posted on February 20, 2003 09:48:02 AM new
DURHAM, N.C. - A 17-year-old girl who received a heart and lungs that didn't match her blood type was returned to surgery Thursday morning after new, matching organs were found.
Jesica Santillan, who had been clinging to life after the botched operation, was undergoing organ transplant surgery for a second time at Duke University Hospital. The operation began around 6 a.m., according to a hospital spokeswoman who declined to give further details or give her name.
The procedure has a 50-50 success rate, said Mack Mahoney, a leader in fund-raising efforts to pay for the girl's medical bills.
"Thank you for helping the world hear my plea for this child's life," he told reporters at a news conference across the street from the hospital where doctors were working on the girl.
He said he did not know where the new organs had come from. He said doctors told the family at a meeting at about 12:30 a.m. that the replacement organs had been found.
Her family was in "just a state of relief" Thursday morning, Mahoney said.
"She is barely hanging on. She is a very, very, very sick little girl and she couldn't have gone another day," he said.
Even if the second operation is a success, he said, Jesica could still have other medical problems as a result of the failed first transplant. A scan Wednesday had found no signs of brain damage, McCormick said.
Renee McCormick, another spokeswoman for the charity, said the new organs were an "incredibly good match." She had initially said the organs were donated directly to Jesica, but later said she was mistaken.
"We have no information about the donor whatsoever," she said. "Hopefully, the donor family will come forward and we can get these families reunited at some point in time."
Jesica, who is from a small town near Guadalajara, Mexico, mistakenly received organs incompatible with her type O-positive blood during the first transplant Feb. 7. She needed the transplant because a heart deformity kept her lungs from getting oxygen into her blood. Doctors said she would have died within six months without a transplant.
But her condition steadily deteriorated after the wrong blood type organs were transplanted. She suffered a heart attack Feb. 10 and a seizure on Sunday.
Jesica's body was rejecting the new organs because of the different blood types. Antibodies in her blood attacked the organs as foreign objects.
The lead surgeon said Wednesday he believed appropriate checks were made before the organs were offered to the girl.
"I am heartbroken about what happened to Jesica. My focus has been on providing her with the heart and lungs she needs so she could lead a normal life," Dr. James Jaggers said in a statement.
The organs were flown from Boston to Durham and included paperwork correctly listing the donor's type-A blood, said Sean Fitzpatrick of the New England Organ Bank of Newton, Mass., which sent the first set of heart and lungs.
Two Duke surgeons who had patients with type-A positive blood declined the organs but a third doctor requested them for Jesica, according to Carolina Donor Services, an organ procurement organization. The organization did not identify the doctor.
Duke hospital officials had no comment Wednesday on why doctors sought the type-A organs for Jesica.
Jesica's parents paid an immigrant smuggler to get the family into the United States from Mexico three years ago, in part for the better odds of landing a transplant for Jesica.
"I said I was putting my daughter in God's hands, but it turned out the doctors made a big mistake," the teen's mother, Magdalena Santillan, said through a translator Tuesday.
Duke started its organ transplant program in 1965. The university performed its first combined heart-lung transplant in 1992 and has done 20 such operations, the university said.
posted on February 21, 2003 06:45:36 PM new
::* When resources are scarce, as the supply of voluntarily donated organs notoriously are, why shouldn't U.S. citizens get top priority?::
Does that mean the US citizens cannot benefit from donations from illegal aliens?
::Finally, if Jesica recovers from the second heart-lung transplant, will any federal immigration authority have the guts to enforce the law and send her and her family back home to Mexico?::
While we do know that they were smuggled across, we do not know if they are still under illegal status. I would be very surprised if the gentleman that has done so much to help the family raise the neccessary funds had not also assisted them in applying for citizenship.
::In all likelihood, taxpayers will be on the hook for Santillan's post-operative care one way or another. ::
In all likelihood, Duke, her doctors, and their malpractice insurance carrier will be covering all medical expenses for the rest of her life considering the rather astounding mistake made.
::Scripps Memorial Hospital in San Diego was forced to close after losing more than $5 million a year in unreimbursed medical care, much of it for illegal immigrants,::
Scripps closed the doors of its East County branch because of rising costs across the board, sky high cost of retrofitting its numerous San Diego locations and the fact that East County had the lowest patient load.
::In a world of scarce resources, compassion must have limits. We cannot afford to be a medical welcome mat to the world. ::
We get to be its ruler but can't expect to be its savior? You can't have your cake and eat it too. If we are going to try to rule the world, we have to heal it too.
posted on February 22, 2003 08:52:57 AM new
This tragic catastrophe is a prime example why we need to enforce our immigration laws... these people maybe going back to Mexico, but not before they receive some hefty monetary compensation for what happend to their daughter...
Duke University was in a tough spot, how do you refuse health care... you can't nor should they be allowed to, however there needs to be something in place to cover circumstances of this nature... Illegals should not be allowed to profit.
On the other hand had the first operation been a success, then all this would never of been known and Duke University would of been heros... Some days your the windshield, some days the bug...
posted on February 22, 2003 09:25:15 AM new
:: Duke University was in a tough spot, how do you refuse health care... you can't nor should they be allowed to, however there needs to be something in place to cover circumstances of this nature... Illegals should not be allowed to profit. ::
Duke University is a hospital, not the INS. If a person can pay the fees, they should be treated. The family was lucky enough to have caught the hearts of many in the community and raised the funds to pay for the surgery just as an other patient.
Does an individual lose the right to recieve competant care as paid for simply because they are not a legal resident?
One more thing - we do not know their current immigration status, people are assuming that because they entered illegally that they still have undocumented status but It's very possible (considering the level of publicity around this family and fund raising efforts its actually quite probable) that they are among the masses stuck in the INS backlog.
posted on February 22, 2003 01:15:18 PM new
Duke nor any other hospital is under no obligation to treat non-emergenicies of illegal aliens. While Duke is not the INS, neither is Duke the police, so if someone is raped or murdered at the hospital they should just keep quiet about it and not notify the authorities ?
It is not only a matter of the money. The organs were also a resource that can not be replaced and there are thousands of citizens and legal aliens waiting for organs. I have yet to hear of illegal aliens donating organs, or having a driver's license or other documents allowing donation of organs.
In an ideal world it would be wonderful if there were no borders, geographical or otherwise. But the truth is that illegal aliens are sapping public resources and filling prisons.
No country in history has failed to control its borders and survived.
posted on February 22, 2003 01:38:02 PM new
REAMOND,
Amen to everything you just said.
We've got to enforce the borders, that's where it all starts. Just asking for too many problems otherwise.
Then, start solving the internal problems, which we all know are there...I am mainly speaking of the terrorists that are here.
I don't want a police state, but there has to be a "happy medium" over the laxness of the past.
posted on February 22, 2003 02:14:09 PM new
The number of ethical issues involved in the transplant field are mind boggling.
I can understand why parents would enter this country illegally to possibly obtain what is supposed to be a life saving transplant for a child. Wouldn't most people do the same?
Since this kind of illegal border crossing cannot be humanely enforced, maybe other options should be considered. I don't know if there is any cooperation between Mexico and the U.S. on this issue. If there is not, we could increase the number of organs available to both countries by encouraging organ donations from Mexico.
Whatever the nationality of the recipient, I am sorry for this girl and her family and of course for the patients who may have lost the opportunity for a timely transplant because of medical error. According to a CNN report, the second set of organs may be used again.
posted on February 22, 2003 03:28:28 PM new
It was a tragedy all the way around in this case. And certainly, the physician really screwed up, to say the least.
I'm just afraid that someday we're going to kill the goose that lays the golden eggs and then we'll all be crying. I guess we can all cross into Canada for free health care. Do ya think they'd go for that?
posted on February 22, 2003 03:29:11 PM new
:: Duke nor any other hospital is under no obligation to treat non-emergenicies of illegal aliens. While Duke is not the INS, neither is Duke the police, so if someone is raped or murdered at the hospital they should just keep quiet about it and not notify the authorities ? ::
1) Again you have assumed that they have not registered and applied for citizenship.
2) Hypocratic oath - they are a medical facility, not a government agaency and are morally bound to give treatment. especially is patient has funding.
::It is not only a matter of the money. The organs were also a resource that can not be replaced and there are thousands of citizens and legal aliens waiting for organs. I have yet to hear of illegal aliens donating organs::
You may have never heard of it but have you even looked? Donor identities are kept confidential unless fthe family deems otherwise and then info is given only to recipient family.
:: or having a driver's license or other documents allowing donation of organs.::
I personally have know 3 illegal aliens with drivers licenses, besides, you don't NEED documentation, in fact the little mark on your license really means very little. They need release from a family member.
:: But the truth is that illegal aliens are sapping public resources and filling prisons. ::
You know, we could ship them home instead. If the prison systems are over burdened wiith illegals, all they need to do is load up a few planes. You can't complain about the cost of housing them when you have chosen to do it.
[ edited by neonmania on Feb 22, 2003 03:29 PM ]
posted on February 22, 2003 03:39:34 PM new
::Since this kind of illegal border crossing cannot be humanely enforced, maybe other options should be considered. I don't know if there is any cooperation between Mexico and the U.S. on this issue. If there is not, we could increase the number of organs available to both countries by encouraging organ donations from Mexico. ::
There is but it's getting a little tricky. The "Dos Marias" from Guadalajara are the most public recent example. They are the conjoined twins that doctors in LA seperated. The twins and parents were given temp visas to enter for medical cause.
The otherside of the story is a group that perform corrective plastic surgeries on underprivledged kids from Mexico in San Diego. All services are free and until recently there have been no problem but the last time the group sponsored an "event" there were numerous INS problems. INS ended up letting the kids across alone without their parents but in the custody of representaives of the charity group but informed them that next time all kids must be accompanied by a parent and all parents and kids must pass security and background checks ... which there is a HUGE backlog on. INS has acknowledge that this is one of the fields were exceptions and changes need to made but have offered no solution yet.
posted on February 22, 2003 04:06:42 PM new
She passed away today when officials removeher from life support. I have t o say that I have one serious moral disagreement with this case and it lies in what happened after her death...
::The Santillan family declined to donate any organs from Jesica's body, Puff said.::
For a family that benefitted greatly from the generosity of others, I believe that this action is unforgivable and inexcuseable.
posted on February 22, 2003 06:58:22 PM new
You're flat wrong. No medical provider is required to give care by their "oath". The US medical system is a fee for service capitalist system.
The only way a medical care giver would be required to give non-emergency care is via contract or government regulation tied to funding. Emergency care also depends on the hospital charter and if they collect any government funding. A private hospital emergency room may only be required to stabilize the patient and then remove them to a tax payer supported hospital.
If it were the case that physicians were required to render care to anyone that asked, there would be no need to carry insurance, as the care would be delivered regardless of ability to pay.
posted on February 22, 2003 07:20:35 PM new
:: You're flat wrong. ::
On the contrary you either flat out can't read, have serious comprehesion problems or just enjoy subsituting my words for ones that it is easier to disagree with.
::No medical provider is required to give care by their "oath". The US medical system is a fee for service capitalist system.::
When did I say required - I said MORALLY BOUND - Did you miss that part?
Also Maybe you were unaware that they had the funds. There was a great deal of fund rasing on her behalf including the prceeds from the sale of a house built with donated materials and labor.
posted on February 22, 2003 07:31:17 PM new
Right, Reamond
The hypocratic oath does not guarantee help when a patient has no money except in the case of an emergency.
Non emergency medical care for free???? It cost thousands just to get your name on the list. Unless you have very good insurance or money, you're out of luck if you need a transplant.
First, it will cost thousands just to get your name on the waiting list. Then the operation and special care for a few years after the transplant.
Without substantial funds, you are out of luck.
Helen
[ edited by Helenjw on Feb 22, 2003 07:31 PM ]
posted on February 22, 2003 08:41:53 PM new
neonmania, you said,
"2) Hypocratic oath - they are a medical facility, not a government agaency and are morally bound to give treatment. especially is patient has funding."
The relevance of the remark above was confusing. I just clarified it....no problem.
posted on February 22, 2003 11:25:21 PM new2) Hypocratic oath - they are a medical facility, not a government agaency and are morally bound to give treatment. especially is patient has funding
There is nothing in the oath that states they must give service to anyone whether they have money or not. The oath demands confidentially, don't diddle your patients, and to do no harm.
Doctors are not morally/ethically bound to give service to anyone they do not choose to. A doctor that does things in his/her professional role that are unethical can lose their license and face other liability.
Medical professional morals as opposed to common morals are enforceable by the governemnt and its licensing bodies.
You mistakenly labor under the impression that a physician's moral code in voluntary, and it is not. The Hippocratic Oath is not part of the physicians ethical code of conduct, but usually administered, if at all, by the medical school. Certain elements of the code are incorporated into professional moral codes, such as confidentially, and having sex with patients.
But treating anyone who demands or asks for treatment is part of no medical ethics code or oath.
The Hippocratic Oath
I swear by Apollo the physician, by Aesculapius, and Health, and All-heal, and all the gods and goddesses, that according to my ability and my judgement, I will keep this Oath and this stipulation--to reckon him who taught me this Art equally dear to me as my parents, to share my substance with him, and relieve his necessities if required; to look upon his offspring in the same footing as my own brothers, and to teach them this Art, if they wish to learn it, without fee or stipulation; and that by precept, lecture, and every mode of instruction, I will impart a knowledge of the Art to my own sons, and of my teachers, and to disciples bound by a stipulation and oath according to the law of medicine, but to none others.
I will follow that system or regimen which, according to my ability and judgement, I consider for the benefit of my patients, and abstain from whatever is deleterious and mischievous.
I will give no deadly medicine to any one if asked, nor suggest any such counsel; and in like manner I will not give to a woman a pessary to produce abortion.
With purity and with holiness I will pass my life and practice my Art. I will not cut persons labouring under the stone, but will leave this to be done by men who are practitioners of this work. Into whatever houses I enter, I will go into them for the benefit of the sick, and will abstain from every voluntary act of mischief and corruption; and, further, from the seduction of females or males, of freemen and slaves.
Whatever, in connection with my professional service, or not in connection with it, I see or hear, in the life of men, which ought not to be spoken of abroad, I will not divulge, as reckoning that all such should be kept secret.
While I continue to keep this Oath unviolated, may it be granted to me to enjoy life and the practice of the Art, respected by all men, in all times. But should I trespass and violate this Oath, may the reverse be my lot.
posted on February 22, 2003 11:42:32 PM new
OK - FIne I give up. We can rule the world. Take advantage of depressed economies to stregnthen our own. Decide who can and cannot protect themselves. Decide who is and is not lying and when and invade at will and thru it all - owe them nothing.
How ever did I forget that the wold and its people exist just to please and serve us and when it comes time to dole out those little bits of common human decency that we claim make us so different from the others - you damn well better fit into our strictly inclusive window of opportunity or you are screwed.
If you are not a white american citizen insured to your teeth with influencial friends you damn well better hope that you never get sick. Because some fellow loving individual will surely decide that you had the misfortune of being born on the wrong piece of land, with the wrong color skin or to the wrong set of parents to be allowed to live.
I'm sorry but that is a crap attitude and one born of people that find entitlement because they were lucky enough to be born here rather than gratitude.
posted on February 22, 2003 11:43:45 PM newBut as other media outlets have more accurately and honestly detailed, Santillan's family didn't just "move" here. They came here illegally by paying a coyote $5,000 to smuggle Santillan and her mother across the border for the express purpose of obtaining medical care and circumventing long wait times in Mexico
I don't care what paper work they filled out or what their current status is. The fact is that came into the country illegally.
Even if they have paper work pending they still jumped ahead of the line of those who made legal application in their home country.
The reason the US had to stop emptying the prisons of Mexican illegals is because they come back and commit more crimes and murders. Angel Resendiz aka "the Railway killer", illegally entered the US many times. He was arrested at least 25 times and deported while illegally in the US, at least 9 times for serious felonies.
He is now on death row for a series of murders in the US. He is just one of the many criminals that cross the border daily.
Why would the Mexican government pay to jail them when they know that they will just come back to the US and we can foot the bill ? The Mexican government would do what Castro did if they thought the press would keep quiet about it.
posted on February 22, 2003 11:56:00 PM new
Where do you get that we "rule" the world ? We have "interests" in international events just as any other country does. But if "we" actually ruled the world it would be a h&ll of alot different than it is.
"Luck" of birth has nothing to do with rights, priveleges, and OBLIGATIONS of citizenship.
You, as many others, wish to extract every last ounce of goodwill the people of America have, even when it is to the citizens' clear detriment.
You will attempt to shame Americans, but remain silent and effortless when it comes to taking to task the Mexican people and their government to improve their own lot.
You are quick to find fault with every position regarding the illegal aliens concerning their machinations in the US, but are silent about the corruption, greed, and total LACK of goodwill of the Mexican government and the people of Mexico.
If you want to preach, go to Mexico, they need it far worse than Americans do.
posted on February 23, 2003 05:46:12 AM new
Reamond, Bones, nice posts...seems you both understand very well some of the ills of the INS and that we need to tighten the border up.
Neonmania, how do you know that none of the doctors that operated weren't Black? or Latino themselves?
Your statement about "white" american citizens is unfounded at best and laughable at most... the only word that matters here is CITIZEN. Having lived in San Diego myself for over 10 years (not currently), you can see how illegal immigration does effect the economy and social infratructure of the area.
