clancey99
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posted on May 5, 2004 03:54:08 PM new
This is a first for me= has this happeened to anyone else here? I just received an email from Paypal reversing a payment for an item they told me was OK to ship- Apparently the bank account is fraudulant-Fortunatly it was only a $9.99 plus $3.00 for shipping item-no insurance-Interesting too is that when they reversed the payment they did not return their commission-I think since they gave me the OK to ship that this is their responsibilityAny thoughts????????????-Also I donm't like the idea tyhat they can automatically remove money from My bank account without any authorization-
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cblev65252
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posted on May 5, 2004 04:12:33 PM new
They told you a check had cleared???? Or did the bidder use a credit card? If Paypal stated to you that the check had cleared and to go ahead and send, I'd raise hell with them. They can't go into your bank account. They can only take from your Paypal account. They changed that a little while ago.
Cheryl
http://www.kcskorner.com
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tomwiii
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posted on May 5, 2004 04:16:11 PM new
What do you mean by "PayPal gave the OK to ship?"
The rules are pretty clear & very easy to follow:
IF YOU SHIP
1) To a USA bidder & to
2) his CONFIRMED USA address,
THEN, PayPal might eat any problems...
If you shipped OUTSIDE the USA &/or to an UNCONFIRMED address, & the buyer complains for ANY reason, then ye be SOL!
SIMPLE?
SiMpLe!
718
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clancey99
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posted on May 5, 2004 04:38:26 PM new
This woman took a long time to pay for this item- Her EBAY status now is "not a registered user" so she apparently has had problems- BUT Paypal has that note that tells the seller to SHIP- Actually I did not ship right away so if there was a problem on her account it should have come up right away and I should have been notified-Not over a week later-I did EMAIL them but I think I will have to find their phone number and call them-If anyone has it I would appreciate it-
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tomwiii
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posted on May 5, 2004 04:54:33 PM new
DID you ship to a CONFIRMED USA address?
If YES, then PayPal will help you & it was a simple clerical error (LOL!)
If NO, then you have NO recourse & YOU ARE SCREWED out of your money!
FAIR? Maybe not, but them's be their rules.
Now, you can yack about this & that & the other thing, but PayPal is VERY simple to use & not get into trouble!
They ain'y gonna give ya back yer money if ya did NOT follow the rules.
718
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clancey99
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posted on May 5, 2004 05:31:57 PM new
It is a CONFIRMED address-and that was on April 23rd- Today is May 5th??? That's almost 2 weeks-That still doesn't explain how they have the right ot REVERSE the transaction by taking money from my bank account- How can that be legal??? They have a right to ask me to repay the money but not to just take it=-
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stopwhining
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posted on May 5, 2004 05:48:17 PM new
Read your paypal agreement,i believe you have to agree to allow paypal access your bank account when you sign up .
This becomes effective 2 years ago??
it does not matter if you ship to confirmed address or not when there is fraud,be it credit card or bank fund.
-sig file -------we eat to live,not live to eat.
Benjamin Franklin
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stopwhining
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posted on May 5, 2004 05:55:08 PM new
they are not going to ask anyone permission to tap into their bank account,too many people will just close that bank account or tell the bank not to allow paypal to access the account.
ever wonder some sellers said they dont accept paypal no matter what,some of them have unfinished business with paypal.
-sig file -------we eat to live,not live to eat.
Benjamin Franklin
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tomwiii
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posted on May 5, 2004 06:00:08 PM new
When one signs up with the EVIL EMPIRE (PP), one agrees to the TOS, which includes this little tidbit:
"When you receive funds through PayPal, if the sender's transaction is reversed because of a credit card reversal and you do not qualify for the Seller Protection Policy for that transaction, you will owe PayPal for the amount of the reversed transaction plus any fees imposed on PayPal as a result of the reversal. You agree to reimburse PayPal from either your PayPal account or by other means as described in the Payments (Sending, Receiving, and Withdrawing) Policy. Furthermore, if you open a Premier or Business Account after October 11, 2001, you authorize PayPal to debit your bank account linked to that PayPal account for the amount that you owe PayPal on transactions which were not covered by the Seller Protection Policy and which were not recoverable from your PayPal balance."
Also, ye should review the SELLERS PROTECTION POLICY, as it HAS become much more obscure & verbose lately:
This Policy was last modified on February 13, 2004.
General. PayPal's Seller Protection Policy is designed to try to help buyers recover funds from sellers who do not ship the promised goods, and to reduce the risk of reversals (a reversal, or chargeback, occurs when a buyer rejects or reverses a charge on his or her credit card) for sellers who follow the risk-reduction procedures specified in #2 below.
When you receive funds through PayPal, if the sender's transaction is reversed for any reason and you do not qualify for the Seller Protection Policy for that transaction, you will owe PayPal for the amount of the reversed transaction plus a $10 chargeback fee. You agree to reimburse PayPal from either your PayPal account or by other means as described in the Payments (Sending, Receiving, and Withdrawing) Policy.
Policy Conditions. If the following conditions are met, PayPal agrees not to pass through to sellers of physical goods up to $5,000 USD per year of reversals resulting from (a) a buyer's unauthorized use of a credit card or (b) false claims of non-shipment of goods. Once PayPal has absorbed $5,000 USD in reversals (or the equivalent amount in the currency of the relevant transactions), the seller is liable for additional reversals even if the seller meets all of the conditions set out below. This protection applies only to the sale of physical goods, and not to any services, intangible goods or sales or licenses of digital content. This protection does not cover reversals arising from claims that goods are "not as described." To reduce the risk of "not-as-described" claims, PayPal suggests using a clear description and pictures of the actual item you are selling in your listing.
To qualify, all of the following conditions must be met:
The transaction meets one of the following conditions:
The seller is a U.S. or Canadian seller shipping to a U.S. buyer, or
The seller is a U.K. seller shipping to a U.S. or U.K. buyer.
The payment is listed as "Seller Protection Policy Eligible" on the Transaction Details page. To see the Transaction Details for a payment, log in to your PayPal account and click on the History subtab of the My Account tab, then click on the "Details" link for the transaction in question.
The seller has a Verified Business or Premier Account. Note: While sellers outside of the U.S., U.K., and Canada may have a status of Verified, they do not qualify for and are not protected by the Seller Protection Policy and therefore will be liable for any reversals of the payments they receive.
The seller ships to the address listed on the Transaction Details page. To see the Transaction Details for a payment, log in to your PayPal account and click on the History subtab of the My Account tab, then click on the "Details" link for the transaction in question.
The seller must provide reasonable proof of shipment from a shipper that the seller does not control, which can be tracked online by PayPal representatives. This documentation must show that you shipped to the address listed on the Transaction Details page. For a list of currently approved shippers, click here. If the shipping provider you used does not appear on this list, you will need to provide PayPal with the shipping provider and the tracking number that can be tracked online. A PayPal representative will then review your information and notify you of your eligibility for Seller Protection. For transactions equal to $250 USD (or the equivalent in the currency of the transaction) or more in value, the seller also needs to provide an online proof-of-receipt in the form of a signature from the recipient. Because comparable proof-of-shipment is not currently available for electronically-delivered items, we are currently unable to offer Seller Protection for digital goods and other electronically-delivered items
The seller accepted a single payment from only one PayPal account for the purchase. Multiple payments from different accounts for a single item are a fraud indicator. Sellers should not accept such payments.
The seller cooperates in resolving disputes by responding in the following time periods: When a complaint occurs, the seller must provide complete information within 7 days of a request from PayPal. However, if PayPal is required by the credit card association to respond immediately to resolve a reversal, sellers must provide the information within 3 days. PayPal will indicate the response time required in the e-mail message sent to the seller.
The seller ships within 7 days of receiving payment.
Do not surcharge the buyer. Surcharging for any PayPal payment is prohibited outside of the U.K. For a transaction to be eligible for the Seller Protection Policy within the U.K., the buyer may not be surcharged.
718
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stopwhining
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posted on May 5, 2004 06:50:31 PM new
QUESTION- online proof of receipt??
for those of us who use USPS,i dont know if any of the proof of receipt we purchased from USPS is trackable online??
anyone knows??
-sig file -------we eat to live,not live to eat.
Benjamin Franklin
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tomwiii
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posted on May 5, 2004 09:19:43 PM new
SW:
Although DC (both RETAIL & e) is NOT tracking, PayPal has declared DC to be adequate to meet the proof for the SPP.
718
[ edited by tomwiii on May 5, 2004 09:23 PM ]
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agitprop
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posted on May 6, 2004 02:52:32 AM new
Doesn't matter whether you have PP's so called "Protection Policy" - fact is you have been defrauded through the mail. Contact the USPS Postal Inspectors and lodge a fraud charge against the purchaser and PP as co-conspirator (this usually makes PP sit up and take notice if nothing else will).
We used to do this (when we accepted PP) and had a high success rate in recovering our payments. 
YMMV
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stopwhining
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posted on May 6, 2004 06:06:09 AM new
tom,
my question is not the electronic DC,it is for item over 250,online trackable proof of receipt means customer signature,and USPS does not have it online,altho FED EXP,UPS do.
-sig file -------we eat to live,not live to eat.
Benjamin Franklin
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stopwhining
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posted on May 6, 2004 06:11:09 AM new
clancey99,
paypal will not know if your bidder is using other people's bank account until the owner of that bank account find out and complain to his bank.
is your bidder a verified member??
-sig file -------we eat to live,not live to eat.
Benjamin Franklin
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clancey99
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posted on May 6, 2004 06:21:07 AM new
Thanks for all of your input- to add insult to injury when I replied to Paypals request for information this is the Email I received last night- all in lower case
' thankx for your feedback- hope to do business with u again"- Now that's really professional-
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clancey99
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posted on May 6, 2004 06:21:15 AM new
Thanks for all of your input- to add insult to injury when I replied to Paypals request for information this is the Email I received last night- all in lower case
' thankx for your feedback- hope to do business with u again"- Now that's really professional-
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clancey99
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posted on May 6, 2004 06:21:19 AM new
Thanks for all of your input- to add insult to injury when I replied to Paypals request for information this is the Email I received last night- all in lower case
' thankx for your feedback- hope to do business with u again"- Now that's really professional-
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clancey99
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posted on May 6, 2004 06:21:26 AM new
Thanks for all of your input- to add insult to injury when I replied to Paypals request for information this is the Email I received last night- all in lower case
' thankx for your feedback- hope to do business with u again"- Now that's really professional-
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clancey99
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posted on May 6, 2004 06:21:38 AM new
Thanks for all of your input- to add insult to injury when I replied to Paypals request for information this is the Email I received last night- all in lower case
' thankx for your feedback- hope to do business with u again"- Now that's really professional-
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tomwiii
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posted on May 6, 2004 06:48:08 AM new
SW:
"tom,
my question is not the electronic DC,it is for item over 250,online trackable proof of receipt means customer signature,and USPS does not have it online,altho FED EXP,UPS do"
Whoever told you this??
I use SIGNATURE CONFIRMATION all the time & it be same as DC, except at the end, it says SIGNED FOR BY Ralph J. Dog!
718
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tomwiii
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posted on May 6, 2004 06:51:30 AM new
Here's one I just did:
You entered 2180 5213 XXXX 7067 XX42
Your item was delivered at 9:25 am on March 30, 2004 in TOMBOY, TX 77777 The item was signed for by IMA HOG
718
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tonimar1
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posted on May 6, 2004 07:04:23 AM new
Goodmorning!
Here is paypals phone number:
1-866-648-5843,
I have called PP many times and always found them to be very helpful.
Also, never accept a transaction from an International Buyer. I have had many who tell me they always pay with paypal and why am I making it difficult for them. Like I tell them this is not my doing it is "Paypal" who tells me not to accept your payment if your an International buyer.
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stopwhining
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posted on May 6, 2004 07:43:39 AM new
PAYPAL would never say dont accept his payment because he is overseas!!
the proper wording is like you get no seller protection and his address is unconfirmed.
-sig file -------we eat to live,not live to eat.
Benjamin Franklin
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clancey99
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posted on May 6, 2004 12:47:42 PM new
This buyer is in the midwest- USA-I did call Paypal and it was a rude awakening- No matter what you mail- if it is a PAYPAL payment you must get "proof of delivery" tracking slip- an additonal 40 cents if the package is not insured-Even for a 1st class letter size envelope at .37 cents- I have always tried to be fair about shipping costs with buyers but those days are gone- the handeling chargen in S&H just took a jump up- Since in all the years I have used PAYPAL I never had a problem I just took too much for granted- No More-
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tomwiii
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posted on May 6, 2004 12:56:24 PM new
YES, if you did not get DC (FREE for PRIORITY MAIL, $0.13 for all other classes), then you are NOT covered under the SPP & PayPal will offer you NO recourse.
FREE or $0.13...
718
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stopwhining
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posted on May 6, 2004 01:12:27 PM new
it sounds like you did not bother to read paypal terms before you sign up.
-sig file -------we eat to live,not live to eat.
Benjamin Franklin
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clancey99
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posted on May 6, 2004 02:53:08 PM new
if anyone who posted is interested in the outcome of this- I just received an Email from PAYPAL telling me that as courtesy they are" reversing the reversal"- Pleasant surprise and I will read the fine print from now on-
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davebraun
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posted on May 6, 2004 03:26:41 PM new
I have had a number of reversals all credited back on my submitting the eDC with no problem.
I have less problems with PayPal than with my Merchant Account (Wells Fargo) and the fees are comparable.
Friends don't let friends vote Republican!
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lovepotions
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posted on May 7, 2004 02:55:54 AM new
Every now and then i'll get a "Reversal Pending investigation"
They take the money from you and hold it.
In my experience it has been from people freshly NARU who decided to say F**** ALL Y'ALL and and claim chargebacks against EVERYONE with their bank who then initiates against paypal...... paypal comes back and takes the money from us and holds it while they gather proof to send back to the moron's bank.
They always ended in MY FAVOR and many times with me doing nothing!
It was not a fraudulent transaction just a fraudulent a-hole who thought for a moment they could get away with screwing everyone.
If this person were really victimized would it have been for a F***ing $10 item?? Ebay account records match paypal records AND shipped to confirmed address....... pretty far fetched for a real hack/identity fraud/scam. If it were a real thief did he sit out side the victims house to wait for the mail man too??
Everytime you see a credit card commercial (think CAPITAL ONE) touting consumer protection and no liability again unauthorized use of you card. It makes morons and opportunists attempt to take advantage of these loopholes thinking they can all go on a free shopping spree ......
They usually get their A$$'s handed to them once the investigation is completed.
http://www.lovepotions.com
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