uaru
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posted on June 19, 2001 07:49:55 PM new
I've got mixed feelings on this story. The man did do a criminal act, I'm just a little amazed they raised $120,000.00 in donations to bring him to justice.
Would the murder of a homeless person bring as large a donation to apprehend the criminal?
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hepburn
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posted on June 19, 2001 07:56:19 PM new
He should have been tossed out in oncoming traffic himself. But the woman was an idiot for rolling down her window to begin with. Still, I have no pity on the man at all. They can throw away the key while he's in there, too. Nothing makes me more crazy than animal abuse.
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hcross
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posted on June 19, 2001 08:05:50 PM new
People like that don't stop at dogs, the next time it could have been a human.
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KatyD
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posted on June 19, 2001 08:09:11 PM new
Let's put him on death row. 
KatyD
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hepburn
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posted on June 19, 2001 08:13:20 PM new
Yes, katyd, lets
Better yet, make him live with 25 poodles in the same cell. That outta teach him
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KatyD
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posted on June 19, 2001 08:16:59 PM new
I think Leo was a bichon frise, not a poodle.
KatyD
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hepburn
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posted on June 19, 2001 08:19:02 PM new
Poor Leo. I dont even want to think about the terror it experienced. Makes me crazy mad.
Ok...a cell full of bichon whatevers AND poodles. Oh, and toss in a few dobermans while they are at it. Mean ones.
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Hjw
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posted on June 19, 2001 08:36:30 PM new
According to another article, a Navy supervisor testified that he beat a stay dog to death without any reason while serving in The US Navy. He is way out of control.
Helen
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ZILvy
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posted on June 19, 2001 08:45:04 PM new
I am very pleased that this man will be paying for his miserable, nasty, hateful act.
The idea that all that money was raised to find this killer of a domestic pet is not so hard to believe...what he did over a minor accident was an horrific act. When I first heard of this I wondered if it was true or another urban legend....unfortunately it was true.
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bunnicula
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posted on June 19, 2001 10:40:50 PM new
Good! I only hope that he doesn't get paroled early for "good behavior"! Someone who can do things like that to animals will do it just as easily to fellow humans. I remember thinking when the incident happened, "what if the woman had had an infant or toddler next to her instead of the dog?" *Not* someone I'd like to have living on my street, that's for sure...
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gravid
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posted on June 19, 2001 10:50:45 PM new
What he did was horrid But if he had been run into by the woman and grabbed her cell phone off her ear and tossed it into traffic you would all be cheering.
Riding along with your dog loose in your lap is as stupid as talking on the phone or reading a book while driving. He overreacted but it is not right to drive like that either.
As to how much she cares about the dog - please visualize what will happen to fru fru if she smacks into something going about 45 with it on her lap.
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LilRedDog
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posted on June 19, 2001 10:59:33 PM new
Gravid,
That is not a fair comparison.
I also want to add that her driving flaws do not excuse the horror of what he did.
I volunteer at a pet shelter and a homeless shelter, by the way.
I suppose you have a point uaru, but until people find their goodness, their buddha nature, their inner mohammed - whatever - little fuzzy pooches and babies get more people crying than old alchoholics or homeless women with dependency issues.
Yup I can feel the groans, it's a lot easy to love innocence, ain't it?
It's a sad state of our world.
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bunnicula
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posted on June 19, 2001 11:01:57 PM new
gravid: actually, no I wouldn't be cheering--though I *am* all in favor of not allowing them to be used while a car is in traffic.
In any case,this sicko took a living creature & sadistically threw it into traffic. There is *no* excuse for that. I agree with you that it is idiotic for drivers to go about with animals or babies on their lap, but that in no way excuses *or* explains away this man's act.
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jtland
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posted on June 19, 2001 11:13:35 PM new
Maybe you have more info than I do, but this article doesn't say that the dog was in her lap while she was driving. Of course the dog is going to jump into her lap with this idiot screaming in her window.
I hate to think about this happening to any dog, but I found it especially sad that it was a 10 year old pooch. 
Lisa
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Baduizm
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posted on June 19, 2001 11:44:47 PM new
As I gaze over at a 12-year-old girl, going on 13 years of age "puppy," it disturbs me that someone would commit an act like this.
It also amazes me that people don't believe that animals (i.e., pets, cats, dogs, etc.) have a right to be treated humanely and not with cruelty. These animals are not "throw aways."
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bunnicula
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posted on June 20, 2001 12:02:23 AM new
Last year there were two sickening animal cruelty acts, both in the Midwest. In both cases the perpetrators--teenage boys--were given slaps on the wrist & their communities took a "boys will be boys" and "they're just animals" attitude:
1. two teenage boys tooks a tiny little Yorkshire Terrier & tortured it to death. They kicked, beat & burned the dog, which was so trusting that it kept coming to them when they called to it.
2. several teenagers broke into an animal shelter & beat over 20 cats to death.
Just thinking of these cases fills *me* with rage. Boys will be boys?!? These communities are raising monsters! And their parents are just as bad, to be so accepting.
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donny
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posted on June 20, 2001 02:34:44 AM new
I dunno, a potential 3 year prison sentence sounds awfully harsh for something that was done in the spur of the moment, under stress, to a dog.
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gravid
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posted on June 20, 2001 04:25:21 AM new
I agree he was in the wrong - even more than her. I just see there is enough blame here to give her a share also. I just don't find it easy to hear one of these stories and dump all the blame on one party. It usually takes fantastic stupidity from both to mess up this bad.
Why did she roll down her window? Stupid stupid thing to do.
We just had a road rage crime where one man killed the other and then himself. If you read the progression both of them had 4 or 5 chances to walk away from it and declined.
That is typical.
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uaru
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posted on June 20, 2001 04:25:58 AM new
I guess my concern is this, at times there seems to be more humanity in our treatment of animals than in our treatment of our fellow man. Raising $120,000.00 in donations to bring a dog killer to justice is a lot of money, more than many missing child cases as the article pointed out. I imagine that many remember several years back a woman in California was killed by a cougar. The cougar was hunted down and killed because of the danger it imposed on others. The woman had 2 children, the cougar had 2 cubs, donations brought in about $10,000.00 for the woman's children and $500,000.00 for the cougar's cubs. I'm having to rely on memory on those amounts, the difference was staggering.
My actions aren't any different, I'll make an effort to give a hungry stray dog some food, but I won't walk across the street to donate to a homeless person. Is something going wrong when we have more compassion for animals than our fellow man?
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toke
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posted on June 20, 2001 04:40:07 AM new
I don't think this reflects compassion for animals as much as it shows outrage at the gratuitous and pointless cruelty of the act. If that wretched excuse for a man had thrown a baby into traffic, I'm confident the entire nation would have gone ballistic. And it wouldn't have required donations to see that every effort was made to apprehend the creep.
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gravid
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posted on June 20, 2001 04:55:45 AM new
"Is something going wrong when we have more
compassion for animals than our fellow man?
Yes.
Far more than I have space to exaimine here.
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caravaggio
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posted on June 20, 2001 05:01:25 AM new
I have been following this story since it first appeared on the news. I am thrilled that he was punished. The dogs owner(the last I heard) was so devastated by the death that she had been off work and severely depressed since it happened. He deserved more than what he got. It is nice to see that he will have to spend some time in jail over a dog. It was stupid of her to pull over and roll down her window, but he had no right to do what he did. I don't think he was punished enough. Good point, Toke.
____________________________
[email protected]
Caravaggio/confusedandsleepy are not my names at eBay.
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busybiddy
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posted on June 20, 2001 05:14:23 AM new
Several studies have linked sociopathic behavior and childhood torture of animals. This guy apparently has a history of this kind of behavior and I think he's dangerous.
I've been under stress and have done silly things on the "spur of the moment" but I've never hurt an animal or a human being and cannot see how that can be an excuse for this behavior.
He should be locked up and I hope he gets counseling; he really needs it.
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mark090
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posted on June 20, 2001 05:58:41 AM new
Do you people realize that if that woman had killed the guy when she hit him in the back she would have gotten NO jail time, just a fine. Yes, what the guy did was cruel, but get real, when did a dog's life become more valuable than the human. What he probably did was save the lives of many other people on the road by REMOVING that woman's driving problem.
Cruel thoughts, yes, but true.
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jlpiece
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posted on June 20, 2001 06:34:14 AM new
"Several studies have linked sociopathic behavior and childhood torture of animals. This guy apparently has a history of this kind of behavior and I think he's dangerous."-busybiddy
FBI profiles of serial killer and serial rapists show the number one common denominator between almost all of these sociopaths is extreme cruelty to animals. Not sure of the connection, but this is considered pretty serious to behavior to a profiler. Maybe this guy already has a few bodies buried in the backyard.
By the way the number 2 and number 3 common denominators between serial killers and rapists: Bedwetting during adolecence, and arson. Strange.
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sadie999
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posted on June 20, 2001 07:27:14 AM new
Some questions have been raised regarding compassion to animals vs. compassion to people.
IMHO, they should be about equal. I neither think animals are more important than humans, nor do I think humans are more important than animals. I think we think we're more important because there are thought capabilities that we have that animals don't.
Culturally, we also believe in souls, and since we have them and animals don't, they aren't afforded the same compassion or protection. We pretty much treat them as property. I think that culturally we do the same thing to children.
Anyone who brings about another's death (barring accidents, self defense, etc.) should be punished harshly. And I don't really care if it was in the heat of the moment - adults are supposed to be mature enough to not throw tantrums.
All that said, I'm not against hunting or eating animals, so I'm sure this will either seem like a dichotomy or hypocrisy to some.
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cyanide
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posted on June 20, 2001 07:31:57 AM new
I think the only reason she pulled over and rolled down her window was to get insurance info, etc.... What did you expect her to do? Hit and run? Yes the accident was her fault, but it wasn't her fault that a guy "instinctly" grabbed the dog and threw it in traffic. That was his only defense. He instinctly grabbed the dog and threw it in traffic because the dog bit him on the hand. 1st off, if you get bit in the hand your 1st instinct is to pull your hand away. 2nd, how was his hand so close to the dog anyway to get bit? He probably got bit when he reach for the dog in the first place.
I hope this guy gets the max sentence.
cyanide3 on Ebay
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jlpiece
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posted on June 20, 2001 07:40:56 AM new
"Culturally, we also believe in souls, and since we have them and animals don't, they aren't afforded the same compassion or protection."-sadie999
How do you know animals don't have souls?
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gravid
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posted on June 20, 2001 08:18:57 AM new
How do you know you do?
I don't believe either have souls as in seperate spirit personalities with intelligence and memory.
The big point about what he did to the dog - it was cruel - far more cruel to the woman than to the dog. She has to live with it and it is very hurtfull. If I don't have the same feeling level to dogs I can still realize she does.
And I agree - the desire to inflict pain and suffering to animals is a huge sign there is a big problem and you can expect to see the same sort of behavior with people sooner or later.
Guess what? I don't think dogs go to doggie heaven - I don't value them the same as people - and I don't think their affection and trust can be equated with human love - BUT - It is still a sick sick person that
gets some satisfaction from hurting them.
The humanity of one's actions does not vary with the target of your activity.
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sadie999
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posted on June 20, 2001 09:09:38 AM new
jlpiece,
I guess what I wrote sounded that way. I'm not sure if anyone has a soul. I was trying to convey how we treat animals as a culture.
I know that when I look into a domesticated animal's eyes, something more is there than instinct. Soul? I don't know - maybe we're all really nothing but a bunch of electrical impulses wrapped in skin. I find that hard to believe, but that could just be ego.
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