “outrage” over Haliburton?)

If the critics of the current administration and the guardians of perpetual outrage would show this much anger and outrage at the enemy, the United States would be a lot closer to winning the Iraq war and the larger War on Terror. The pacifists and appeasers on the left have decided that they cannot win by attacking the military and smearing General Petraeus so now they have moved on to attacking the underpinning organizations that are supporting the mission in the field. They have suffered severe blowback in the past for questioning and attacking the troops and for threatening to pull the financial rug out from under them. The ''modern day merc'' is a relatively unknown and mysterious entity that makes a far easier target than the uniformed military and it does not have the reflexive patriotic defenders that the military enjoys.

Much has been made about the Iraq government’s complaints about Blackwater. I think we can kindly, and with little consequence, tell the Iraqi leader to mind his P’s and Q’s and we’ll remove any and all armed combatants when we are good and ready, and not a minute before that. When he gets his political situation and own military up to snuff then he can complain about a handful of incidents among the tens of thousands of armed security contractors in Iraq.

The security contractors play an important role supplementing troop strength by guarding infrastructure, politicians, and diplomats, and vital convoys. By doing so they free up the uniformed members of the military for combat, patrols, raids, and the other necessary roles that they play in a combat zone. There is no argument that the U.S. military is limited in size and that there have been difficulties in maintaining the elevated troop levels needed to provide the military stability required to suppress the various terrorist and militia insurgents and to prevent sectarian violence.

If private military companies are not allowed to operate in the Iraqi theater of operations, the estimated 50,000 armed contractors would be extremely difficult to replace. There has already been an outcry at the deployment of an additional 30,000 U.S. boots on the ground (the Surge). To suddenly announce that we need tens of thousands of additional troops to babysit journalists, drive trucks, protect convoys, and guard diplomats would be absurd and a no-starter both politically and militarily.

"There is simply no way at all that the State Department's Bureau of Diplomatic Security could ever have enough full-time personnel to staff the security function in Iraq. There is no alternative except through contracts." – current U.S. ambassador to Iraq, Ryan Crocker

The private security contractors in Iraq are almost entirely ex-military and most are from elite fighting units. They are familiar and comfortable working with the military establishment and have been trained by the very governments they are working for. The modern day ''merc'' is not the bloodthirsty soldier of fortune slaughtering, raping, and pillaging across the landscape in the service of a warlord as many of the loudest voices of criticism would seem to have you believe.

In stark contrast, the average armed contractors are highly trained, highly motivated, and willing to risk life and limb in an often very dangerous environment. They have been accused of being gung ho, cocky, swashbuckling, and foul-mouthed on occasion but I wouldn’t expect any less from such types in a volatile war zone facing off against the most ruthless of enemies. Though mistakes and poor decisions have undoubtedly been made, private security contractors have not been shown to have participated in a greater amount of questionable ''incidents'' than the regular U.S. military or its allies in the country.

They are far more reliable, trustworthy, and disciplined than many of their counterparts in the Iraqi military, police, and security forces. Until the day comes that the Iraqis themselves are able to provide the security and services that the private security companies provide, or stabilize the situation so such companies are not needed, they should and will remain a valuable piece of the security establishment not just in Iraq, but wherever the battle against Islamofascism and rogue regimes takes them.

The concept of the privatized army will gain momentum in the future as a nervous public increasingly doesn’t like troops in harm's way and politicians panic every time the public expresses a bit of displeasure. But the level of public interest, outrage, or concern about the deaths and injuries occurring among the private military companies is minimal and, amazingly, many on the left have actually cheered these casualties. But that makes them invaluable as well. They (normally) exist beneath the radar. Despite the various qualms and public aversion, there is a global need, nonetheless, for well-trained, well-armed forces loyal to the capitalist, democratic West.

If the Blackwater types are becoming the American equivalent of the French Foreign Legion fighting ''unpopular wars'' for national interest, then they have my blessing. The wars that the United States will be fighting around the globe need to be fought utilizing special forces, overwhelming air power, proxy armies, native militias, warlords, tribal clans, good intelligence, massive power, and, if need be, private U.S. and allied ''armies'' of ex-military types willing to risk it all for a good paycheck. I support doing what it takes to avoid bogging the military down as we have succeeded in doing in Iraq, reducing U.S. military casualties, and ensuring victory against Islamofascists and the enemies of Western Civilization throughout the world.

By David Huntwork


It is foolish and wrong to mourn the men who died. Rather we should thank God that such men lived.George S. Patton
 
 mingotree
 
posted on October 7, 2007 05:28:51 PM new
Conservative propaganda with no truth...so much Fascist blather.....there is NO defense for the use and actions of the Republican company Blackwater.

 
 logansdad
 
posted on October 7, 2007 06:13:39 PM new
It is amazing how the conservatives defend Blackwater. These contracted security groups get paid more than the troops the Republicans claim to support.


"In my experience, those who do not like you fall into two categories: the stupid, and the envious. - John Wilmot, the Second Earl of Rochester
 
 shagmidmod
 
posted on October 8, 2007 08:48:31 AM new
Funny how a redneck conservative like BearPorn could even support this crap.

First off, this is obviously a fascist system of corporate military control. Second, BearPorn should be screaming his head off about how much the government spends per "fascist" contractor vs how much the government would spend for our own soldiers. There have been tons of estimates showing "fascist" contractors getting $300-400 a day for their work, while Blackwater contracting at $950 to 1500 a day per security contractor. Our government is spending at least 4 to 5 times the amount to contract these companies vs using our own military personel. So much for fiscal conservatism. Third, this also creates the illusion of fewer American deaths. How many Blackwater contractors have died while in Iraq? How many Americans are truly in Iraq? These companies do nothing but hide the truth about this war.

BearPorn should be outraged rather than support this fascist controlled system of privatizing our military.

 
 Bear1949
 
posted on October 8, 2007 08:54:16 AM new
Further proof that you defeatists losers are determined to turn azz up to terrorism is not needed.



It is foolish and wrong to mourn the men who died. Rather we should thank God that such men lived.George S. Patton
 
 shagmidmod
 
posted on October 8, 2007 08:56:32 AM new
I'll also add, that while traveling to Seattle this past week, we stopped at Fort Lewis. Its been a few years since I've been on a base and the first thing I noticed was that the gate was protected by hired security instead of our own military. Not only was this very disappointing, but also a major concern.
To make matters even worse, only a few had firearms. When I used to enter NAS Jacksonville, NAS Cecil Field, NAS Mayport, NSB Kings Bay they all had fully armed Military security.



 
 shagmidmod
 
posted on October 8, 2007 10:25:24 AM new
"Further proof that you defeatists losers are determined to turn azz up to terrorism is not needed."

Where is the proof???

The point the progressives here are making is that you are supporting the "rent a soldier" mentality.

It is paying SCABS more money to do the job that our own soldiers could do themselves, and BETTER!!!

Can you imagine the public outcry if NFL players went on strike and the teams hired scabs that got paid more than the normal NFL player did?

But Noooooooooo.... you got an idiot in BearPorn that supports this type of crap.




 
 profe51
 
posted on October 8, 2007 08:59:00 PM new
Let the contract soldiers fight Bush's war, and let him pay them out of his own pockets instead of the pockets of our grandchildren and great-grandchildren.

Mercenaries are mercenaries. If this war can't be fought without them, something is horribly wrong.

 
 Helenjw
 
posted on October 9, 2007 05:20:37 AM new

It surprises me that someone like Bear who is always touting military service would be in favor of these scabs who take the cushy jobs for which they are paid attractive salaries while soldiers are putting their lives on the line for nothing.




 
 desquirrel
 
posted on October 9, 2007 06:07:23 AM new
I'm surprised Bear would even attempt to use math. It gets liberals all glassy eyed and comatose.

 
 Helenjw
 
posted on October 9, 2007 06:47:04 AM new

Keep trying, Squirrel and someday you may surprise us with an intelligible remark.



 
 Bear1949
 
posted on October 9, 2007 07:31:13 AM new
It surprises me that someone like Bear who is always touting military service would be in favor of these scabs who take the cushy jobs for which they are paid attractive salaries while soldiers are putting their lives on the line for nothing.

If you had you head out of you azz, you would see that the majority of the Blackwater personnel are former military, with long years of special ops experience.

Hardly what the knowledgeable person would refer to as a scab.


I'm surprised Bear would even attempt to use math. It gets liberals all glassy eyed and comatose.

A perfect example would be their attempt at socialized health care.




It is foolish and wrong to mourn the men who died. Rather we should thank God that such men lived.George S. Patton
 
 desquirrel
 
posted on October 9, 2007 07:42:56 AM new
It is hilarious when Helen pontificates, no doubt with a look of constipation on her face. Too bad in war people get killed, even NICE people, no matter how much you bug your eyes out.

 
 mingotree
 
posted on October 9, 2007 08:32:29 AM new
The neocons, carrying on their tradition of NO answers only insults....like their puppet bushit, unable to handle disagreement or logic.

Not one word, of their own, about how uncontrolled, unregulated, mercenaries that we pay for with our taxes are a good thing.



From the OP:

""I support doing what it takes to avoid bogging the military down as we have succeeded in doing in Iraq"""


(Even THIS neocon admits it ! )







"", reducing U.S. military casualties,"""


( doesn't HE know that even nice people die in war ???? Doesn't he know that people like desquirrel , bear, and linduh think it's just "too bad". ???))


""and ensuring victory against Islamofascists and the enemies of Western Civilization throughout the world.""


AGAIN, What IS Victory ? WHO decides WHO the enemies are?

A bunch of overpaid Republican funded blood crazed renegade mercenaries??

Are they coming after the Fascists in THIS country?




Or is the question WHEN are they coming for the fascists in this country?





Or is the question, "Who DECIDES, controls and directs who these "forces" go after next ??????????




[ edited by mingotree on Oct 9, 2007 11:03 AM ]
 
 Helenjw
 
posted on October 9, 2007 10:12:58 AM new

"If you had you head out of you azz, you would see that the majority of the Blackwater personnel are former military, with long years of special ops experience."


Excuse me Bear for being surprised that you find nothing wrong with this scenario. I suppose I can see you down on your conservative knees in respectful submission to a scab.




 
 mingotree
 
posted on October 9, 2007 11:05:23 AM new
Ya, going SO "well".....

2 Iraqi Women Killed by Convoy Guards
Updated 1:28 PM ET October 9, 2007


By SAMEER N. YACOUB

BAGHDAD (AP) - Guards in a security convoy opened fire on a car at an intersection in central Baghdad on Tuesday, killing two Iraqi Christian women then speeding away, police said. The Iraqi government said preliminary reports indicated an American security company was behind the shooting.

Across Iraq, violence claimed the lives of at least 44 people, including 19 who died in coordinated suicide car bombings in the north that targeted a local police chief and a Sunni sheik.

Neither witnesses nor police could immediately say which organization was involved in the Baghdad shooting, but the four-vehicle convoys of armored SUVS are commonly employed by private security companies and the Iraqi Interior Ministry.

Government spokesman Ali al-Dabbagh said the convoy did not appear to be one from Blackwater USA, which has denied any involvement.

"Preliminary reports indicate that an American security company has opened fire on two women and they were killed," al-Dabbagh told The Associated Press. "But I don't think it's Blackwater."



The womens' deaths threatened to increase calls for limits on the private security firms, which have come under intense scrutiny since the Sept. 16 shooting deaths of as many as 17 Iraqi civilians allegedly by guards with Blackwater, the largest firm protecting U.S. diplomats in Iraq. In that case, the American security company said its employees were acting in self-defense.

BAGHDAD (AP) _ Guards in a security convoy opened fire on a car at an intersection in central Baghdad on Tuesday, killing two Iraqi Christian women, police said.

The State Department said the convoy was not protecting U.S. diplomats, but an embassy spokeswoman said an American nongovernmental organization may have been involved.

Across Iraq, violence claimed the lives of at least 44 people, including 19 who died in coordinated suicide car bombings in the north that targeted a local police chief and a Sunni sheik.

Police and witnesses could not immediately give more details about the gunmen in Baghdad except to say they were in a convoy of four SUVs commonly used by private security companies and the Iraqi Ministry of Interior.

The womens' deaths threatened to increase calls for limits on the private security firms, which have come under intense scrutiny since the Sept. 16 shooting deaths of as many as 17 Iraqi civilians allegedly by guards with Blackwater USA, the largest firm protecting U.S. diplomats in Iraq. In that case, the American security company said its employees were acting in self-defense.

Blackwater spokeswoman Anne Tyrrell denied the Moyock, N.C.-based company had any involvement in Tuesday's deaths.

In Washington, State Department spokesman Sean McCormack said only that the incident did not involve U.S. diplomats. "It was not an American convoy," he said.

"There may be a contractual relationship with a U.S. NGO," U.S. Embassy spokeswoman Mirembe Nantongo said. "We're working on clarifying that."

The women were in a white car that drove into the Masbah intersection in the central Karradah district as the convoy of three white and one gray SUVs was stopped about 100 yards away, according to a policeman who witnessed the shooting from a nearby checkpoint.

The men in the SUVs threw a smoke bomb in an apparent bid to warn the car against coming forward, said Riyadh Majid, the policeman. The woman driving the car tried to stop, but was killed along with the passenger when two of the guards in the convoy opened fire, Majid said.

The pavement where the attack occurred was stained with blood and covered with shattered glass from the car windows. He said the convoy then raced away and Iraqi police came to collect the bodies and tow the car to the local police station.

Security officials in Baghdad, who spoke anonymously because of the sensitivity of the topic, said the description of the convoy vehicles matched those used by Iraq's Interior Ministry, although that could not immediately be confirmed.

Another policeman, who spoke on condition of anonymity because he feared retribution, said the guards were masked and wearing khaki uniforms. He said one of them left the vehicle and started to shoot at the car while another opened fire from the open back door of a separate SUV.

The victims were identified by relatives and police as Marou Awanis, born in 1959, as Geneva Jalal, born in 1977.

"These are innocent people killed by people who have no heart or consciousness. The Iraqi people have no value to them," said a man who was part of a group of relatives gathered with a Christian priest at the local police station.

The man said Awanis had three daughters. "Who will now raise the girls? They are now motherless," he said.

Awanis' sister-in-law, Anahet Bougous, said the woman was using her car to taxi government employees to work to help raise money for her three daughters.

"May God take revenge on those killers," Bougous said, crying outside the police station. "Now, who is going to raise them?"

The nearly simultaneous attacks in Beiji were the deadliest in a series of bombings in recent days as the terror network apparently steps up its promised Ramadan offensive as the end of the Islamic holy month draws near.

The attackers in the oil hub 155 miles north of Baghdad drove a minibus laden with explosives into the house of a local police chief and detonated an explosives-packed Toyota Land Cruiser outside the home of a leading member of the local Awakening Council, a group of Iraqis who have turned against extremists in the area.

A Sunni mosque about 100 yards away from the police chief's house was damaged and three of its guards were among at least 19 people killed, according to police and hospital officials.

Iraqi officials, who spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to release the information, said the police chief, Col. Saad al-Nifoos, and the Sunni tribal official, Sheik Hamad al-Jibouri, survived.

The U.S. military said the targeted Awakening Council leader was Samir Ibrahim, not Sheik Hamad. It also said Ibrahim and the police chief had survived.

Saleh Jassim Moussa said two of his relatives from the neighborhood were killed.

The force of the blast was so strong, it shattered all the windows and ripped the doors from their frames in his home, only 100 yards away from the first explosion.

"It was a really huge explosion, we panicked and ran out but for minutes, we couldn't see anything because of the heavy smoke," said Moussa, 38, a government employee, who was reached by phone. "We're still digging through the rubble, looking for others."

Beiji is in the Sunni province of Salahuddin, which along with the vast Anbar province to the west is part of Iraq's Sunni heartland. The heartland has been the home base for the Sunni-led insurgency, but the U.S. military has cited recent success in getting local tribal leaders to join forces against the terror network.

"This is yet another failed attempt to break the will of the Iraqi people who just want to go on with their lives without violence, raise their children, earn a living and coexist together in a peaceful manner," said Lt. Col. Michael O. Donnelly, military spokesman for northern Iraq.

___

Associated Press writers Katarina Kratovac and Sameer N. Yacoub contributed to this story.

Copyright 2007 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.




 
 logansdad
 
posted on October 9, 2007 11:32:09 AM new
Further proof that you defeatists losers are determined to turn azz up to terrorism is not needed.

What do you say when the Iraqi government wants Blackwater to leave?

BAGHDAD — Iraqi authorities want the U.S. government to sever all contracts in Iraq with Blackwater USA within six months. They also want the firm to pay $8 million in compensation to families of each of the 17 people killed when its guards sprayed a traffic circle with heavy machine gun fire last month.

The demands _ part of an Iraqi government report examined by The Associated Press _ also called on U.S. authorities to hand over the Blackwater security agents involved in the Sept. 16 shootings to face possible trial in Iraqi courts.

The tone of the Iraqi report appears to signal further strains between the government of Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki and the White House over the deaths in Nisoor Square _ which have prompted a series of U.S. and Iraqi probes and raised questions over the use of private security contractors to guard U.S. diplomats and other officials.

Al-Maliki ordered the investigation by his defense minister and other top security and police officials on Sept. 22. The findings _ which were translated from Arabic by AP _ mark the most definitive Iraqi positions and contentions about the shootings last month.

The report also highlights the differences in death tolls and accounts that have complicated efforts to piece together the chain of events as one Blackwater-protected convoy raced back toward Baghdad's Green Zone after a nearby bombing, while a second backup team in four gun trucks sped into the square as a backup team.

The Iraqi investigation _ first outlined Thursday by The Associated Press _ charges the four Blackwater vehicles called to the square began shooting without provocation. Blackwater contends its employees came under fire first.

The government, at the conclusion of its investigation, said 17 Iraqis died. Initial reports put the toll at 11.

It said the compensation _ totaling $136 million _ was so high "because Blackwater uses employees who disrespect the rights of Iraqi citizens even though they are guests in this country."

The U.S. military pays compensation money to the families of civilians killed in battles or to cover property damage, but at far lower amounts.

The United States has not made conclusive findings about the shooting, though there are multiple investigations under way and Congress has opened inquiries into the role of private security contractors. Last week, the FBI took over a State Department investigation, raising the prospect that it could be referred to the Justice Department for prosecution.

The Iraqi government report said its courts were to proper venue in which to bring charges.

It said Blackwater's license to operate in Iraq expired on June 2, 2006, meaning it had no immunity from prosecution under Iraqi laws set down after the fall of Saddam Hussein in 2003.

The government report also challenged the claim that a decree in June 2004 by then-Iraqi administrator L. Paul Bremer granted Blackwater immunity from legal action in incidents such as the one in Nisoor Square. The report said the Blackwater guards could be charged under a criminal code from 1969.

U.S. Embassy spokeswoman Mirembe Nantongo said the diplomatic mission would have no comment on the report. Iraq's Interior Ministry spokesman, Abdul-Karim Khalaf, said the document was in American hands.

The report found that Blackwater guards also had killed 21 Iraqi civilians and wounded 27 in previous shootings since it took over security for U.S. diplomats in Baghdad after the U.S. invasion. The Iraqi government did not say whether it would try to prosecute in those cases.

The State Department has counted 56 shooting incidents involving Blackwater guards in Iraq this year. All were being reviewed as part of the comprehensive inquiry ordered by Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice.



"In my experience, those who do not like you fall into two categories: the stupid, and the envious. - John Wilmot, the Second Earl of Rochester
 
 shagmidmod
 
posted on October 11, 2007 08:26:49 AM new
Logan... in the eyes of the great lemming BearPorn, everyone is a defeatist if they disagree with his tunnel vision view.

 
 logansdad
 
posted on October 11, 2007 09:50:40 AM new
Yeah I know what you mean.

When people complained about the war it was:

1) you are anti-American and don't have military experience so you dont know what you are talking about.

2) Then when it was retired generals and veterans speaking out against the war, the neocons complained they are not activity duty solidiers

3) then when it was activity duty soldiers that were complaining against the war, they were called "phony soldiers"

Just like Bush's reason for going to war in Iraq keeps changing so does the Neo-cons view of who can complain agianst the war and whether or not they are anti-American and against the troops.


"In my experience, those who do not like you fall into two categories: the stupid, and the envious. - John Wilmot, the Second Earl of Rochester
 
 desquirrel
 
posted on October 11, 2007 09:59:17 AM new
I kind of like the argument "sh*t happens".

And of course it takes a real twit to say we're going to have a war but "we're not going to let sh*t happen".

But there never seems to be a shortage of twits.



 
 Helenjw
 
posted on October 11, 2007 03:09:50 PM new


Squirrel writes...[/i]I kind of like the argument "sh*t happens". [/i]

"And of course it takes a real twit to say we're going to have a war but "we're not going to let sh*t happen"."

"But there never seems to be a shortage of twits.



I agree that it's very difficult to believe that anyone is unaware that "sh*t always happens" in a war. The problem with this war is that there was no plan or expectation of an outcome other than the one envisioned by George. There was no contingency plan in case of a civil war. There was no plan in case armored vehicles would be needed. George was the fellow who failed to recognize that "sh*t happens" and therefore by your definition he is the twit.




 
 desquirrel
 
posted on October 11, 2007 04:05:02 PM new
And what do all the hysterics have to do with Blackwater fragging 2 civies??

Maybe you could volunteer and jump in front of every car and stick your face in the window to check for contraband.



 
 coach81938
 
posted on October 11, 2007 04:44:13 PM new
Helen, What a pleasure to read your posts--such good, logical thinking. Thank you. Desquirrel's only response was another adolescent post.
[ edited by coach81938 on Oct 11, 2007 04:47 PM ]
 
 Helenjw
 
posted on October 11, 2007 08:43:07 PM new

Actually, Coach, your posts have been very insturctive to me. I especially admire your poise and well reasoned posts.

Thanks!



 
 colin
 
posted on October 12, 2007 01:09:02 AM new
I see no reason to Defend Blackwater.

They're there to do a job and they do it.

An occasional Iraqi civilian is killed and eveyone is up in arms???? I'm more upset by the deputy sheriff that killed 6 young Americans.

Liberals have a way of making smaller things big and big things disappear.

The importance factor here is this.(in my Opinon)
One (1) American is worth more than all the the crap in the Middle East.

Muslims are our sworn enemies. Not a choice we made but one the Koran (Qur'an)has made for them.

I feel safer with the death of each and everyone of these fine people and if I could help send them to their just deserve, I'd do so.

“if God had wanted man to vote, He would have given us candidates.”

Amen,
Reverend Colin
http://www.reverendcolin.com

Rev's Roadhouse
http://www.revsroadhouse.com

Amen,
Reverend Colin
http://www.reverendcolin.com
 
 mingotree
 
posted on October 12, 2007 05:03:41 AM new
colin:

"""I see no reason to Defend Blackwater."""


Of course not, an uncontrolled force with no accountability is what bushits want on their side. With neocons like you backing them it'll be easy to install that kind of force on US soil.





"""They're there to do a job and they do it. """"

Yup, and doing a great job of keeping hostilities growing (with YOUR tax dollars), producing more hatred for the US and , hence, more terrorists.





""An occasional Iraqi civilian is killed and eveyone is up in arms????"""



OCCASIONAL ? Do you have any idea of how many Iraqi civilians have been slaughtered since the war started ????



"" I'm more upset by the deputy sheriff that killed 6 young Americans."""

The bushits have killed almost 4,000 Americans and mutilated thousands more.





"""Liberals have a way of making smaller things big and big things disappear."""




Matter of priorities, yours are screwed.





"""The importance factor here is this.(in my Opinon)
One (1) American is worth more than all the the crap in the Middle East."""""



So I take it you're AGAINST the war in Iraq.




"""Muslims are our sworn enemies. Not a choice we made but one the Koran (Qur'an)has made for them.""""



They're not MY sworn enemies.

AND THE TWO WOMEN RECENTLY MURDERED BY SOME OF THESE FORCES....


WERE CHRISTIANS.



So it must be skin color YOU don't like .





"""I feel safer with the death of each and everyone of these fine people and if I could help send them to their just deserve, I'd do so.""""


Hate speech will justifiably get you kicked out of Vendio.....ask around .







[ edited by mingotree on Oct 12, 2007 05:36 AM ]
 
 coach81938
 
posted on October 12, 2007 07:06:59 AM new
Thanks, Helen. The Mutual Admiration Society is now accepting new members

 
 logansdad
 
posted on October 12, 2007 12:10:32 PM new
Blackwater and me: A love story it ain't

I know something about Blackwater USA. This opinion is both intellectually driven as well as moderately emotional. You see, during my own yearlong tour in Iraq, the bad boys of Blackwater twice came closer to killing me than did any of the insurgents or Al Qaeda types. That sort of thing sticks with you. One story will suffice to make my point.

The first time it happened was in the spring of 2005. For various reasons, none of which bear repeating, I was moving through downtown Baghdad in an unmarked civilian sedan. I was with two other men, but they had the native look, while I was in my uniform, hunched in the back seat and partially covered by a blanket, hoping that the curtains on the window were enough to conceal my incongruous presence, not to mention my weapons. It was not the normal manner in which an Army infantry major moved around the city, but it was what the situation called for, so there I was. We were in normal Baghdad traffic, with the flow such as it was, in the hubbub of confusion that is generated when you suddenly introduce more than 1 million extra vehicles in the course of two years into a city that previously had only a few hundred thousand vehicles, and no real licensing authority.

As we approached one semi-infamous intersection along the main route used by Blackwater between the International Zone (a.k.a. the Green Zone) and the Ministry of Interior, one of Blackwater's convoys roared through. Apparently, Blackwater's agents did not like the look of us, the main body of cars in front of them. Their response was, to say the least, contrary to the best interests of the United States effort in Iraq. Barreling through in their huge, black armored Suburbans and Expeditions, they drove other cars onto the sidewalk even as they popped off rounds from at least one weapon, though I cannot say if the shots were aimed at us or fired into the sky as a warning. I do know one thing: It enraged me ... and Blackwater is, at least nominally, on our side.


But imagining that incident from an Iraqi perspective made it clear to me that though Blackwater USA draws its paycheck from Uncle Sam, it's not working in Uncle Sam's best interests. If I was this angry, I can only imagine the reactions of the tens of thousands of Iraqis who encounter Blackwater personnel on a regular basis.

Iraq operates on the basis of an honor culture. Honor is, arguably, more important than Islam. Being dishonored, in word or deed, or even by implication, is enough to set the average Iraqi man to plotting his revenge. This is a culture in which political assassinations (usually based on honor issues) are not an abstraction but an everyday occurrence. Every time one of those Blackwater convoys drives an Iraqi civilian off the road because the most important thing in the world is the protection of their "principal," they make a new enemy for the United States. Every time they ram another car to clear the way (and, yes, I've seen them do that), so that they could maintain their own speed and thereby minimize their exposure to "improvised explosive devices," they make another enemy. Every time they kill innocent civilians, or wound them, they make whole families of new enemies.

This understanding of the backlash effect from dishonoring an Iraqi is included in a past military counterinsurgency manual, "Instructions for American Servicemen in Iraq during World War II," recently re-published by the University of Chicago Press. But the reality is that Blackwater USA, from top to bottom, just does not care.

What employees of the private security firm care about, and I have heard this from the Blackwaters with whom I interacted in Iraq, is their paycheck. They care about their huge compensation packages, and about getting home alive to spend them. Blackwater USA has already taken in more than $1 billion from the public coffers.

All in all, that's not a bad take for Erik Prince, the founder of Blackwater and a Naval Academy dropout who served less time under the colors of the nation, in uniform, than my most recent pair of boots.

----------

Robert Bateman is a historian and U.S. Army infantry officer. He served in Iraq in 2005 and 2006. His most recent book is "No Gun Ri: A Military History of the Korean War Incident."
"In my experience, those who do not like you fall into two categories: the stupid, and the envious. - John Wilmot, the Second Earl of Rochester
 
 Helenjw
 
posted on October 12, 2007 02:17:38 PM new

Logansdad, that sounds more like the estimation of most U.S. soldiers toward mercenaries that I know or have read about.

This is an interesting reply from the Smokingchimp

"While your comments about the crimes committed by US troops have some validity, the issue here is one of legality and responsibility. If it was a question of who commands the lowest price per dead innocent Iraqi, Im sure everyone would agree that the good old US Army is a paragon of efficiency."

"But the reason that the media is "piling on" to the story about Blackwater is not the fact that it happened, but the fact that these are people operating in perhaps the shadiest of all "professions", who are killing with impunity because they have been exempted from both Iraqi and US law by the Bush Administration."

"Have you forgotten the reason why (at least according to Al Gonzales) the US is holding people indefinitely at Guantanamo, with no recourse to the courts? Its because they were "illegal combatants"! People who were fighting for and in a country other than their own, while not belonging to any recognized army. That is to say -- MERCENARIES."

"And now the US is stuck trying to explain why . . . . if it is so concerned about people in Afghanistan acting as "unlawful combatants . . . it has hired mercenaries who run around shooting innocent people, and why it protects them from any legal consequences of their actions. If you cant see why that is a bigger story than some out-of-control grunt in the "real" army, I dont know what I can say to make it any clearer."

..........

"Incidentally, I couldnt repress a guffaw today when I read the latest WaPo spin on gun-happy merks shooting up Iraqi civilians. Heres Joshua Partlow's cleverly phrased comment on the situation, when reporting the latest shooting of civilians:

"The killings came at a time of unprecedented scrutiny into the behavior of Western private security guards, viewed by many Iraqis as reckless mercenaries who operate with impunity, and with little regard for Iraqi life."

"Really Josh? "Many"!?!? Thats a surprise! Why on earth would Iraqis view people who sell their services as soldiers to the highest bidder "mercenaries"? And just because Paul Bremer ensured that they would be immune from prosecution, is it really fair to go around claiming that they "operate with impunity"?"

"And as for believing that they have "little regard for Iraqi life" . . . my goodness! I cant imagine where the folks in Iraq got that idea. Probably some librul media types spreading more bad rumours."

...........

 
 desquirrel
 
posted on October 12, 2007 04:06:21 PM new
This why people laugh at you. Bear pastes the statistics and we get:

"killing with impunity"
"gun happy..."

Bear pastes NUMBERS or a black and white statement and you get "conservative propaganda" from some twit. No "this is incorrect". And what's even better: the fellow whack packers chiming in to say "you really showed him". Half my office gets silly laughing at some of the posts here.

Just think how hysterical it would be if we took the entire Vendio whack pack, sent them to Iraq with rifles, and ran a few speeding cars past them. I wonder what stats we'd get.

 
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