posted on December 30, 2000 10:47:42 PM new
Looks yet another increase in restrictions and effectively an increase in fees (if you can't sell directly to other users then its either pay them more or sell less). Also BuyItNow, which I find somewhat useful (better yet if it worked more often) will probably soon cost $0.50-$1.00. If I can't sell additional items without ebay or use it to promote other items, the already high listing costs are just not worth it.
That being said are there any good alternatives to eBay? I find amazon and yahoo just too poorly designed. So far Haggle seems to best thought out site other than ebay, its free but unfortunately does not get enough traffic.
It seems strange that they want to crack down on extra sales which they would probably can't control, while people are selling overclocked CPUs in systems, pirated items and so called information disks.
On another thought does anyone know anything about Take to Auction.com? It looks interesting but on the other hand it seems like they are just polluting ebay with more retail priced products.
posted on December 30, 2000 11:19:27 PM new
'design' is not a criteria I use for judging auction sites. traffic is. The only other site that has any traffic at all is Yahoo, and even there the culture is much different than that at ebay. on Yahoo you're more likely to list at your BIP* price, and more likely to have to wait multiple relists until a sale occurs.
sniping aside, eBay really is more like an auction, whereas Yahoo is more like a store.
posted on December 31, 2000 12:00:37 AM new
I would say design is quite important. If a site is poorly laid out and counter intuitive, traffic is virtually useless as anything rarely gets sold. I noticed this on amazon most, stats show lots of traffic on amazon's auction site, much less but still lots view items, and almost no one bids. I have found others with much less traffic but more friendly interfaces are much better for # of sales. Maybe this is just me or the items I am selling... Unforutnately all of them are still nothing compared to eBay.
[ edited by vfxweb on Dec 31, 2000 12:02 AM ]
posted on December 31, 2000 05:08:00 AM new
some possible alternatives:
www.321gone.com
and
www.dutchbid.com
I really like the way 321Gone is designed... it's simple and easy to list (I put some sample listings up last month at some of the smaller sites) - but since they're new, they don't have the traffic. Sure wish they did. Perhaps if Sellers and Buyers got organized and agreed to list a certain amount of items and shop for a certain number of hours on the site it would create a noticeable impact.
The other site (dutchbid) seems to have a bit more traffic. They recently "bought" GOLDS AUCTION (Golds Auction closed down a couple months ago due to the sites outstanding debt.) Dutchbid has a fairly comfortable format AND the benefit of the bulk of Gold's Auction community members who have found their way over to that site.
Either site could be turned into a nice little selling niche... but it takes traffic to make traffic, and the question is: Do they have what it takes to still BE THERE next year, if we sink our time and efforts into them?
Folks who are not pleased with the changing marketplace at eBay must take a serious look at their options. Do we want to grow and change the eBay way? Or do we want to put our Internet businesses out on a limb in hopes of cultivating a marketplace that grows and changes based on the TRUE needs of the very folks utilizing the site?
(Personally... I believe that if enough folks wanted to make a difference, they could continue at eBay while growing traffic on another site simultaneously by listing a percentage of their items AND spending a certain percentage of their SHOPPING time on that same site). Sellers won't continue to list items, if bidders don't bother to bid... and folks won't bid if there's nothing listed.... It's a tough catch 22 that we've been caught up in!
AND.... after growing an alternative site to the point of realizing adequate success... what's to stop them from going public and becoming another Wall Street driven baby eBay?
Many folks tried it with Gold's Auction. Gold's Auction ran out of money before they began charging fees... Can the folks at DutchBid (or even 321Gone) get organized and carry a plan that is profitable for both the community and the owners of the site? Who knows!
posted on December 31, 2000 07:17:48 AM new
www.321gone.com
Looks quite good but the number of items listed under computers is pretty small. About the same as my old setup. I might list some stuff just to try it out. When I had a very large number of different items to get rid of I setup my own auction for a while. This worked ok as I actually got multiple bids on most everything.
eBay is just too big as a single player, and they are starting to charge anything they feel like (note all the extra service costs and feature prices). I am willing to bet that in the future all the large companies (SUN, SGI, USPS etc..) Selling on ebay will be able to wave their feedback for a fee, as I noticed that some them have quite a few negatives built up.
posted on December 31, 2000 07:39:57 AM new
vfxweb
It is hard to recommend a site to some one if you don't know what they sell. I have a friend who deals in older china pieces and older breakable type items, she has done quite well on a site, I believe it is called Old & Sold - something like that.
I tried the same sight, but since I seldom deal in such items, it was a waste of my time, but works well for her.
Obviously, there were sellers on Gold, I have no idea what they sold, but something sold here - but it most likely depended on what one was selling.
Point is: it is hard to recommend a secondary site without knowing what someone seller.
**********
Dottie:
You are right, design is not that important, nor shouldn't be for the seller, IF the site has buyers of their item, one can adjust to a site's design. Needless to say, if there was a site that produced well sellers, would take the time to learn the style of said site.
*******
It seems to me that one of the major problems in finding a secondary site, is the eBay Mentality. No site will work like eBay, either in the way it produces, or the way it is designed. If you can't test a site, and leave your eBay mentality behind, most tests of other sites will fail.
EXAMPLE: An car with an automatic transmission and a car with a stick shift, are totally different to drive BUT they both get you where you want to go, they just don’t function in the same manor. BUT if you insist on driving the stick shift like you would the automatic – your car won’t take you anywhere!
EBay is one type of car, Yahoo another. You can’t get anywhere trying to drive one the same way you do the other.
***************
Last year at this time, I decided to do a serious test of Yahoo. I tried and quit; I tried again and quit. Then I got serious. My elder son who is an adult, was selling like heck on Yahoo, and I couldn't stand the fact that he could make the system work for him and I couldn't. It was a challenge. I discarded my eBay mentality, and went back and tried Yahoo once more -
Now, a year later, as a eBay Power Seller, I sold twice as much on Yahoo as we ever did on eBay! Once we got the hang of Yahoo, and established a steady flow of sales, we began backing off our costly eBay postings, and dropped them to only 10% of our over all posts. In 2000 we doubled our sales by learning to use Yahoo.
**********
We have had limited success on Lycos in the Fair Market group. We test Amazon every few months, but have never found it to produce as it did during its first 6 months. We tested BidBay but although we liked the site design, the buyers weren't there.
We are always testing new sites, and to me the ONLY fair way to test is with the very best items you have - items you KNOW have sold good on other sites. That gives the test site a true opportunity to produce (if it has the ability).
Best of wishes in your search.
Wishes to you and yours for a Blessed 2001. Our New Years Greeting to YOU at this URL:
posted on December 31, 2000 07:44:46 AM new
Lowestbids.com would be an alternative to eBay. They don't get the traffic that eBay does, and they are still fairly new. However, they do post the number of auctions and the number of items they have listed on their site. Plus, I just received an e-mail from them saying that they now have a bulk item loader.
Maybe things are looking brighter for all of us.....
posted on December 31, 2000 08:14:17 AM new
Well i see there are alot of people not happy with the new ebay features,and cant figure out what to do.we have been learning how to sell at yahoo for about a year now,things at yahoo have improved some. not like ebay but think about this.when we put as much effort into listing at yahoo as we did at ebay things sold,and lately we have wasted 2.00 to list at ebay get no bids then went to yahoo and sold it.every site will grow from word of mouth not advertiseing.as did ebay.traffic will shift only if sellers shift sites.but if everyone only complains about this or that and never puts any effort into another site then ebay will remain the giant.it takes hard work and consistancy to change things.our new policy for ebay will now be to list frist at yahoo then list at ebay,as we feel ebay cannot legally controll our inventory outside of ebay if we list it first elsewhere.but that will need to be challenged in court for anyone to find out if federal law will allow ebay to have a monoply on our unsold stock.which is mind boggling to say the least.yahoo is still slow but growing,they are allready a public company so the fear of that is not there.sellers make a site [not buyers]if others only complain and dont try listing at other sites they are just as much to blame for what is going on as they wont try new things to make a change.but only complain about the problems.may you all have a prospoures new year.
posted on December 31, 2000 08:25:23 AM new
Take another look at YAHOO and see if you can't find a way to make it work for you.
While other sites might provide opportunities, no other sites seem to have the combination of mass, willingness to work with sellers and profitability that YAHOO presently offers.
No doubt there are a long list of things we might want changed with the default listing order being number one. But ask 1000 sellers which site, other than eBay, is providing the most profit and I have no doubt that the overwhelming answer would be YAHOO.
They have come a long way in just the last year and are in the best position to be the "other" major site.
True, it is mostly a one bid marketplace and my 80+ items are all 1st Bid Wins listings but that approach is spoken of as being the next big wave. Meg mentioned that as a major approach eBay is moving towards and Half.com expansion plus BIN pricing demonstrate eBays intent to feature that selling model.
No question the glass is half empty at YAHOO but it's also half full and moving in the right direction.
posted on December 31, 2000 09:17:45 AM new
Thanks for the warm welcome, Pocono .
Seriously though, I know what you are getting at. And like I said before, I'm not the guy that you think I am. I don't even remember that person's name. I am an actual user on lowestbids.com (under a different username there), and I have a couple of things up for sale. The topic asked for alternatives to eBay, and I threw in my two cents.
posted on December 31, 2000 09:19:27 AM new
I would also like to point out that I have yet to get a virus from the download. Besides, if you acutally took the time to look at it, you would see that when you click the button to close it, you are given the option to either minimize it or to close it out.
posted on December 31, 2000 09:32:59 AM new
No real alternative? Please explain what you mean. And what would you define as a real alternative? I'm sure that many people would disagree with you and say that a site like Yahoo! is a great alternative to eBay.
posted on December 31, 2000 09:43:03 AM new
Well, for the main sort of stuff I buy and sell [antique pocket watches], I have yet to find a decent alternative to eBay. I did note a lot of pocket watches on Amazon.com last time I checked, but most were "incorrectly" [I'll give the sellers the benefit of the doubt and not say "fraudulently"] described and had extremely overinflated prices. And none of the other sites have enough traffic to support a viable marketplace for antiques and collectibles.
However, I did find Gold's to be an excellent place to sell stuff like used books, videos and DVD's. These were items of personal property that I decided to get rid of, so I wasn't asking very much for them. And I was usually able to sell stuff the first time listed, sometimes the second. I doubt anybody could have made a living selling at Gold's, but there did seem to be a large enough core group of members to make it worthwhile to sell SOME things.
Which means that I will probably check out dutchbid.com and give them a go. Since I'm not trying to make a profit on these items, I'm more than happy to list them low and have them sell at my starting bid [hey -- if I can get $5.99 for a video I originally bought for $19.99 and have enjoyed watching a few times, I'm happy]. Unfortunately, there are SO MANY books, videos and DVD's on eBay that it's unrealistic to expect anybody to notice my listings there. But at a smaller site I might just stand out from the crowd.
Barry
---
The opinions expressed above are for comparison purposes only. Your mileage may vary....
posted on December 31, 2000 09:58:01 AM new
What I mean is that the day you go to another auction site to sell the widget you bought for a quarter at Goodwill or at an estate sale, and then sell it for $10, $20 or whatever, without having to relist it a Gazillion times, then I will consider that site a real alternative.
I said it once and I'll say it again: I would rather pay for my items to actually sell on eBay, than to go somewhere else and let my items gather dust there, just because its free.
posted on December 31, 2000 09:59:52 AM new
Point taken, preacher. But, it does seem that a lot of people are having great luck with free sites like Yahoo!, and terrible luck with eBay.
posted on December 31, 2000 10:08:38 AM new
Folks say "competition with eBay" like there's another site that's equal to eBay. Not! Despite appearances, eBay did not appear overnight. They did grab a lion's share of the market, but on the other hand, they are responsible for making online auctions a household word.
Since Yahoo is free, there's absolutely no reason not to list every valuable and collectible item there first with a reasonably high minimum bid or buy-it-now price. It may take a year or two or three, but eventually bidders will figure out that the good deals are at Yahoo. Then the scales will be more balanced.
Instead, sellers moan about the lack of competition, then line up at eBay like sheep waiting to be shorn. Duh!
posted on December 31, 2000 10:11:56 AM new
twinsoft, your last statement is my entire point. Why is it that people gripe about eBay or the lack of competition, yet continue to stay with eBay? Like you said, eBay didn't become a giant overnight. And neither will all of the auction sites that are out now. But, in order for their to be good competition, people need to be willing to try the other sites, and if they like it, stay there and get others to come with them.
posted on December 31, 2000 11:05:56 AM new
Last fall I asked sellers to put up 5-10 auctions on another auction site, and to keep plugging at it each week.
Things were on the summer slow down at ebay and I thought "why not"
I choose yahoo, and like some above posts, I have had good and bad weeks with them, but I keep trying.
Us sellers keep lamenting that no other site has the traffic, well buyers aren't going to be conditioned to go there unless there are things to buy. We have to be there first, or else no site is ever going to work.
I don't like the fact that most of my income comes from ebay, at least in the winter when there isn't much horse-training.
I would like to see another auction site start to be built up, and I think yahoo is the best alternative for me right now.
Ask yourself this, where would you be if ebay pulled the plug, or you were suspended?
posted on December 31, 2000 02:32:10 PM new
Hi everyone and a peaceful and prosperous New Year to us all!
As I stated in a previous post (different thread), nobody really knows me because I rarely post but I'm here all the time learning so much from everyone. I'm thankful for each and every "lesson" you've imparted. I feel like I know so many of you!
In reading the latest threads regarding eBay's newest restrictions, I have become quite restless and have, therefore, decided to break down and post (this'll be the 2nd time in less than a week). While I hesitate to reiterate exactly what I've posted in another thread (at the risk of appearing lazy - I am), my mind is only good for limited composition. So, if you've already read this (I hope not), my apologies! I don't want to start off boring anyone to tears (yet).
My reaction to a few hundred posts regarding eBay's latest move to further restrict its sellers and, consequently, buyers, was (and still is):
[Now, take a look at this scenario: An eBay rep is instructed to camp out on the boards to find out what the people are saying about the new Spam/Fee avoidance dictate and then is to take it back to eBay. What would he/she say? Boy you really got 'em rockin' this time...... (Boy, you really got 'em wrapped around your little finger....)
I keep looking at the "big brother" syndrome and wondering why, if it's so bad, don't sellers and bidders, alike, unite somehow and choose another venue (that is a venue!) to set up business?
I, personally, am feeling like I am being strangled. I hear people talking about how it can get worse and worse, just wait. What I don't understand, though, is why are we waiting? What are we waiting for? We all have a choice to stay or leave so why am I ready to go because I don't plan on selling behind the red curtain yet, I don't feel like I see anybody else really weighing this as an option - to leave, that is? I have been looking at other sites to go to but one person at a time won't have much of an impact on destroying an existent community or building a new one. It takes numbers to make an impact. Besides, I wouldn't know where to go to start over but I'll bet a million someone else reading this would.
While it's been stated that eBay will pay for this in the end when they have no community left to speak of, I don't see anyone mentioning how this is really going to come about. I only see posts about how this is just one more straw to - to what?
This community started once. What's to say a new community can't begin in much the same way? eBay is not the only game in town. Just one where we've established endless friendships and business relationships. It doesn't have to end by eBay.]
Everyone is entitled to their own opinion as to whether another auction venue can become what we have so loved (and miss) about eBay. We can learn from both pros and cons on this subject. But, I have to side with the people who have posted here that it's the sellers who bring the buyers. This is the key and this is the very reason why, united and organized, another venue can be built and will grow into what we are all looking to find. We can build it; we can invite our guests.
In the past few weeks (and before), I have visited numerous auction sites. I've keyed in my search criteria and came up with very little of interest to me. Why? Not because there's no buyer traffic there - because there's not enough diversity in the sellers present. There would be buyers (traffic) if there were sellers. And the sellers will predetermine the amount and types of buyers attracted.
What site would be a good alternative? As stated, I don't know but I think others with a bit more experience in this than I, might be better qualified to answer. A few months ago, I did take the step(s) to remove some eggs from my eBay basket and (begrudgingly) placed them at Yahoo. I say begrudgingly because it was a pain learning something new but it did pay off. Where my eBaying was failing, Yahoo filled the void. I'm not necessarily saying Yahoo is the answer. What I am saying is that "Something New" is the answer.
posted on December 31, 2000 02:52:05 PM new
Wow, that was a loooooong note.
ePAY = Corporate arrogance.
All of us sellers helped this become true.
YAHOO = ePAY's next aquisition (They're just waiting for most of us to switch over!)
No other site has the size or clout with the exception of Amazon and they're a mess.
For what you're talking about to work you'd need lots of sellers to jump ship somewhere and most likely take a hit on what strangled and mutilated sales they have on ePay with no guarantees that this new site wouldn't do the same route as ePAY or get bought out by them.
I think that sums it up.
But an association of sellers would be a good thing. Chaotic, but good.
posted on December 31, 2000 03:36:34 PM new
vfxweb & dave- My 2¢ on site design is that it is pretty important. For example, I won't buy on half.com because I don't think it's a buyer friendly site. since I don't buy there, I won't sell there either. OK, design isn't the be-all end-all, but it's not unimportant in my opinion.
dottie- excellent points! will take a look at dutchbid & 321gone.
reston ray- yes!!! I second that!!!
preacher4u said "What I mean is that the day you go to another auction site to sell the widget you bought for a quarter at Goodwill or at an estate sale, and then sell it for $10, $20 or whatever, without having to relist it a Gazillion times, then I will consider that site a real alternative."
preacher, do you mean to tell me you have never been able to do that at Yahoo? Because I do on a regular basis, and I always thought that if I could do it than anyone could!!!
canvid said "YAHOO = ePAY's next aquisition (They're just waiting for most of us to switch over!)"
Yes, this is a very real fear of mine too. If I do stay in online auctions in the new year, I will be seriously looking to expand my presence in new directions, beyond just Ebay & Yahoo, and will include amazon.com and possibly some other smaller sites as well. I have been well-rewarded for my efforts to learn Yahoo. I honestly think that diversity is good.
posted on December 31, 2000 04:49:18 PM new
Hi canvid! I'm in agreement about eBay possibly buying Yahoo. I only used Yahoo as an example of my "trying" out something new other than eBay. I was pleasantly surprised.
I'm not talking about everybody jumping ship completely from eBay, merely moving some eggs elsewhere (like Dottie said). But the "elsewhere" would have to be one or 2 other places, previously agreed upon (hee hee), with a good number of people doing it at the same time in order to make a noticable impact at the chosen site(s). We could inform our current customers (that we could trust) to check us out "over there".
I know there are both good and bad points to so many of these issues we're all discussing but one thing is for sure in my book - I really have a problem with eBay's latest and I will have to live with it if I stay there but I have a choice to accept it or reject it. We all do.
Maybe some will not find it in their best interests to take a risk and that's okay. But some will be able to at least give it a shot on a proportionate level. I think this is all that is needed.
Like barrelracer said, what are your plans should eBay (ePay! smile) no longer be here?
CA's got the right idea - diversify. I say diversify to the same place(s) to have an impact.
posted on December 31, 2000 08:20:07 PM new
i have never seen so many whiney people to afraid to try new things before in my life.why dont some of you posters stop wasteing time posting here and list a few things at yahoo.because it will be yahoo that will be the competion for ebay.you can beat this with a dead horse but if everyone justs whines and never tries. NOTHING will ever change.and if only 1 at a time goes elsewhere IT WILL MAKE A DIFFERENCE! to bad most people feel (i'm not going if joe or sally dont go) well i've said my peace on this matter oh by the way we have 250 things listed at yahoo and 31 at ebay.WE ARE TRYING TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE.........GOOD LUCK EVERYONE!
posted on December 31, 2000 09:50:12 PM new
I left eGREED when they announced the extortion (reserve) fees. I tried Golds and starved- amazon a little better (the page views you see on the auctions is because they are linked to the books) and then I tried Yahoo. I have had very good success with Yahoo with mostly antiques and collectibles.
I decided to try eGREED again this Fall and sold some items- but didn't do nearly well as I was doing on Yahoo and not nearly as well as I did (with the same type of items) before the extortion fee was implemented by eGREED last year. Some of the items did not even get a bid on eGREED -so I relisted on Yahoo with the same description, title, starting price, and reserve price- and they get more page views and bids. The secret for me is to feature the auctions on Yahoo - and you can wait until a couple of days before the auction ends. The minimum to feature an auction is .10 a day which is FAR less than eGREED. For less than a dollar I can feature an auction on Yahoo- and on eGREED with feature category it would cost $20. (or more) With searches such as auctionwatch - my items get page views and I get sales- PLUS there is NO final value fee! I make more in sales on Yahoo and I save about $1,000. a month in listing fees on top of that.
