posted on January 9, 2002 09:19:39 AM new
This is my first lost package on maybe 600 I've shipped. I used delivery confirmation and can see the package was scanned at a USPS processing facility in the buyers state a month ago, but does not show delivered.
I told him: "Insurance is optional for $1.00 if desired. I cannot be responsible for lost or damaged shipments that are not insured." Buyer declined insurance.
It's been 35 days and still hasn't arrived. So, not wanting to leave the buyer with nothing and trying to be nice, I offer him replacement at my cost (half off) or my cost on a similar priced item from my storefront.
He fires back with "Well I don't know where to start...I appreciate you contacting me about the situation but for you to tell me that you are not going to replace the item
and expect me to buy from you again is very unfair....the insurance is for items that are damaged when it gets here not items that never arrives...you the seller should be responsible for that....we are not talking about a whole lot of money here, but it is the principle behind it....I really think
you should be fair about the situation and send me the item that suppose to
be here a month ago...!!!
The buyer is also a seller with like 280 good feedback. So I think he should know better. I absolutely am not going to eat this. Before I felt bad for him, now I want to punch him, or at least withdraw my offer.
Does anyone out there agree with him? I'm right, he's wrong, right?
posted on January 9, 2002 09:28:17 AM new
I've been there plenty of times, so I know how you feel. It's a no win situation...
My recommendation is to replace the item or refund and move on, especially since it is not a high value item. I've reluctantly done this many times, and in hind site, it has always been the best thing to do. The problems these types of buyers can cause simply isn't worth your aggrevation. Dont' get me wrong, you are completely correct in all cases, but you simply cannot win.
Since using Priority Mail with delivery confirmation, the number of non-receipt scammers we have encountered has gone way down. With the DC, we can tell if an item arrives or if it doesn't. The number of items we have had to replace since using the feature has also dropped.
You're clearly a consciencious seller, so save yourself the aggrevation and get rid of this buyer. Save your enegery for more listings.
posted on January 9, 2002 09:31:51 AM new
I'd refund and take it up with the USPS, if they won't help I'd eat the money and be glad this was the first in 600.
Customer satisfaction is just good business... Return business is always good business, plus I'd hate the neg that will come with this ordeal.
I also have similar TOS but there is an exception to every rule and I'd call this the exception.<br />
[ edited for fun by kyms on Jan 9, 2002 09:32 AM ]
[ edited by kyms on Jan 9, 2002 09:34 AM ]
posted on January 9, 2002 09:43:54 AM new
I have had success with have my post office (window supervisor not window clerk) contact the other postoffice. Print what the DC shows and take it to the PO, ask them to call. You will be amazed how fast they find it (sometimes).
"the insurance is for items that are damaged when it gets here not items that never arrives"
That is NOT true. Insurance coverage as stated on the back of the little green slip -" Postal insurance covers (1) the value of the article(s) at the time of mailing, if lost or totally damaged, or (2) the cost of the repairs. It does not cover spoilage of perishable items. And so on.
SO TOTALLY LOST ITEMS ARE COVERED!
It is not your respondsiblity as you stated "I cannot be responsible for lost or damaged shipments that are not insured."
Just to mention one more thing - For many reasons that the PO makes up, delivery confirmations are not always scanned. One reason is that the delivery guy scanners do not always work especially in the cold or rain. A delivery guy told me that. He says all he can do is try and a lot of times by the end of the day it does not work at all.
posted on January 9, 2002 10:14:25 AM new
I don't know if I'd be so quick to refund either.
I had a package scanned just as you have described. It eventually came back to me because the buyer never picked it up from the post office after several notices.
Try richierich's suggestion. You might find out the package has been at their PO all along.
posted on January 9, 2002 11:04:32 AM new
I would not refund the money nor would I ship a relacement item. If the buyer has over 200+ feedback they are aware of the rules. I know you probably get a neg out of this but You have to wonder how many times this buyer has pulled this little scam and gotten away with it. Too many sellers are afraid of negs and allow dishonest buyers to dictate the rules. I would inform the buyer that if the item ever shows up on your doorstep you will refund immediately, take the possible neg-respond to it-block this buyer and move on.
posted on January 9, 2002 11:38:04 AM new
I think having the insurance optional policy is a no win situation. I think it is either better to automatically add the price of insurance into the item, or to not offer it, and just refund on problem deliveries. The problem with insurance optional is that most will decline, but most will demand that you make good since the item was not delivered. I know you can say this was my policy, but it will result in negatives, and definitely you will not get a repeat customer base.
From my point of view, it is the seller that is responsible that the item gets delivered. How would you feel if you ordered something from the JC Penney Catalog, it got lost in the mail, and they told you too bad, you were paying for it anyway? I would be outraged, as would you!
posted on January 9, 2002 11:48:52 AM new
ahc3 - I had 2 packages from mail order/catalogue places never get to me.
One immediately sent a replacement. It made me wonder if they really ever sent it in the first place!
The other sent me a claim form for me to fill out. 30 days later they sent me a letter to file a claim at UPS. In total 58 days past since it was sent. 3 weeks later my package arrived.
So to immediately offer a refund or immediate send a replacement is NOT good business either. The package may show up. It just needs some time and some checking into. After all, the package did not grow legs and wander away on it's own. Someone some where needs to look for it.
posted on January 9, 2002 12:09:44 PM new
if a package has not shown up in more than one month,it is probably lost or stolen.
since you have the dc and it showed it arrived at his post office,it is really up to him to track it,he wants to save 1.10,so now the package is lost.
i have noticed recently ebay sellers do not take out insurance even though they charge enough to take out insurance,priority and dc and more,these sellers are taking advantage of buyers who sent mo or personal check.
for example one seller sold me a bunch of junk jewelry and charge me 6.00,shipped in padded envelpe for under 3 dollars.another one sent me an ivory brooch for 5.95,no insurance,just a padded envelope with dc.
these sellers are taking a chance,what if buyer claims he did not get the item and do a chargeback if he used credit card.
posted on January 9, 2002 01:41:14 PM new
As a seller why are you "offering" an insurance option ? Just add it in to the shipping and handling price and give no option.
That's what I do. I also get compliments from surprised buyers too for sending the item insured.
Shifting the risk to the buyer is bad business and generally won't hold up, and will not hold up in a credit card transaction.
Rule of thumb for insuring- how much can you afford to lose ? $10, $20 ? Remember, you're not insuring an item, you're insuring risk. If you can't afford the risk, don't take it. If you insure, there is no reason for DC either.
But if this is for an item under $10, why in the world would you argue over it- just send another one- AND INSURE IT !!
posted on January 9, 2002 09:32:47 PM new
Yes the USPS pays insurance if an item is lost. I can attest to that. I sent a book, priority mail, insured with delivery confirmation. The delivery confirmation said it was delivered but the person said it never came. Now, the postman cannot leave a priority package at a mailbox without finding out if the person is home. If the person is not home they must take it back to the postoffice for delivery at a different date. If they leave it the USPS loses and you get paid. Ask your buyer to call or go down to the Post office and see if that package is hiding around there someplace. It still could be there. Now if it was me and I offered insurance and it wasn't taken I would put the insurance on it if it was $15.00 or more but under that I would eat the cost. If offered and refused and I put the insurance on it, I never tell my buyers. I can't refund because I have no duplicates so I would refund the money.
posted on January 10, 2002 12:57:08 AM newAs a seller why are you "offering" an insurance option ? Just add it in to the shipping and handling price and give no option.
Reamond -- Am I correct in assuming that the above statement is in the context of domestic shipping only? I often ship packages international and all buyers have opted for the "insurance optional" method. For example, the difference between insurance (Global Express) and no insurance (Air Mail) is $12.50 for a one pound package. If I provided insurance on all international packages, I am confident I would receive less bids.
posted on January 10, 2002 08:08:38 AM new
You are right, but it's a no-win situation. At best, you'll get away with a neg, at worst, a fraud complaint and then you take your chances with eBay.
Rather than offering optional insurance, you can require insurance and then allow the buyer to opt out at their own risk. IOW, the buyer must explicity state that they do not wish to insure, at their own risk. It's (a little) more protection for you. I know many buyers do not wish to add $1.10 to the cost of an inexpensive item.
posted on January 10, 2002 09:01:43 AM new
I use a combination of these methods. I state that insurance is optional on most items and that buyers assume the risk if they don't purchase it. On inexpensive items, I don't bother with it at all. On items costing over, say, $20, I buy it myself if the winner hasn't opted for insurance. But I use PIC, which costs me only 60 cents up to $50. On really expensive stuff, I add it to the cost of shipping and inform the buyer that I've done so.
In over two years, I've had only one relatively inexpensive item get damaged/lost. One of a set of three knives came out of its package. Not only was I lucky enough to have a replacement for the buyer, but I had insured the package with PIC and within about ten days of making the claim I had received a check for the missing knife.
Reluctantly, I have to agree that this is a no-win situation. Most buyers won't pony up the extra for the insurance...which is no big deal on a $10 item. But if it's a $100 sale, you really don't want to have to refund that kind of money just on a buyer's say-so. To protect yourself, you almost HAVE to insure those more expensive packages (the threshhold is whatever makes you comfortable).
I think it also matters what you sell and the type of buyer your products attract. Some categories seem to gather all the nutcases and weird winners, and others don't. In my niches, I seem to get mostly "normal" folks who don't make outrageous demands or expect kid-glove treatment for a $5 purchase (but they get it anyway). If I sold computer stuff, or electronics, or popular collectibles, I'd have to take a whole different attitude about possible fraud, etc.
