posted on December 28, 2000 07:45:07 PM new
Hello, all!
In a response I posted to a previous question on MPAA and eBay I was asked to explain pricing structures and MPAA's views on illegal copies on eBay.
Here goes:
Video stores must have latest New Releases on New Release day, which is usually every Tuesday (sometimes before a major holiday some studios will move it to Friday to accomidate the customers). To have it in store on that date an Independent Video Retailer (IVR) must pay about $82 each. So if your local store has six copies they paid $82 X 6 to have them in stock. OK, say the IVR down the street buys one copy and 5 blank tapes and records them to rent. IVR #1 has spent $492, IVR #2 spent $97. The additional cost of the "real" tapes goes to the actors, studios, etc. IVR #2 has cheated the studios out of $$$. MPAA is an organization made up of the studios to police things like this and the selling of promotional screeners.
Be aware that MPAA is actively policing eBay and prosecuting offenders.
As for the Wal-Mart $9.99 scenario, yes, you can also buy movies there. The duplication quality is normally lower than that of a rental tape. They are also available at stores AFTER release date. With the high volume of rental tapes out in the market now to satisfy customer demand of the first two weekends I would certainly watch local video stores for used copies of your favorite movie. Most IVR's carefully watch the quality of their movies so you will more than likely get a nearly-new copy of a superior recording at a great price.
DVD's, however, are currently being released on the same day and date to Wal-Mart, Circuit City and the like as IVR's.
To answer another question, "First Sale Doctrine" allows video stores to rent movies they buy from both distributors and department stores. It does not, however, all them to copy the movies. It also does not give the rights to rent computer programs.
Of course, if you are into rare collectible movies, video discs and games you could always watch my auctions - I am selling off the contents of a 11-year-old 10,000+ title store one at a time. AND not an illegal dupe in all of them!
posted on December 29, 2000 03:23:42 AM new
Umm...I'm sorry, but what exactly is the point of this thread? Other than to point out and promote the fact that MrsSantaClaus is going to be posting a bunch of videos on eBay?
I've never actually seen an independent video dealer make copies of a movie for rental. I can't see how anyone would be able to make any money at it, since even the most braindead prole out there can tell the difference between the labels on a prerecord and a boot.
Remember, the MPAA would really prefer that no one is allowed to even rent movies...they really want you to buy a studio copy of each and every movie you want to watch. If they actually took to cases that disclaimer at the beginning of each tape, every video rental store would be in violation of the law.
Rental and Sale pricing is just a means to control what is out on the market and to control how it gets there. They overlook the illegality of the rental situation and sell the tapes for an inflated amount that usually is only affordable by major rental chains (especially since major releases are required to be purchased in bulk to meet demand) when a video is initally released. DVDs don't really matter yet, since the average person doesn't know how to make a copy from one.
I personally think the studios collusion with the major chains in this situation amounts to restraint of trade and violates some anti-trust laws, since it allows a few rental chains to benefit at the expense of the independent renatl outlets.
posted on December 29, 2000 08:23:09 AM new
TRC: "since even the most braindead prole out there can tell the difference between the labels on a prerecord and a boot"
Yes, if they can see the item before they buy it. The problem with eBay and that entire ilk is that bootleg sellers do not, for obvious reasons, include a pic of their item and they word the description in a vague way. They also do not respond to pre-closing questions.
This is why I continue to advise video tape buyers that if you are not sure if the item is 'real', ask before bidding. If the seller will not offer you the courtesy of a reply, don't bid. When that seller gets busted, s/he will be required by the courts to name his/her sources and everyone who purchased a copy. The innocent buyer will lose the item, and possibly more.
Although you are correct that mrsantaclaus has figured out a way to cleverly advertise his product at AW, his statement about the MPAA actively prosecuting is correct. The MPAA, and a few large studios (Disney, etc.) are continuously runnning 'stings' (looking for stuff and offering to sell stuff) across the internet. Please be careful if you want to enter the bootleg video market ... either as a seller or a buyer
btw - your argument about violation of anti-trust laws, studio collusion, etc. is nonsense. This type of paranoid thought has been challenged several times and it's going nowhere ....
posted on December 29, 2000 08:36:16 AM new
This discussion was on video RENTAL dealers, not sellers. In this case, the prole will be able to see the tape (as he is renting it), so they should be able to tell the difference.
The point made here was that independent dealers often buy one copy of a movie and make copies for rental. I have never seen a successful video rental outlet do this, though I am sure a few small-minded entrepreneurs have tried it.
Perhaps the relationship between the studios and the big chains is not legal collusion, but I believe the effects of their deals are just the same.
Perhaps the rental outlets should just trade tapes with folks? That would certainly circumvent all the rules now, wouldn't it?
posted on December 29, 2000 09:03:23 AM new
The ORIGINAL discussion that I started and ended, and that this one has re-opened was NOT about video rental dealers at all. It was about illegal tapes being sold on eBay and how the MPAA is dealing with this problem.
I believe the question that I and a few others had wrt video rental stores is: "Are you allowed to purchase movies at Walmart, then rent them in your store?". I think a few of us are having difficulty trying to figure out why we have to pay a video rental joint $80.00 if we lose their copy of "The Matrix", yet we can buy a brand new, factory sealed, IDENTICAL quality copy for $9.99 at WaMart. That bit about inferior quality is not accurate when it comes to new releases of first run movies either at the video rental store or WalMart - we get the same quality of tape and reproduction as the video stores. There are, however, many EP, poor quality commercial tapes being sold at WalMart, but these are usually for old movies and teevee episodes. Beware of these as some of the "Recorded in EP" labels are cleverly hidden by the store bar code strip.
The only apparent difference between my copy of "The Matrix" and the one at Blockbuster is the release date. I will gladly wait a week or two and buy my own copy, saving $70.00 and 2 trips to Blockbuster
I also believe this question has been answered very nicely by mrsantaclaus ...
posted on December 29, 2000 01:48:25 PM new
Hello all
Sorry about that last paragraph in my original post. It should not have been there. The point I was trying to make was that I never had illegal dupes - and the fact I am still brokenhearted over closing my store overrode my normal better judgement. I don't have anything on auction now.
I had started this post to answer a question that was asked of me in another post. I was not trying to be clever to make sales. Also, I was asked my name on eBay. I did not in any way mean this to be a "let's attack this person" post. Someone asked a question and it was answered. I have previously asked questions of those in the know and had them answered for me. Isn't that what a discussion board is for?
Dealing in the video industry over 14 years I have come across many people renting, selling, distributing and making illegal copies of movies. Some have even gone so far as to buy color copiers to duplicate both the boxes and the labels on the cassettes. At one point I had in my possession 3 tapes that a customer rented from a competitor that were all dupes. Illegal duplication has long been a problem in the video industry and continues to be.
Rental and sale-thru pricing is determined using the following formula: a studio needs to make "x" amount of dollars once a movie reaches video. If they feel it will generate enough sales to make that amount, it will be released as a sell-thru. If not, rental pricing prevails.
MPAA doesn't work with the studios. It IS the studios. And, thankfully, they work hard to assist rental stores in making sure all tapes are legitimate.
Rentals are not illegal - the first sale doctrine has been challegened and has held up each time. It is currently under attack in respect to the internet and the downloading of movies. I wouldn't venture a guess as to how it will end.
TRL, you are absolutely right about the studios and major chains - and there are anti-trust lawsuits in the courts now.
As to movies at discount stores, I was relating to LP and SP mode. Also to the difference in ratings and special editions.
Actually there was a difference between the Matrix at the video store and the one at Wal-Mart - the one at Wal-Mart had additional scenes. Go figure!
The main point I was trying to make was eBay and your local IVR are excellent places to buy and sell movies. Ask questions and check the feedback of the seller AND if you receive an illegal tape get a refund. If you want to sell an illegal or promo tape MPAA is watching.
posted on December 29, 2000 01:52:55 PM new
One quick reply - if you lost a movie that you rented from me and were able to replace it with another copy you bought elsewhere that was in good condition, I would be happy. If not, I would only charge the actual replacement cost of the movie at that point - not the $80 that I originally paid for it.
