posted on July 2, 2001 05:56:40 PM new
Snipe hunting: a fun game some country folks have. Take a group of city folks into the woods to hunt snipe. They must bang pots and pans loudly and yell, "C'mon snipe, c'mon snipe!" When no snipe appear, tell the city folks to bang and yell all the more.
posted on July 2, 2001 08:07:45 PM new
To snipe is to place a last minute bid within seconds of the auction's close hoping to beat out other bidders with a last minute bid.
Some people use sniping software to do this. There is a public snipe tool at vrane.com that is free and quite popular.
Others have two browsers open at the same time on the listing they are interested in. On one browser they place and review a bid, but don't submit it. On the other window they keep hitting the reload button.
Depending on how good your nerves are, if you count backwards from one minute down to about 25 seconds, then pop up the other window and hit the submit button, you have a good chance of winning the bid.
(Or losing it if someone has better nerves and a faster connection that you do.)
The sniper software is hard to beat, as it is automated, but it doesn't always work.
Sniping is a bit of a game. Most sellers love it, as it drives up the ending price of their listing at the last minute and makes for an exciting close to their auction.
Other buyers hate it as they often loose a desired item in the last seconds of an auction.
posted on July 2, 2001 08:37:56 PM new
Sniping is also most fun if you do it while wearing camouflage clothing & yell "TARGET DOWN!" after each successful snipe.
posted on July 3, 2001 08:25:33 AM new
"Most sellers love it, as it drives up the ending price of their listing at the last minute and makes for an exciting close to their auction"
If true, then "most sellers" are fools, since buyers are using sniping as a technique to ultimately pay less for the item than if they had bid early (and gotten sucked into bidding wars, etc)
But hey, if sellers are easily fooled by "eye candy" ("wow, look at the bid go up in the last second! Gosh I made a lot of money! " ) then that is their business.
Myself, I prefer the slow and steady rise of "early proxy bid and rebids" that most savvy buyers have found ends up in a higher price and thus avoid if possible.
Less exciting, of course, but better for my wallet.
posted on July 3, 2001 08:44:51 AM newIf true, then "most sellers" are fools, since buyers are using sniping as a technique to ultimately pay less for the item than if they had bid early (and gotten sucked into bidding wars, etc)
My employer enjoys every bid he gets. Since the seller has no control over the bidding patterns of an auction, (save illegal tactics like shilling, etc.)--what makes him a fool? People are not obligated to bid on anything, and certainly not in the manner a seller wishes.
Maybe a little business sense using satisfactory opening bids, research on comparable items, reserves, etc. would help someone who is getting less than satisfactory $.$$ from their auctions?
posted on July 3, 2001 08:51:17 AM new
what makes a seller a fool for *LOVING* sniping? simple..it makes them less money.
And that is what most sellers are here for, to make money.
Now, if a seller is here for charitable reasons, or for the pure joy of listing items, and does not care what the final price is, fine.
But "most sellers" I know are here to make money, and prefer more money to less, and if they "love sniping" then they are fools, since sniping is costing them money, pure and simple.
If your employer enjoys a snipe bid as much as an early proxy bid, then he clearly doesn't understand the fact that sniping is costing him money.
But as I said, that's his business, not mine.
But it doesn't change the fact that buyers use this technique to reduce the money he gets for his items, and if he's ok with that, so am I.
And yes, I don't have any "control" over bidding techniques, but that doesn't mean I have to "love" a technique that costs me money.
posted on July 3, 2001 09:15:12 AM newwhat makes a seller a fool for *LOVING* sniping? simple..it makes them less money.
If a seller loves sniping for the sheer thrill of watching the last couple bids in the ending seconds of an auction over seeing a progressively higher bidding before the end...then they are fools, and possibly mentally unstable. (Probably love Vegas too!)
I read the post as a seller being happy that there was an extra bid or two for an item that has been up for a complete auction cycle.
If your employer enjoys a snipe bid as much as an early proxy bid, then he clearly doesn't understand the fact that sniping is costing him money.
We sell the same crap every week. I'm sure people are even realizing this if they are looking for art supplies on ebay they can always tune in next week. We get bids throughout the week and even more right before the auction closes. My employer runs a succesful business. Brick and mortar and online. He's OK with receiving the opening bid, BIN or more for each item. He's making his margin.
Maybe sellers hoping for unreal bidding are in the wrong business.
Again...The seller has no control over how the bidding will proceed.
Accept the outcome of each auction and if you don't like it figure out a way to get a better bid
People who whine about bidding patterns don't belong selling.
posted on July 3, 2001 09:52:15 AM new
"He's OK with receiving the opening bid, BIN or more for each item. He's making his margin. "
If by this you mean he is NOT happier if he receives MORE than the minimum bid, that's fine. Of course, that makes him not a typical seller, who generally DOES prefer to make more money. If you don't believe this, just read the threads here, and/or consult any basic psychology or economics textbook. Its a rare seller indeed who, when offered either $50 or $40, would be exactly as happy with the $40. But hey, maybe your employer is that way. Since he cares so little about money, that's good for you - hit it up for a raise, quick!
"Maybe sellers hoping for unreal bidding are in the wrong business.
Again...The seller has no control over how the bidding will proceed.
Accept the outcome of each auction and if you don't like it figure out a way to get a better bid
People who whine about bidding patterns don't belong selling"
All of the above statements are, of course, irrelevant to my argument, and I presume you make these statements for whatever personal reasons.
I stand by my (very simple) argument: most sellers on ebay prefer to make more money than less, and sniping results in a lower final price, so sniping should make them less happy (let alone they should "love it" !). (Masochistic sellers are excluded from my argument of course! )
posted on July 3, 2001 10:24:57 AM newIf by this you mean he is NOT happier if he receives MORE than the minimum bid, that's fine. Of course, that makes him not a typical seller, who generally DOES prefer to make more money.
>> He's OK with receiving the...
What succesful business does not prefer to make more money!?
(That was a statement I hope you can agree with, please don't try to assume what my intentions with the question are and reply to it...)
If you don't believe this, just read the threads here, and/or consult any basic psychology or economics textbook. Its a rare seller indeed who, when offered either $50 or $40, would be exactly as happy with the $40. But hey, maybe your employer is that way.
Maybe you should not assume anything and not read into the posts of others something that was never intended...just to start your little pissing matches.
(Masochistic sellers are excluded from my argument of course!)
I'm feeling, unfortunately, a bit masochistic myself, in even replying to your little session of mindreading here...
arttsupplies (webmaster)
edited to add a space between two words.
[ edited by arttsupplies on Jul 3, 2001 10:25 AM ]
posted on July 3, 2001 10:27:46 AM new
well, since you seem to be getting upset by my logical reasoning, I will do my part for peace and tranquility here by not responding directly to your last post.
I will merely end by noting that my argument stands untouched by anything you've posted. No "mind reading" (actually, I leave that to my friend Mr. Spock) is required to observe this fact!
posted on July 3, 2001 10:35:23 AM new
"Sometimes it does, and sometimes it does not.
To state anything is else, is pure nonsense."
Well, many, many buyers have stated that it results ON AVERAGE in a lower price, so I guess there are many, many of us stating "nonsense". He he.
In any case, OF COURSE "sometimes" it does NOT result in a lower price..but I was talking about ON AVERAGE. And OF COURSE we can talk about what happens ON AVERAGE. ON AVERAGE, it has to go up or down (or, theoretically, remain exactly the same, but this is statistically very unlikely).
99% of people have stated that, ON AVERAGE, sniping results in paying less money. Believe us or don't, doesn't matter to me, since you are entitled to your own opinion. Since Its "many against you", I know where I stand!
"Nice to see you beating the same bush Kirk"
glad to have you join me, reddeer!
Now if only you could disprove any of my arguments, that would be a nice change!
posted on July 3, 2001 10:48:27 AM new
On AVERAGE I find that ANY bid placed raises the final ending price.
On AVERAGE I find that IF that person placing the FINAL bid in the FINAL moments had chose NOT to bid, my final ending price would be lower, in many cases, MUCH lower than had they placed the bid.
On AVERAGE I find that the lowball cheapskate early proxy bidders are the true BARGAIN hunters that are hoping for a steal of a deal, and that on AVERAGE last minute/second bidders know the true value of the item, and are willing to pay the price to win it.
posted on July 3, 2001 11:04:45 AM new
"On AVERAGE I find that ANY bid placed raises the final ending price"
True, but irrelvant to my argument.
"On AVERAGE I find that IF that person placing the FINAL bid in the FINAL moments had chose NOT to bid, my final ending price would be lower, in many cases, MUCH lower than had they placed the bid"
Ditto, just the same as your first irrelevant statement.
"On AVERAGE I find that the lowball cheapskate early proxy bidders are the true BARGAIN hunters that are hoping for a steal of a deal, and that on AVERAGE last minute/second bidders know the true value of the item, and are willing to pay the price to win it."
you are 3 for 3 on irrelevant. This may be your experience, but, as I said, I'm speaking on behalf of the average buyer's viewpoint. Your mileage may vary, but you are just one of millions on ebay, so you are (statistically speaking) insignificant.
Besides, we aren't comparing the average character of an early bidder ("cheapskate bargain hunter" ) versus the character of a sniper ("wonderful buyer" ); even if we accept your charactertization of them (which I don't, since I think its an insult to many early proxy bidders), the question we are discussing is the result of CHOOSING A BIDDING STRATEGY. In other words, to make it very plain to you, what would have happened had the "wonderful buyers" placed their bids early, and/or if the "cheapskates" had placed their bids later? would the price have gone up or down? We need to address that issue, which you haven't.
As a bidding strategy, buyers who chose to bid later rather than early pay less, or so they say. This means a seller gets less. This means that a seller should NOT love sniping (the bidding strategy).
posted on July 3, 2001 11:20:56 AM new
And, as it turns out, i have to end my time here, as i'm off to get ready for a trip to, of all places, reddeer's home country.
Just to be boring, I'll reiterate: Buyers who are savvy and want to pay as little as possible (which is most buyers) will adopt a bidding strategy of bidding as late as possible. This helps eliminate shilling, counter bids, etc. Choosing this bidding strategy will, ON AVERAGE, result in a final bid price that is lower than if they had chosen a bidding strategy of early proxy bidding. Don't believe me? that's fine, there are hundreds/thousands of other satisfied bidders who will back me up! Why else would they put up with the hassle of being glued to a computer, late at night, for that last-second bid?
Given that, if you are a seller, and you "love sniping", you may want to rethink that position. Sniping is taking money away from you. Not that you have any control over it, of course, but at least recognize when a bidder has chosen a strategy to pay you as little as possible.
posted on July 3, 2001 06:03:12 PM new
QUICK REDDEER......Mr SPOCK HAS CAPTAIN KIRK IN ONE OF THOSE MIND GRIP HOLDS...
I will take any and all Snippers any time any where....!
A bid is a bid is a bid...regardless of when it was placed...5 seconds after listing
it or 5 second prior to the end ...
I get tons of email from people who say.... [b] “will you sell me one of those..I keep
getting outbid at the last second” [/b] ...well I tell them they’re in luck because I just re-listed one and to set their proxy bid higher next time...
ya baby.......The Captain says....... “ Given that, if you are a seller, and you "love sniping", you may want to rethink that position” I SAY OK...Instead of just skipping to the bank with my eBay..money I just might whistle “oh what a beautiful day” as well...
.
EBAY ID
JUMPIN*JACK
ubb again
[ edited by jumpinjacko on Jul 3, 2001 06:04 PM ]
posted on July 3, 2001 08:48:39 PM new
I'm glad to hear that-I'm one of those early proxy bidders! If I see something I want, I place my proxy bid at the highest I'm going. If I win, I do-if not-there will be another one come along. I don't want to bother with checking back on my bid. I just wait until the end and see how it comes out. Works for me.
posted on July 4, 2001 02:59:40 PM new
Let me throw my two cents in...
As a seller, I am happy to simply have items sell, and I think bidders that throw down outrageously high early proxys are rather dumb. Besides, people can go into a bidding war the last six days or the last six minutes of your auction. As a buyer, I snipe to win items that I want, not to keep the cost low.
If I saw a CD I wanted with five days and realistically thought "hey, if I proxy bid $12, I will win" then I would do so, but it doesnt work this way, so I watch it and let anyone else who wants it bid on it and hope they are not paying attention when there are 26 seconds left...Because the key to a bidding war is to have at least two bidders who want your item and who will pay attention to it until it ends.
[ edited by beekmanbooks on Jul 4, 2001 03:05 PM ]
posted on July 4, 2001 04:02:33 PM new
There are numerous reasons why "some" bidders place an early proxy bid, just as there are numerous reasons why "some" bidders wait until the final moments to place their bid.
And as much as it pains Kirk to hear me say this ......
I love ALL bidders, regardless of when they place their bid.
posted on July 4, 2001 04:27:27 PM new
[i]posted on July 2, 2001 06:32:52 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
06:32:52[/i]
