Twelvepole
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posted on July 24, 2004 08:35:08 PM new
It appears there really is no pleasing the left on the subject of homosexual marriage...
Right now there is a bill in congress that would allow each state to decide the issue of homosexual marriage, unfettered by the US Government... but to hear homosexuals scream that is not acceptable is absurd... it was what they were saying when congress was discussing the constitutional amendment...
They should be happy this bill is coming out and once it passes the senate, then the states can do as they like for homosexual marriage irregardless of what other states do...
It does appear they want to FORCE their lifestyle upon everyone everywhere... that is not acceptable...
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yeager
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posted on July 24, 2004 08:44:11 PM new
Wrong again! A gay person's lifestyle DOES NOT affect anyone. So to say they are forcing it onto another person is nonsense. A gay person's life doesn't affect you unless you want it to.
If a gay person was in the closet and you never knew he/she was gay, how would that affect you?
True Americans do not exclude anybody. They recognize that everyone should have the same rights. Bigotry, intolerance and hatred are cancers of the mind.
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Twelvepole
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posted on July 24, 2004 08:46:55 PM new
Yeager we will never agree on this subject and you have totally not answered the question...
Why are they against the bill currently in congress to allow the states to decide?
AIN'T LIFE GRAND... 
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Twelvepole
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posted on July 24, 2004 08:53:53 PM new
Wanted to add that homosexual child molesters do not affect me either.... but it is wrong all the same...
The sentiment that is doesn't affect "you" is WRONG... you have no idea what affects a person or not...
Unfortunately little by little people have been fooled in to tolerating this abomination, so now as it locked onto society as fungus that won't go away... it does not mean they should have privledges for the wrong choices they have made.
AIN'T LIFE GRAND...
Homosexuality is a choice that can be corrected...
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kraftdinner
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posted on July 24, 2004 08:54:32 PM new
Right on Yeager. Because it's stupid and a waste of money. What if the government said each state should decide what everyone wears? It shouldn't even be an issue to decide.
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parklane64
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posted on July 24, 2004 09:40:09 PM new
My, my, you do have a skewed perspective don't you? How does a personal decision to abrogate the reason and intent of sexuality equate to the wearing of clothes? You have taken your sexuality and side-tracked it into an abhorrence before just about every man-imagined God AND nature. Now you want to trivialize sexuality even more by equating it to a vanity issue? You have a problem that goes way beyond sexual orientation.
____________
Hebrews 13:8
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kraftdinner
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posted on July 24, 2004 09:46:30 PM new
Parklane, are you trying to re-live scenes from My Fair Lady? What are you talking about? It's not clothes, it's the principle. Are people that fried that they think gay marriage is really an issue? Please.
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yeager
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posted on July 24, 2004 09:55:45 PM new
Twelve says,
Wanted to add that homosexual child molesters do not affect me either.... but it is wrong all the same...
Again, another nonsensical comment attacking gays. It seems that you think that all pedophiles are gay. This is NOT true. Why don't you include ALL pedophiles, including those who molest girls. Is that group acceptable to you, as you seem never to mention them? Is the catholic priest that molest both girls and boys any different. Talk about abomination.
Parklane,
What a person wears DOES NOT affect you. I suppose you are the type that says that a young girl who wears a short dress is "looking to be raped". Is that part of your thinking???
True Americans do not exclude anybody. They recognize that everyone should have the same rights. Bigotry, intolerance and hatred are cancers of the mind.
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Twelvepole
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posted on July 24, 2004 10:00:13 PM new
kraft you are making my point, the left is not going to be happy until homosexuality is shoved down everyone's throat...
Should I dig up past threads where you same people were advocating the states should decide? Now that may have an opportunity to decide they can decide without interference from the federal government or other states...
Why is that wrong?
Homosexuals have made this an issue, they are the ones who have brought this out now... they were hoping that it would slip under the radar... but guess what... it hasn't and is one of the top issues...
Let them make everyone happy and go back into the closet... or make a new sexuality choice...
AIN'T LIFE GRAND...
Homosexuality is a choice that can be corrected...
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Twelvepole
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posted on July 24, 2004 10:02:43 PM new
Yeager to me, the only true pedophile are the ones that do attack young girls.... the rest are just homosexuals...
Like I said we will never agree on this issue, but at least more true Americans agree with me
AIN'T LIFE GRAND...
Homosexuality is a choice that can be corrected...
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parklane64
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posted on July 24, 2004 10:59:38 PM new
KD said, "Are people that fried that they think gay marriage is really an issue?"
You can get 'gay married' every day of the week, but it isn't an issue. The fact that marriage is defined as between a man and a woman is.
You can try to re-write laws, you can attempt to illustrate how antiquated tradition is, you can howl at the moon and scratch your ear with your foot; It does nothing to alter the fact that your chosen lifestyle is outside of the accepted norm and is only a parody of marriage. You cannot change the hearts of men, so you might as well keep on calling them names.
____________
Hebrews 13:8
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kraftdinner
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posted on July 25, 2004 12:16:03 AM new
Parklane, just because marriage has always been defined as something between a man and a woman doesn't mean these traditions shouldn't be revised to keep up with the changing times. If religion wasn't involved, it would be a natural process without all the politics.
"... It does nothing to alter the fact that your chosen lifestyle is outside of the accepted norm and is only a parody of marriage. You cannot change the hearts of men, so you might as well keep on calling them names."
Are you talking to me? If so, when did you become knowledgeable about my lifestyle? Who's hearts am I trying to change? When you talk about norms, you are talking about sheep that need norms as a safety net. Without them, people don't know what to believe. I'm beyond that. 
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crowfarm
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posted on July 25, 2004 05:18:05 AM new
The Right is not going to happy until RELIGION is shoved down everyone's throat so guess what
it's a TIE!
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Twelvepole
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posted on July 25, 2004 05:51:05 AM new
Wrong crowfarm, but then as yo uhave pointed out... which religon? People on the right want their freedom to have religon...
I notice none you anti-religous people ever say anything about our money... but everytime you use it, IN GOD YOU TRUST!
AIN'T LIFE GRAND...
Homosexuality is a choice that can be corrected...
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crowfarm
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posted on July 25, 2004 07:00:05 AM new
Twelve that is the biggest stretch yet to non-prove a point.
But if you want to go that route, yes, the "in god we trust" thingy IS religion being shoved down our throats but hardly(and impractically) an important issue when there are so many more real battles to be fought.
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Twelvepole
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posted on July 25, 2004 07:05:06 AM new
Why did homosexuals do this now when we should be focusing on other things... however I think even they are surprised that America does not really accept them...
Even Kerry is not for homosexual marriage...
AIN'T LIFE GRAND...
Homosexuality is a choice that can be corrected...
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logansdad
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posted on July 25, 2004 07:15:54 AM new
Homosexuality is a choice that can be corrected...
Since you seem to believe in NARTH so much. I guess those gays that converted back to being straight made a choice to be straight again. So in essence being straight or living the straight lifestyle is a choice.
Let's have a BBQ, Texas style, ROAST BUSH
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All Things Just Keep Getting Better
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We the people, in order to form a more perfect Union....
.....one Nation indivisible, With Liberty and Justice for ALL.
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Twelvepole
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posted on July 25, 2004 07:37:29 AM new
Those that received help corrected the mistake they made when they chose to be homosexual, we are ALL born striaght... hardwired... for attraction to the opposite sex... they were straight the whole time, but made a choice to be homosexual, just as you have done....
It really bothers you being homosexual doesn't it... deep down you know that your lifestyle choice was wrong....
Logansdad, your continuing down this path shows how reall unahppy you are about the choice you made... try NARTH since you seem to bring it up more ofter now...
I found the site for you and am glad you recognize you are not trapped in this choice.
AIN'T LIFE GRAND...
Homosexuality is a choice that can be corrected...
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davebraun
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posted on July 25, 2004 07:44:51 AM new
Now Twelve has gone into the therapy business. Have you hung up ta shingle yet. I suggest "Yhe crooked straightened" as on of your claims. Your belief in religious intervention and "choice" is nothing more than snake oil.
[ edited by davebraun on Jul 25, 2004 07:45 AM ]
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logansdad
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posted on July 25, 2004 08:39:54 AM new
Those that received help corrected the mistake they made when they chose to be homosexual, we are ALL born striaght... hardwired... for attraction to the opposite sex... they were straight the whole time, but made a choice to be homosexual, just as you have done....
What a lame excuse...correcting a previous mistake. Can I use that excuse when Bush is voted out of office in November? The American people are correcting a previous mistake but not electing Bush.
But back on the topic. I have shot down your theory three times aleady and you still choose to defend it. Go ahead, but this doesn't surprise me coming from someone with a second grade education. Where is your evidence supporting your ridiculous claim?
Either you are straight or gay. You can't be gay on the outside and be straight on the inside. Those in NARTH were gay and chose to be straight again after going through a series of brainwashing.
Let's have a BBQ, Texas style, ROAST BUSH
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All Things Just Keep Getting Better
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We the people, in order to form a more perfect Union....
.....one Nation indivisible, With Liberty and Justice for ALL.
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logansdad
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posted on July 25, 2004 08:41:47 AM new
Spaniards support legalization of gay marriage
As the socialist government in the traditionally Catholic country of Spain draws up legislation to allow gay and lesbian couples to wed, a new poll shows that two thirds of Spaniards back the move. The Centre for Sociological Investigations (CIS) showed 66.2% of a random sample of 2,400 people said they felt gay and lesbian couples should be allowed to marry, Agence France-Presse reports. Just less than half the sample, 48.2%, said they thought same-sex couples should be allowed to adopt children, with 44.6% opposed, according to the poll, conducted in June. Three quarters of those polled said that where children are concerned, the overriding factor is the good of the individual child regardless of its guardian's sexual orientation. Overall, 42.9% of the poll sample said they believed they were "very tolerant" toward homosexuality, although 40.9% disagreed with it.
Since his March election, socialist prime minister Jose Luis Rodriguez Zapatero has placed the issue near the top of a liberal social agenda. Although Spanish bishops have spoken out against Zapatero's plans on gay marriages, the CIS poll showed the Catholic Church is steadily losing influence. According to 88% of those polled, gays should not be subject to any kind of legal discrimination, although that fell to 79% when they were asked if homosexuality was as respectable as heterosexuality. Whereas Spain is nominally 95% Catholic, only 79.1% of the poll sample defined themselves as such, and 48% said they almost never attend Mass. During the 1939-1975 military dictatorship of Gen. Francisco Franco, homosexuality was officially banned.
Let's have a BBQ, Texas style, ROAST BUSH
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All Things Just Keep Getting Better
------------------------------
We the people, in order to form a more perfect Union....
.....one Nation indivisible, With Liberty and Justice for ALL.
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maggiemuggins
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posted on July 25, 2004 10:17:33 AM new
Here it is in a nutshell.
If government is going to sanction/regulate marriage and thus convey upon it certain rights and privileges, then it cannot discriminate. Thus, it must allow for the same sex marriage.
As has been pointed out, if all parties are consenting adults, then the question comes as to why government should regulate/prohibit it.
Remember, we are talking about the contractual relationship which is recognized by the government and not the religious aspects of the sacrament of marriage.
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Twelvepole
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posted on July 25, 2004 10:25:28 AM new
Your nutshelll is left leaning, and won't fly...
People of these UNITED STATES do not want homosexual marriage... that is the nutshell
Because this is an election year elected officials were afraid to discuss amending the constitution, that is not dead just tabled until next year...
However this new bill will allow the states to decide what they wish to do without federal government interfernece...
Homosexuals do not deserve the priveldge of marriage...
Logansdad you have proved nothing son... except you refuse to acknowledge that the American people really only barely tolerate your chosen lifestyle.
AIN'T LIFE GRAND...
Homosexuality is a choice that can be corrected...
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parklane64
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posted on July 25, 2004 10:30:29 AM new
Oh yea, the Spaniard's cut such an honorable trail to follow.
____________
Hebrews 13:8
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Twelvepole
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posted on July 25, 2004 10:32:35 AM new
I yet to see one reponse as why the left is against the states to decide this issue?
AIN'T LIFE GRAND...
Homosexuality is a choice that can be corrected...
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maggiemuggins
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posted on July 25, 2004 10:34:31 AM new
Twelve.. could you please explain to me, in plain English, without sarcasm or insults.. how you believe Homosexual Marriage will affect or harm us as Heterosexuals? This is the part I don't understand in your posts.
Thank you. Maggie
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logansdad
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posted on July 25, 2004 10:47:33 AM new
Maggie, he wont be able to give you a reason other than he thinks it is wrong. End of story. Because it is wrong it should not be allowed.
Those that oppose gay marriage have refused to look at themselves and see how they have destroyed the "concept of marriage". They refuse to accept divorce as the downfall of marriage. They refuse to accept allowing couples to get married for the sake of insurance and survivor benefits without any basis for love is another factor. They refuse to accept reality based marriage TV shows also harm marriage. Instead the straights on this board who are opposed continue to laugh at the above reason instead of being responsible for what has happened. I don't see how gay marriages have caused the downfall of "the sancity of marriage" in the past two months when marriage has slowly be destroyed over the past 30 years by the straight people.
Let's have a BBQ, Texas style, ROAST BUSH
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All Things Just Keep Getting Better
------------------------------
We the people, in order to form a more perfect Union....
.....one Nation indivisible, With Liberty and Justice for ALL.
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logansdad
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posted on July 25, 2004 11:08:55 AM new
I yet to see one reponse as why the left is against the states to decide this issue.
One state did decide to allow civil unions and then the government has to setp in a pass a federal law - the DOMA.
One state did decide and then an activist president had to take an extreme measure to preserve something most Americans are making a mockery of.
You have yet to show how gay marriage will corrupt society.
Let's have a BBQ, Texas style, ROAST BUSH
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All Things Just Keep Getting Better
------------------------------
We the people, in order to form a more perfect Union....
.....one Nation indivisible, With Liberty and Justice for ALL.
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Reamond
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posted on July 25, 2004 12:55:36 PM new
maggiemuggins' "nut shell" hit the nail right on the head.
The issue is not about any of the religious aspects of marriage.
There is no reason gays should not be given equal protection and equal due process of marriage.
We have also changed what "traditional" marriage is over the centuries in any number of ways.
Just a century ago a wife was still seen as a chattel of the husband, and at law the husband and wife were considered one person and that person was the husband.
Inter-racial marriages were a "states rights" issue just several decades back.
"States rights" has become a code word for bigotry and inequality.
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neroter12
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posted on July 25, 2004 01:04:20 PM new
I think the biggest fear is it will throw the taxation system into chaos.
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