posted on May 14, 2004 05:27:32 PM new
Hi: You gave me a link to a site that buys and sells coins. I've e-mailed them twice with no response, but I'm willing to wait a bit longer.
My question: I have a St. Gaudens $20 gold coin in a holder. I'll post a picture of it here. I need to know what to call the holder; I'm guessing there's some esoteric jargon-y word for it.
posted on May 14, 2004 06:21:32 PM new
Hi Roadsmith--Haven't dealt in coins in awhile, but as far as I know this is called a......coin holder! or case. If it were professionally graded, it would be called slabbed. By the way, you should get this coin graded as it adds to the value and desirability of a coin. PCGS is well-known grading service. Don't know what the fee is now, but is should be around $ 30-50. They will grade it and slab it. A site where you can check prices on these coins is Coin Universe. Should help you determine the ballpark price of the coin, depending on the grade. Some of these 1915's are book valued at $15,000 some at $ 2500 and a lot in between. Depends on condition, what mint it was struck at and if it is graded. I love St. Gaudens. Many believe this was the most beautiful US coin minted. Good Luck!
posted on May 14, 2004 08:21:03 PM new
Road,,,,,,I was ready to jump into my 782 gear and garter belts when I heard your for Help! When ya call the U.S.Marines, they JUMP! A coin? Stand down,,,As you were,,,false alarm....back to the sack,,,,,,,Recall,,,,,,Hurry up and WAIT!!!!
and the beat goes on,,,,,,,Have another 2 Buck Chuck.
posted on May 14, 2004 08:29:59 PM new
Thanks, coincoach and Washingtonebayer--
I'll have to try to get hold of PCGS, then, and I will definitely hold off launching this one on Sunday night until I know more. I was going to start it at $450, which still may be a good idea.
The coin, in this holder (Capital Plastics coin holder, I now know!), was in my father's safe deposit box when he died in 1983, and it's been stowed away here in our belongings for 20 years. We've never attempted to remove it from its holder, and I doubt my father did. He probably just bought it as is as an investment. We're ready to transform it into cold cash!
What do you know about St. Gaudens? Was this a coin designer? Or? And the coin is called a double eagle because? (I'm guessing because there's another wing behind the bird's wing?)
Affectionately, Her Coinish Ignorance
And Jack, I knew that thread title would bring you out of your nest!
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posted on May 14, 2004 09:26:33 PM new
Marines: I've been all over Google and can't seem to find where I can get that PCGS grading done on my coin. Is it only one location in the U.S. Or do different dealers do the grading for us? I looked at Coin Universe and can't seem to understand how this is all done.
Also, "slabbing" is what? My coin is already in a holder. Would the grader put it instead into another holder that cannot be jimmied open before I sell it? Is the slabbing just a way for buyers to see that it's been graded? See how much I don't know? (But I'm learning!)
I'd hesitate to mail the coin somewhere; I'd much rather take it to a reputable coin dealer close by, if that's possible.
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posted on May 14, 2004 09:26:57 PM new
Augustus Saint-Gaudens was a famous sculptor.
Teddy Roosevelt commissioned him to design a gold coin in the fashion of ancient Green coins, as TR was a fan of this type of coin. They were first minted in Dec. 1907, and were very high relief. Due to the difficulty in striking a high relief coin, they were changed to a much lower relief. The high relief Saint Gaudens are the most valuable, $ 20 or $25,000 and up, depending on grade and the right buyer. Good luck and here's hoping your coin grades MS 65 or better. (MS means mint state-never circulated and the higher then number the better.)
posted on May 14, 2004 09:32:38 PM new
When a coin is graded they are put in "slabs" which authenticates the coin and sort of guarantees that the coin has been graded. You have to send the coin to PCGS to get it graded. Go to PCGS.com to find out how. Send it registered.
posted on May 14, 2004 09:40:52 PM new
I truly appreciate your help here! I've sent an e-mail to PCGS, which happens to be in Newport Beach; we're in Southern Calif. too, but about 2 hours away. I think I'd prefer to just drive there, if they allow that. Anyway, thanks so much, and I'll let you know what happens! Adele
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posted on May 14, 2004 10:00:48 PM new
Hi Roadsmith I don't know how to make a link yet, but here is a price guide for Saint Gaudens. It shows how important grade is and also certain dates which are desirable due to small mintage or other reasons. Hope this helps.
posted on May 15, 2004 05:39:49 AM new
Thank you Ron! Don't know what happened to link. I c & p'd a price guide table, but it didn't work. I appreciate your help.
posted on May 15, 2004 08:55:44 AM new
Hi roadsmith:
Sorry, I been away, you know duty calls!
Here are some answers to your questions.
The website I gave you, was down, it appears that was under attack, but is back on now, you should be able to get in touch with them.
Here is all you want to know about the
1907-33 DOUBLE EAGLE SAINT-GAUDENS http://www.coinsite.com/CoinSite-PF/PParticles/$20sntix.htm
Proofs are very rare as only 687 were offered for sale from 1908 through 1915.
Mint marks appear above the date the designer's initials (ASG) below.
From the picture, it appears to be a 1915 D or S
This is one of the common date St. Gaudens, price of these coins are based on the spot price of gold and fluctuate widely.
The April CDN Monthly Supplement was based on gold at $427.80 per ounce. Friday Gold close at $376.70.
The price range for the 1915 D is between $435 at XF to $1,800.00 at MS65.
The price range for the 1915 S is between $435 at XF to $2,000.00 at MS65.
The present range ($376.70 Spot Price) will start at $383.00, based on the price of Gold, the upper range for higher grade coins is not as much affected by the price of gold.
An honest coin dealer should be willing to pay about 85% - 90% of the above listed prices depending on the price of gold and the grade.
The four most respected and reliable coin grading services are:
NGC http://www.ngccoin.com/
$20 5 Working Days All dates for $5-$10-$20 Liberty; $10 Indian, $20 Saint Gaudens. Maximum value $1,000 US gold. Five (5) coin minimum.
$28 12 Working Days US coins valued at $3,000 or less
Can be submitted by NGC Authorized dealer,
By a paid member of the Collector Society,
Active member of the ANA.
PCGS http://www.pcgs.com/
Regular* $30 15 days guaranteed $3,000 No minimum number
Member of Collector Society
PCGS Authorized Dealer
ICG http://www.icgcoin.com/
ICG Dealer
ICG Collector Club
US coins valued @ $5,000 & less 15-Days $30
Pieces valued @ $5,000 & less 15-Days $30
ANACS http://www.anacs.com/
Economy Service 1 - 9 coins, $12 per coin plus shipping
10 or more, $10 per coin plus shipping
Submit coins directly to ANACS; no third party is required. Coins must be listed on a submission form. To obtain one, either download from their website or call their office at 1-800-888-1861 to request an information packet.
A. Yes. Gold coins are often counterfeited. Having them graded and encapsulated assures their authenticity to any interested parties.
If it is in uncirculated condition and at least MS60, it would be worth the expense of having the coin graded and slabbed.
You can get a rough idea of the grade of the coin by going to the closest coin dealer and ask him what grade it is and how much would he willing to pay for it. Here is a list of Coin Dealers for California.
posted on May 15, 2004 09:23:48 AM new
Again, thanks a zillion for your help. There's a dealer in a town 20 miles from here, and I think I'll start with him.
One last question--what does MS60 mean?
And P.S., I've heard from the people who buy coins, too, and I'll send them the silver dollars etc. that I have here.
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posted on May 15, 2004 09:51:02 AM new
You don't give the date which is also important as well as the grade. I have a friend who just bought a 1914 $20.00 Gold piece that grades MS64, worth 1200 to 1800 dollars. I think $450.00 is far too low.
posted on May 15, 2004 10:42:55 AM new
Hi Roadsmith and sanmar:
MS - 60 is defined by the ANA Grading Standards as:
Uncirculated - Typical
A strictly Uncirculated coin with no traces of wear (see points of wear below), but with blemishes more obvious than for MS-63 (light marks or blemishes). Has full mint luster but may lack brilliance. Surface is usually lightly marred by minor bag marks and abrasions.
Check point for signs of wear: (obverse) forehead, breast, knee, nose; (reverse) eagle's wings and breast.
The bad feature of selling coins on eBay, if you are not a coin Dealer, is that you are not sure of the coin grade and you may not get an adequate bid and if the coin is overgraded, it will be returned to you. There are a few dishonest buyers, who may switch a raw coin (unslabbed) for an almost identical one of a lower value or a counterfeit. It happen recently to one of my fellow dealers, he sold a very rare coin on eBay, worth into the thousands and the buyer switched and returned. Fortunately, for my friend, the buyer also purchased the replacement coin on eBay for a fraction of the price of the Rare Coin (less than 1/500).
A few dishonest dealers sometimes downgrade the coin to purchase it, at a lower price than market value. However, you will have the advantage of having the coin graded by an ANA member dealer, which are the most reliable among Coin Dealers. You can get a second opinion, by offering the coin for sale to a second dealer.
It is very hard to grade a coin from a photograph, that is why I have not offered an opinion as to the grade of your coin.
If you have a good experience, with the dealer you are sending the silver coins, use him as your second opinion. We have had very good experience with them.
Yes, the coin we are talking about is picture above and it appear to be a 1915 D or S St. Gaudens. The 1921 St. Gaudens in MS-65 can run as high as $260,000. But we are talking about a common date St. Gaudens (1915 D or S). What is uncertain is the grade of the coin.
The 1914 St. Gaudens MS-64 currently it is priced at $2860.00, while the 1914 D MS-64 it is price at $810.00 and the 1914 S MS-64 it is price at $700.00. To illustrate your point.
Hope that this helps and answers your questions.
[ edited by usmarines on May 15, 2004 11:01 AM ]
posted on May 15, 2004 11:08:26 AM new
Sanmar: The coin is 1915 "S". I've looked at these coins on Ebay, and a typical starting price for an ungraded one is $450 - $480. The graded ones frequently start around $1,000.
You probably know me well enough by now to know that I start my auctions lower than some may, to encourage bidding, and I take my chances from there.
What I'll probably do here, though, is not sell it on Ebay, but get two offers from accredited dealers and take the higher one. I sure don't want to take the chance of an unscrupulous buyer switching coins on me!
Marines: More and more to learn, isn't there? First I had to learn about the World of Pipes, about 2 months ago; now coins. What's next?!
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Yes, there is a lot to learn about coins, we have been selling them for over the past quarter of a century, and we are still learning. A lot more difficult than pipes!
An educated seller always gets a better price.
I did a search for you on Completed Auctions:
Completed Sales for the 1915 S, indicates 5 items sold over the past 30 days.
3909423684 1915 S $20 Gold ST. Gaudens MS65 NTC $1,100.00 $1,800.00*
3911153508 1915 S $20 Gold ST. Gaudens MS65 PCI $750.00 $1,800.00**
3909933794 1915 S $20 Gold ST. Gaudens XF Not slabbed $456.00 $435.00***
2241507151 1915 S $20 Gold ST. Gaudens MS64 PCGS $10.00 $1,150.00****
3911351108 1915 S $20 Gold ST. Gaudens with Rope Bezel $499.00 $435.00****** After being listed 3 times.
The first price is the eBay Sale price and the second is the Coin Dealers Newsletter (GreySheet) Listed Price (Bid). Items 1, 2 and 4 would have done better by selling to another Coin Dealer directly. Items 3 & 5 were lucky, they got a better price than Retail market.
* sold at $700.00 Discount, because it was not graded by one of the four grading firms. There is the possibility that this coin was of a lower grade.
** sold at $1,050.00 Discount, because it was not graded by one of the four grading firms. There is the possibility that this coin was of a lower grade.
*** sold at least at a $50.00 to $75.00 Premium. Despite the coin not being graded by none of the grading services. Very lucky seller!
**** sold at $1,0400.00 Discount, despite being graded by one of the four grading firms. Bad luck for the seller!
****** The rope Bezel worth about $35.00 to $50.00 sold at $50.00 to $75.00 Premium. This was no longer a coin but a piece of Jewelry.
Good Luck, I have to get back to work!
[ edited by usmarines on May 15, 2004 12:50 PM ]
for Help! When ya call the U.S.Marines, they JUMP! A coin? Stand down,,,As you were,,,false alarm....back to the sack,,,,,,,Recall,,,,,,Hurry up and WAIT!!!!