posted on March 12, 2004 10:44:33 AM new
I found it at last. It is in the Old Testament in Isaiah 50:6. Isaiah foretold of Jesus 700 years before His birth. Read Isaiah chapters 50-53. I'm not posting to start another discussion just answer Shoesandsocks question.
posted on March 12, 2004 12:29:54 PM new
paws got a question for you,
seems to know your bible verses, i am not a bible expert but here is my questions
how come when religious republicans preach about jesus and at the same time are condoning the murder of innocent children in the middle east ??
how come you hear the republican ministries who preach jesus and at the are condoning violence in the name of God??
how come you hear and read about bible thumbing generals, politicians and people preaching about God and it is God talking to them to kill....
Is the President's claim, that he is doing God's work, correct, is God talking to the president, and is god telling the president to kill for oil and to make profit for his families' bank account, is that your God also, or are we talking of different Gods here, got me confused ???
posted on March 12, 2004 01:15:51 PM new
Skylite, those questions have been asked since I came here and haven't been answered yet.
The closest I've heard is that Christians have some kind of blanket OK from God to get rid of evil on His behalf, and that REAL Christians hear His voice (I assume for further instructions).
I'm not ashamed to say that I hear God's voice too, Skylite. Mine tends to tell me the exact opposite of what their God tells them, so I'm confused too.
All I know is men since the beginning of time have used God to accomplish their purposes. Don't blame God for what selfish greedy men do while hiding behind the name of God. I don't believe Bush is doing that however. He is a Christian but many of the laws in this country aren't and he has to stand by them. Bush isn't killing Innocent children in the Middle East. War has always put innocent people in harms way because of some tyrant's egotistical craving for power. It isn't a perfect world and as long as there are Hitlers and Hussans (spelling?) there will be destruction and death to keep freedom. It is an unfortunate part of the fall of man that started in the garden of Eden.
Why do people who are all for animal rights and against the death penalty for guilty criminals believe in killing innocent unborn babies?
People have their own agenda and use God's name to hide behind.
Why does Kerry put down rich people when he is married to one of the richest women in the country. Answer: to accomplish HIS purposes.
People need to quit confusing what people do with what God says.
When was the last time a Muslam, Buddist, or Hindu start a hospital or something? Are you aware that the first Universities and hospitals in this country and other countries were all started by Christian. Quit looking at the evil people have done, which by the way is terrible and will be answered for someday, and look at all the great and wonderful things done by REAL Christians.
Jesus said. If you say you belong to Me and hate your brothers you are a liar.
As I said I didn't start this thread to get a discussion started on Christanity. It was just to answer Shoes question.
posted on March 12, 2004 03:52:20 PM new"Don't blame God for what selfish greedy men do while hiding behind the name of God."
That's exactly right, Paws. The laws today are man-made and totally against what He had in mind. Money, Greed, Hypocrisy, War, Lies, Cheating, Killing, Power, Apathy, Starvation, etc., etc., have nothing to do with God, yet they are all promoted today as ways to achieve a goal and perpetuated by the most powerful people on Earth. Hiding behind the name of God indeed.
As we now know, Bush is endorsing a Constitutional amendment which could change the country forever. As one Republican lawyer told Andrew Sullivan, "[With] one amendment the religious right could wipe out access to birth control, abortion, and even non-procreative sex (as Senator Santorum so eagerly wants to do). This debate isn't only about federalism, it's about the reversal of two hundred years of liberal democracy that respects individuals." Or, as Sullivan put it, "Memo to straights: you're next."AndrewSullivan
posted on March 12, 2004 04:27:08 PM newWhy do people who are all for animal rights and against the death penalty for guilty criminals believe in killing innocent unborn babies?
That is an excellent question paws4god. I wish someone here would answer that.
__________________________________
"Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known."- Carl Sagan
posted on March 12, 2004 04:35:45 PM newWhen was the last time a Muslam, Buddist, or Hindu start a hospital or something? Are you aware that the first Universities and hospitals in this country and other countries were all started by Christian.
What a ridiculous thing to say. Of course christians started the first hospitals in this country, most of the US population is christian after all. For that matter, I'll bet you most of the gas stations and mini marts in this country were started by christians. Probably most of the porn theaters and adult bookstores were too. Do you suppose christians started all of the hospitals in all of the world's muslim, hindu and buddhist countries too? You would be sadly mistaken if that's what you think.
As far as universities go, I hope it doesn't bust your godly bubble to know that the world's oldest university, Al-Azhar University, is in Cairo, Egypt. It was founded roughly the same time as the city of Cairo, in 969 AD. The first lecture was delivered in 975 AD. It was founded originally as a place of MUSLIM worship and study, and is now a place of well reputed secular learning.
Your piety is admirable, but it is no excuse for ignorance.
___________________________________
"Why do people who are all for animal rights and against the death penalty for guilty criminals believe in killing innocent unborn babies?"
The line "believe in killing innocent unborn babies" is the problem. Nobody believes in that. The term is free choice. It's a private thing between a woman and a doctor, nobody else.
posted on March 12, 2004 05:38:15 PM new
paw said : Jesus said. If you say you belong to Me and hate your brothers you are a liar.
so this makes me believe that this president and republican adminstration are liars, and satanists
they been doing a lot of hating lately
where in the bible does jesus say killing is justified???
how can a president be a member of the skull and bones and practice christianity ??
is that not worshipping 2 gods ??
so those christians that vote for this president, are not christians but satanists accepting a president where god talks to him, is this not a false prophet??
posted on March 12, 2004 05:41:26 PM new
Sky Pilot
He blesses the boys as they stand in line
The smell of gun grease
and the bayonets they shine
He's there to help them all that he can
To make them feel wanted he's a good holy man
Sky pilot,
Sky pilot,
How high can you fly?
You'll never, never, never reach the sky.
He smiles at the young soldiers
Tells them it's all right
He knows of their fear in the forthcoming fight
Soon there'll be blood and many will die
Mothers and fathers back home they will cry
Sky pilot,
Sky pilot,
How high can you fly?
You'll never, never, never reach the sky.
He mumbles a prayer and it ends with a smile
The order is given
They move down the line
But he'll stay behind and he'll meditate
But it won't stop the bleeding or ease the hate
As the young men move out into the battle zone
He feels good, with God you're never alone
He feels tired and he lays on his bed
Hopes the men will find courage
in the words that he said
Sky pilot,
Sky pilot,
How high can you fly?
You'll never, never, never reach the sky.
You're soldiers of God, you must understand
The fate of your country is in your young hands
May God give you strength
Do your job real well
If it all was worth it
Only time it will tell
In the morning they return
With tears in their eyes
The stench of death drifts up to the skies
A soldier so ill looks at the sky pilot
Remembers the words
"Thou shalt not kill."
Sky pilot,
Sky pilot,
How high can you fly?
You'll never, never, never reach the sky.
******
Censorship, like charity, should begin at home; but unlike charity, it should end there --Clare Booth Luce
posted on March 12, 2004 08:21:36 PM newwhere in the bible does jesus say killing is justified???
I don't think Jesus Christ said killing is justified. A lot in the OT talked about killing though. Not in the NT, that I can think of off hand
how can a president be a member of the skull and bones and practice christianity ??
is that not worshipping 2 gods ??
Yes he was a member of the Skull and Bones, but he became a 'Christian' later in his life, when going off drugs and alcohol. So he is not worshipping 2 gods, only what I see and read, I don't know him personally of course.
so those christians that vote for this president, are not christians but satanists accepting a president where god talks to him, is this not a false prophet??
No, where is God talking to him, or are you still referring to the Skull & Bones thing?
We all, I'm sure have made mistakes, and even thought when we did, that it was the 'right' thing, but later found it wasn't. Maybe that is what he did, when he became a Christian later in his life.
See, though all I said, could be totally wrong. I've been corrected more than once on things like Catholicism, and I went through 12 years of parochial school. (shows how much I learned)
I haven't read any links that have been posted in this thread either, so I don't know, this is just what I've read myself other places. ie; Bush becoming a Christian later in life.
__________________________________
"Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known."- Carl Sagan
posted on March 12, 2004 09:02:50 PM new
I still believe orginizations? whatever you would call them, like the S&B's are not right. But that is my personal opinion/belief. How Bush feels about them now, I have no idea.
__________________________________
"Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known."- Carl Sagan
posted on March 13, 2004 07:45:22 AM new
according to this link, when you join the Skull and Bones like the President and his family did, you are a active lifetime member, in other words once your in, there is no out
which leads me to say that a so called christian president like Bush who speaks of jesus and yet is still a member of a satanist club...serving 2 gods
got me confused...are all church goers members of secret clubs, and why ??
posted on March 13, 2004 08:32:21 AM new
Sen. John Kerry is/was a member of the Skull & Bones also, he claims he's Catholic.
Your the one posting 'We Must Vote For Kerry'. So its ok that John Kerry joined the S&B's and could be President?
__________________________________
"Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known."- Carl Sagan
posted on March 13, 2004 08:37:41 AM new
That's very true! The big difference is that Kerry isn't trying to run on his "Christianity" or Catholicism or trying to make us all follow his religious ideals.
******
Censorship, like charity, should begin at home; but unlike charity, it should end there --Clare Booth Luce
posted on March 13, 2004 08:47:34 AM new
In the campaign of 2000 and the campaign today, I do not see anything 'Christian' Bush is running on, as you are saying here. What religious ideals is he making us follow??
During his administration, I have not become a Methodist (or whatever he is) or even gone back to the Church. Yet. But my beliefs have nothing at all to do with the Presidents.
__________________________________
"Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known."- Carl Sagan
posted on March 13, 2004 10:13:20 AM new
So true, NTS.
----------------------
And I read more about this Presidents religious beliefs on these threads than I do anywhere else. Plus there's more Bible quoting done here by those who are opposed to religion than is done by those who do profess a religion.
Many who constantly complain about this President's religious beliefs appear willing to over look the same things in kerry.
ie: Bush not supporting gay marriage....neither does kerry. Wonder why? Could it be HIS religious belief?
kerry preaching in churches in the south...quoting Bible scriptures....if Bush did any such thing they'd be screaming about that. But it's okay for kerry to do.
kerry becoming a member of Skull & Bones is somehow different than when this President did it.
President Bush being a Christian and kerry being a Christian. The difference I see in NOT a religious issue, but rather one of different political positions. One is conservative, the other liberal.
posted on March 13, 2004 10:21:07 AM new
I don't know how many 'devout' Catholics will be voting for Kerry,as he has been divorced once, and he remarried, which last time I looked was a 'no no' in the Church
Gotta go out, have a good weekend
__________________________________
"Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known."- Carl Sagan
