posted on February 26, 2001 09:22:57 AM new
I rarely buy on eBay but I sell a lot of audiobooks & some videos: 550/425POS 0-N,0-N
Anyhoo, lately I've been buying some vids for resale and ALL of them say $4.00 SHIPPING -- and of course, ALL of them have been shipped 1st or book for $1.00 - $2.20!
Some are packaged in PAPER ENVELOPE ONLY!!! Some in $0.10 bubble bag!
Yes, I know I'm TOO LAZY to contact them before hand & ask: "BTW is that $4.00 for PRIORITY MAIL?"
But still, this is getting a little $%^%'ed!
I change ACTUAL POSTAGE +0.30 after a lot of gut-renching & soul-searching about that measley 0.30!
I can't believe buyers don't raise hell about what I call the:
$4.00 SHIPPING SCAM!
edited because "why not?"
[ edited by tomwiii on Feb 26, 2001 09:24 AM ]
posted on February 26, 2001 09:42:14 AM new
How can it possibly be a scam when it is posted in the auction? Total cost = bid amount + shipping charges. If total cost is acceptable why does it matter how the cost is split as long as it is not "fee avoidance", which is a violation of eBay's policy. $4 shipping does not sound like fee avoidance so what is the big deal?
posted on February 26, 2001 09:45:05 AM new
The fee avoidance is because the seller is making an extra $2-3 on the item by charging $4 for shipping and actually spending only $1-2, but they are not paying eBay fees on that shipping overcharge.
posted on February 26, 2001 09:46:57 AM newtomwiii...You are right...It is getting to a point where I do not even buy anymore! Since the postal hike, it would seem that the flood gates have been opened for ridiculous shipping charges. Sure, you could have questioned the shipping method, but it would seem to me that it should be the seller's responsibility to MENTION THAT in the listings...There is so much deceipt going on in the last year! I am actually looking back at my early days with fondness....
posted on February 26, 2001 10:08:16 AM new
Because one naturally ASSUMES that "$4.00 SHIPPING" (note: I did NOT say SHIPPING & HANDLING) would be priority!
Of course, I should NEVER ASSUME ANYTHING! And OF COURSE I should ASK BEFORE BIDDING if the seller is trying to garner an EXTRA $1.00 - $3.00 on these items!
HOWEVER, it would be nice if JUST ONCE! "$4.00 SHIPPING" turned out to at least be in the BALLPARK!
posted on February 26, 2001 10:13:33 AM new
If it doesn't say "Priority Mail" is probably isn't. Although this horse has been beaten to death 100 times already, I guess I'll beat it some more too.
Boxes don't pack themselves.
Boxes don't walk to the post office and mail themselves.
Someone has to pack and ship the item. If they choose to charge an extra fee to cover that expense, that is their right. As a customer, you have a right to not bid on their item but you do not have a right to refer to their policy as a scam.
We do not charge a handling fee, but just for example, this is what some companies have to spend to ship items:
Digital Scale: $150.00
Computer for UPS and Fedex Software: $800.00
Laser Printer for Shipping Labels: $250.00
36 Feet of Cabinets, Countertops, and Shelves for packing and shipping dept: $750
Add to that about $500 a month for tissue paper, bubble wrap, peanuts, boxes, and tape.
Add to that about $100 in gas to get back and forth to the post office to send packages.
Add to that Wages and Taxes for the person that packs and ships the packages.
Not everyone that sells on Ebay works out of their house. (although their time is worth money as well)
posted on February 26, 2001 10:14:35 AM newPLUS it is deceptive because they ALL pick a price that just happens to be VERY CLOSE to the Priority Mail charge -- accident? Me don't think so!
One could say "FIRST CLASS MAIL - buyer pays $4.00 SHIPPING" at least then it would be UP-FRONT!
I really DON'T CARE what the shipping charge is -- the point is that it looks SOoooooo yucky when they pull this crapola!
posted on February 26, 2001 10:16:47 AM new
I complained to Ebay about some sellers selling something in a dutch auction for 0.01 cents each, and charging 4.99 for shipping. Ebay told me they checked the auctions and that they were not "fee avoidence"
Its funny because if you look at the past auctions the same sellers used to sell the same item for 4.99 with a shipping charge os 2.00
Whats with that? If that is not fee avoidance then I dont know what is...
They pay to feature it so I guess since ebay is getting the Cat Feature listing fee then its ok!
posted on February 26, 2001 10:16:48 AM new
You are reading your own expectation into a statement. If they don't say priority mail, you really don't have an argument other than that they appear to charge too much and that is a relative matter. They are entitled to charge whatever they feel the market will consider as reasonable.
posted on February 26, 2001 10:29:34 AM newBecause one naturally ASSUMES...
Since I know not everybody does as you do, I ASSUME you meant to say...
Because I naturally ASSUME...
Besides, if shipping is going to be costing you $4.00, why does it make a difference who gets the money?
$3.85 to post office + $0.15 to seller = good seller???
$1.25 to post office + $2.75 to seller = bad seller???
I'm beginning to think that other sellers are the worst buyers. How many posts have been made here on AW that start out with a comment similar to this:
"I have a feedback rating of XXX from selling on eBay, and this is how I do things..."
in order to justify their criticism of another's business practices. Many seem to be operating under the delusion that, since their own personal TOS work for them, any seller they buy from should be more than happy to deviate from their own TOS to accomodate the buyer's obviously superior policies.
I change ACTUAL POSTAGE +0.30 after a lot of gut-renching & soul-searching about that measley 0.30!
$0.30 extra?!? If charging more than actual postage is a scam, isn't that just scamming on a smaller scale?
posted on February 26, 2001 10:30:00 AM new
I don't think stating "$4 shipping" is in any way dishonest, but I for sure agree that it's tiresome to have to email to ask questions before bidding. I've been looking at shipping supplies and having to email to get the UPS rate to my zip code, and it's a bother. But on the other hand, if I am shopping ebay I am looking for a deal, so isn't a few seconds of time worth saving money and driving around town?
posted on February 26, 2001 10:37:27 AM new
To quote:
"Boxes don't pack themselves.
"Boxes don't walk to the post office and mail themselves.
"Someone has to pack and ship the item.
"Digital Scale: $150.00
"Computer for UPS and Fedex Software: $800.00
"Laser Printer for Shipping Labels: $250.00
"36 Feet of Cabinets, Countertops
"Shelves for packing and shipping dept: $750
"Add to that about $500 a month for tissue paper, bubble wrap, peanuts, boxes, and tape.
"Add to that about $100 in gas to get back and forth to the post office to send packages.
"Add to that Wages and Taxes for the person that packs and ships the packages."
And what do you end up with? A friggin' retail outlet! Why are you playing with on line auctions then???
Tom ... when one of these greedy video tape sellers tells you they need $17.00 US to mail two tapes from USA to Canada, you KNOW it's time to start buying at Rogers, Future Shop and Blockbuster again
OTOH, if the listing says $4.00 to ship and you bid, that's what you pay regardless of how the tape is shipped. If it's too much, don't bid
posted on February 26, 2001 10:40:38 AM new
If I am bidding on a movie I certainly take the four dollar shipping into account and just deduct that from the total amount I am willing to spend.
Personally, I don't know why a seller would care if the movie was shipped priority or first class, other than for the free boxes, but even buying a video or cd size box brand new should not cost $2.50.
It would piss me off if I bid on a movie, then paid $4.00 for shipping and the movie was sent first class (instead of priority) with $1.50 in postage paid. That is quite a profit the seller has made. Although I probably would never say anything to the seller, I would never buy from that person again.
As a seller, when selling a movie I try to put the shipping cost in the title, (Where the Red Fern Grows 1.50 ship). I want to get the item to the high bidder and cheaply and safely as possible. I want them to feel we had a mutually positive experience and that neither one of us got scammed. This is the important if a seller has a desire for repeat business.
I agree with tomwiii
PLUS it is deceptive because they ALL pick a price that just happens to be VERY CLOSE to the Priority Mail charge -- accident? Me don't think so!
This is just plain sleazy!!
One could say "FIRST CLASS MAIL - buyer pays $4.00 SHIPPING" at least then it would be UP-FRONT! well said Tom.
posted on February 26, 2001 10:45:07 AM new
WHAT SCAM ????????
If the auction says shipping will be $4.00 then guess what, SHIPPING IS $4.00 !!!!
DUH !!!!!!
A scam is when the auction does not say anything about shipping and then charges $4.00 shipping on an item that cost $1.00 to ship. This is what I would consider a $4.00 scam.
If you have such a problem with sellers who clearly state the shipping charges up front in their auctions, then DON'T BID ON THOSE AUCTIONS !!!!!
GEEEEZ, how simple can that be ?
Instead of crying about it, simply don't bid on those auctions !
By the way, would you like some cheese to go with that whine ?
posted on February 26, 2001 10:56:01 AM new
cix ... Tom's example may not be a scam, but how about this:
The auction says "shipping $3.00, $3.50, or $4.00" (a few of these are listed right now!). What are you supposed to do when deciding whether or not to bid ... pick the shipping cost you like the most???
Or this one:
The listing states "Shipping $3.50 within the USA. Other countries will be the actual shipping cost". You place a bid "assuming" that the shipping costs to Canada will be the same or close to the other 500 tapes you have purchased during the past few years, then the seller tells you "that'll be $17.00 please - if you want insurance, that'll be extra".
Do you really think this is actual or a scam?
When the package arrives in a plain brown envelope with $2.35 postage attached, do you this is actual or a scam?
posted on February 26, 2001 11:52:32 AM new
You simply email the seller and ask how much will it be to where ever it is you want it sent to (if you are not in the U.S.)
As far as the $3.00, $3.50, or $4.00 question.
Do you mean the auction gives you a choice of what shipping price you will pay ??
posted on February 26, 2001 12:02:37 PM new
cix ... If only life were that simple!
I have found that about 50% of the time, video tape, CD, and DVD sellers will not respond to a request for "International" shipping. Those that do respond are either honest and tell you exactly what your laid down cost will be, or they tell you "I charge the actual shipping costs" (which is BS most of the time based on the postage on the envelope). I guess the other 50% must figure that the time it takes to provide a reply cuts a little too much into their profit
But, like I suggested above ... my best advice now with the new shipping rates (and the scams) is to buy your movies at the local video joint. It's just too expensive to buy these off the auction sites now, especially if you don't live in the USA.
As to the "pick-a-price" shipping, the seller does not specify what the difference is ...
[ edited by RB on Feb 26, 2001 12:04 PM ]
posted on February 26, 2001 12:08:16 PM new
I always assume the seller will just send the item free even though it says $4, then if they say no, the shipping is $4 final, I get real mad!! Maybe I should stop assuming things!!!
When I go to an Italian restuarant and order spaghetti, I get real upset because they charge me $7.99 when I can get the same thing in the store for under a $1. What kind of scam do these places operate?
posted on February 26, 2001 12:21:36 PM new
"..buy your movies at the local video joint. It's just too expensive to buy these off the auction sites now, especially if you don't live in the USA."
How much do you value your time? If you drive to the video store and back is that time not valued anything to you? If not, then you have a low sense of self worth, just like some people in China who work for .20¢ an hour. If you think you're worth more, well, why shouldn't a seller also value their time accordingly? So buy your videos in the store if it's cheaper, many people do. The people who buy at auction may value their time more, that's all.
[ edited by quickdraw29 on Feb 26, 2001 12:24 PM ]
posted on February 26, 2001 12:23:28 PM new
tomwii,
I totally agree with you. I am so sick and tired of buying things from eBay .... some went to the extent of getting it right on Priority rates! $3.95 for some labels ... okay, look like Priority. It comes staggering in a plain envelope that looks like it's been run over and postage paid $.76. YIKES! Boy, did I waste my time zapping my money via PayPal for service like this?
eBay already is getting tarnished reputations from rip off sellers like these. Come on and make an honest buck and be upfront about it. It's better to adjust the price and keep shipping minimal. Oh another thing. I hate those "surprise shipping charges!" been stung there too.
Okay, I'll get down from my soapbox.
avmom
(not avmom on eBay)
Edited to add .... now you know why customers haggle with outrageous shipping charges. None of my customers can haggle cuz they pick the shipping choice with "handling costs, being actual material".
[ edited by avmom on Feb 26, 2001 12:26 PM ]
posted on February 26, 2001 12:25:37 PM new
Everyone has a right to conduct their business how they see fit within legal limits. And if eBay doesn't frown on it, there's really nothing to be done.
Personally, I charge exact postage only and state the shipping method used. No guessing games. No handling fees. I build my packaging cost into the opening bid.
Since you know that it doesn't really cost $4 in postage and packaging materials unless it's shipped Priority Mail, then don't bid unless the auction states Priority Mail. Or, if you really want/need the item that bad, take a deep breath and open wallet.
As far as the paper envelope, if you're saying that it was unpadded, well, I certainly wouldn't send a video out like that. Hope it was OK.
Guess you haven't seen the threads that pop up about this now and again.
Don't assume anything.
It's a shame to hear that this discourages someone from buying. The problem with this is that might mean someone isn't even looking anymore to comparison shop. And that hurts us all.
posted on February 26, 2001 12:26:16 PM new
BTAIM, the point I was making was that YES, sellers can do this, and YES I should email before hand, and YES, I should ASSUME NOTHING -- however, in my most humble opinion, sellers who do it are low-life scumbags!
And yes I do prefer cheese with my WHINE, along with the pathetic automatic knee-jerk defense of any SLIMEY and SLEEZEY and TACKY SLIMEBALL SELLER techniques engineereed to WEASEL another lousey $1.00-$3.00 out of buyers!
posted on February 26, 2001 12:28:28 PM new
As a buyer I hate when sellers charge high rates. As a seller, I hate being accused of charging high rates. I charge(d) $4.95 to ship videos. Why? First, I send the videos priority. That is $3.50. Second, I pay for certificate of mailing which brings the total to $3.75. Third, I pay for packaging $0.25 which brings the total to $4.00. Then, I pay for labels so that the address is clear and I pay about $0.50 on labels which brings the total to $4.50. That is not including ink for my printer, gas, tape, time and labor. So, a $0.50 handeling charge is quite fair in my oppinion!
I have however recently found a solution to this problem though. I am going to offer 2 different shipping rates so people who don't want to pay higher shipping wont have to. I will offer media-mail and priority. I will still have to charge my packaging costs though.
posted on February 26, 2001 12:29:15 PM new
All the expectations from buyers is why I gave up selling on Ebay back in December. I did not charge a handling fee, ate the price of boxes, tape, etc. when not shipping Priority and packaged very carefully.
Then sales started sliding as competition grew to where I only made $1 to $2 profit per sale on the records, tapes, etc. I sold. I did good to make 50 cents on postcards after Ebay fees for all the ones that didn't sell.
You have to make money somewhere and if buyers only want to bid $1 to $3 for an item you have to at least cover your expenses for shipping the item -- not to mention your time spent packaging -- or you lose money -- and for anyone who does not sell lots of items I can tell you that took a lot of time!
I don't think anyone lists something to lose money - do you? If attitudes don't change I am just going to haul everything I have down to the local auction house and let someone else try to list it on Ebay next month!!!
If and when I start selling again I will add $1 to $2 to each box shipped non priority. If you call it "handling" fees it sounds like you are charging just for mailing it. Shipping includes the cost of boxes, tape, etc. Haven't you bought anything from any mail order place lately? Their shipping and handling fees are really high and they usually manage to ship in 3 different shipments so you pay that handling charge 3 times for one order!
When I started selling on Ebay I was getting $7 to $10 for what now sells for $3. I also sold 90% of my listings. Now I only sell 40% (without charging addtional shipping -- just because of competition). Ebay fees are high, Paypal fees are high, gas prices are high, my storage unit fees are high -- I just don't understand why everyone has so much trouble understanding it costs money to ship something.
Of course, he could have shipped it priority for the price you paid. But how much did you pay for the video in the first place? I agree with others that the price including shipping wasn't more than you were willing to pay so why not let him cover his expenses rather than giving it away to the post office? It arrived safely didn't it? Why should you care?
posted on February 26, 2001 12:30:54 PM newquickdraw29,
When I go to an Italian restuarant and order spaghetti, I get real upset because they charge me $7.99 when I can get the same thing in the store for under a $1. What kind of scam do these places operate?
posted on February 26, 2001 12:32:59 PM new
digitalmaster,
Excellent idea to offer a choice. Personally, I feel mailing a videotape excessive at $4.95. This is my prediction, but even though media mail may take longer, most consumers will appreciate you being sensitive to their pocket books! Watch your business activity. I think it will drum up more business.
Cheers.
avmom
(not avmom on eBay)
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Maybe I should stop assuming things!!!
