rawbunzel
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posted on August 29, 2001 11:11:49 PM new
Actually, I would think the incentive would be to be able to get a better than $6 an hour job one day. Am I missing something?
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docpjw
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posted on August 29, 2001 11:18:51 PM new
I don't think Many of them do, they figure there are Plenty of these Jobs available. Maybe they Figure (this is a "Maybe" ) their Children or Grandchildren will take the Next step or Maybe Not. I work with MANY of the Non-English speaking (as a First Language) People, and actually have a GREAT deal of respect for them, more respect than if I didn't work with them. But I am telling you the employer could CARE less if they speak english well. They are MUCH more concerned if they are showing up for work, than how they communicate. Someone HAS to fill these positions, and the english Language is NOT a Job Requirement.  (edited for POOR English)
[ edited by docpjw on Aug 29, 2001 11:20 PM ]
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docpjw
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posted on August 29, 2001 11:25:17 PM new
Many of the people that fill these positions have a VERY mediocre education, and have really a Hard time picking up a New Language at this stage of their life. BUT don't think all of them are NOT trying, MANY are trying to learn english, But it is a struggle. I know they don't want to earn $6/hour forever, but alot of these employees feel stuck in this way of life.
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bunnicula
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posted on August 29, 2001 11:28:09 PM new
The only employers who "care less" are those filling positions in which the employee does not have to interact with the public, or those whose business is in a primarily Hispanic community.
You tend to lose business if people decide they don't want to frequent a business that is represented by unintelligible employees.
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docpjw
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posted on August 29, 2001 11:36:15 PM new
Where I live (Chicagoland), MANY low paying Jobs, THAT DO interact with the Public ARE filled by people (who at best use english as a 2nd Language) who interact with the Public all the time or at least Frequently. These are NATIONAL Companies and they don't think twice about it when Hiring them, Oh well they do think about how Much they save by filling a Low Paying position. I really don't ( I do realize this is MY opinion ) customer service is a Real High Priority in the U.S. anymore, BUT company profits ARE. I know you will say well it will cost them Overall, BUT I don't think they look at it that way anymore.
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Baduizm
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posted on August 29, 2001 11:38:50 PM new
I would first, say, that I have not read all of the comments in this thread. I need to say that, before saying this:
There is a sentiment at AW, the AW RT, whatever, that is oh, never mind. Pardon me. I.......am in grief
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kraftdinner
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posted on August 29, 2001 11:44:04 PM new
It's nice to see you again Baduizm  ....are you OK?
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krs
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posted on August 30, 2001 03:13:36 AM new
Spazmodeus eats at McDonalds--LOL!
How do you say "McNuggets" in Lithuanian, Spaz? Oh wait! I know! It's "McNuggets".
'Course..in there, can't you just point at the picture and grunt? LoL!
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gravid
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posted on August 30, 2001 04:34:11 AM new
"The bilingual thing is at a point now where I can't get simple answers to simple questions from McDonald's counter clerks"
Hey this is more than a language problem.
I went to McD's and told the white English speaking kid that I wanted the next-to-biggest drink because that is the one that fits in my cup holder.
The twit asked "Do you want to super size that?"
I said NO - that is the big one - I want the next smaller. He honestly was confused and could not look at the damn cups and figure out which one was next-to-biggest. All these burger places have different names for their sizes - It is not small/med./large so I thought how I said it was safer than jumbo, biggie, etc.
I had to tell him never mind and go to the next register where an older lady was working who did not have the intelligence of a gerbil.
They already have registers with pictures and have to have the register tell them how to make change. If they can't tell the difference between the 4 sizes they will have to line up little pictures of the cups with maybe color coding so when they turn around and aren't looking at the picture anymore they can remember it is the yellow size.
[ edited by gravid on Aug 30, 2001 04:37 AM ]
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bunnicula
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posted on August 30, 2001 07:52:38 AM new
Gravid:  I've had that happen. I was at a fast food place the other day & asked for a medium Dr. Pepper. Turned out they didn't have "small" "medium" & "large"--they had "Regular" "Large" and "Extra-Large." The young woman (not a teen) working the register looked puzzled and said "we have Regular, Large & Extra Large." I looked at her for a moment, then said "in that case, wouldm't your large be the medium-sized drink?" Duh.
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DWest
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posted on August 30, 2001 07:53:30 AM new
Where I live there are quite a few educated immigrants that speak multiple languages. Many of the "real Americans" resent them because many of the foreigners own their own businesses. It appears that regardless of the level of their skills and abilities, there will always be a reason for fear and mistrust.
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bunnicula
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posted on August 30, 2001 07:59:42 AM new
Um...no one here has been talking about fear or mistrust.
Personally, I welcome immigrants (legal ones) & what they can bring to our country. That's what's made us a great nation. But...I strongly believe that if you come to this country expecting to make it your home, that you should learn English and fully embrace this country as yours. I get sick & tired of those who won't do this.
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DWest
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posted on August 30, 2001 08:07:31 AM new
That is my point, most people do not call it fear and mistrust. Instead they try to legislate what they cannot control. The fear involved with this topic is the fear that other ethnic groups may soon outnumber english speaking Americans. Enacting legislation that would make English the official language is an attempt to make sure that the status quo is maintained.
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jamesoblivion
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posted on August 30, 2001 08:17:07 AM new
There are tens of millions immigrants living in this country now. Probably all but a couple hundred thousand at most speak English. It is but a small percentage of immigrants overall who don't learn to speak English. Hardly crisis proportions.
[ edited by jamesoblivion on Aug 30, 2001 08:18 AM ]
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toke
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posted on August 30, 2001 08:44:57 AM new
It's really stupid of some of the companies involved, who simply place some obviously bright people in the wrong positions.
I desperately needed phone tech support a while back, from my broadband provider. It was like a comedy routine. The tech was East Indian or Pakistani with very poor English skills...trying to answer (and understand) my questions...a woman with very poor tech-speak. It was unreal. We both gave up...laughing.
It was truly amazing that this company put her on the telephone of all places.
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hepburn
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posted on August 30, 2001 08:45:26 AM new
Doc, it is not my husband that was told this. It was an associate. If I worked there, I would not be as timid as that gal who was threatened, trust me. Also, I beg to differ on your opinion that "someone needs to fill the position because most peope would refuse to do that kind of labor". Hogwash. There have been many applicants and all refused, UNLESS they were spanish. The big boss is spanish himself, but bilingual and speaks english very well since she was born here to english speaking parents. Thats all fine and dandy, but it still smacks of discrimination that english speaking people cannot get or keep their job IF they dont learn it.
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arttsupplies
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posted on August 30, 2001 09:13:30 AM new
>...<
[ edited by arttsupplies on Sep 7, 2001 08:57 AM ]
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krs
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posted on August 30, 2001 09:19:34 AM new
Dwest, if you don't mind my saying so--hogwash. It's only a failure to communicate (deja).
While true that in many cases employers are restricted by laws protecting the equal rights of potential employees, wouldn't you say that a person in business to sell to other persons who speak only english for the most part would prefer to employ persons who are able to communicate effectively with their customers without being accused of either being fearful or discrimatory if they do so?
Though I do not support laws which would make any language a requirement here I do think that for the smooth operation of a society a common language is necessary for any who chose to participate in that society at the level which would enable employment. It is the responsibility of the non majority to adapt as in when in Rome, do as the Romans do.
Would you have all employers required in law to be fluent in every conceivable language which might come to the door for the convenience of all who refuse to learn to be fluent in english?
Or is it that you plan to take over the country and speak whatever language is native to you while requiring all who speak anything else to learn that language lest you live in fear and distrust that they might one day take over and require the same thing of you?
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krs
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posted on August 30, 2001 09:30:53 AM new
Hepburn,
You have preempted my "hogwash" and I am grieviously injured that you have.
Apologize immediately.
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NearTheSea
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posted on August 30, 2001 09:34:12 AM new
you meant to put a yellow smiley next to that right?
hogwash yourself
[email protected]
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toke
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posted on August 30, 2001 09:51:55 AM new
Plagiary...pure and simple. Could at least have gone for swinebath or hogswallow or the like.
Oops...here's a for NTS
[ edited by toke on Aug 30, 2001 09:55 AM ]
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krs
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posted on August 30, 2001 09:56:47 AM new
Neerthasee,
If you wish to fill your posts with sappy looking little icons feel free to do so as that is your business, not mine. Will you show the largess to allow me the same courtesy which I have just extended to you?
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NearTheSea
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posted on August 30, 2001 10:14:18 AM new
ksr Which courtesty?
Hey toke I don't know all the icons! I just do them with the colons and cap D LOL!!!
OT (LOL!) why do people say hogwash?
(I like 'swinebath' LOL!)
[email protected]
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DWest
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posted on August 30, 2001 10:20:11 AM new
KRS - Calling something hogwash doesn't make it so.
I am American Indian. What you describe is exactly what happened to my ancestors. We got over it -- maybe someday you will too.
English might be the second language of some of those business owners you are talking about. Maybe they are employing their own relatives and friends. Do you believe that the Asian, African, or Hispanic business owners should be prohibited from employing their own relatives until they have been certified as being competent in the english language. If so, require it of everyone. There would probably be a few U.S. born citizens that would fail certification.
I'm just glad that these people you are complaining about have a job. It probably won't be long before they learn the language -- it is inevitable when you are exposed to it on a daily basis.
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toke
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posted on August 30, 2001 10:21:19 AM new
NTS...
I just use the old ones, for the most part...too lazy for all the bouncing thingies. I thought krs was funny, teasing hepburn, so I just wanted to goof too. Plus, I like to make up stupid words...heh.
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NearTheSea
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posted on August 30, 2001 10:31:27 AM new
toke - I was messing around too.....
I especially like to mess with ksr name, like he does mine
[email protected]
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krs
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posted on August 30, 2001 10:39:48 AM new
Dwest,
"Do you believe that the Asian, African, or Hispanic business owners should be prohibited from employing their own relatives until they have been certified as being competent in the english language".
Perhaps you haven't taken the time to read my post above, or perhaps my english is insufficient to communication in this forum for I do believe that I did not say that anyone should be prohibited anything. In fact, I thought that I said that an employer might rightfully expect that his employees be able to communicate effectively with his customers. That would be, don't you think, a rather simple means to assist in the enhancement of his goals, which generally are to profit?
And did you miss that portion of my post which posited that a common language is necessary for any who chose to participate in that society at the level which would enable employment? You have already acknowledged with your "what happened to my ancestors" phrasing that the predominant language in the workplace is english though I cannot see how you could post in that manner and end by saying "we got over it".
Now, predominant does not mean "all". If a person who is of any heritage which does not use english wishes to open business, hire like speaking employees, and sell primarily to others with whom his employees can communicate, and accepts the limitations self imposed upon his prospects for growth in the general society in this country I'm sure that he can do so without sanction of law, and in fact that is done today.
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Hjw
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posted on August 30, 2001 10:50:36 AM new
I understand the argument here...Every word except the expression "hogwash" as used by krs to a relatively new poster.
From Hepburn, it makes sense.
From krs, it does not.
Helen
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DWest
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posted on August 30, 2001 11:14:43 AM new
KRS - There is a common language right now, it is english.
I do not want to see english made the official language because I don't think it is necessary. On the otherhand, I don't want to see burdensome legislative requirements in the other direction either. Personally,if I find that a business is not providing me the quality of services that I believe I deserve, I go elsewhere.
I'm always amazed at the number of people in other countries that are multi-lingual. People in this country should start learning other languages, especially if they expect to lead the global markets, etc.
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rawbunzel
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posted on August 30, 2001 11:25:30 AM new
arttsupplies, not a typo. It happened when I was fresh out of high school and had gone to S Cal with my Marine boyfriend so that we could be together while he was stationed at the El Toro base. Can't remember the name of the town. I was only there for a few weeks since the relationship was not working out but while there I tried to get a position at Nursing homes as I had been a nurses aide for two years...no dice said they...I must speak spanish. Ok. I tried the fast food places, no dice. The little local stores. No spanish, no dice. I had no car so was looking very local, that may have been the problem. I remember thinking how strange it was. Since I had come from the Seattle area it was new to me. Now, that was my own personal experience. Yours may differ.
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