posted on February 17, 2001 11:35:35 AM new
Paypal restricting people for inquiring about their accounts?? geez
[ edited by auctionqueenie on Feb 23, 2001 09:37 AM ]
posted on February 17, 2001 06:31:29 PM new
HI.. I AM A SELLER MAINLY BUT I BUY ON EBAY ALSO.. I QUIT PAY PAL.. AFTER I HAD TO FILE A FRAUD CLAIM ON A VERIFIED PREMIER MEMBER FOR 189.00 AND AFTER 4 MONTHS AND ALL THE PAPER WORK I DID THEY FINALLY EMAILED ME AND TOLD ME THE TRUTH .. YOU HAVE NO PROTECTION AT ALL... WE WONT COVER IT AND TOUGH LUCK BASICLLY THEY ARE LIARS AND ALSO I GOT A 750.00 CHARGEBACK FROM A BUYER THAT USED A STOLDEN CARD... PAY PAL NEVER REPLY'S TO EMAILS AND I AM TELLING EVERYONE I KNOW TO BEWARE.. PERSONAL FRIENDS AND SELLERS I KNOW HAVE QUIT PAY PAL AFTER THEY HEARD ABOUT MY PROBLEMS.. AND I ONLY USE BILLPOINT RIGHT NOW.. THEY GIVE ME NO TROUBLE ... PAY PAL IS A BUNCH OF SCAMMERS AS FAR AS I AM CONCERNED.. THEY WANT OUR MONEY AND THEY NEVER PAID ME FOR THE 5.00 REFFERRALS I WAS A VERIFIED BUSSINESS PREMIER MEMBER AND HAVENT GOT A REFFERAL IN MANY MONTHS OVER 6 TO BE EXACT... TO ALL THAT READ THIS STAY AWAY FROM PAY PAL... THEY CANT LAST TOO MUCH LONGER THE WORD IS OUT..
I'm sorry but your post has been deleted because it contained a link to a competing site, which is a violation of the Community Guidelines. You may post again but please omit the url.
posted on February 22, 2001 05:12:28 AM new
My husband an I are victims of PayPal's deplorable tactics to steal money from innocents. They have frozen both our accounts, will not address our issues of concern, explain what is wrong and now they refuse to answer emails unless we fax them with driver's licenses, CC statements and a copy of their email.
What is really sad is that this company is trying to force us to disclose more personal indentification with out explaining a thing. The basic personalized automated reply is a simple, 'we request... and until we get it... you get nothing, not even an email'. Under legal and professial advice from people who work with security in this realm, I send them nothing but did write and demand a release of our accounts, or checks to be cut for the remaining balances. I further requested they remove all our personal data and provide me proof of this request.
Less then 24 hrs I once again received an automated response..*rolling eyes*. Well BBB has heard from me I guess the next move is to contact FTC and a all the Consumer's groups I can find and all the links provided here.
We are up for a class action suit with the rest of you if that is what it takes. Unfortunately we are still in Europe at this time but arrangements can be made to be present.
posted on February 22, 2001 12:01:50 PM new
Hi pks,
I believe I had seen your complaint in another forum and I passed along the concerns to the account review department so that they can explain the need for additional information.
posted on February 23, 2001 04:16:36 AM new
If reading the negative Paypal posts upsets you go to this story about PayPal! http://www.salon.com/tech/feature/2001/02/23/pay_pal/index.html
posted on February 23, 2001 05:15:59 AM new
well do i feel stupid now.. I thought i was the only one having trouble with paypal (& ebay).. I see now my troubles are minor compared to most everyones here. Mine doesn't have to do with Frozen accounts.. It has to do with Lies in regards to Paypal telling me that i would be getting my money refunded. Money that was stolen from a man & woman team scamming people on ebay. I know its a man & woman team because the FBI & US Postal Inspectors have nailed them, after ebay let them go long enough to steal from hundreds of people (& i mean hundreds). I paid thru paypal & i sent the money to a verified user. After about two months i finally got a letter from someone at paypal (I still have it) saying that they have reviewed my claim & i would be getting the money put back into my account. I think Great.. My 11 year old son will get his money back. so i wait.. ANOTHER 2.5 months go by & i get another letter. "We have revied your claim & decided you do qualify for a refund.. BUT.. We need you now to jump thru more hoops for us. Make copies of utility bills, Drivers Licenses, & Sign the afidavit (I did that one already) & mail it to us. I'm waiting almost 5 months for a louzy $31.85 & all they had to do was to put it back in my account. It came from there! They had no trouble taking it out, so why do they need my D.L. Coies of utility bills, & me to sign another afidavit? I feel they are just hoping i go away. I don't think i'd be this angry if they had said this in the first letter (2.5 MONTHS AGO!).. The person who defrauded me & the others is going to prison. I see from all the backlash here & a couple other places, maybe someday the owner of paypal will be spending some time behind bars.. All its going to take is for them to piss off the right person.
Ebay is a little smarter in the respect that they don't say anything. Lloydes of London has not said, nor done a thing. In affect, biding their time hoping i croak or something..
[ edited by call1 on Feb 23, 2001 05:26 AM ]
posted on February 23, 2001 08:26:31 AM new
Hi paypaldamon,
Yes I am sure you have seen it....so will quite a few more if something is not resolved and we don't hear from a real person that we may have our money and close the accounts.
I am thoroughly appalled at the treatment I have received. The final straw was an open statement that if I do not provide them with more proof of "who I am" they will not even acknowledge my email, or that I am alive.yet if I had questions directly relating to this matter please contact them. Well I have been ignored for almost a month until I recieved the origional 'recycled' automated e-mail. I am not impressed, nor am I pleased.
The refusal of a company I am supposed to trust, not to be upfront/honest with me has dissolved any trust that I had. This is a shame as I am actively involved with a few NPO's that utilize PayPal and I will definitely be willing to tell them what is happening with me. I haven't done so before now as I figured it was just a small internal glitch...however, I begin to see things much differently the longer I am ignored.
Not a very plesant way to start off my new life across the big pond!
posted on February 23, 2001 08:46:02 AM new
penfreak,
whoa..now that article has some pretty sound facts in there. One thing that certainly does ring true and MUST explain the piss poor customer service is....(and I quote this from Jim McCoy)..
""Customer support costs will eat you alive," he says. They pose the greatest threat to any bottom line so "the less you have to get involved in customer disputes, the better off you are,""
This is a MUST READ article for everyone dealing with PainPal.
posted on February 23, 2001 10:48:12 AM new
I just got off the phone with one of the Senators in my State... Topic of Conversation? Paypal & Companies like em. I'm usually not one to be yelling "Federal Regulation" But in this case i'll be the first one in line to help draft em up, go to the hearings to see how paypal tries to worm their way out of it, & i can't wait to plaster that article up where mr whats his face Admits the way to handle complaints of consumers to is avoid them or they'll eat you up.. You'd think they'd want happy customers, & not the pissed off ones. Espically when theres so many of them.
I didn't realize until this morning that the club we belong too was so large. Paypal can't be that blind. I know i didn't get nailed for as much as most of you, but if theres a suit, i want it, PLEEEEASE?!
[ edited by call1 on Feb 23, 2001 10:50 AM ]
posted on February 23, 2001 04:40:44 PM new
Plz remove your reply post paypaldameon,
If auction watch will not allow my original post to remain as I wrote it there is no need for you to reply.
Sincerely,
Todd Sumrall
Authorize.net & Miva Partner
http://Merchant-Solution.com
http://Canada-Merchant-Accounts.com
Providing merchant accounts and web hosting for both Americans and Canadians
posted on February 23, 2001 04:45:15 PM new
Hi toddsummrall,
The issues you mentioned needed a response and this thread is dedicated to PayPal issues. I will correct information that is incorrect or offer an explanation for policy issues for the benefit of all users.
posted on February 23, 2001 04:48:05 PM new
Hi PD,
My post was removed and now you have replied only to a part of the entire post and thus readers do not know the entirety of the original post. Therefore I do not see the need for you to reply to something that has been removed.
Sincerely,
Todd Sumrall
Authorize.net & Miva Partner
http://Merchant-Solution.com
http://Canada-Merchant-Accounts.com
Providing merchant accounts and web hosting for both Americans and Canadians
[ edited by toddsumrall on Feb 23, 2001 04:59 PM ]
posted on February 23, 2001 05:06:23 PM new
In response to paypaldamon's previous statement.
(Accounts are rarely frozen unless there are very specific instances in a violation of one or more of our terms of use. This can be viewed by all users on the web site... Users that have their account restricted have an email sent to them advising of what the appeals process is and what kind of information is needed to unrestrict the account. The response to the receipt of fraudulent funds is to isolate the transaction in question and not the entire seller account unless there is a clear problem evident in the recipient's account)
I did not get any information of why my account was restricted, only the following:
Your account was restricted for administrative purposes. In order
to lift this restriction, you must contact the PayPal Account Review
Department by replying this email.
Thank you,
PayPal Account Review Department
I replied to this e-mail, plus after not hearing anything after a few days went into my account and went through their process from there, and still nothing from them, not even an acknowledgement.
Also, really irks me that I cannot have access to my monies, but I do have the privilage of adding to it and still be able to have others send me money!!!???? Who does that benefit?
posted on February 24, 2001 10:51:53 AM new
E-Gold was apparently upset with the way PayPal's founder portrayed E-Gold -- as a haven for money laundering. Here is E-gold's response:
posted on February 25, 2001 09:52:13 AM new
I can't find in paypal where to try to get your money back if a seller ripped you off. Anyone know anything about this??
posted on February 25, 2001 02:40:05 PM new
well, It's quite obvious that [Damon Billian] paypaldamon's job is PR. And I know he is doing his best to do his job. Ain't nothing wrong with that except I have not heard of anyone whose problem was resolved by paypaldamon or with his assistance. I know mine hasn't been. I only waisted more of my valuable time attempting to get one simple question answered: why was my account restricted. Well, actually, one reason was offered: "because of a "bad IP".
I quote: "A bad ip typically happens if there is a problem from the point you are using the system. Do you share a computer with anyone or work?"
this is the craziest explanation I have ever heard. Is this a sufficient reason to restrict someone's access to their money?
by the way my reply to that last message was ignored and that was the end of his involvement.
Here is another example: I tried to establish contact with Elizebeth Alejo, Senior Fraud Manager whose contact information I saw in this forum. She replied to my email: "Please feel free to call me at 650-251-1127 to discuss your account in more detail. "
I called about 10 times to no avail. I have left messages. Perhaps she went on vacation right after sending me that message? I don't think so. Why? - because it's the same story with everyone at paypal fraud department and everyone in their customer service department (whose managers by the way, aparently routinely have all day meetings. All at the same time too It would have been funny except it isn't)
In my attempts at communication with paypal, I have come to conclusion that their policy is:
1. If you receive two questions - answer the one that's least important
1.2. If you must reply - make sure the recepient can't make any sense out of that reply.
2. If you receive only one question - answer that question with another question.
3. If you cannot answer the question with a question - forward the email to someone else.
4. If someone is really bugging you - ignore him. The problem will go away by itself. These people will just give up their money without a fight. Customers are just silly, really.
posted on February 25, 2001 03:50:37 PM new
In response to RatCat. I went to the link you provided and found the following to be very disturbing:
"Once you allow PayPal to make a deposit into your account, you also allow them to make withdrawals. PayPal has reversed deposits made even months before. So anytime you accept a PayPal deposit, you will have 4 or 5 months of worrying if it will be taken back."
Can you or someone else explain how they (PayPal) can do this??? I have been able to have different companies, etc. make deposits into my account, but did not know they could withdraw monies unless they had my access information such as pin numbers or such??.....Toni
posted on February 25, 2001 05:16:43 PM new
>>In response to RatCat. I went to the link you provided and found the following to be very disturbing:
>>"Once you allow PayPal to make a deposit into your account, you also allow them to make withdrawals. PayPal has reversed deposits made even months before. So anytime you accept a PayPal deposit, you will have 4 or 5 months of worrying if it will be taken back."
I have to be clear and say that I never said this, and I don't know where this information came from!
The link that I provided didn't say anything about this.
[ edited by RatCat on Feb 25, 2001 05:19 PM ]
posted on February 25, 2001 09:10:34 PM new
Yes Toni.. The answer if real simple. The way i see it is Paypal is not bound by Banking Laws or Regulations. They can make up any rule of their own, anytime they get a whim & because you agreed to their TOS theres not a damn thing you can do about it.
I see the future for paypal & its not rosey. One day everyones going to wake up & your going to go to your paypal accounts only to find all of them locked out. Paypal's owners will have taken all the money & ran, while at the same time declaring Bankrupcy with everyones cash. I wonder where all that money goes when its taken for its rightful owners? $20,000 here & $20,000 there adds up quick. Theres no FDIC Coverage so everyone who put their faith it paypal loses everything with No recourse to get their monies back.
It took me 5 months to figure out what Paypal was about & i should have figured it out when they started hounding me to upgrade my Indivisual/ Personal Account to a Business/ Primium Account. I finally did it so i could quit getting those dumb pushy start pages that would block me from getting into my account so i could read their sales pitches. I hope not too many others fell for it.
I'm hoping by removing my Banking & Credit Card Information i'm done with any dealings with PP, but i have a feeling i still have things i should be worried about regarding them being able to remove money from my accounts.
[ edited by call1 on Feb 26, 2001 12:03 AM ]
posted on February 26, 2001 06:30:38 AM new
tfeeny: YES, THAT IS CORRECT!! This is one of the many crooked things they did to us!! FIVE MONTHS after a sale! A customer sends us funds for some products. We then send out all the products to them (as usual). They RECEIVE the products. Done deal..end of story, right?? WRONG!!! FIVE MONTHS later, the paypal morons wait, then tell me that those funds received were "fraudulent"! TUFF!! THAT'S NOT MY PROBLEM, IT'S THEIRS!!! So, they ask for name, address, products, shipping info (carrier, #, etc), and expect US to STILL have that AFTER FIVE &$%#@ MONTHS!!! Well we did not. I don't know of any other small company that will keep this type of info five months after the fact! Since we could not supply it, the account was disabled!! But oh no, not totally disabled, they just made it to where customers could still SEND US funds, but we could not withdraw them!! And, that's exactly what happened! Read on..
Due to several other 'thefts' from my PP account (yes, they stole funds FROM my account on numerous occasions), I made sure to keep it at ZERO at this time in question. (Even IF I still would have had this information from this five month old transaction, I WOULD NOT have supplied it Due to the way I have been treated, and hey, who the hell would want to cooperate with a company that has stolen funds from you several times!!) Since it was at zero, it was then in the MINUS...that's NEGATIVE figures of several hundred bucks after this five month old problem was FINALLY discovered by them!! So, all funds sent to us after that, THEY KEPT THEM and we still had to ship out the merchandise to the paying customers, even though we never received a CENT for ANY of them!!! This all happened in a period of a day or so, so when we realized this, I then removed ALL of PP's webaccept info from our website and told customers to NOT send us funds via paypal under any circumstances, or they would loose their money and NOT get the products. This is only ONE of my PP horror stories above.
These people are the MOST incompetent, thieving moronic JERKS I have EVER seen in my life. They are NOT fraud protected as you can now see. That's a outright LIE. They WILL STEAL from you as I think we all now know. They will blame YOU for their incompetence and lack of security & verification problems!! They will blame YOU when someone sends you 'fraudulent funds' and expect YOU to take the blame for it...expect YOU to pay for it, even clearly when they are the ONLY party to blame for all these screw-ups!!! They make it a "DUTY", to blame their members for their (paypal's) out right incompetence and stupidity.
God help us all if this is the way of the future for the internet!! This WILL be it's undoing and will contribute to it's demise if this is it's future. We must all ban together to put an end to this..... this "company" and see to it that no others are victimized they way THOUSANDS have already been victimized. They stole from the wrong person when they stole from ME!!!
Clint Hamilton http://orpheuscomputing.com [email protected]
posted on February 26, 2001 05:19:41 PM new
LETS SUE THESE PEOPLE, I'M OUT WITH ABOUT $5,000, I'M WILLING TO PUT $2,500 FOR A LAWYER RIGHT AWAY IF I CAN SUE THEIR ASS OFF !!! MY EMAIL IS [email protected] , IF WE GET TOGETHER WE CAN FIND A DECENT LAWYER AND IT MIGHT BE FREE !!! I TALKED WITH ONE ALREADY AND IF WE GET TOGETHER AND FIND ENOUGH PROOF ABOUT THEIR FRAUDELENT BUSINESS WE CAN PUT THEM OUT OF BUSINESS !!!
AGAIN, MY EMAIL IS [email protected] , LET ME KNOW IF THERE IS ALREADY CLASS ACTION OR GROUP THAT WORKS ON THIS PROBLEM !!!
posted on February 26, 2001 08:18:33 PM new
I am not a PayPal user (although I have been contemplating it) and all these problems from fraud concern me.
However...as online sellers aren't we at risk just as retail store sellers are when people purchase items with a stolen credit card?
When my card was stolen on vacation overseas the thieves purchased about $2,000 in automotive equipment before I could even cancel the card. I was not responsible for the charges. But the thieves got merchandise. So who suffered. I would assume the merchant did and that the credit card company did not pay the merchant.
Does anyone know if this is how it works? I realize it would be upsetting if this happened to anyone but I'm not sure if I would blame PayPal for all the problems. And whining here about having to provide PP with proof of identification when they are investigating fraud seems a little unreasonable.
Fraud is going to be a problem for any online credit payment system. Have you found any other methods to be more adept at handling and resolving fraud cases?
posted on February 28, 2001 09:11:13 AM new
I can't say thank you enough for everyone that has taken the time to let others know what they've been experiencing with Paypal, and similiar places. I've been very successful with them since day one, but, on the other hand, I'm glad I was enlightened by everyone. After a year of very hard work, I was about to spend $80K to lauch a new website, and was going to use paypal as a main payment option. Thank Goodness mine eyes has seen the evidence to be very careful, and seek over options to protect myself. I could have very easily suffered the same as everyone else! Thanks again to everyone, and good luck!
posted on February 28, 2001 02:35:38 PM new
To all you sellers out there who are getting frustrated and abused by:
· Non-paying bidders
· paypal charge backs
· Bounced checks
· Fraud problems
· Negative feedback for no good reason (retaliation)
I found out the hard way that safe harbor and FBI don’t do a thing about it, and I signed up for a sitesentury.com, a security company that will do REAL investigations. Check out their site, I signed up for their service and I put their log on all my auctions and the bad guys will think twice before they mess with me!!!!!!! It is like having a security guard by my side protecting me!!! Which car do you thing the thieves like to break-in: one with alarm-on or one without??? That is what the log will do for you.
The investigator already got me some of the money I lost on bounced checks and the bank fee too!!!!!!
Do yourself a favor and check out sitesentry.com
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