"A brain tumor caused a 40-year-old man to become obsessed with sex and to molest children, doctors have reported. This is the part of the brain responsible for judgment, impulse control and social behavior."
Question: What if ALL pedophiles had some pressing damage to this area of the brain, would you still be so inclined to treat them as the filthiest criminals on the earth who deserve only to be exterminated on sight? Operable or inoperable, is it still right to want to treat them as pond-scum criminals, or do we forgive only those who can be successfully treated? What do you say?
posted on October 23, 2002 09:47:41 AM new
Don't you think you're just giving these people and out? Maybe one or two have brain tumours, but the others make a choice at what they want to do. Maybe all people with hang-ups have a missing or faulty gene or brain lesions... they still have to be responsible for their actions.
[ edited by kraftdinner on Oct 23, 2002 09:48 AM ]
posted on October 24, 2002 12:30:56 PM new
>I look at it like the "gene" that causes obesity. Few will have it, many will claim they have it.
That would most likely be the case. Shouldn't we check convicted pedophiles for brain damage in this area? I mean, all the tumor did was press against an area of the brain responsible for judgment, impulse control and social behavior. Damage on this area could also account for the same compulsion. And also, knowing that this might be a smoking gun, might there be corrective surgery or medication targeted towards that area that might be affective? And if so, what about having councilors, psychologists, and psychiatrists be on the lookout for potential offenders and start treatment early on?
posted on October 24, 2002 01:03:10 PM new
Borillar,You and I diddled for two days on this subject a couple of months ago.No one else wanted to have an intelligent conversation about child rapists and pedophilias,Remember? Then it became more women were pedophiles and stalkers and You were trying to prove it to the Police,Remember? I do, I didnt want to believe there were woman who were pedophiles,and fought You on it,So You tried to turn it on me,That something was amiss from my past,and unsolved issues.
Yes Borillar,that is partly true, I am a Mother 1st,and a Grandma 2nd,That makes me the most dangerous woman a pedophile would ever make the mistake of coming around.I will fight to the death for my young.I am not the only one out there that knows how to lock and load,A child molester will get no warning.
And Borillar,The thing that really bothers me about Your strange outlook,No mention of the victims,Where is the sympathies for them?
Its not in the 2 day round we had, Nothing here..........
When I found a website with the gene that had been found,That contributed to molesting,and pedophila,You ignored it completely,I posted it to that thread! Why didnt You get excited then?
I asked You before,Can You name a woman You like? You chose to ignore me.
So yeah,I will call it "Your fascination"
Its a lot nicer,Then I really would say.
posted on October 24, 2002 04:00:14 PM new
>And Borillar,The thing that really bothers me about Your strange outlook,No mention of the victims,Where is the sympathies for them?
The sympathy is everywhere for the victims. A blind person can see it, hear it, feel it. There is both plenty of and never enough sympathy for the victims.
And yet, maybe there are some, who are victims, and they receive no sympathy at all?
A dog bites and kills a small child. Yet nothing is thought of the owner, who, day after day, chained that dog to a tree and beat the living sh1t out of it to make it mean, ferocious, deadly. No. We only have sympathy for the lost child and no sympathy for the dog that suffered such cruelty.
What makes someone sexually assault/molest young children? Think about it. There is the case of say, for argument's sake, a Man, who is severely retarded. This man has the intellect and mind of a five or six year old, no matter the fact that his body has grown into adult stature. This man can only relate to children of five and six and plays with them because he is one of them. But his body betrays him, with puberty and sexual drives and urges, he approaches the only ones that he can relate to for sexual release, and unfortunately, that's the five and six year old kids.
That pathology is understandable, although every bit as sad as is any case of sexual predation of minors can be. The severely retarded man's mind went for his own age group. But what of the rest of the pedophiles out there? What is their excuse?
What Adult of either sex would have sexual encounters with a small child, without being the foregone retarded person? Is this normal behavior for an Adult? I say that it is not normal behavior for an Adult. It is a mental illness.
Is mental illness a choice? If you can answer Yes to that - this discussion is ended for you and you need not drop back into any pedophile threads of mine anymore. If you think that mental illness is not a Choice, a logically made and selfishly derived at Choice, then you agree that mental illness is not something that can easily be controlled by willpower alone.
Pedophilia, being a mental illness, must have causes. If we are to look at this rationally and logically and scientifically, we can not afford to turn our collective noses up at facts that may explain that nature of such mental illness.
In a previous thread, a link to an article showed where a case was that a man, when a pre-pubescent, had been sexually molested by his aunt. And this young boy, after growing up to age 35, turned around and sexually molested a girl the age that he was when he was molested.
If I recall correctly, someone - I think it was you, junquemama, who objected to the molestation because it was incest with the aunt, not because it was an adult female sexually molesting a small boy. That further conversation seemed to point out from several posters that Adult Females who seduce young boys was not seen as Pedophilia, or sexual molestation, or mental illness of any sort. And it was only Pedophilia and sexual molestation f the roles were reversed (incest excluded). I called those people Hypocrites. And there you go.
I feel as if not fact should be overlooked, just because we find the notion socially reprehensible. That an Adult female who sexually molests a young boy becomes a causal factor of why the male, then when adult, turns around to molest as effect and is an established fact in that one case should not be ignored as a probably causal factor in other cases. That we should never exclude female predation simply because our society thinks of the practice otherwise. And that if all female sexual predation of children were to stop for several generations, only then could we look at it as a non-causal factor.
In this thread instance, the man, without his own choice in the matter, developed a brain tumor and this caused his uncontrollable urges to sexually molest children; and when removed, his urges ceased completely. Junquemama wants to victimize this victim. That's junquemama's choice. But I should not be berated for displaying compassion for this poor guy who had this terrible thing placed upon him without his own choice in the matter.
Certainly, we should recognize child molestation for what it is. Whether the molester is male or female, that should certainly be acknowledged and no one should be such a hypocrite to think otherwise. That these predators display abnormal behavior should be dealt with as mental illness will go a lot further in protecting children in the future than simply incarcerating them for an offence - of which they eventually get paroled for doing their time. That a person who may develop this mental illness may be so terrified of incarceration and punishment that they would rather try to control their uncontrollable impulses, rather than seek appropriate treatment for the illness, is largely due to the attitudes of people like Junquemama in society and within the justice system.
Finally, if there is a part of the brain that can be affected that stimulates this behavior, then in all fairness we ought to look at all of those who report symptoms or are convicted of those crimes in order to try to treat them. That perhaps in the future there may be brain operations or gene therapy or targeted medications that would help these people rather than treating these victims as monsters is a cause that is both just and in our best interests. That is the discussion that I had hoped to create with this thread.
posted on October 24, 2002 04:53:24 PM new
What we consider abberant behavior is either learned or the result of pathology...either chemical imbalance or tumors as this topic suggests. Although there may be a genetic abnormality, people are not born evil. Advances in science should make corrections of this behavior possible in the future.
In the meantime, we should treat these people as sick rather than evil.
posted on October 24, 2002 04:59:26 PM new
All that,and You still want to humanize the molester.No mention of free will except for,
That a person who may develop this mental illness may be so terrified of incarceration and punishment that they would rather try to control their uncontrollable impulses, rather than seek appropriate treatment for the illness, is largely due to the attitudes of people like Junquemama in society and within the justice system.
Bingo,Borillar! I believe in keeping the ba-tards at a great distance untill You
Cure them!
posted on October 24, 2002 05:12:19 PM new
Borillar,You said they can control their impulses,Make up your mind!
If a would be or budding pervert in the making were to go to a Doctor,And say said to him,I need help,My thoughts arent right.Sure,Ill buy that,The rest of society would too.Thats not going to happen,and You know it.So while You are trying how to save all these delightful people,
I will keep them away the best way I know.
posted on October 24, 2002 05:46:28 PM new
Helen,When I use to kid around about KRS being my junkson,I had 2 emails from men wanting to help me with my wayward son.They both had experience with bad behavior in young men,and so very careful as to what was said to me in those emails.They werent real bright,Neither one bothered to follow the light hearted banter that was going on,all they saw was son.This was a couple of years ago in a different chat room. Both quickly got rid of their email address's,So no place is safe.
posted on October 24, 2002 06:13:56 PM newso terrified of incarceration and punishment that they would rather try to control their uncontrollable impulses
posted on October 24, 2002 06:14:13 PM new
Junquemama
"Helen,When I use to kid around about KRS being my junkson,I had 2 emails from men wanting to help me with my wayward son.
LOL!!!
I don't get email from anybody...male or female so I don't have to worry. Like somebody used to say here...I'm not paranoid anywhere but here. Don't take anything that I say too seriously...I like to kid around a lot but nobody knows it.
posted on October 24, 2002 06:38:34 PM new
Borillar,It damn sure says there is a will of thought,other wise Your statement:
so terrified of incarceration and punishment that they would rather try to control their uncontrollable impulses
Is nothing more then a lie.
And while You seem to be an expert on the subject,How can You possibly know a molester can not help them selves.Are You in the medical field and know exactly how a pedophile thinks? Maybe You wrote a paper on the study.Be sure and send all your studies of many years to the scientific community,Im very sure they would enjoy the read.
posted on October 24, 2002 06:53:24 PM new
And back to the other question,Can You name a woman that You really like and have respect for.This is not a loaded question,I simply want to know ,and if not,I won't yank your chain,Each to their own and I would consider You honest.
posted on October 24, 2002 06:54:32 PM new
I have a couple of questions for you...
Let's say they catch a pedophile with a brain tumour, then they catch a pedophile without any tumours. Both have the same characteristics, but one gets off for medical reasons. Couldn't the tumourless pedophile then argue that he should get off for 'undiscovered' medical resons?
And if it's thought that all criminal behavior is a mental illness, who will be responsible for any crimes committed?
posted on October 24, 2002 08:51:00 PM new
Well, KD, I can't answer your question as posed. I think that we ought to investigate every possibility for treatment and a cure for mental illnesses that make monsters out of people. That many of them are aware of how terrible their impulses are and are both ashamed and horrified to find themselves in that way speaks plenty for them being victims as well. That these people need to be treated as mentally ill people makes sense. Punishing them for mental illnesses makes no sense.
posted on October 24, 2002 09:09:20 PM new
Borillar,You said:
A dog bites and kills a small child. Yet nothing is thought of the owner, who, day after day, chained that dog to a tree and beat the living sh1t out of it to make it mean, ferocious, deadly. No. We only have sympathy for the lost child and no sympathy for the dog that suffered such cruelty.
The dog is put down,as should be,The owner is fined and hopefully does jail time.You chose the dog over the child for sympathy.The child died a horrible slow death the dog dies pain free(almost)if shot.
Same as the pedophiles who killed all those young little girls during the summer,They died horribly,And to have any sympathy for those perverts will not happen,They have to be put down.
posted on October 24, 2002 09:26:32 PM new
Hi Borillar! I see what you're saying now. Now that they've found the area in the brain that could be responsible for pedophilia, they might be able to operate or do something to help these people. Maybe all devious, criminal behavior just needs to be mapped out in the brain to provide cures or relief. That's interesting.
