posted on December 30, 2000 10:32:12 PM new
I am now officially pissed.
A Seller claims she never got payment in time to mail my item before the postal rate change, and she has "asked" me to send her $1.00 to cover the extra Postage for the new rates.
I tell her that the rates don't go into effect till Jan. 7th, then she gives me this:
"Either you give me the extra postage to cover costs, or else i'll report you to ebay and keep your money."
I already sent the copy to safeharbor, but then again, I won't go to court over a $5.00 item.
Tell me the rate change isn't pulling up some scams like this.
:\\\"Crystalline Sliver cannot be the target of spells or abilities.
posted on December 30, 2000 10:53:39 PM new
Does the seller accept Paypal? If so, and she has a business account, send it as 4 twenty five cent payments. The seller would not receive a dime extra, yet you could prove that you had paid in full....
posted on December 30, 2000 11:20:04 PM new
Dang. I like that! You've got an evil streak. Perhaps one could even overpay by a quarter and ask that it be refunded.
posted on December 31, 2000 12:47:29 AM new
Okay...
I think nobody is getting at what my problem is and how to help. Allow me to write it again.
Seller is telling me that because my payment arrived Today, she cannot mail till after New Years, and due to the rate hike, is demanding I give her an extra $1 to cover the cost.
I promptly noted that the rates aren't gonna kick in till Jan. 7th, and she replies back with an e-mail threatening to keep my payment and report me to eBay as a bad Bidder.
I send copy note to safeharbor, and now I need help on how to get my item or my payment back.
So, can anyone help me?
:\\\"Crystalline Sliver cannot be the target of spells or abilities.
posted on December 31, 2000 01:14:27 AM new
It appears the seller has until Friday or Saturday in some cases to receive your payment yet.
As a buyer and seller on eBay for quite awhile now, I would simply email the seller mentioning (among other things) I have sent my money and that the seller will have eat the extra charge.
Another option I would entertain would be to email the seller stating that if they don't like my payment then I will consider it to be their cancellation not mine. In my opinion the change of "contract" was not agreed upon.
All the while CC safeharbor.....
Sometimes it amazes me how quickly people forget "customer service!"
Unless it turns out to be a HUGE misunderstanding, I would neg.
my two cents......
EDITED TO STATE: oops! the seller has received your payment.....I would also think about emailing the seller stating negs will hurt you more than me I can neg you too.
Sometimes the "threat" of negative feedbacking can be and is extorsion in my opinion to browbeat.
posted on December 31, 2000 01:16:53 AM new
How about inviting the seller here? Or forwarding this thread to him/her maybe they will see the errors of their ways.
posted on December 31, 2000 01:23:55 AM new
Some people...as Bobbysoxer said, maybe email the seller again stating that you have made the payment they requested and that if they cancel the sale it is them doing it and not you.
As you said and we all know, the new postal rates take effect Jan. 7th and that gives them 5 full days to mail your item.
Bobbysoxer also advised that you cc safeharbor the email. Maybe if you tell the seller that you have cc safeharbor all of the emails they will back off?
Good Luck!
And all this for an extra dollar.
posted on December 31, 2000 01:30:02 AM new
I think I understand the problem, but maybe not. You can either (1) tell the seller to go to hell, or (2) buckle under and pay the extortion money. Am I getting warm?
What this comes down to is "only a dollar." I hate to say it, but I would probably pay the extra dollar because I don't think it's worth fighting over. Yes, you're getting screwed, but compared to a four-way collision on the highway, it's not too bad.
That said, I would forward all correspondences to SafeHarbor and leave strong negative feedback upon receipt. The seller does NOT belong on eBay.
posted on December 31, 2000 01:46:30 AM new
When I was a novus a seller with a little bit of more time than I "attempted" to *blackmail* me with negative feedback. I shot right back and stated in my email that I considered that to be an outright threat (I may have used the word "extortion" in the email) as well as the fact I knew my rights and had legal resources, he backed off FAST! Never heard from him again. We didn't follow through on the transaction. No negs either.
The situation was different but the use of "negging" in my opinion -from what has been stated in this thread- is similar.
posted on December 31, 2000 02:27:38 AM new
As I have thought it over some more, if there wasn't an agreement as to the postage increase prior to sending the payment and the seller doesn't ship without the $1.00 additional payment in my opinion the seller is responsible for the mishandling of the transaction.
So Crystalline_Sliver did we help you or do you have more inquiries?
posted on December 31, 2000 03:25:50 AM new
I suppose that you could point out AGAIN that the postal rates don't go into effect until the 7th. Ask very nicely if she is able to mail your item before this date and if not, why not.
If this is a Canadian seller, our postal increase is Jan. 1
posted on December 31, 2000 03:49:07 AM new
Crystalline ...
They have the 2,3,4,5, AND the 6th to get your stuff in the mail under the old rates.
I'd tell them to either ship it before then or consider the sale cancelled by them, because they have your money and they have plenty of time to get it packed and to the USPS before the new rates kick in. And leave them a negative for it!
It's a petty attempt at gouging a buyer out of a few more centavos.
posted on December 31, 2000 05:52:59 AM new
Crystalline_Sliver - Did this seller have a clause in their TOS about holding checks for clearance for a certain length of time? Is this why they can't/won't ship until after the new rates (1-7) start to apply?
I've seen many listed auctions where the sellers have put, "If payment is received before XXX, then shipping is $x.xx. If received after XXX the new USPS rates will apply." If this seller didn't plan ahead, that should not be your problem.
On a different subject - Just curious as to whether or not you ever decided to be the one to auction/sell off your family estate items. I'd read your thread about your struggles with your immediate family members, but never did read how you decided to handle that. If you'd prefer not to answer, I understand.
posted on December 31, 2000 06:04:44 AM new
1. Don't send anymore money
2. Inform the seller that you will report them for mail fraud if they do not send you your item or refund your money.
3. CC safeharbor on these emails
AND...4 NEG no matter what, because this can't go on and if they have none,Your first one may break the dam and then other bidders may do as you have done.
Ain't Life Grand...
posted on December 31, 2000 06:24:34 AM new
As a seller I fully expect to have to "eat" a few bucks on postage during this rate transition. No huge deal.
Don't send any more money and give a neg. Your seller is out of line.
posted on December 31, 2000 06:26:21 AM new
Send them the URL link with this thread.
I had a seller do a similar thing to me when the auction (for a bicycle) included a charge of $20.00 for shipping. I won the auction only to get an e-mail which said that the shipping would be $25.00. I reminded the seller that the auction stated $20, at which time he e-mailed back in agreement. When he took the bike in to ship, he was hit told the price was $44 to ship plus $30 inconvenience packing charges. He wanted me to include an extra $45. I e-mailed back an extortion reference and got a message back that he would ship the bike and eat the charges but he would only profit $20 on the transaction. Fine and good, but it was supposedly shipped on 12/23, and I have yet to get it.
posted on December 31, 2000 06:31:39 AM new
It's a relief to know that the new postal rates don't take effect until the 7th. I also forgot to factor that into my EOA emails for my recently ended auctions, but I felt I'd just have to eat the difference (still do!). At least I might be able to get a few more items mailed out without eating any additional postage.
To the original poster: I'd follow the suggestions above. Remind the seller that the new rates don't kick in until the 7th, so she still has plenty of time to get your item sent out at the current rate. Send a copy of her email asking for additional money AND threatening negative feedback if she doesn't get it (that's at least two suspendable violations, as I count them) to Safe Harbor with expanded headers and the subject line "EXTRA COST ADDED AFTER AUCTION/FEEDBACK EXTORTION". CC: a copy to the seller. You may take a neg on this one; if so, just respond factually and unemotionally.
posted on December 31, 2000 06:36:28 AM new
"This postage increase is causing a lot of confusion for everyone - are you aware that it doesn't actually go into effect until January 7?"
Also, as someone else asked, was your payment a personal check by any chance? And is s/he one of those sellers who holds shipment until check has (supposedly) cleared?
Your seller was much too quick to threaten. An explanation of his/her thinking would have been in order...if in fact there is an explanation.
Sorry you ran into a 'hair-trigger' personality.
Also, as someone else has stated, I expect to "eat" a little postage during this transition.
posted on December 31, 2000 07:46:45 AM new
Check out the other thread running yesterday from a sellers perspective. My comments added to that were that while a seller may politely ask if a buyer wants to cover the extra cost in a "near-deadbeat/very slow pay" situation.
The fact of the matter is that the seller, if they stated in their auction OR EOA notice, a specific shipping cost, they CANNOT FORCE you to pay anything over that as that is a change in their TOS after the fact, which is against eBay rules.
Your seller seems to have gone bonkers placing themselves in a situation to have mail-fraud levied against them by their comment of "keeping your money" you already sent but not shipping the product.
I agree with everyone else.. Don't send them any more money, tell them they have until Jan 7th to ship, tell them they can't change their TOS, tell them you will report them for mail fraud, and CC: safeharbor on EVERYTHING.
As much as it would be fun to mail them 4 separate 25 cent charge card fees from PayPal, (costing them 30 cents each to get), DONT DO IT... It will only show that you're out to get them and spiteful.
Take the high road... You know your rights, and you're not out to ----- them like they are trying to do to you.
However--I would still leave negative feedback AFTER you get your product, especially if they don't change their ways immediately after you shoot your last letter and have to fight with them longer. Be unemotional and state something like "Seller tried to extort additional monies and change TOS after agreed upon ship price"
You as a bidder will have much better luck with eBay safeharbor than if you were a seller dealing with an extortion from a buyer...
posted on December 31, 2000 09:43:36 AM new
I would send them a final email, matter-of-factly advising them that you paid the amount shown in their TOS and will not agree to pay more, after the fact. If they, by their own free will, choose not to mail the package until after the rate increase on January 7, it is their problem, not yours. I would also point out that you have saved the copy of their email threatening to keep your money if you don't send more money. This is called mail fraud and also internet fraud. Let them know you will be happy to forward their email to the USPS and to the FBI's Internet Fraud Complaint Center. And make sure to follow up on it if they don't send your item or your money back. Either way, be sure to leave them a BIG, FAT NEG!
posted on December 31, 2000 09:56:25 AM new
Agreed with all the otheres sayong to CC to SafeHarbor etc.
How about asking for a refund if the seller chooses not to complete the transaction? I did not see that suggested. Might be easier than beating your head against this brick wall.
posted on December 31, 2000 09:58:30 AM new
I don't know how much you paid for the item, but I would take the seller at their word. You might end up out all your money, and relying on the FBI to investigate this as a case of mail fraud, hoping that you'll ever get your money back, is unrealistic.
Pay the buck, get the item, and then go to town on the seller.
posted on December 31, 2000 10:31:00 AM new
Since you have already contacted Safe Harbour (good for you, BTW ), I would not send her another penney (I would not, in any case...). It might be worth a NEG, to which you can let her have it by stating facts in a Response, and NEG her for EXTORTION.
If she considers that extra dollar as part of her Handling Fee, then she has to mention it in TOS.
Unless you are absolutely dying for that item, I would not yield.
********************
posted on December 31, 2000 10:33:02 AM new
A little catch up here (sorry I couldn't post earlier; I needed to sleep).
The Auction ended Dec. 20th. I sent payment (Money Order) Dec. 23th via Priority Mail.
(Yes, I know, but this wasn't a gift or any holiday related item. I didn't care if it got delayed by the holidays, I wanted it to get there!!).
Her TOS never stated a time frame to pay up. And, she noted the $3.20 Priority Postage rate, thought there was no reference to the new postal rates anywhere in her TOS.
The item was a $5.00 Widget.
I have done the cc thing to Safeharbor (as noted in my first post), and I've asked my neighbor (who's also the carrier that delevers my mail) to ask the Postmaster how I can file possable Mail Fraud charges.
No reply from her yet.
Linda_K: The Probate Court is thinking of breaking up the estate and allowing several "other" family memebers, (myself included) to manage the estate.
[edited for the weird space at the end]
:\\\"Crystalline Sliver cannot be the target of spells or abilities.
[ edited by Crystalline_Sliver on Dec 31, 2000 10:34 AM ]
posted on December 31, 2000 10:53:32 AM new
I know it is not required according to the AW community guidelines, do you plan to invite the seller to this thread? It might help you to resolve the situation.
posted on December 31, 2000 11:15:14 AM new
Twinsoft,
I found the FBI's internet fraud complaint site and filed a complaint several months ago. You can do this right over the internet. The next day, I had an emailed response from them asking for more info, copies of emails with headers, etc. Very shortly after that, the item I had been waiting for two and a half months, showed up on my door. They evidently shook this guy up in ways that I didn't. Ebay NARU'd him, but I was still out of my money, until the FBI got involved. Another lady I was in contact with re this crook, received her item a few days after I received mine. (We both filed complaints).
