posted on August 7, 2005 06:43:18 AM new
I suppose all the neocons are going to claim she is Un-American and doesn't support the troops.
Mom wants to ask Bush `Why'?
Associated Press
Published August 7, 2005
CRAWFORD, Texas -- The angry mother of a fallen U.S. soldier staged a protest near President Bush's ranch on Saturday, demanding an accounting from the president of how he has conducted the war in Iraq.
Supported by more than 50 shouting demonstrators, Cindy Sheehan, 48, told reporters, "I want to ask George Bush: Why did my son die?"
Sheehan arrived in Crawford aboard a bus painted red, white and blue and emblazoned with the words, "Impeachment Tour."
Her son, Casey, 24, was killed in Sadr City, Iraq, on April 4, 2004. He was an Army specialist, a Humvee mechanic.
Sheehan didn't get to see Bush, but did talk for about 45 minutes with national security adviser Stephen Hadley and deputy White House chief of staff Joe Hagin, who went out to hear her concerns.
She said Hagin told her, "I want to assure you that he [Bush] really does care."
Appreciative of the aides' attention, yet undaunted, Sheehan said she planned to continue a roadside vigil, except for a few breaks, until she gets to talk to Bush.
"They were very respectful. They were nice men," she said. "I told them Iraq was not a threat to the United States and that now people are dead for nothing."
Sheehan, who is from Vacaville, Calif., arrived in Crawford after attending a Veterans for Peace Convention in Dallas.
Absolute faith has been shown, consistently, to breed intolerance. And intolerance, history teaches us, again and again, begets violence.
----------------------------------
President George Bush: "Over time the truth will come out."
President George Bush: "Our people are going to find out the truth, and the truth will say that this intelligence was good intelligence. There's no doubt in my mind."
Bush was right. The truth did come out and the facts are he misled Congress and the American people about the reasons we should go to war in Iraq.
posted on August 7, 2005 08:52:20 AM new
Had to come out of the lurking mode on this one. The fact that two high ranking officials came out and listened to this woman traveling in an impeachment advertisement says alot for the Bush administration.
They are willing to listen and they respect their troops - to give this woman an avenue to vent her frustrations also tells me the Bush administration cares about their troops and understand what the families are going through.
I am sorry for this mother, and I can understand her anger - don't agree with it, but understand it.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Caroline
posted on August 7, 2005 09:55:31 AM new
"The fact that two high ranking officials came out and listened to this woman traveling in an impeachment advertisement says alot for the Bush administration. They are willing to listen and they respect their troops. To give this woman an avenue to vent her frustrations also tells me the Bush administration cares about their troops and understand what the families are going through."
What is says is that Bush is a chicken-hawk. He cannot face any criticism himself. He is a worthless piece of crap that neocon pigs like you and Linda roll around in. He could care less about our troops, and the neocons who support his Christian neo-fascist agenda do the same. None of you could care less about our military. YOu hide behind a charade of "support our troops" stickers on you cars, all the while you keep on supporting this fascist regime who cuts back funding for Veterans, who doesn't supply enough armor for our troops, and who profiteers from killing hundreds of thousands of innocent people while contractors screw Americans out tax dollars. The Bush plan is to hold every middle class American upside down and shake them until money falls from their pockets or their sons die on the battlefield. It is shameful.
"I am sorry for this mother, and I can understand her anger - don't agree with it, but understand it. "
You are sorry for this mother??? Give me a break. Your last statement is so pathetic.
posted on August 7, 2005 10:50:56 AM new
Death is a risk in military service. The guy ENLISTED, it was HIS choice.
As a parent, you CANNOT live your kids life for them, all you can do is give them the best possible advice based on your life experiences.
She can complain all she wants, but ultimately the decision was her sons, not hers.
"Why, it appears that we appointed all of our worst generals to command the armies and we appointed all of our best generals to edit the newspapers. I mean, I found by reading a newspaper that these editor generals saw all of the defects plainly from the start but didn't tell me until it was too late. I'm willing to yield my place to these best generals and I'll do my best for the cause by editing a newspaper." --Robert E. Lee
posted on August 7, 2005 11:01:20 AM new
Hi and welcome, carolinetyler.
You spoke about the namecalling on the other thread you posted to. Guess ol' foul-mouthed rusty just had to out-do crowfarm/mingotree.
Some people here just aren't mature enough to just state their views without all the uncivil name calling. Hope you won't let the fact that rusty can't be civil to keep you from posting again. He's just a left-wing, foul-mouthed, immature poster.
"Whenever the nation is under attack, from within or without, liberals side with the enemy. This is their essence." --Ann Coulter
And why the American Voters chose to RE-elect President Bush to four more years. YES!!!
posted on August 7, 2005 11:32:18 AM new
How do you classify your name calling, linda? How can you agree with Caroline out of one side of your mouth and then proceed to call rusty a name out of the other. Doesn't that seem hypocritical to you?
You are the biggest name caller on this board. Now, I suppose that you will call me a few names in order to demonstrate to Caroline that you are some kind of privileged character???
posted on August 7, 2005 11:58:56 AM new
Yes, Caroline, LindaTwelvek is a saint on this board! She NEVER calls names, never gets upset, is always kind and civil, never laughs over the misfortunes of others, ....just hang around ahwile, you'll see!
posted on August 7, 2005 12:05:06 PM new
Caroline, you say that you understand this mother but you don't agree with her.
If you understand that that this war was waged under false pretenses....If you understand that George Bush misled Congress and the American people to justify going to war and risking the lives of thousands of their sons and daughters....If you understand that this war was not planned after the initial shock and awe and that as a result thousands had to go without appropriate armored vehicles and without other necessary equipment and if you understand that because of lack of planning that occupation of this country would become a losing battle against an overwhelming insurgency then you should understand this mother and agree with her.
Now, with over 60 Percent of Americans disapproving of the way that George Bush has handled the war, it's not surprising that many family members of dead soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan are speaking out against bush and this war. This mother represents the feelings of thousands of other mothers. And she is not the only mother of a dead member of the military to speak out.
posted on August 7, 2005 12:21:55 PM new
Yes, helen, I understand that you can't see who starts with the name calling first. Here we have a NEW poster and rusty has to start calling her names too.
Shame on you for defending his foul mouth. But then you've been seen doing a lot of cussing and calling others foul-mouthed names too. Birds of a feather...as they say.
It only shows your own lack of self control.
-------------------
And it's like bear said.....the FACTS are her son was a grown MAN. HE made the decision to join the Armed Forces....knowing full well what the risks were. PERIOD!!!
It's just you anti-war people can't grasp grown people can and DO make their OWN minds up about what they WANT to do. You get in a tither because YOU can't control everyone else and their OWN choices. Too bad.
"Whenever the nation is under attack, from within or without, liberals side with the enemy. This is their essence." --Ann Coulter
And why the American Voters chose to RE-elect President Bush to four more years. YES!!!
posted on August 7, 2005 12:56:44 PM new
If only you could see yourself as others see you, linda.
Your every reply is a name calling event. Seldom do you offer a legitimate comment. Instead your remarks consist of C&P from significantly biased sources or some form of ad hominem fallacy or horse laugh.
The previous comment is typical. You refuse to hold Bush responsible for anything. Instead you hold the poor soldier responsible for enlisting in the army. I'll bet that soldier didn't anticipate being led into an unplanned war that was really waged for political imperialism.
posted on August 7, 2005 01:22:40 PM new
Whether you agree with the mother's actions or not, she does have the freedom to speak out. She is getting the story out, that her son was sent to a war based on lies, and he lost his life. She has every right to be angry and there are other parents that feel the same as she does who are also speaking out, while others still support the war.
More are realizing the war was based on false information so it explains why recruitment is down about one half. Most parents do not spend years of their lives loving and raising beautiful children only to have them sent off to be killed in a meaningless war that started with lies and deception, a war that they aren't properly equipped to fight.
If President Bush stands so strongly behind his beliefs and this cause, to prove it he should have his daughters enlist and go to Iraq with all the other sons and daughters.
posted on August 7, 2005 01:24:27 PM new
helen you are so very confused it's not even funny.
Now it appears you lack even the character to be truthful about rusty's totally UNCALLED for words to a brand new poster here.
You will change the subject around and around rather than deal with his total lack of civility.
Go play your stupid little 'twisting' games with kiara. You're both so great at it. But please allow others to form their own opinions on the issue....and on how our NEW visitor was treated by another uncivil, out-of-control, ultra-liberal.
"Whenever the nation is under attack, from within or without, liberals side with the enemy. This is their essence." --Ann Coulter
And why the American Voters chose to RE-elect President Bush to four more years. YES!!!
posted on August 7, 2005 01:57:16 PM new
I think it was lindak that recently stated here about raising children and how they seem to follow their parent's beliefs and values after they go out into the world and how they become so much like their parents.
If that is true, then shouldn't Bush's daughters be following his so-called beliefs and values that he touts? They should be gearing up and heading out to battle as they shout 'Bring 'em on'.
OR maybe they really do take after good ol' pa ...... and duck and cover until the heat is over with.
posted on August 7, 2005 02:18:30 PM new
If nothing else, Bush should have his daughters on tour visiting the hospitals to lend support to the injured and the families in grief. He should have them there to help steady the young man trying to use his new artificial leg. Bush should have them sitting there listening to the stories they have of battle and how they lost their arms and legs.
The daughters should meet with other siblings who are crying because their big brother or sister is gone forever. They should be attending some of the funerals to show they care. After all, shouldn't that be part of the responsibility of being the daughters of a war president in these modern day times?
Linda, I've known for a long time that you don't really find me or anyone else here "funny". We've seen the truth behind your old horse laugh which is nothing but a false show of confidence...you try to use laughter to deceive.
posted on August 7, 2005 02:36:51 PM new
Besides the fact that Army Specialist Casey enlisted on his own, who really knows why he enlisted. His own Mother may not have even known. He could have enlisted because he felt a sense of duty to his country as a patriot and he may have felt that he was willing to give his life for his country. In my eyes Casey is a hero.
I can certainly understand her frustration and I agree that she has a right to be angry and a right to protest in any way she sees fit, as long as it's done peacefully but just because some angry person comes to your house to chew you out, does that mean that you are obligated to come out and have them yell and scream at you with spit flying from their mouth?
If President Bush stands so strongly behind his beliefs and this cause, to prove it he should have his daughters enlist and go to Iraq with all the other sons and daughters.
This is an asinine statement that keeps getting repeated in allmost all the anti war threads here. Well, i got news for you, you don't need you parents permission to enlist if you are 18 or over and when you are an adult your parents don't HAVE you do anything that you don't want to do, you are your own person and are allowed to make your own decisions about your life. Like Casey made his own decision to enlist. I am sure, and you are sure that Casey's Mom had no say in his decision.
posted on August 7, 2005 03:05:11 PM new
The reason for his enlistment is irrelevant. The fault lies in the false justification for the war, lack of planning and poor leadership which put the troops in unnecessary danger...leading to the death now of over 1700 and serious wounding of even more.
posted on August 7, 2005 03:22:37 PM new
I vehemently disagree with you helen. Just because you have your own beliefs about this war you think you can call his decision irrelevent. It sounds like you don't support his decision to enlist and you probably don't support others decisions to do the same.
posted on August 7, 2005 03:32:18 PM newIf President Bush stands so strongly behind his beliefs and this cause, to prove it he should have his daughters enlist and go to Iraq with all the other sons and daughters.
This is an asinine statement that keeps getting repeated in allmost all the anti war threads here. Well, i got news for you, you don't need you parents permission to enlist if you are 18 or over and when you are an adult your parents don't HAVE you do anything that you don't want to do, you are your own person and are allowed to make your own decisions about your life.
Still if Bush's daughters believed so much in his cause, do you honestly believe Bush would allow them to sign up yet alone fight on the front lines? I don't think so. How many of the US Congressmen would be joyous that their loved ones signed up. Yes I am aware there a few Congressmen that do have sons/daughters in the military now, but you don't see all the other members of Congress urging their kids to sign up for the military and fight for this noble cause especially those that voted for the war.
Absolute faith has been shown, consistently, to breed intolerance. And intolerance, history teaches us, again and again, begets violence.
----------------------------------
President George Bush: "Over time the truth will come out."
President George Bush: "Our people are going to find out the truth, and the truth will say that this intelligence was good intelligence. There's no doubt in my mind."
Bush was right. The truth did come out and the facts are he misled Congress and the American people about the reasons we should go to war in Iraq.
posted on August 7, 2005 03:35:26 PM new
Piinthesky, once they are adults I agree they are free to make their own choices. And while I realize that it’s a touchy subject to discuss the children of a president, I guess the point I’m trying to make is that President Bush speaks of family values and I think it would help his cause to show more support for the troops with his daughters at his side.
I realize he may want to shield them from some of the hospital sights but young people their age have had to witness much worse on the battlefield. Gaining media attention by showing troop support as a family unit may help make the parents who have lost loved ones believe just a tiny bit more that President Bush really does care about them and their losses. JMHO
posted on August 7, 2005 03:36:40 PM newThey are willing to listen and they respect their troops - to give this woman an avenue to vent her frustrations also tells me the Bush administration cares about their troops and understand what the families are going through.
How come Bush couldn't listen to this woman if he really respects what our troops are doing. He is the commander in chief. Wouldn't he like to know what other family members think? I suppose he decided against it, because this grieving mother doesn't agree with his policies. I am sure if was the other way around - where the mother wanted to thank Bush - he would have had a press conference for the world to see. I guesss Bush would rather carve a fake turkey with the troops on national TV than deal with one grieving mother.
Heck even Rummy was able to deal with tough questions from the soldiers themselves.
Absolute faith has been shown, consistently, to breed intolerance. And intolerance, history teaches us, again and again, begets violence.
----------------------------------
President George Bush: "Over time the truth will come out."
President George Bush: "Our people are going to find out the truth, and the truth will say that this intelligence was good intelligence. There's no doubt in my mind."
Bush was right. The truth did come out and the facts are he misled Congress and the American people about the reasons we should go to war in Iraq.
posted on August 7, 2005 03:44:02 PM new
Piinthesky, In an argument about what UNUSUAL circumstances led to the deaths of these troops, the fact that a fellow enlisted in the army should not be a factor. This soldier's loyalty is not being questioned. It's the Bush administration's lack of consideration for the troops that is being argured here. An illegal preemptive war justified by bogus reasons along with the lack of planning and poor leadership is clearly the fault that led to the deaths of over 1700 troops.
posted on August 7, 2005 04:05:42 PM new
President Bush does speak of family values and as such as far as his daughters go i can only guess what they really think of their Father but they probably do support what he stands for and his decisions, however, this doesn't mean that they should have to accompany him wherever he goes just to show their support of their Father. I think it's enough that he carries pictures of them in his wallet.
It's like you, if you say you are Canadian then i'll just take your word for it. You don't have to carry a Canadian flag around to prove it.
I think it would help his cause to show more support for the troops with his daughters at his side.
I disagree, it wouldn't make a difference either way, afterall his daughters aren't the President, he is and we all know that they support him. If i were a soldier i wouldn't necessarily want to see Bush's daughters, i would want to see him and hear his words of support.
Not to change the subject but i never wanted to see Chelsea or hear her thoughts on issues. I wanted hear and see the President himself.
posted on August 7, 2005 04:26:20 PM new
It appears some don't know that President Bush sends personal letters to each family of a fallen soldier.
He has meetings with them personally at military bases across the Nation.
He also visits the injured in the military hospitals.
You can continue to 'chant' he doesn't care about our soldiers....but you are wrong, as is usual from the anti-war, Bush bashing side of the aisle.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Whenever the nation is under attack, from within or without, liberals side with the enemy. This is their essence." --Ann Coulter
And why the American Voters chose to RE-elect President Bush to four more years. YES!!!
[ edited by Linda_K on Aug 7, 2005 04:36 PM ]
posted on August 7, 2005 04:32:41 PM newthis doesn't mean that they should have to accompany him wherever he goes just to show their support of their Father
I think you misunderstood what I said, Piinthesky. Nowhere did I say that his daughters had to accompany him wherever he goes just to show support of him. That's just silly. I said they should be showing "support for the troops" once in awhile as a family unit, sharing family values that they really do care about the injuries and losses and dedication of these young people and that they truly sympathize with the families who have been so hurt by the losses. That's just my opinion and I don't expect others to agree.
I don't blame some of the parents for feeling anger. Some of the soldiers do also and months ago the Pentagon admitted that at least 5500 had deserted, realizing it was the wrong career choice and that they had been sent off to a war that was based on wrong information.
posted on August 7, 2005 05:19:44 PM new
So far, all I have seen on this board is the left coming together to bash the right. Gee, sounds familiar - kind of like real life in here. I can't even get through all of the posts since there's so much nastiness, name-calling and insults. And, as usual, it is all coming from the Libs!
I was hoping this was a forum for civilized discussion, raising valid points, political debate, etc. I guess the Vendio description of " A place to kick back, relax, and have fun! Share a story, tell a joke, write a poem, make a friend..." is a bit off.
As usual, the only intellectual debate and facts are on the right. If I wanted to hear name-calling and Bush-bashing, I can turn on the network news, or better yet, CNN!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Caroline
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Caroline 