bunnicula
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posted on August 17, 2001 01:48:05 PM new
...about some people. A couple of evenings ago one of the librarians where I work caught a young girl using our computers looking at a porno site. She didn't stumble upon it, either--she'd gotten the URL somewhere, written it down, brought it with her & deliberately went to the site. The librarian told her to get off the computer and that her computer privileges for the day were lost. The girl's dad was in the library & was told what had happened.
End of story, right? Nope. The girl's *mother* came back yesterday and demanded that the librarian call her daughter and apologize to her! Why? Because the girl had had her feelings hurt by being asked to get off the computer...the mother felt that her daughter's "embarassment" deserved an apology.
What's wrong with this picture? I know if I'd been the mother *I* would be concerned about a) where my daughter got the URL and b) what she was doing visiting the site once she had it. And I would be grateful to the library for making sure my daughter got *off* the site.
This mother is lucky that I wasn't the librarian in question. Apologize? In a pig's eye.
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spazmodeus
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posted on August 17, 2001 01:52:59 PM new
[ edited by spazmodeus on Jul 2, 2002 09:30 PM ]
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hepburn
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posted on August 17, 2001 01:56:36 PM new
Bunnicula, things seem to just get worse and worse nowadays. Sadly, it does not surprise me the mother was indignant about her daughters feelings, versus being in denial about what her daughter was LOOKING at.
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jamesoblivion
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posted on August 17, 2001 02:01:20 PM new
I imagine the daughter had a version that cast the librarian in a bad light. Who's mom gonna believe - her sweety pie of some mean lady?
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snowyegret
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posted on August 17, 2001 03:17:04 PM new
Bunnicula, tell your coworker thank you from a parent of 2.
If it was my daughter, she would be in apologizing to the staff for abusing the use of the public library. 
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shoshanah
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posted on August 17, 2001 03:35:52 PM new
This whole society, all over the world, is sick, SICK, SICK!
I totally second snowyegret..congratulate the Libririan for not being intimidated by those idiotic "soft" parents...What next: the darling, angelic little (pornQueen) girl is going to return with an oozie and blow away the Librarian? and THAT will be OK also????
I am SO happy I am old! I could not stand to bring up my daughter in such moral turpitude!
********
Gosh Shosh!
My "About Me" Page
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MrsSantaClaus
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posted on August 17, 2001 04:45:26 PM new
Had that been my daughter we would have made a return trip to the library - only one of us would have been in tears.
AND I guarantee you that the one apologizing would not be the librarian!
BECKY
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Hjw
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posted on August 17, 2001 05:41:28 PM new
Oh Good Grief!!!
Now, the daughter and the mother should apologize to the librarian!!!
That is, assuming that the girl was old enough to know that this was not approved use of the library computers.
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Linda_K
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posted on August 17, 2001 06:12:53 PM new
Some parents can't get past the idea of someone else disciplining their child, regardless of the child's offense....hits the nail on the head, IMO.
There once was a time when children were expected to respect their elders....especially teachers, librarians....anyone in authority. That day seems long gone.
Bunnicula - I'd be interested in knowing how your peer handled this request.
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ZILVY
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posted on August 17, 2001 06:17:31 PM new
The father was in the library at the same time the daughter was searching out a URL for a Porno site. He was apprised of what the daughter had been doing and she was told to get off the computer.
The girl was embarrased...well, I hope so! The mother wants an apology from the librarian because "the cute thang" was embarassed....well, lands sakes, let's hope so~ where is the father now? These little darlings are just so devious...tell the Mom to stuff it and go to another library...wouldn't it be great if you could do that! I take it we don't have porn filters on the computers because.......??
[ edited by ZILVY on Aug 17, 2001 06:21 PM ]
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ashlandtrader
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posted on August 17, 2001 06:20:06 PM new
Oh my gosh!!!!
She had to be old enough to write down the url and to be unsupervised in the library, so she was plenty old enough to know that she should not have been doing that. I agree, only both parents and the daughter owe the librarian an apology!
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bunnicula
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posted on August 17, 2001 08:09:46 PM new
HJW: That is, assuming that the girl was old enough to know that this was not approved use of the library computers.
She was 10 or 11 years old--plenty old enough to know that what she was doing was a "no-no."
LindaK: I'd be interested in knowing how your peer handled this request.
To my infinite disgust she caved in & called to apologize! I asked her why on earth she would do that when she had done absolutely *nothing* wrong...she waffled & mumbled & gave to clear answer. I just think that she doesn't like confrontation & the mother was being a shrew.
That's why I said the woman was lucky I wasn't the librarian in question! I have not hesitated in the past to face up to parents when necessary & I certainly wouldn't have backed off on *this*!
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Borillar
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posted on August 17, 2001 08:21:18 PM new
Is this a story about the librarian or the parents? There are many familes that, when in the privacy of their own home and the curtains are closed, everyone in the family goes about nude - nudists in their own home. What if these same parents were trying to explain sex to her at that age or saw nothintg at all wrong with procreation? Are we offended by the child seeing such things as sexual activity or are we more offended at the parents for not seeing what the fuss is all about?
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bunnicula
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posted on August 17, 2001 08:51:07 PM new
Borillar: have you ever taken a moment to look at the sex sites on the Net? We're not talking Nudist sites here. And we're not talking the privacy of one's own home. We're not even talking about an adult here.
I am not a prude. I *have* looked at such sites. I sincerely doubt that any sane parent would use a Net sex site to "teach their daughter about sex"--unless they were raising her to be a prostitute. Highly doubtful.
Teach kids the facts of life? Yes, certainly. There are plenty of books & videos in the library that can do so in a healthy manner. Teach kids there's nothing shameful about nudity? Yes, certainly, within social bounds--Janeist priests may go about nude in India, but in other countries including ours there would be a problem with that.
But...bondage? Bestiality? Gang-banging? Juvenile sex (some of these sites have girls that may legally be 18 but are touted as "appearing" to be much younger)? Etc. etc. etc. These are things you think it's OK or healthy for children to be viewing?
If an adult wishes to visit these sites in the privacy of their own home, that's fine for him or her. But that sort of thing doesn't belong in the public library--and especially not in the Children's Room.
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Mybiddness
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posted on August 17, 2001 09:01:08 PM new
I can't believe your co-worker actually apologized. That's terrible.
A mother once explain to me that her son shouldn't have to pay me the full $50.00 cost to replace an electronic game that he had admitted stealing from my daughter. Her reasoning was that after he stole it from her he accidently broke it so the most he should have to pay was $25.00 cause after all... it's broken now and no longer worth $50.00.
Yep, that makes sense.
Not paranoid anywhere else but here!
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kraftdinner
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posted on August 17, 2001 09:08:01 PM new
Bunni, I'm in total agreement with you, and am shocked at how these parents could be so cavalier. This is what bothers me.......if people are so crazy about not letting youngsters view this stuff, then how can it be good for anyone to view? I really feel that if you wouldn't want your child to partake in something, means that you shouldn't be either. The stuff on the internet isn't sexual expression, it's sexual aggression IMO.
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bunnicula
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posted on August 17, 2001 09:18:03 PM new
kraftdinner: I can't agree with that sentiment. Adults aren't children & shouldn't be limited simply because there are some things in this world that children simply aren't ready for or which are appropriate for children.
I don't buy into the prevailing attitude these days that children absolutely must be involved in every little thing, regardless of age. Or that absolutely everything must be appropriate for children. As an adult, I don't think that everything I watch on TV, or read, or whatever should be dictated by the the sensibilities of a child. What might not be appropriate for a child is perfectly OK for adults.
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kraftdinner
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posted on August 17, 2001 09:31:21 PM new
Hi bunni, I know what you're saying, and I know that children are not as mature at handling certain things, but it seems like the only things we really don't want our kids to see are of a sexual nature. Why?
I think because most of what's out there is "sick sex".....stuff that's on the internet and things like you mentioned. The reason why we don't want out kids to watch any of it is because it's sick. I can't think of any other topic other than sex you wouldn't want your child to know about.
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Linda_K
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posted on August 17, 2001 09:59:25 PM new
To my infinite disgust she caved in & called to apologize
And to mine!!!
That's so hard for me to understand.
Next time a child is viewing this pornography and a parent walks in they will be screaming bloody murder that their child was allowed to view this material.
Or even worse...at this tender age this mother is opening up the possibility that her daughter could meet up with some of the child preditors that were mentioned in the thread that spaz started. The young teen who came into contact with people over the internet that ended up sexually abusing her. Then this same mother will be suing the library (city) for endangering her child. ie: Why weren't the children being supervised? What were the librarians doing allowing such a young child to have unlimited access to porn? etc. etc. etc.
Oh boy........
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shoshanah
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posted on August 18, 2001 03:39:48 PM new
I am very disappointed to hear that the Librarian did apologize!....Yet, on the other hand, I do not know the person, nor that person's life-style...It it possible that holding on to this job is of utmost importance...The way the economy is heading, any job would seem worthwhile holding on to right now. If this person is a single parent, even more reason to not risk getting fired. I still do not approve, though! Just trying to rationalize.
********
Gosh Shosh!
My "About Me" Page
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rancher24
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posted on August 18, 2001 05:50:36 PM new
I believe that the mother's attitude was outta line. Parents who do not discipline or worse, teach their children (by example) that overriding the authority is perfectly ok are making it quite difficult for those of us who still believe that authority deserves respect & that there are rules, and breaking them is wrong. "I" can deal with it, but it's hard for kids to do the right thing when 90% of the kids around them are not!
As for the kid herself, 10/11 is a very curious age. They are becoming aware of sex and are striving to be part of the group that "knows" about those things. Maybe she couldn't talk to her parents or had no other "source" of information & picked up the URL from a friend and thought she might be able to learn something. I certainly wouldn't advocate having a child learn about sex online (eek!), but she probably wasnt' aware of just how bad it can be out there, and was trying to satisfy her curiousity.
~ Rancher
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Hjw
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posted on August 18, 2001 06:21:50 PM new
Now that I know the child's age, I believe that it was just a case of curiosity on the childs part.
Bunnicula, did you see this incident? I ask, because I wonder if there is a possibility that the librarian may have overreacted. Why, did she feel that it was necessary to apologize unless she felt that she had handled the situation inappropriately? That is the question that I have.
If she handled the problem with diplomacy and tact while explaining the very serious nature of the offense to the child, why would she feel that it was necessary to apologize to anybody?
Helen
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Hjw
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posted on August 18, 2001 07:00:38 PM new
Probably the best procedure would be to talk with her in the office, where she could reinforce the library policy and more importantly, explain the risks involved in visiting pornographic sites. Embarrassing the child is distracting and reduces the effective delivery of this very important message.
Helen
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jamesoblivion
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posted on August 18, 2001 07:07:17 PM new
Is this a story about the librarian or the parents? There are many familes that, when in the privacy of their own home and the curtains are closed, everyone in the family goes about nude - nudists in their own home. What if these same parents were trying to explain sex to her at that age or saw nothintg at all wrong with procreation? Are we offended by the child seeing such things as sexual activity or are we more offended at the parents for not seeing what the fuss is all about?
Forget about the fact that pornography isn't sex education material -- that's not relevant -- porno site surfing is against library policy.
[ edited by jamesoblivion on Aug 18, 2001 07:10 PM ]
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Hjw
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posted on August 18, 2001 07:46:34 PM new
Probably the best procedure would be to talk with her in the office, where she could reinforce the library policy and more importantly, explain the risks
involved in visiting pornographic
sites. Embarrassing the child is distracting and reduces the effective delivery of this very important message.
Helen
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hepburn
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posted on August 18, 2001 07:57:34 PM new
Bunnicula, I wish you were the librarian that busted the kid too. Im sure you would have handled it differently, and probably more correctly, embarassment to the kid or not. Maybe the kid should have been even more embarassed. Next time she comes in, or her mother, say out loud "Thats the mother who wants an apology if her kids surfs porn sites on our pc". Now THAT is embarassment. Then again, maybe mom will preen.
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bunnicula
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posted on August 18, 2001 09:15:03 PM new
HJW: the librarian in question is a soft-spoken woman & not prone to "over-reaction". She simply & calmly told the girl that the site was innappropriate (which the kid already knew)and that her computer-use privileges were gone for the day.
Was the kid being curious? Maybe. Doesn't matter what her intentions were. I just can't get over the fact that the girl's mother seriously expected (& unfortunately got) an apology.
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mybiddness
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posted on August 18, 2001 09:32:34 PM new
I don't think we help kids when we look to justify actions that they clearly know are wrong. An eleven year old (at least my eleven year old) has no problem understanding that porno is off limits.
The way I see it the library provides the free use of these computers as a part of their service to the community. The librarian made a logical and even protective decision for the child. Yet the mother wants her to apologize... Instead the mother should be thanking the librarian. And, if the librarian hadn't intervened as she did she probably would have risked being fired.
Not paranoid anywhere else but here!
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