posted on November 17, 2000 06:53:44 AM new
I currently have a Buyers Protection Claim with PayPal. Luckily, at the time of the auction, PayPal's Buyer Protection Plan was still in effect stating that Buyer's are protected from Seller's if the Seller was Verified. The seller was verified on PayPal. The auction turned out to be a SCAM. Myself and several other users were scamed for over $50,000. We have patiently waited our 30 days to file our claims. Now, PayPal has issued "Reverse Payment Pending" notices with the Status "Pending". Now we still will have to wait another 30 days while they supposedly investigate the claim. I included a copy of the response from PayPal:
Thank you for contacting PayPal, a service of PayPal. We have
received your Buyer Protection Claim and will contact you by
email when we complete our investigation. However, we may contact
you during our investigation if more information is required.
Please allow up to 30 days to investigate. Please note that if
you file a charge back with your credit card issuer during or
after our investigation, your PayPal account may be closed.
The seller has committed big time fraud. I am now somewhat concerned that PayPal is just waiting for the chargeback period to expire and will simply cancel the the reverse payment citing something to the effect that their underwriters refuse to pay.
I am out about $200 bucks. I can afford to wait it out because I am very interested to see what PayPal does. If in fact they refuse to issue the payment after the 30 days, you bet I will be taking this to my Attorney General and finding a class action lawsuit to join. PayPal has since changed the Buyer Protection Policy. If this policy was in place before the Oct timeframe, I would have NEVER agreed to send money to this seller.
posted on November 17, 2000 07:43:13 AM new
How convenient that you must first wait 30 days. Then another 30 for them to investigate. That brings it to 60 days. The maximum time many credit cards allow you to do a chargeback.
Good luck on this one. I would be concerned, too. Make sure you keep your paypal account empty. Because, if you do decide to do a chargeback, they will freeze your account.
posted on November 17, 2000 09:01:07 AM new
This happened to several people I know. Paypal kept telling them to wait and delaying until the charge back period ended. Then they said there was nothing they could do. Paypal's protection plan is designed to protect Paypal and no one else. What do you think they're doing that takes 60 days? They know who the seller is, they should just take it out of his account. It should be obvious that all they're doing is preventing you from charging it back.
Read the details of how Paypal handles problems right here:
posted on November 17, 2000 11:23:09 AM new
yisgood -- I'm setting up a PayPal page similar to yours so I can refer my buyers to it if/when they ask why I'm no longer accepting PayPal. Do you mind if I provide a link on my page, leading to your page as well? The more information, the better!
posted on November 18, 2000 09:04:23 PM new
Yes, I have changed my web pages (I now have one for paypal and another for ratings of other services) to state that anyone can link to these. I have already gotten lots of good feedback and even a possible new service that wants some input from me on what customers of this service would want.
posted on December 8, 2000 09:16:08 AM new
Well, I got an Email from PayPal saying that my claim was accepted. Now they are asking for a copy of my Drivers License, a copy of a Utility Bill, and a signed affadavid before they will issue me a refund. Did anyone else ever see those as requirements in the Buyer's Protection Plan in the TOS? When did the Credit Card companies start requiring merchants to obtain copies of customers drivers license, and utility bills before they would accept payment or issue refunds.
Why should PayPal have the right to demand this information if I am using a credit card?
Afterall , they are the merchant of record and should be required to abide by the same rules as any other merchant.
posted on December 12, 2000 04:50:52 AM new
Are you a verified buyer? If not, they're simply verifying your identity. Sounds like overkill, but it protects them from getting involved in money laundering situations by issuing refunds to non-existent individuals. Seems unfair, I know, but isn't it worth it to get your money back?
posted on January 17, 2001 12:10:16 PM new
Hih,
Please let me know if you file a suit...or anyone else who does. I purchased a car part for $500 that I never got before their buyer protection plan, and was lied to and hung up on various times, even today. I was even told by a so-called supervisor that my case had never been touched (months after all the calls saying it was being processed), and he apologized. There is a long story behind my case, and I have names, dates, and exstensions too. Anyone out there that wants to do this soon, please let me know because Im all for it.
I have not filed a law suit like this before, so anyone with this experience/know how - your advice is greatly appreciated.
posted on January 17, 2001 01:23:42 PM new
Damon, here's a question I posted at different times and never got an answer. If someone pays a seller through PP and never receives the merchandise, what difference does it make if they are verified or if the protection plan was in place? PP knows that the seller received the payment. PP paid the seller either through an electronic deposit or a check. PP has the information to attempt a resolution. Why would they want to use technicalities to permit this seller to defraud others? I'm not saying the seller's account should be automatically frozen on a complaint. I'm against any automatic action that doesn't give both side a chance to respond. But the seller should at least get an email from PP that a complaint was made and can he show shipment to the buyer. If not, then his account should be frozen, whether he or the buyer are verified or not.
posted on January 17, 2001 01:40:11 PM new
Hi yisgood,
The seller is notified that a claim has been filed and is given 3 days to respond to the claim (based on the information recovered from that group). If no response is brought forward, then the account is in danger of restriction.
posted on January 17, 2001 01:44:59 PM new
Hi Damon,
I will email. This comment by yisgood is very valid. And even though it was before "buyer protection", it did at that time say that they were responsible. And shouldnt this be the case considering that their name appears on the bill...not the scam artists? All I want is my money back as they lied to me and said they were working on. The problems and headaches as well as dishonesty that they handed me should be worth the $500 alone. I will email you for the class action lawsuit info.
Thanx again,
posted on January 17, 2001 02:02:34 PM new
>>The seller is notified that a claim has been filed and is given 3 days to respond to the claim (based on the information recovered from that group). If no response is brought forward, then the account is in danger of restriction.<<
You keep repeating that but there have been dozens, if not hundreds, of posts from sellers claims that their account was restricted without notice. Take the case on auctionwatch. The guy has been calling and emailing PP for days. Then he gets your attention and you finally provide him with the name of the complaining customer. He then produced proof of delivery and his account was unrestricted. It is obvious that not only did PP make no attempt to contact him, they blew him off when he contacted them. This is the problem and there is no excuse for it. No bank, no credit card, no financial agency that I know if, operates this way. Most of use have at one time or another received a bad check or accidentally bounced one. Did your bank restrict your account? Did they prevent you from accessing all of your money because of one transaction? Did your bank ever shut down your account without contacting you? Except for Exchangepath, which looks like it's gone, no one else dares to operate this way.
posted on January 17, 2001 05:44:03 PM new
>>I understand the concerns but I am simply stating what the procedure is when it comes to claims<<
No, you are stating what is *supposed* to happen. Unfortunately, it has become painfully obvious that Paypal employees haven't read their own TOU. What actually happens is this:
-a buyer (often an outright liar) goes straight to his credit card company or to PP without bothering to contact the seller and claims not to have received the item
-PP freezes the seller's account without informing seller
-seller spends the next few weeks calling and emailing PP for the reason for the restriction and they keep blowing him off.
-seller then contacts the BBB, advises his customers to charge back their payments since he can't access them and posts nasty messages on a public forum
-Damon comes along and finally tells the seller who complained.
-seller presents proof of delivery to buyer
-Damon then tries to correct the problem. Even if successful in this case, at this point several other customers have made charge backs and the cycle starts again, if seller is foolish enough to continue using PP.
