posted on August 2, 2004 02:46:31 PM new
I used to live in Jacksonville for 6 miserable years. Another classic example of why I had to move out of this septic tank of a city. Odd that 4 people from this visit crossed out Republican and checked off Democrat, yet none crossed out Democrat and checked Republican. To take this even further, it was a Republican who was the whistleblower on this.
From CBS 47 Jacksonville: http://www.wtev.com/news/local/story.aspx?content_id=CC7E4D8D-5956-431B-81B6-C62E5106EF77
Duval County Democrats say they've heard the rumors for years and say there is now proof local Republicans are using shady tactics to recruit new American citizens into their party.
The local Democratic Party says it received a complaint last week following a citizenship ceremony in which voter registration forms were partially filled out by Republicans.
Immigration officials have been called in to investigate.
After living 15 years in the United States, Alton Villamueva was sworn in last week as an American citizen. At the swearing in, the Filipino-American filled out a card and registered to vote. But he says when he got his application, the box to choose a party affiliation had already been marked "Republican". "My impression is that it was a Republican activity urging new Americans to register and vote Republican. Personally, I was hoping it would have been a bi-partisan activity. I was actually surprised to see only Republicans running the registration process."
On that day, Duval's Republican Party registered 36 new American voters. We tried to contact the head of Duval County's Republican Party Mike Hightower about the allegations, but he's out of town. He said over the phone he was unaware of the registration tactic and had no comment until he found out more.
Many have viewed this tactic as a way of denying citizens the right to choose their own party affiliation. While pre-selecting a party on the applications is not illegal, the Supervisor of Elections Office says its certainly unethical. "The law does say that if a voter is misled or something on the application was changed without their consent that is against the law. But it’s not this office's job to make that determination." said Erin Moody of the Duval County Supervisor of Elections office.
A look at those 36 applications showed that 27 people were registered as Republicans, 6 as Democrats and 3 chose not party affiliation. Four applications had crossed out Republican and chose either Democrat or no party affiliation.
The concern is that many of the newly naturalized citizens, with language barriers, may have become Republicans without knowing it. Villamueva says, "I'm very sure there were a lot of new Americans who didn't even notice that."
Villamueva says he decided to leave his box checked "Republican" because he supports President Bush, but still says he doesn't support Republican tactics to try and recruit unsuspecting voters.
The Supervisor of Elections Office says if any of those newly registered voters feel misled, they can simply stop by the downtown office before August 2nd and switch to the party of their choice.
posted on August 2, 2004 07:17:26 PM new
Even if they are already registered Republican, they can still vote for the Democratic candidate. Or simply switch parties.
I seem to remember that the Gore? people were giving cigarettes to 'street people' last time, so they would register to vote, and they would 'help' them. Not sure if that was true or not.
posted on August 2, 2004 09:47:15 PM new
It's no different than the democrats that came to Milwaukee, gave the homeless cigarettes and then took them to vote. It happens all the time.
When we register people in Wisconsin we never ask them what party they are registering as. They can register the day they vote and at every registering table there is 1 democrat and 1 republican.
I am sure that the New Citizens will not remember who they registered as only that now they are a registered voter. Give them a little credit.
posted on August 3, 2004 11:06:02 AM new
It does mean something. If it didn't mean anything, then why would they bother doing it? They are trying to up the registered Republican count in Jacksonville.
The difference between the cigarettes is that it was a rumor and never proven. This is pretty obvious, especially when a Republican is the one who was interviewed regarding this.
It is a shame that people discredit these tactics as nothing. It only shows how Republicans will do anything to try and prove they have the numbers, when in fact they don't.
It has come out in recent weeks that the Republicans worked pretty hard in removing the black vote in Florida when they purged thousands and thousands of legitimate black voters from the lists. Why? Black voters predominately vote Democrat. They purged a handful of Hispanics, who usually vote Republican in Florida. Odd that Bush guaranteed that victory in Florida and now it has come out that his cronies knew full well that they were cheating. They should make tampering with elections no different than being a traitor. These people should be put on Death Row, and if that means that George Bush was one of them, then he should fall under that as well. I am sick of crooks stealing our country and if it means the death penalty to finally stop it, I may just be all for it.
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"One thing is for sure: the extremists have faith in our weakness. And the weaker we are, the more they will come after us." --Tony Blair
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
"The War on Terror will not be won until America is united. And as long as Democrats target the Bush administration -- not the terrorists -- as the enemy, we are in trouble." --Oliver North
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posted on August 3, 2004 11:41:14 AM new
I'm confused with that one...
I don't see where this is a problem if the person is 21. I don't see where this would only appeal to Democrats or only Republicans. They are not prechecking voter registration cards to register people as one party or the other. They are looking for a gimmick to register people to participate in the voting process.
2 2 oz. beers???? The last I checked, 4 oz of beer is 1/3 of a bottle. That's like a shot of beer. Big deal. They should at least give you one full pounder of brew and a hotdog, perhaps a ticket to a baseball game. That would be pretty American of them.
posted on August 3, 2004 12:26:40 PM new
FORMAL COMPLAINT FILED WITH ELECTIONS BOARD
Democrats bribed voters with cigarettes
MADISON-Rod Hise, executive director of the Republican Party of Wisconsin, today filed a formal complaint with the state Elections Board in the wake of published reports that the Democratic Party of Wisconsin gave packs of cigarettes to voters in Milwaukee in exchange for their votes.
According to the complaint, agents of the Democratic Party of Wisconsin, working on behalf of the Gore-Liebem1an presidential campaign, distributed packages of cigarettes to voters whom they had transported to vote by absentee ballot in violation of the Wisconsin law that prohibits election bribery. [b]Their actions were captured on videotape Saturday, Nov. 4, 2000, by Milwaukee television station WISN.
"Al Gore and the Democrats have cast a smoky pall over this year's election in Wisconsin, " Hise said.
"Wisconsin has a long tradition of fair, clean elections. This eleventh-hour bribery of Wisconsin voters is absolutely at odds with that tradition." The television station reported that individuals working on behalf of the Gore-Lieberman campaign were visiting Milwaukee shelters on Saturday, offering rides to City Hall where homeless citizens could vote by absentee ballot. The volunteers then gave packs of cigarettes to the voters outside City Hall after they had voted.
"It has now become all too clear that Al Gore and his campaign will do anything or say anything to win this race," Hise said. "Wisconsin voters will see this for what it is: a desperate and despicable act by Al Gore and the Democrats that has no place in Wisconsin election activities."
"The War on Terror will not be won until America is united. And as long as Democrats target the Bush administration -- not the terrorists -- as the enemy, we are in trouble." --Oliver North
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Those are only two reasons why we need to:
Re-elect President Bush!!
[ edited by Linda_K on Aug 3, 2004 12:30 PM ]
posted on August 3, 2004 12:45:23 PM new
Linda - Nothing but a typical neo-con Republican giving only part of the story. It appears as though the woman gave away cigarettes to homeless people after they had voted. This article also cites many establishments who do giveaway gimmicks to those who come in wearing, "I voted" stickers. She knew afterwards she put herself in a bad situation.
If this one individual, who by the way appeared to act alone and not as a representative of a Party gave away cigarettes to get votes, then they should have been prosecuted accordingly. As I have noted, anyone caught rigging, tampering, etc. with elections or registration should be considered an American traitor and be subject to the death penalty. By the way, as I said earlier, the truth about the Florida elections and the purging of voters who were legal voters makes my point that much more interesting.
" $5,000 settles election case
Allegation involved cigarettes for votes of homeless men
By DAVID DOEGE
of the Journal Sentinel staff
Last Updated: May 3, 2001
A New York philanthropist and major Democratic donor will pay a $5,000 forfeiture and not contest a civil complaint filed Thursday by prosecutors probing allegations that she gave packages of cigarettes to homeless men in Milwaukee while drumming for votes in the fall presidential election.
Connie Milstein was charged in a small claims complaint alleging 10 violations of a state election law that says it is illegal to spend more than $1 on something that is disbursed as a voting promotional item.
Prosecutors place the value of each package of cigarettes Milstein disbursed at $3.25 and allege that she broke the law 10 times by dishing out 10 packs.
In 30 years of practicing law, I don't think I have ever seen anybody who is more chagrined over the outcome of something that was undertaken in what she thought was a public-spirited way.
- Stephen M. Glynn,
attorney for Connie Milstein
State law makes it a felony to induce someone to vote; providing anything worth $1 or more as an incentive is illegal. But the prosecutor who issued the two-paragraph complaint Thursday said that the lesser civil action that was filed was as far as prosecutors felt they could go after an unusual, lengthy investigation.
"There are evidentiary difficulties in proving anything more than what we've alleged," said Assistant District Attorney Kurt Benkley.
First, according to Benkley, "the witnesses were guests in homeless shelters who had alcohol problems that have affected their ability to recall what happened."
The fact that they are homeless, Benkley explained, made it difficult to find them in the first place and difficult to locate them later as the investigation ground on.
"Also, there were considerable contradictions among the witnesses we were able to identify and contact as to just what happened," Benkley said.
Oak Creek aldermanic candidate Jeff Enea, who disseminated coffee mugs in connection with his 1998 campaign, paid a $100 forfeiture when local prosecutors last used the statute.
Stephen M. Glynn, the attorney for Milstein, said his firm conducted its own investigation of the matter, and it showed that the men who received cigarettes got them after voting and after asking Milstein and her associates for them.
Glynn said that Milstein, along with friends and relatives from New York, came to Wisconsin "on their own power and paid their own way" in an effort to get out the vote "for people who were otherwise disenfranchised."
"Some of these people, after they had voted, noticed that she was a smoker and asked her for cigarettes," Glynn said. "She told them that, sure, they could have some and asked if anyone else wanted some.
"They went to a store and bought some and gave them to those who asked for them."
Glynn said that publicity about the affair and the fact that she became the target of a criminal investigation deeply embarrassed Milstein.
"She didn't want to cause any problems," Glynn said. "In 30 years of practicing law, I don't think I have ever seen anybody who is more chagrined over the outcome of something that was undertaken in what she thought was a public-spirited way."
Glynn said he believed there was room to contest the case, but Milstein has decided not to do so, and he felt that was best, considering the circumstances.
"If she were a local resident and if the penalties associated with contesting these kinds of things weren't as severe as they could be, depending on how prosecutors proceed, it might be worth contesting," Glynn said. "But on this one, it just is a sensible way to resolve it."
Glynn said that before prosecutors proceed in enforcing the law in a contested case, it needs to be changed.
"As it is now, any nursing home that offers rides to the polls for its patients commits a felony under the law," Glynn contended. "Any restaurant that offers free coffee to people who come in wearing an 'I Voted' sticker commits a felony.
"I don't think that is what was intended when the law was enacted."
The complaint filed against Milstein is scheduled for a May 11 initial appearance. Milstein does not have to appear personally and is not expected to. Each of the 10 counts carries a fine of up to $500 and Milstein, and her attorneys have agreed upon a total forfeiture of $5,000, which amounts to the maximum.
Glynn said he expects that the $5,000 will be in his firm's trust account by then, and it can be handed over that day, finally ending the matter.
Appeared in the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel on May 4, 2001."
posted on August 3, 2004 03:38:55 PM new
Point was....you statement saying it was never proven....was incorrect.
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
"One thing is for sure: the extremists have faith in our weakness. And the weaker we are, the more they will come after us." --Tony Blair
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
"The War on Terror will not be won until America is united. And as long as Democrats target the Bush administration -- not the terrorists -- as the enemy, we are in trouble." --Oliver North
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
posted on August 3, 2004 05:28:38 PM new
Thing is, giving CIGARETTES to the homeless, why not a carton of milk, or a frikking 7-11 hot dog? I was under the impression Democrats were proud of the status of being 'compassionate' (not that Republicans are not) but giving cigarettes, how bout some food instead?
posted on August 3, 2004 06:16:44 PM new
Clarify? Now? After saying: [i]The difference between the cigarettes is that it was a rumor and never proven. This is pretty obvious, especially when a Republican is the one who was interviewed regarding this.
I understand the dems have a hard time admitting they're wrong when they are....but you implied something that wasn't true. She was on FILM/video tape handing them out.
Yes, she wanted to avoid being tried in a court so she willinging paid the fine for what she had done.
It's illegal to offer any bribe, with a value of more than $1.00, to get a person to vote.
Right now...there's a group of people who are watching Michael Moore's recommendation to others to take 5 potential voters out for lunch...buy them this or that for and get them to vote...most likely not for this President. He is promoting they break the Federal election laws. I'm sure we'll be reading about it in the future if he's caught doing what he's recommending others should do.
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
"One thing is for sure: the extremists have faith in our weakness. And the weaker we are, the more they will come after us." --Tony Blair
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
"The War on Terror will not be won until America is united. And as long as Democrats target the Bush administration -- not the terrorists -- as the enemy, we are in trouble." --Oliver North
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
posted on August 4, 2004 11:50:08 AM new
Ah... So, let me get this straight Linda. You come here to drop us your typical cut and paste articles to counter my topic. You cannot accept the fact that she was not convicted of any wrongdoing, but she is, according to you, guilty because she paid a fine??? The last time I checked, to be guilty you have to be tried and found guilty. Obviously, you fail to acknowledge the fact that the city, county, or whoever was responsible to prosecute this woman failed to uphold the law if she broke it, or perhaps they didn't have much of a case and both sides came to an agreement. Nevertheless, she paid a fine for what she did. She was punished. I completely agree with that, and if you didn't read my other messages, I believe anyone caught rigging an election or tampering with the voting or voter registration process should be treated as a traitor to America, but for some strange reason Linda, you want to still argue semantics. You wish to point out an error in my choice of words rather than the facts of the story. You spend so much time worried about what an Ultra Liberal may say, that you completely miss the point I was making... which I will repeat one more time so you can understand. ANYONE CAUGHT RIGGING AN ELECTION OR TAMPERING WITH THE VOTING OR VOTER REGISTRATION PROCESS SHOULD BE TREATED AS A TRAITOR TO AMERICA.
Now, this of course means that all of those Republicans who were part of the name purging of legal voters in Florida should also have to follow the same laws. Yes, Linda... Republicans were involved in the worst case of voter tampering in the history of National elections. This also means that your president won in Florida because of it.
posted on August 4, 2004 06:54:38 PM new
rusty - And I suppose you have 'proof' of all that voter 'tampering'....like those convicted of such crimes....or is this just another false statement - incorrectly worded statement that is as you say just a rumor that has never been proven....no one's gone to jail to this 'tampering', been convicted for this 'tampering', or even forced to pay a fine so they won't be convicted of their 'tampering'? LOL
"The difference between the cigarettes is that it was a rumor and never proven.
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
"One thing is for sure: the extremists have faith in our weakness. And the weaker we are, the more they will come after us." --Tony Blair
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
"The War on Terror will not be won until America is united. And as long as Democrats target the Bush administration -- not the terrorists -- as the enemy, we are in trouble." --Oliver North
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
