posted on January 29, 2003 04:12:56 PM new
LindaK,This is exactly why I said "They dont think like we do.No concept of our society what so ever.We are the ones who are viewed as the axis of evil.The women and children would not be called to the front unless we attack.Thats the only reason they are on display now.
posted on January 29, 2003 04:18:11 PM new
LindaK,You said:
"Did you see the picture of their women all in white, in military formation, carrying their rifles? Smiling? Feeling so proud? Their choice.
Then if we arent liberating the children and women of Iraq,What the hell are we doing there?
Im pretty sure we are suppose to be there liberating somebody.
posted on January 29, 2003 04:55:29 PM new
junquemama - I've said this before....we're going to disarm Saddam. Will doing so liberate their people? Yes, imo.
I'm going to say something else that I've been wanting to, but haven't because I can't find a link. And God only knows around here, NO ONE can be believed without proof....and sometimes even with proof they're not believed. BUT during the election, BOTH Clinton and Gore said they too believed Saddam has these weapons. I've heard it stated on TV recently too.
So....believe it or not.
But my point is...this hasn't been an issue that Bush started. It's been going on for years. No one chose to deal with it. Now Bush is either going to, or hopes to get Saddam to disarm...come clean...tell the UN inspectors where all the items are they're missing. It's Saddam's choice, but many here blame Bush.
posted on January 29, 2003 05:19:16 PM new
LindaK,The arms inspectors asked for more time,3 to 6 more months,To be able to look everywhere for the nukes or WOMD,Not abideing by their wishs,and going ahead with this war will cause an international incident.
Iraq will not pull anything, as long as those inspectors are around.Whats the big hurry?
posted on January 29, 2003 06:31:09 PM new
Their choice? that's laughable! Choose to be inducted or watch your family die, if that's a choice....having said that, we fought children in Viet Nam...
posted on January 29, 2003 06:35:44 PM new
junquemama - The inspections will always continue to ask for more time. Always have, always will.
Bush didn't need to give Saddam this ONE LAST CHANCE [through the UN] to come clean and even the inspectors say he's playing games with them. And there's no requirement he wait.
You didn't read or hear all the violations Blix himself just gave? And this latest UN resolution said he was to declare. He didn't. Period. Chance up.
One reason we can't wait too long is the weather. It will soon be Iraq's summer. It gets very hot over there...extremely hot. Our soldiers will be wearing anti-bio gear. That's hot enough, but to wear it in extreme heat will make their job much harder on them. I don't want their job made harder....they're already putting their lives on the line. And while everybody is screaming for PROOF....I just hope that in trying to convince those demanding this PROOF our sources aren't put in danger. I hope Saddam doesn't find out what we know and move the weapons....thereby again putting our soldiers more at risk. [Thinking they're in one place and that not being the case.]
Editing to add: You do know Saddam agreed to disarm don't you? He's had 12 years to do so. But he hasn't done so. That's why I'm saying there is no reason to wait any more. Remember Iraq is about the size of CA. And there's what? 140 inspectors. Our intellegence tells us he's moving these weapons around.
I know I won't convince any one. I'm just trying to state why I'm supporting Bush in this war.
[ edited by Linda_K on Jan 29, 2003 06:41 PM ]
posted on January 29, 2003 06:41:50 PM new
JUNQUEMAMA, THE HURRY IS TO GET THIS OVER WITH AS SOON AS POSSIBLE, THE HEAT CAN BE ALMOST UNBEARABLE IN FULL GEAR DURING THE SUMMER.
posted on January 29, 2003 06:56:13 PM new
I dont think WE are hand in hand of putting the women and children in there. I think Saddam and other Iraqi's that have the same mindset as Saddam are giving those women and children no other choice. We all know how the womens rights are over there. They KILL their women at the drop of a hat. No sweat. So I think MOST of the women and children really dont have much say in the matter. "Train as soldier, or die now at OUR hands" sorta thing. Then again, I could be wrong. Sometimes smiles hide fear, so keep that in mind.
Helen, I feel badly for the animals over there, yes.
posted on January 29, 2003 07:14:24 PM new
Helen, as has been pointed out, I am not in favor of this war. I was answering the question of how our soldiers would be expected to deal with any child soldiers firing upon them. Censorship, like charity, should begin at home; but unlike charity, it should end there --Clare Booth Luce
posted on January 29, 2003 07:19:40 PM new
That's good to know, bunnicula!
Hepburn
Maybe my question about dogs was not clear.
When children are used as shields, for example, US soldiers will have a serious problem carrying out maneuvers without killing children. My question is would you, under those circumstances, where the life of the soldier was not in jeopardy, be in favor of following orders to drop cluster bombs on the children?
posted on January 29, 2003 07:25:05 PM new
No, it was not clear, because I have no clue what dogs and my charity with them have to do with a war in Iraq.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
You said:
Hepburn
Maybe my question about dogs was not clear.
When children are used as shields, for example, US soldiers will have a serious problem carrying out maneuvers without killing children. My question is would you, under those circumstances, where the life of the soldier was not in jeopardy, be in favor of following orders to drop cluster bombs on the children?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
No, I would not be in favor of dropping bombs on children. However, if soldiers lives ARE in jeopardy and they are being bombarded themselves with imminent death and its children that are doing it, yes. Sounds really bad, doesnt it? But I wont lie and say "no, because they are children". If it comes to our soldiers being killed due to their lack of wanting to kill a child that is trying to kill THEM, then I see no choice.
posted on January 29, 2003 07:47:04 PM new
LindaK,There is a reason the inspectors want more time,They want to complete the inspection.To tell them it doesnt matter any way,Why did they bother to send them in?
Somebody has to answer to the UN, after all it will be main leadership in the end.And they sure dont want to look like they are one sided in this war.
Ive heard of fair weather sailors,but never fair weather soldiers.I dont believe that is part of the hurry up process, because I think their weather is the opposite of our own.
We are monitoring
every move they make,By land and by sea and overhead.Any move made will be recorded.
I still see no hurry to war before the inspectors are thru.
posted on January 29, 2003 08:13:01 PM new
junquemama - I'm posting the url so you can read what was agreed to. Saddam is in breach of this agreement once again. And this same article also speaks to the temperatures reach 120 degrees and Bush's concern of this fact is mentioned in this article. That's pretty hot.
Why did we do this, you ask? Here's part of your answer. To show the world Bush was willing to give him one last chance to comply. And there were time restrictions mentioned.
When the resolution passed, John Negroponte, U.S. ambassador to the United Nations, said, "This resolution is designed to test Iraq's intentions." Bush also warned Iraqi President Saddam Hussein he must comply immediately. "His co-operation must be prompt and unconditional or he will face severest consequences."
The countdown to compliance began when the Security Council resolution passed on November 8, 2002.
--------------
Hep - If someone hasn't already answered. BRACKETS [b i url img] with / to end.
posted on January 29, 2003 08:54:04 PM new
LindaK,Giving another country a time frame doesnt mean Saddam hasnt met the compliance order,It means the inspectors havent found anything to charge him with.The inspectors asked for more time,I didnt,I ask what the hurry was.
Iraq is already confined,The people dont know it.
The weather is the issue,Really, I can understand that.Sounds like a done deal.
Now if Bush will drop the we want peace, jazz
its so superficial.
He will do what he wants,This is something we learned here,when he was Govener,He does what he wants.And doesnt care what others think.
There is no hurry.
posted on January 29, 2003 08:59:46 PM new
The search for weapons of mass destruction was just a charade. Most people know that Bush is just going through the motions in order to gain SOME semblance of propriety before pre emptive strikes on a country that has not bothered us in 12 years.
The battle is to gain access to oil and power which is located in Iraq. Bush wants to replace Saddam with some other thug who will follow his orders.
posted on January 29, 2003 09:05:17 PM new
junquemama = He's NOT contained at all. He's not allowing over head survellence. He's still firing at our [and the UKs] planes that were put there to protect the Kurds. He's not allowing his scientists to speak with UN inspectors ALONE. Nuclear information has been found by the UN in the scientists home. I could go on and on. FACT is he's in breach, once again, in many ways. I can't believe you haven't heard all the actual reports the inspectors have given.
They may ask for more time...but the point is Bush made it clear he wasn't going to be given very long.
AND It's not the inspectors job to FIND anything. Read the agreement. It's SADDAM'S requirement to produce ALL information. He didn't, and can't, even tell the inspectors where the items are they already KNOW he has.
Say what you will.....he's in breech and Bush is justified in going to war. The UN agreement spells it out quite clearly. Bush is not required to come back for their approval.
Good night.
[ edited by Linda_K on Jan 29, 2003 09:18 PM ]
posted on January 29, 2003 09:34:16 PM new
LindaK,Go back to the url you supplied me with earlier.Check the links out,The war with Iraq is all laid out there and has been sitting there one year.Now the Iraqs know they will be safe under a bridge.There are no surprizes.The no fly zone depends on who is in it,The Iraqies have their own air space,Do you really believe we will hear the truth? It will be the first time since our Country was formed,That we even hear any truth.There is people in the streets marching not to go to war.It hasnt got anything to do with what side of the political fence they are on.Most remember all the last wars,Some are vets,Some are our age,some remember George,Most remember the secrecey of our own Government against its own people.A whole bunch of them are young,Most are mothers and fathers.They dont deserve a handle like pro Saddam,or any other party insult.They want common sense used by our leaders,They want our problems fixed at home.They want their loved ones safe.
There is no hurry.
posted on January 29, 2003 10:35:54 PM new
I would much rather see Saddam, his family, and high cronies bow out of power in Iraq and Americans not step one single foot into that country, nor drop one bomb there, or shoot one bullet. Even doing so would bolster Bush's reputation as a statesman so dam far the heights will be dizzyingly sickening. But I'd rather that happen and America STAY OUT ALTOGETHER from Iraq.
posted on January 30, 2003 10:32:48 AM new
Bush is real busy keeping the American public eyes, away from what is going on here in our own Country.
We are in trouble here,and if some people dont wake up to that fact soon.....They will
lose "more" then any war overseas.
We are being kept in a state of fear on purpose.
We havent even gone to war with Iraq,So Bush insulted N. Korea and Iran in his speech,knowing full well,They will not sit back and be accussed of blackmail and other crimes for the world to judge.
I believe it nice to help the Africans with cheap drugs for aids,However all the aids programs have been cut in our country,And anyone sick will now have to die from lack of medications.If you were to ask the Africans what they need first,They would say "Food"So lets make them healthy or keep them alive so they can starve to death.
Bush also told people to volunteer to be mentors and help your neighbors.That means medicade,medicare and State programs are in the tolit.
When Bush spoke of Doctors who are being sued and spoke of a lady Doctor,Who laminated
over the fact she couldnt practice medicine because of all those lawsuits!..I dont know about you,But I wouldnt want a Dr. to touch me with that kind of background.Those are not frivolous lawsuits,someone almost died.What Bush, is telling us he is trying to cap all lawsuits.
I have learned double speak in our world.
posted on January 30, 2003 11:36:41 AM new
Good post, junquemama!!!
Behind every move that George Bush makes is a self serving agenda while the American people are being deceived and used.
Only a few months ago, he refused to help the people in Africa. Now all of a sudden he is offering a seemingly gratuitous amount of money for aids drugs which is really made in an effort to make himself appear human.
You can go through the speech, sentence by sentence and find an ulterior motive in each one. His vow to improve Medicare and Medicade was interesting because he didn't say HOW.
Remember that just last week, it was announced that old people would be kicked out of nursing homes and mental facilities.
George Bush is making NO effort to use diplomacy and Tony Blair is the only world leader that is really backing his wild and crazy plans. Blair follows him around like a little puppy dog..
From Blair's announcement...
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Tony Blair today pledged that after dealing with Iraq, the UN would confront North Korea about its nuclear weapons programme.
The prime minister was giving an impassioned defence of the government's position on Iraq during his weekly question time when an anti-war MP shouted: "Who's next?"
Replying to the heckle, Mr Blair said: "After we deal with Iraq we do, yes, through the UN, have to confront North Korea about its weapons programme".
"We have to confront those companies and individuals trading in weapons of mass destruction," he added.
To another cry of "When do we stop?", Mr Blair answered: "We stop when the threat to our security is properly and fully dealt with."
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In other words, there is no end as long as George Bush is in office.
posted on January 30, 2003 12:01:01 PM new
Helen,....I also want to know the about all those jobs,that will be created by tax cuts.Talk about pulling a rabbit out of a hat.
Those companys that have moved overseas, are not coming back,The tax breaks were already in place when they left.So now everything hinges on new startups.
All I see daily, is 1000s of jobs being cut.
It's not the inspectors job to FIND anything. Read the agreement. It's SADDAM'S requirement to produce ALL information. He didn't, and can't, even tell the inspectors where the items are they already KNOW he has.
