Helenjw
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posted on September 26, 2003 03:26:42 PM new
SO Touchy, Linda! By your response, I would say that Austbounty and Kraftdinner are RIGHT on Target!!!
Helen
[ edited by Helenjw on Sep 26, 2003 03:35 PM ]
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ebayauctionguy
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posted on September 26, 2003 03:34:34 PM new
I think assbounty is just envious. The only thing Australia leads the world in is homosexuality. 17% of Australians are gay.
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kraftdinner
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posted on September 26, 2003 03:39:48 PM new
What a juvenile you are, ebayauctionguy.
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ebayauctionguy
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posted on September 26, 2003 03:50:49 PM new
Well assbounty started it!
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Twelvepole
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posted on September 26, 2003 04:03:34 PM new
Kraft you must of missed all of his anti-Semitic talk... now that would of made Hitler proud...
It always does amaze me how people of other countries can be so interested in the US that they ignore their own countries problems... how nice of Austrailia though giving all of those sheep to Iraq... diseased sheep.
AIN'T LIFE GRAND... 
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kraftdinner
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posted on September 26, 2003 04:25:41 PM new
I read a few, Twelve, but didn't understand them. I DO understand where's he's coming from when he talks about the American government, which not only affects Americans, but everyone else in the world.
Yeah, what's the deal with those sheep, austbounty??
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Linda_K
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posted on September 26, 2003 04:32:41 PM new
KD - Please correct me if I'm wrong on this. But weren't you the one [among others] who were scolding us when we were being critical of France and Chiroc when we were all having a hissy fit about how France was obstructing the Iraq issue at the UN? I believe it was you who were telling us how terrible we were to be so critical.
So maybe the things austi posts you agree with, but just didn't agree with our stand against the French?
Or is it not really a matter of 'caring and helping' but rather who's side you agree with?
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Helenjw
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posted on September 26, 2003 04:48:40 PM new
You seem to forget the military help that we have received from Australia and Canada.
Just a few weeks ago, Canada contributed millions to the Iraq reconstruction fund!
How can you say that the citizens of Australia and Canada should have no interest in our country?
It's an open world and lord knows we need all the help we can get right now. Bashing other countries is just ignorant!
Helen
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kraftdinner
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posted on September 26, 2003 04:48:46 PM new
Sorry, it wasn't me Linda. The only thing I said on that subject, was that I felt France and Germany were correct to not join the coalition under the circumstances presented by the U.S. Other than that, I'm ignorant about the relationship the U.S. has with these 2 countries.
I know what you mean about sides Linda, but if nobody agreed with me, I would still feel the same. I don't know if you remember, but I thought Bush was a total dork until 911 happened. I thought he handled that with dignity and said so here. I could've cared less if nobody liked me saying that. My feelings have since changed, but I try to be at least semi-diplomatic about it. 
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Linda_K
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posted on September 26, 2003 04:52:08 PM new
helen - Good then we finally agree on something:
Bashing other countries is just ignorant!
Helen
So next time you read austi with his US bashing...I'm sure you'll step right in and defend your country....yeah right.
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kraftdinner
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posted on September 26, 2003 04:56:16 PM new
I think she meant if they were lies, Linda.
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Helenjw
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posted on September 26, 2003 04:58:52 PM new
Disagreeing with Bush is not bashing the country. Are you still attempting that crazy spin?
Bush does not represent most Americans today.
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Helenjw
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posted on September 26, 2003 06:18:40 PM new
Embracing the True Nature of Patriotism
Before sending young Americans to kill and die in foreign lands, a democracy has a sacred obligation to permit full and searching discussion of the issues. There is no obligation to bow down before a reloaded imperial presidency.
Nor does the actuality of war change the situation. As Theodore Roosevelt said in 1918 during the First World War, "To announce that there must be no criticism of the president... is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public."
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Twelvepole
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posted on September 26, 2003 06:26:34 PM new
Very nice Helen,
However I would think that even Teddy Roosevelt would take offence to some the gloating you seem to exude everytime something bad happens to the US and its soldiers... but hey even anti-americans such as yourself are entitled to your say...
AIN'T LIFE GRAND...
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kraftdinner
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posted on September 26, 2003 06:52:25 PM new
Not true Twelve. Helen focuses on WHY things are bad, not that they ARE bad. Why do you see that as un-American?
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Twelvepole
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posted on September 26, 2003 07:10:10 PM new
Kraft considering I think Helen would lie and you would swear to it... we'll just leave it at that.
Helen, you should try this site
http://www.mcgop.net/index.htm
AIN'T LIFE GRAND...
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kraftdinner
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posted on September 26, 2003 07:28:41 PM new
???
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austbounty
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posted on September 26, 2003 07:32:30 PM new
The comments I have previously made, which you call 'anitiSemitic'
Were made as a reaction to the proliferation of anti-other-Semites propaganda (and effects of) which I saw on these boards.
It was an attempt to combat the pro-Israel anti-all-other-Semites sentiments which clearly run strong in our anglo-centric societies and particularly in America, and these sentiments were there long before 9/11.
I can’t tell you much about the Aussie Sheep, because I little care, when compared to all the human suffering going on.
But apparently, we sent sheep that went over in poor transport conditions and we had to buy them back from the buyer @ AU$10Million (apparently a profit) and we are now ‘giving’ them to Iraq ???
That’s all I know.
Next time I criticise anything American, should I perhaps, instead, say; “those who represent America eg. the Poindexters, and Norths the Kissingers and other ‘covert’ operatives”
Where does the responsibility lie for these assassinations, coups, and general exploitations.
I’m not complaining because you are Americans but because the overwhelming evidence is that those who represent America eg. the Poindexters, and Norths the Kissingers and other ‘covert’ operatives, and the overt hawks of the PNAC and American Based Energy and Military Companies appear to be at the root of or ‘in bed with’ all the evil.
Nuclear;
for lest we forget.
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ebayauctionguy
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posted on September 26, 2003 07:33:13 PM new
Before sending young Americans to kill and die in foreign lands, a democracy has a sacred obligation to permit full and searching discussion of the issues. There is no obligation to bow down before a reloaded imperial presidency.
I agree with that. Before sending young Americans to kill and die in foreign lands, a democracy has a sacred obligation to permit full and searching discussion of the issues.
But once the decision is made, the debate should end and we should unite and accomplish the mission. Democrats have not united with the administration and they have not supported our troops. They are hoping that we fail in Iraq and they gloat over any bad news just so they can score political points. I think that is unAmerican.
[ edited by ebayauctionguy on Sep 26, 2003 07:33 PM ]
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kraftdinner
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posted on September 26, 2003 07:38:26 PM new
"Democrats have not united with the administration and they have not supported our troops. They are hoping that we fail in Iraq and they gloat over any bad news just so they can score political points. I think that is unAmerican."
That's not true. How do you come up with this stuff?
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austbounty
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posted on September 26, 2003 07:42:46 PM new
e.a.g. ” But once the decision is made, the debate should end and we should unite and accomplish the mission.”
Somehow, e.a.g. you don’t think that principal should have applied to the Germans during the reign of Hitler.???
Is that what all ‘Good’ Germans should have done.???
If they 'did', it was because most 'fell for' the propoganda and lies.
Your philosiphy does not give consideration to 'right' and 'wrong' morality.
Extreme Nationalist are dangerous and a risk to global security.
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Helenjw
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posted on September 26, 2003 07:43:45 PM new
"Democrats have not united with the administration and they have not supported our troops."
Isn't it interesting how the neocons are ratcheting up the effort to silence criticism. Well, that's not going to work again.
Seems to me that Bush did get support...not only from the American people but also from Democrats in Congress.
[ edited by Helenjw on Sep 26, 2003 07:48 PM ]
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austbounty
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posted on September 26, 2003 07:48:38 PM new
k.d.
e.a.g. ‘came up with that stuff’ the same way he came up with using his increased ebay sales as a national economic indicator.
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kraftdinner
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posted on September 26, 2003 09:05:44 PM new
LoL austbounty!!
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austbounty
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posted on September 26, 2003 10:31:11 PM new
It seems the ‘right’ way, assertions made for ‘effect’ with no regard for accuracy.
"I've been to war. I've raised twins. If I had a choice, I'd rather go to war." -- Bush, flat out lying in 2002.
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Twelvepole
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posted on September 27, 2003 06:25:41 AM new
What is laughable is two individuals that do not live in the US, consistently refuse to discuss their own country's issues and problems...
Their governements are our supporters and in fact that support empowers us to do the things we do, because their governments know that it is the right thing to do also...
Speaking of economies kraft, how about the 1200 jobs that will be lost when Levi Strauss pulls out of Canada moves over seas?
How does Canada help your people in issues of that sort?
AIN'T LIFE GRAND...
[ edited by Twelvepole on Sep 27, 2003 06:28 AM ]
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kiara
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posted on September 27, 2003 08:40:28 AM new
Every country in the world has its own issues and problems. We should feel free to criticize any of them whether we reside there or not.
Levi Strauss is moving overseas for cheaper labor costs and the US lost about 3600 jobs last year and will lose more now that the last plant closes. The quality of their product has gone down over the years.
Canada will lose jobs because of this. Last year the Zippo manufacturing plant closed in Canada also.
If you check US flags you will find that many are either made in China or Canada. The ones made in Canada are excellent quality.
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Twelvepole
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posted on September 27, 2003 09:11:08 AM new
You can feel free to criticize any country in the world, but you should have the integrity to be able to address issues about your own country...
which seems won't or can't be done.
Your answer is meaningless kiara, that does not address what I asked... are you Kraft in disguise? We are not talking about "last year" Many more jobs have been lost here in the US since then... and as ususal the Liberals are blaming President Bush
How does Canada handle the loss of jobs... do they blame it on the premier and/or governement?
Do they line up for unemployment?
Why is the medical care there such a pathetic mess? Is there any relief in sight to correct those problems?
AIN'T LIFE GRAND...
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austbounty
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posted on September 27, 2003 09:32:40 AM new
Just for you 12.
But unlike you, I do have the integrity to speak honestly.
I believe that my Prime Minister is a racist, just watch him when he visits any Asian Country, he’s like a fish out of water, he can’t even ‘relate’ to them.
He needed our Governor General’s authority to go to war but preferred to be puppet for your President. He placed our ships in a war stance knowing well that it was a commitment to war and that many like you wouldn’t have the integrity to say ‘we shouldn’t be here, forget saving face, and let’s turn back’.
You & Linda demand I answer your questions, but the important questions are not answered by you.
You are offended by criticisms of your nation, or those who represent it, but take great pride in your nations murderous attacks on other nations and people.
Your nation 12, has reneged on international agreements.
Failed to comply with International laws, refused to recognise others.
Assassinated, even probably one of your own Presidents.
Unlawfully detained prisoners.
Polluted the most.
Manufactured the largest number of the most devastating weapons.
Taken their immoral exploitative industries all over the world.
Has instigated overt and even covert wars or attacks on other nations and divided other nations as well as your own.
Aided and abetted terrorists.
Aided and abetted dictators.
AND EVEN OVERTLY DECLARED THE DESIRE TO CONTROL THE WHOLE PLANET AND EVEN THE STARS
This Nazi-like pax-Americana has pretty well disgraced the name of all Americans.
It is a challenge for global control put forward by those who represent your country.
NO other nation is doing this.
It seems that your leaders long for the good’ol days of slavery.
Your EXTREME NATIONALISTIC PNAC IS a declaration to world war.
They_needed_a_new_Pearl_Harbor_and_they_got_it.
And_More
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kiara
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posted on September 27, 2003 09:40:50 AM new
No, I am not Kraft in disuise. She is much kinder and gentler.
Sorry, I must have missed the part where we were only discussing job loss this year. You happened to bring up Levi Strauss so I mentioned it. Like I said on a recent thread, part of the problem with the job loss and factories closing is that the consumer keeps demanding lower prices.
In Canada the Premiers and Prime Minister get blamed a lot for everything and rightfully so. Just because a country has a certain policy it doesn't mean that all the people are happy or that they all support it. The good thing is that they have the freedom to speak out.
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