posted on August 25, 2003 10:51:46 PM new
Aside from the simple fact that religious based drug programs do not work I really don't care what you do with your money. You assume I am against all that you are for and again I could care less. Those of your belief system are quite short sighted in their outlook.
If your precious Lord showed up unannounced I believe you'd have him declared a socialist alien and deported on the spot.
posted on August 25, 2003 10:54:57 PM new
There are no walk in clinics in San Francisco or the East Bay that an uninsured person can walk into with the exception of the Emergency rooms.
Friends don't let friends vote Republican!
posted on August 25, 2003 11:00:49 PM new
You obviously haven't been reading just how successful religious based organizations ARE doing.
When I worked for an HMO in Santa Clara and young women came in who had no medical insurance, I personally gave them Valley Medical's phone number. There they were seen and cared for. It's a county hospital. That's what county hospitals do....take care of those who have no where else to turn.
My mother was also a nurse in a county hospital in So. CA.
posted on August 25, 2003 11:07:58 PM new
That is known in the trade as patient dumping. Send them to county. You should be ashamed of yourself. Did you evaluate her condition before you closed the door?
posted on August 25, 2003 11:26:11 PM new
The government taxes us and forces us to give money to the less fortunate. But when is the last time you heard a welfare recipient actually say thank you? Instead, they think we owe them and they deserve more. It's a twisted system.
Charities, not government, should be taking care of the poor. Wealthy people would prefer voluntarily donating money to charity instead of being forced to pay high taxes. I think you would be very surprised with their generosity. And the recipients of aid might actually appreciate the gifts and even say thank you.
Republicans aren't greedy. They hate to pay taxes but they are very generous with charities. Democrats prefer government bureaucracies while Republicans prefer nonprofit charities.
These aren't exact figures, but I remember back in the 2000 election that Al Gore's tax return showed something like only $15,000 in donations to charity while Bush donated something like $300,000. I think liberals are the real tightwads.
posted on August 25, 2003 11:53:37 PM new
The liberals also would like to imply that if one is un-insured that automatically means they don't have money to go to the doctor. Not always the case. There are a lot of people who have no insurance that can be seen at many walk-in clinics by a doctor, PA or NP and pay a small charge.
My girlfriends daughter got free medical care, while in college, in San Jose. Minor things...but still it's offered.
And at the walk in clinic [4 years ago there was one on Santa Teresa near Snell] that she visited without having any insurance.
Many clinics see patients on a can-pay-basic. UCLA did this graduating [income] scale doctors visits.
Stanford University Hospital has treated hundreds of thousands of patients who couldn't afford to pay for cancer treatment their family members needed.
There are many of the same....the socialists would just like to present their one-sided view in hopes of people feeling there is no care if you don't have insurance. Bologna!!!
[ edited by Linda_K on Aug 25, 2003 11:57 PM ]
posted on August 26, 2003 12:46:09 AM new
And for those who don't believe what I'm saying....do a google search. Just type in 'free medical care'. There you will see the truth. Then also try 'free health care'.
Here's just one example...on the search about 5 down:
Posted on Mon, Aug. 25, 2003 Free and low-cost health care is available
By LINDA WIEDMAIER Special to The Star
No one should fall through the health care cracks in the Kansas City area.
Primary care clinics throughout the area provide outpatient services for the uninsured and the underinsured. Costs range from free to the amount a family can pay based on its income and other factors.
As I said....sliding scale.
You can ensure that your entire family has regular primary care attention whether you're employed or not and whether you have no insurance, minimal insurance or coverage for yourself but not for your spouse and children. Please note that the clinics are open and phones are manned weekdays -- with some evening hours.
Kansas City Free Health Clinic.
And dave, just so you don't have to travel to Kansas City, Iowa or any of the places listed that are too far from the bay area where you mention there are NO clinics. There are free clinics [also found on google] in:
posted on August 26, 2003 04:19:39 AM new
Linda, Liberals like davebraun don't care that free and lowcost medical care now exists, they will never be happy until they see all us of having to pay for people, who in most cases don't deserve any compassion what so ever.
What he terms as "patient dumping" is a liberal misnomer just it get some attention. They have no actual proof of that, they are just upset that a hospital that is already over streteched doesn't move a paying patient to the hall and put a non-paying one in a room.
Having taken a friend to ER last year, she had no insurance, but was treated as well as any other patient.
Having a sister that is an RN, let me tell you that most non-payers they get are drug addicts and other people who bring it on themselves. Believe me they don't like waiting on these people either.
edited to add, good article Linda
AIN'T LIFE GRAND...
[ edited by Twelvepole on Aug 26, 2003 04:24 AM ]
posted on August 26, 2003 08:18:05 AM new
Simply stating your right wing party line does not make it factual. The clinic you refer to in Berkeley has no supplies, no dispensary and no funding there are also no doctors on duty. Essentially all they can offer is free advice and an apology, most of their funding was cut years ago.
As to people who deserve no compassion I believe you head up that group, schmuck. The only thing you seem to do is lay your oppressive bummer on the worlds head.
The San Francisco Free Clinic is suffering a financial crisis has had to cut it's hours, close many of it's successful programs in the drug rehab area and is in danger of closing it's doors permanently, there is no full time doctor nor do they have any advanced diagnostic equipment. They dispense minimal amounts of fairly common generic medication.
When you get some exact figures speak, until then sit on your made up figures as well as your hard earned money.
Your party cares for the wealthy and no others. You a working class stiff are the first to be ignored by your leaders. They could care less about your personal plight. They see you as a vote and potential donor nothing more. Grist for the mill.
Had your party prevailed social security would have never come into existence. If it is successful the program will be scrapped.
By and large hospitals are not being built with few exceptions. As facilities age and the population ages beds are not being added to the existing inventory. The ratio of care to the patient load is decreasing exponentially. If your sister does not like serving the people who brought it on themselves I suggest she chose the wrong profession. She'd probably be happier as a deportation officer in the INS.
BTW wasn't that hypocritical of you to take an uninsured person to the hospital. I would think your creed demands she die in the streets rather than burden the taxpayers by straining precious resources paid for by other hard working insured people.
Friends don't let friends vote Republican!
posted on August 26, 2003 09:32:45 AM new
dave - You said earlier: "Much of the work that defaults to the ER physicians could be more efficiently and economically handled in a clinical setting by PA's and Nurse practitioners. This is impossible in our system as there are no such clinics.
And I proved you were wrong. My right wing agenda...saying it's doesn't make it so? LOL Any one who does the search I recommended will see the FACTS as they are. Not as you profess.
There ARE such clinics in our system. A simple "google" search proves it. But wait....maybe all of google is right wing too. LOL
posted on August 26, 2003 09:40:24 AM new
The Berkeley Free Clinic which you so proudly point at is there in name only. They have no supplies, no doctors, limited hours, no programs, no funds. Essentially it is a crash pad for the homeless. They have no medical equipment. They occupy a church basement on Durant Avenue, two blocks below Telegraph Avenue in Berkeley. Currently although open they offer virtually no medical services. I believe that the homeless can shower there if they wish.
If you wish to believe this is a medical facility I am not surprised. One of your great heroes thought Ketchup to be a vegetable and essential to good nutrition.
Friends don't let friends vote Republican!
posted on August 26, 2003 09:43:00 AM new
Helen, it wasn't a Thousand Points of Light, I believe it is just 'Points of Light' and it was founded by the first Pres. Bush in '90, its a non partisan, non profit that is promoting volunteers. Whats wrong with that?
As for health care for those that have no insurance, there IS places, and things you can do.
In this state, (besides welfare and medicaid) there is Basic State insurance. We have friends who lost their business (pre Bush, fyi a few years back) they had a small shop. Well they pay for a couple $20 a month, their ins. is basically like mine, they get low low cost prescriptions, hospital and DENTAL. They may have qualifyed for medicaid, but she didn't want to go that route. Her decision.
As for giving to charity, yes we do. Our choice. I have to agree I do NOT like the National Healthcare idea. Look at the mess other countries have with it.
As for davebraun saying Lindak dumped someone on county what is she supposed to do, as far as I know, she is not a dr. There ARE county hosptials, the one here is Harbor View, not only is it the county hospital, but the major burn center for the northwest.
Another thing, we DO have a semi National Healthcare... called medicaid, I think in CA its Medical or whatever.
I think you can google that and find out who qualifys for medicaid.
As far as I know, NOT POSITIVE, but there is only one major HMO up here; Group Health. And Group Health has one (as far as I know) hospital in the Seattle area called Community Hospital downtown, sure they have clinics everywhere, but for major hospitalizition, there is one hospital. I had my kids enrolled in Group Health for awhile when they were younger, it sucked, I did not like it. And thank God they never had to go to the hospital. Other people may like it. Maybe some of the other local community Group Health clinics are better than where I had to take them.
Another problem I see with a National Healthcare is a lack of doctors. Once you have the Gov't running it, I believe less and less young people will opt for med school, hey that would be their choice... but then with fewer drs, what then??? make students go to medical school......??????...
Art Bell Retired! George Noory is on late night coasttocoastam.com
posted on August 26, 2003 10:04:05 AM new
Another thing about medicaid. It may be that some people might, I said MIGHT, feel ashamed, embarrassed, whatever to apply for it.... my daughters friend is a single mom just had her second baby, is on welfare, medicaid, and foodstamps.
In this state, they made it so having this, no one would know... for example; the foodstamps she used to get were paper ones, and she WAS embarrassed, in a store, people in line 'could see that she was on foodstamps' well now they give each recipient a card like a debit card that is swiped through the debit machine at that checkout. They are looking at changing the medicaid also.
But one thing she can't understand is that the state says now after a certain amount of time, she MUST get a job OR get into training school (they pay, for that, and daycare) she does not want to. My daughter asked me, what will happen if she doesn't do either? I didnt' know... I thought, well, they may take her kids away, I really don't know... BUT she is capable of working, I'm sorry, I do think she shoud take up their 'offer' of job training and get a job... maybe that sounds heartless of me, but myself and others have done it and survived. Unless there is some condition that totally prevents her from working, there is no excuse, with all that the state will provide (day care, training etc)
Sorry, but that is my 'right wing' thought on it
Art Bell Retired! George Noory is on late night coasttocoastam.com
posted on August 26, 2003 11:39:05 AM newBTW wasn't that hypocritical of you to take an uninsured person to the hospital. I would think your creed demands she die in the streets rather than burden the taxpayers by straining precious resources paid for by other hard working insured people.
Not hardly dumba$$, she had more than enough money to pay for the bill... at the time she left the ER... not some bum you would kiss the a$$ of.
posted on August 26, 2003 11:41:55 AM new
davebraun you strike me as some bum one step away from the streets... to lazy to work and just wanting to ride on everyone else's hard work.
posted on August 26, 2003 11:56:57 AM new
Whatever I strike you as is not of no concern to me. I'm surprised you haven't offered to meet for a beer. You can call me whatever you wish but we are both aware you haven't the cajones to back anything just another punk with nothing going in life a bag of hot gas.
Twelve of all the posters I have read I find you the most laughable, you are a pathetic little man. I pity those close to you should there be any.
Friends don't let friends vote Republican!
posted on August 26, 2003 12:04:42 PM new
I don't see a whole lot of difference with the liberals response of You Fascist Scum or you Nazi to what 12pole said, do you?
Art Bell Retired! George Noory is on late night coasttocoastam.com
posted on August 26, 2003 01:03:56 PM new
LOL, we both know that you wouldn't meet, you might actually have to pay with your own money instead of someone else's.
[ edited by Twelvepole on Aug 26, 2003 04:24 AM ]