posted on April 8, 2001 08:55:23 PM new
First, I would like to say that I have NOT PERSONALLY EXPERIENCED THESE PROBLEMS WITH PAYPAL WHICH I WILL BE DISCUSSING!!! I recently opened an account with PayPal to make a purchase with no problems.
The bottom line is that Paypal is SO big, that they NEED TO MAKE THEIR PROGRAM "GOOF-PROOF." If many of the problems with PayPal arise on AW boards (FROM AW users, who are for the most part computer-literate), then we can only imagine the problems faced by Internet "Newbies."
IMHO, Paypal does *NOT* perform a true verification. I have seen reports of sellers who use Paypal called "UNVERIFIED," even after they verified bank accounts, credit cards, and whatever else...
Check out this web page related to PayPal troubles:
http://www.ygoodman.com/paypal.html
This is a list of investors in PayPal. You need to quit using their services also and let them know why.
Example, now when Aria begs me to get their credit card instead of saying I do not like you I can say I do not like what you invest in and PayPal being one of them.
Just some more food for thought.
Jim
[ edited by lanefamily on Apr 10, 2001 08:12 AM ]
posted on April 9, 2001 09:30:17 PM new
of coure you have to be a PayPal member to see it... LOL!!! I closed my account two days ago... after reading all the neg comments about PayPal.
posted on April 17, 2001 11:36:29 AM new
DODGE FEEL FREE TO CONTACT ME AT [email protected] SO WE CAN GET STARTED LINING UP PEOPLE FOR A SUIT AGAINST PAYPAL I HAVE SEVERAL THAT ARE INTERESTED.
posted on April 19, 2001 08:13:56 AM new
Another UNSATISFIED Custome?
PayPal may hold twice a payment's value
Click to see the latest issues of the free Woody's Watch ezines
(http://www.wopr.com/)
Sending "instant payments" using PayPal.com may be a convenient way to send
someone money. But you might be surprised to learn that PayPal may freeze
your checking account for twice the amount of the payment you send.
Woody's Windows Watch reader Phillip Niebrugge of Decatur, Illinois, found
out the hard way that eternal vigilance is the price of electronic
transactions.
Niebrugge used PayPal in February to send payments for a few hundred dollars
each to various vendors. To his surprise, a physical check that he'd written
on his checking account then bounced, although Niebrugge knew he had
sufficient funds to cover the check.
Only by asking his credit union to investigate did he discover the problem.
PayPal had placed a temporary "hold" on his checking account for each instant
payment. In addition, an equal amount had been electronically withdrawn by
PayPal to pay the recipient.
Thus, double the amount Niebrugge had expected to pay had been made
unavailable to his checking account, causing the bouncy check.
Annette Summers, an accountant with Staley Credit Union of Decatur, confirmed
in a telephone interview that PayPal's holds had caused the bounce. After
Niebrugge gave credit union officials a signed authorization allowing me to
inspect his financial statements, Summers sent me records showing the PayPal
transactions.
In one case, Niebrugge had authorized PayPal to send a payment for $285 from
his checking account. Summers said PayPal had for some reason placed two
different $285 holds on the account, even though there was a single $285
payment. The holds hadn't yet been released when the credit union examined
the account.
The credit union itself rescinded the holds when Niebrugge brought them to
light. Summers said the situation was resolved within about one week.
Niebrugge, however, is still incensed about the overdraft in his checking
account. He had voluntarily given PayPal his debit card number. But nothing
in the PayPal instant-payment procedure warns debit-card users that twice the
payment amount will be made unavailable to their checking accounts for
several days.
Niebrugge says no one at PayPal would help him, even after he sent five
e-mails asking for support. "I basically got a standard reply that they put a
hold on the [debit] card for the funds while the check clears," Niebrugge
says. "They are effectively holding twice the funds to which they are
entitled."
Vince Sollitto, PayPal's vice president of corporate communications,
confirmed that PayPal imposes a hold when a debit card is a member's
"primary" bank card. The held amount is made unavailable to the user's
checking account while an equal amount is deducted from the account to make
the instant payment.
The result? Twice the amount you expected is temporarily "missing" from your
checking account. The held funds can be unavailable for four business days or
longer.
"Occasionally, what happens is customers link their debit card to their
checking account," Sollitto said. "We go ahead and put a $200 hold on their
debit card. They've now blocked $400 in their checking account."
Sollitto said members preparing an instant payment can click a "more info"
link to learn about PayPal's hold policy. This link, it turns out, is a small
question-mark (?) button. When you click the button, a new window says,
"debit cards also draw on your checking account." But it doesn't say that
this adds up to twice the payment amount.
Users, Sollitto suggested, should consider giving PayPal a credit card, not a
debit card, to absorb holds. Or users should transfer money from their
checking account to their PayPal account several days in advance of
authorizing a payment. That way, he said, no hold is taken from a checking
account.
As always, you should carefully read everything about electronic transactions
you make. In this case, though, even that might not have helped.
Niebrugge will receive a free copy of Windows Me Secrets for calling
attention to this problem.
posted on April 19, 2001 11:09:07 AM new
Come on people it's time to smarten up close your paypal accounts and save yourselves money. why let paypal make money on you by holding your money and drawing interest on it. when a bank loans money they charge interest. when paypal holds your money they draw interest on it.don't let them make fools out of you CLOSE YOU ACCOUNTS TODAY.SEND ME A COPY OF YOUR EMAIL CLOSING YOUR ACCOUNT. BE THE MOUSE THAT ROARED NOT THE TWERP THAT LET THEM CHEAT YOU.
COPY TO [email protected]
posted on April 19, 2001 11:25:26 AM new
club1man is making a number of incorrect and possibly illegal assertions about PayPal on a number of public Internet forums. The simple truth of the matter is that club1man's e-gold business attracted a large number of credit card payments that were unauthorized or disputed, and "charged back." As is standard in the payments processing industry, and in accordance with our Terms of Use, PayPal paid these "chargebacks" and then sought to hold club1man liable for these repudiated payments, as we do for any seller who has not qualified for our generous Seller Protection Policy. club1man did not qualify for this protection due to the nature of his business, has refused to abide by our Terms of Use, and has refused to accept his financial and legal responsibilities to our company. As a result, we have ceased doing business with club1man and will pursue legal action to recover the funds he owes us. We believe he may now be seeking to further avoid the legal ramifications of his actio
ns by spreading erroneous information about our company. This, too, will be the subject of any legal proceeding.
PayPal's 7 million members send over $8 million in nearly 200,000 separate payments through our network each day. Very few of these transactions ever result in a dispute. To help protect members against those that do, we provide a Seller Protection Policy, that holds sellers harmless against chargebacks if they take certain preventative measures. This has helped PayPal maintain one of the lowest fraud rates in the industry and to become the #1 online payment service. Thank you for your interest and support of PayPal."
posted on April 19, 2001 03:51:34 PM new
Here we go again I was merely replying to the fact that another persons account was debited for $285 dollars above the amt needed and I'm making illegal assertions.Also paypal keeps downing egold which is a legal and upstanding company that I must say doesn't have the complaints against them that paypal does.The people buying $100-$1000 dollars of gold from me sure aren't laundering money as paypal would have you believe.Now paypal is trying to force me to come to California to arbitrate this so they can shut me up.
posted on April 19, 2001 10:01:49 PM new
Well! Everyone here now knows RSMSPORTSGA wants this thread locked because 'He thinks this issue has been talked about enough"..
Lets all hear it for one mans Opinion
Rhodes Inc.
M Rhodes (CEO)
posted on April 20, 2001 01:24:51 PM new
plain and simple go to this web site and take the time to file a complaint. If you don't your only hurting yourself--------------http://www.ifccfbi.gov/
posted on April 24, 2001 08:08:35 PM new
I sent payment to a guy for something that I bought off of a message board. He never shipped it. I filled out PayPal's dispute form on 3/13/01. Now I can't get any kind of email response from paypal or the dude that ripped me off. What am I supposed to do? I am frustrated as hell. PayPal is not getting anymore of my business. I'm out $150 plus interest on a credit card. Sux big time. =(
posted on April 24, 2001 09:57:50 PM new
cstenson - If the funds were from your credit card then close your PayPal account and do a charge back againsed PayPal.
posted on April 25, 2001 04:29:55 AM new
What about always using a USPS money order for transactions? That way if you have any difficulty with the seller or buyer both are protected.
It is better than a customer sending a check and no shipment (or lost shipment) happening.
posted on April 25, 2001 08:05:42 AM new
I'd close my account, but PayPal has restricted my account.
An eBay seller sent me a book that was "poorly described" (fraud). Eventually, cost me $231 for the book, Square Trade mediator $15 and cash stuck in PayPal restricted account $34.10.
I had my credit card company charge the $231 back to PayPal. PayPal has also contacted my credit card co., at least twice, to get the charge back removed. My Credit card co. reviewed the documentation and agreed on the "damaged" merchandise. This is a case where the Seller should have been punished, not me. Book is worth about $50 and would require about $100 to fix.
PayPal is so sloooooow in answering their email.
posted on April 25, 2001 12:02:23 PM new
Hi krueger,
Did you file a Buyer Protection claim with PayPal first or did you file a charge back first? I don't have all of the details on this, but you are more than welcome to contact me at [email protected] with the information (I will have the Buyer Protection/Charge Back teams review this).
posted on April 25, 2001 01:28:26 PM new
I found my original email from 10/15/2000 and have sent it to you separately. It contains the data from 9/8 till 10/15, the cotacts to the Seller, the contacts and case with Square Trade and the initial contact to PayPal.
My name is Daniel Costello and I am a reporter at the Wall Street Journal. I am interested to talk with anyone here about this Paypal thread. My email is [email protected] and my phone number is 212-416-3620.
posted on April 26, 2001 03:44:20 PM new
Greetings,
Recently Paypal has pulled money from my account that was over three months old. They requested that I provide them with proof of delivery, I did. Then I received a "Reversal of Transaction" notice. When I inquired as to why, thier response was "we feel that thier wasn't sufficient proof...." Despite the fact that that I provided them with a UPS tracking #, and my invoice.
posted on April 26, 2001 04:36:29 PM new
Well, now here is my problem. I signed up for pay pal about a week ago. Today I canceled and I think I have lost no money. I tried to see my account for the first time. It said my password was not correct. So I put in for a new password. It said I had to answer 2 questions. These were my mothers maiden name and the city of my birth. I entered them 3 different times, Pay Pal told me I was wrong.
After a series of arrogent email answers from pay pal about I should remember my items and that I never sent them any request (I have return email from them that says different), I informed them that I am canceling my account and they can inform all my "customers" that nothing will ship that has been paid through pay pal.
I think this company has some very major problems, not to mention the arrogent answers given to me.
posted on April 26, 2001 05:57:09 PM new
Hi drjackk,
Passwords are a very important security concern for us because it involves a user's account.
If you can't remember the password and you couldn't remember the questions, we can reset the password for you, but it will take a little time to get to you because it has to be mailed. The mailing is an additional security precaution (because emails can be sniffed going through servers).
This is done to protect our users and you are more than welcome to contact me at [email protected]. I will have customer service call you if need be.
posted on April 26, 2001 05:59:25 PM new
Hi homefurnishings,
Did the transaction meet all the criteria of the Seller Protection Program? Here are the details----
The seller has a Verified U.S. Business or Premier Account.
The seller ships to the buyer's Confirmed Address.
The seller can provide reasonable proof-of-shipment which can be tracked online. This document must show that you shipped to the buyer's Confirmed Address.
The seller accepted a single payment from one PayPal account for a purchase.
The seller shipped to a domestic (U.S.) buyer at a U.S. address.
If you met all of these conditions, and the transaction was still reversed, please contact me at [email protected] with all the information. I will have the charge back team review the case.
posted on April 26, 2001 07:22:14 PM new
So we don't meet all of those requirements, so we are out both the money from our Paypal accounts and the merchandise, so some fraudulent person decides they want thier item for free AND most likely knew they could get away with it?
I have been reveiwing the posts in this thread, and I am begining to believe most of them.
paypaldamon stated in a previous post that Paypal has 200,000 transactions per day? and very few of them result in a dispute. I guess too bad for the hand full of people who get trampled by the big beast Paypal
I am watching these posts multiply, you may have to adjust your numbers.
[ edited by collector2005 on Apr 26, 2001 07:25 PM ]
posted on April 26, 2001 07:25:40 PM new
Hi collector2005,
Charge back liability is explained in the terms of use. How to eliminate charge back liability is also explained in the terms of use (Seller Protection Program).
Charge backs are a fact of life with credit cards. You were defrauded by someone using a fraudulent credit card and not PayPal. All credit cards go through a heavy screeing process before registration (and we have numerous internal techniques for spotting potential credit card fraud), but it does not negate the possibility that someone gained access to a stolen credit card. It is why I mention the Seller Protection Program so often.
posted on April 27, 2001 08:12:05 AM new
Hey PayPalDaemon...
you posted the following as a requirement...
"The seller can provide reasonable proof-of-shipment which can be
tracked online.
This document must show that you shipped to the buyer's
Confirmed Address"
Now the last time I checked out the seller's agreement (When I was robbed by a buyer who used your company as a gateway) the last part of your post was not included. Did your company's agreement change again to not protect another seller.
Now in your humble opinion and expertise, please give us a list of those shipping companies that will post online delivery addresses and are compliant with paypal.com.
My intent is to compare what paypal.com says is compliant and what has been used by us and still didn't meet the requirements. Not to mention those of us who goit robbed and then the policy changes and even though the policy was not in effect at the time of the transaction we were bound to it's new additions.
Hell we don't even know how often you guys be changing your agreement terms!
posted on April 27, 2001 02:31:35 PM new
Paypal doesn't protect the seller first, even though it is us the seller that is bringing in the majority of the revenue. If Sellers stopped accepting Paypal, then paypal will be out of business.
It is Paypal first, and customers second, Paypal is forgetting that Sellers are the customers as well, there is no charge for a buyer to pay with Paypal, the money comes from the seller's accounts.
My instance was not due to the fact of a stolen credit card, it was due to the fact that my customer prefered to have the item, AND thier money back. Where is the protection against that?
posted on April 27, 2001 03:56:50 PM new
Hi homefurnishings,
Charge backs are a consumer right and this is something that PayPal can't change.
This is a fact of life when accepting credit card payments, but sellers can be protected by following the details of the Seller Protection Program. This is to protect the sellers from charge backs and it needs to be followed to remove that liability.
Your buyer,for whatever reason, filed a charge back. In order to protect you from the charge back, the guidelines of the Seller Protection Program had to be followed.
posted on April 27, 2001 04:31:41 PM new
Hi izzzy12k,
The Seller Protection Program has been in effect since August of last year with pretty much the same criteria (we released the billing address of the credit card shortly thereafter).
Any confirmation that can be tracked on-line can be used. Examples include:
Delivery Confirmation through the USPS
Fedex packages can be tracked on-line
UPS also has tracking programs available on-line.
Please feel free to refer to the Seller Protection Program details on the web site.
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