mlecher
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posted on June 12, 2002 08:47:27 AM new
There are only 10 types of people in the world
Those who understand binary and those who don't
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gravid
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posted on June 12, 2002 09:25:08 AM new
Tell the prosecutor it was your freebie.
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kraftdinner
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posted on June 12, 2002 10:04:26 AM new
I thought it was one free "sexual act". The words 'groping' and 'fondling' are so ambiguous, I doubt they'd even count.
So is that it? Is that the punishment for all these perverts?
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stusi
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posted on June 12, 2002 10:10:03 AM new
The bottom line is it sets a precedent legally and otherwise that a first sexual violation of a child is acceptable. There will inevitably be those who will feel that if a Priest can do it, so can they.
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Helenjw
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posted on June 12, 2002 10:28:34 AM new
I question every action or thought of a priest.
Unfortunately few perverted priests will ever see a prosecutor.
Helen
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Helenjw
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posted on June 12, 2002 10:30:30 AM new
Now, they are having a difficult time collecting money from the flock.
Helen
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Borillar
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posted on June 12, 2002 11:01:28 AM new
"There will inevitably be those who will feel that if a Priest can do it, so can they."
EXACTLY, stusi!
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Linda_K
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posted on June 12, 2002 11:02:39 AM new
From what my Catholic friends have shared, they are just as upset that these crimes against children have happened. They are working for change in their parishes and telling the leadership they expect change. It's been a hard time for them.
I think most of them are horrified that this was a much larger national issue than they realized.
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KatyD
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posted on June 12, 2002 11:27:44 AM new
It's only a "big" issue for those who hate Catholics to begin with. How convenient that most of those "molested" have come forward 10, 20, 30 years later, after media started salivating over the salaciousness. Course when there's the possibility of money, people remember all sorts of things they had "forgotten". The one good thing to come out of it, is that most of these type people will no longer get a payoff based purely on an accusation. Now they'll have to prove it in court. Imagine that.
KatyD
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gravid
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posted on June 12, 2002 11:30:18 AM new
Does that mean you think the majority are just golddiggers looking for a payout and the accusations are largely false and the Church was paying for cases that their people were innocent of?
[ edited by gravid on Jun 12, 2002 11:42 AM ]
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posted on new edit
It is WRONG to sexually molest children.
Wheather or not money is involved does not change that fact.
I believe that it's possible that all of the priests who engage in taking advantage of children are mentally ill. It's possible that they were molested when they were growing up in the Catholic church.
In the best of all possible worlds, these priests would be removed from their church and transferred to a mental facility where they might possibly be helped. Money would not be an issue.
In any event, you can't say that because money is involved that the crime did not happen.
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posted on new edit
KatyD - after media started....
To me, I believe it's because there's strength in numbers. As more and more cases were brought into the spotlight, some felt more comfortable coming out. Many had already settled with the church. Some never told anyone. I truly believe that many of these victims thought they were alone.
Do I believe there are cases of false accusations? Sure.
Please consider that these people turn to their priests when troubled..are used to seeking guidance from them...etc.
The shame they feel too, is another consideration for not coming forward, IMO.
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KatyD
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posted on June 12, 2002 11:56:56 AM new
Baloney. Innocent men have been accused and never given the chance to defend themselves in a court of law. I know one personally accused years ago of misconduct and the diocese would not allow defense but chose to settle the case. Even though the woman had a history of "accusations" against a variety of people (doctors, teachers, etc). The one good thing to come out of this is that the Church will be forced to stop the practice of "settling" with accusers and make them prove their accusations in a court of law.
A good many of these people are "coming forward" because they spent their payoffs and are looking for more.
KatyD
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Linda_K
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posted on June 12, 2002 12:02:55 PM new
KatyD - have come forward 10, 20, 30 years later, after media started salivating over the salaciousness.
[Saying with compassion] IMO, there's power in numbers. When you feel alone it's harder to speak up. Because of the media attention maybe (??) more have felt more comfortable about 'coming out'.
I believe those not coming forward for years have either not been able to deal with this issue and suppressed it, or they've already settled with the church. Maybe even not settled...just walked away from the faith altogether saying nothing.
This is indeed a very hard time for Catholics. No one likes to have their church [etc] and it's inner workings put in the spotlight. Good, needed changes will come about because of this becoming so public.
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Linda_K
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posted on June 12, 2002 12:05:57 PM new
posted once...it didn't take...so second post is kind of a repeat....sorry.
AW burping again?
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KatyD
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posted on June 12, 2002 12:07:39 PM new
Whatever.
The two posts above my last post at 11:56, and right after gravid's 11:30:18 post...who made these posts? Does everyone a name with the posts? They are blank. No name, no time. Just the posts. Weird. Everyone else's posts are showing up by their names. I just can't see these posts. Is it my browser?
KatyD
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KatyD
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posted on June 12, 2002 12:10:25 PM new
Because of the media attention maybe (??) more have felt more comfortable about 'coming out'.
Nope. It's because they smell "money". And alot already got money. They want some more. There are lawyers advertising for "victims". They smell money too.
What a crock.
KatyD
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Linda_K
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posted on June 12, 2002 12:12:29 PM new
KatyD - Two posts are mine. One with my name and the other [without my name that starts out: KatyD - after the media
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Linda_K
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posted on June 12, 2002 12:17:49 PM new
KatyD - Please know this: I in no way mean to offend you. Just sharing how I see what's happening. I'd just like to understand from your perspective and opinions.
Do you believe the church would have paid off the people it has if the charges weren't true?
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KatyD
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posted on June 12, 2002 12:18:08 PM new
That's weird, Linda. Neither are showing your name, and no time. They are blank and then "posted on" and that's it. At least that is what I see. Weird.
edited to add that I see all of your other posts just fine.
KatyD
[ edited by KatyD on Jun 12, 2002 12:18 PM ]
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KatyD
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posted on June 12, 2002 12:22:19 PM new
Do you believe the church would have paid off the people it has if the charges weren't true?
Yes. I personally know for a fact that the Church has done this. Traditionally, the Church does not want it's business in the limelight, so the practice has been to make payoffs even when their own investigations have shown the accusations to be untrue. That is why I said that the one good thing to come out of this is that they will no longer be able to do this. And a lot of innocent men unfairly accused will be exonerated.
KatyD
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Helenjw
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posted on June 12, 2002 12:28:45 PM new
My post is unnamed and undated also.
It begins with
It is WRONG to sexually molest children.
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Linda_K
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posted on June 12, 2002 12:31:14 PM new
KatyD - a lot of innocent men unfairly accused will be exonerated.
That's what I meant when I said maybe good things will come out of this. By bringing things out in the light of day....both the innocent priests - unfairly accused and those who are guilty of violating the trust of their parishioners will be weeded out. I think that's a positive thing.
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Borillar
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posted on June 12, 2002 01:06:45 PM new
"It's only a "big" issue for those who hate Catholics to begin with."
Maybe. I don't hate Catholics. But realize that once the media has stopped their feeding frenzy, they'll turn to the Protestant faiths and Watch-Out! Ministers and Pastors and even Jewish Rabbis are know for their "extreme" tastes. I used to have my mom tell me about Congressional Pages. Seems that Congressmen on more than one occasion have abused Pages. That's why there are certain fraternization rules in place -- to keep the hands of representatives and senators off of tender young Congressional Page behinds! She never did tell me what scandals those were or when, though.
So, we have more to look forward to! We'll end up all agreeing that we are one, sick society.
sp.
[ edited by Borillar on Jun 12, 2002 01:07 PM ]
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kraftdinner
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posted on June 12, 2002 01:33:26 PM new
I don't understand your reasoning KatyD. Why does one have to hate catholics to bring forth these allegations? These people are (have been) living with shame. Who would they have told 30 years ago that would have believed them...especially coming from a priest? 30 years ago women never admitted to being raped. This adds up to nothing more than a slap in the face for a victim that's already living with a crime being committed against them imo. Makes me wonder how many haven't come forward.
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kraftdinner
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posted on June 12, 2002 01:42:01 PM new
Unfortunately, you're right Borillar. Sexual perversion of this nature isn't just limited to the catholics. 
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KatyD
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posted on June 12, 2002 01:42:07 PM new
Why are you so willing to believe that this sudden onslaught of all these accusations are true, kraftdinner? They are accusations over events that supposedly occured 10, 20 30 years ago and these so-called "victims" had plenty of time to come forward. Not until the media began it's salacious coverage of Geoghan did all these people caome forward. How are their "allegations" going to be proved now? Or worse, disproved?
This adds up to nothing more than a slap in the face for a victim that's already living with a crime being committed against them imo.
Now you are assuming facts not in evidence. What would YOU know about it? Oh yeah. You saw it on the news. It must be true. Your gullibility is showing. Whatever.
KatyD
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kraftdinner
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posted on June 12, 2002 02:17:15 PM new
I guess I believe it because the catholic priest representative that was on CNN stated that this type of behaviour has been known about for decades by some. He didn't know of any himself, BUT if he did, he said the percentage would be a very small number (less than 5%) that he believed were involved. Now, I'm not catholic, so I don't know the total amount of priests in the world, but even 4% would add up to a lot of people.
There was also a psychiatrist on talking about celibacy and its effects on these men. In short, it was a perfect breeding ground for sexual disfunction.
As far as the victims go, I just try to change places and imagine I was sexually assaulted by a priest (which I have never been btw). I'm not sure if, at any age, I would be able to tell someone about it, but if I did, what would they have been able to do for me? We're talking about the Catholic Church here. If 30 years past and I had heard of others with the same allegations, it might give me enough courage to tell my story.
If enough people had the same story, I'm sure charges could be laid. They've convicted people of murder on cases that were older than these, so I'm sure it's not impossible. If the priests are innocent, I'm sure that will come out too.
(sp)
[ edited by kraftdinner on Jun 12, 2002 02:20 PM ]
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KatyD
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posted on June 12, 2002 02:30:08 PM new
So you admit that you get all of your "information" from the tlaking heads on t.v. Figures. Oh and precisely WHO was this so-called "catholic priest representative"? Lol!
There was also a psychiatrist on talking about celibacy and its effects on these men. In short, it was a perfect breeding ground for sexual disfunction.
This would be laughable if it wasn't so absurd. Celibacy doesn't have a damn thing to do with sexual predators...child molesters, rapists or any other kind. Um...is this the same "psychiatrist" that said that celibacy leads to homosexuality? Lol!
If enough people had the same story, I'm sure charges could be laid.
No doubt. Especially if they know there is a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.
KatyD
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kraftdinner
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posted on June 12, 2002 03:00:25 PM new
Most people get their information from the news Katy, unless there's a new source I haven't heard about.
The catholic priest representative was who ever was the representing spokesman for the church.
The psychiatrist talked about sexual maturity/immaturity, adding some understanding to the whole concept. Homosexuality never entered the story, so I'm not sure where you got that.
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