posted on February 11, 2009 05:55:13 PM new
Yes, I saw Dr. Phil. That's where I got the figures for expenses for 1 year in my previous post. It was fairly interesting for a Dr. Phil show. They had bioethisists, a pediatrician and a fertility specialist on as well as Kate. Kate said she barely made it thorough the fist year with sextuplets and two? year old twins--and she has a very helpful husband who has a good job. She said it took 50 volunteers a week to help, and they dried up after awhile.
I fear those Suleman children will have a very hard life.
posted on February 12, 2009 12:55:22 PM new
I am sorry but I don't believe the $1.4/year million price tag to raise 14 children. If you divide that sum by the number of children that is $100,000/child/year. I am sure it can be done for a whole lot less than that.
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posted on February 12, 2009 01:44:47 PM new
I can't vouch for the veracity of this estimate shown on Dr Phil yesterday, but it did include getting a home big enough for the family ($400,000)and a van or other transportation. Also on the list were food, well-baby visits, vaccinations, child care and clothing. Sick baby visits, treatment for any disabilities were not included, nor was hospital care for the octuplets.
Supposedly, this is a conservative estimate and obviously, it is for the first year only and includes housing and transportation.
[ edited by coach81938 on Feb 12, 2009 01:46 PM ]
posted on February 12, 2009 02:24:26 PM new
Is Dr Phil giving the entire cost of a $400K home as a first year expense? Creative accounting, at best. The situation is bad enough, but tabloid TV exaggerating a dire-enough situation can't help.
A totally different situation: I used to work with a woman who grew up as one of 14 kids (15-year age span) in a 2 bedroom farmhouse. Her mom stayed home and worked the farm and her Dad had an outside job. Her mom and the girls had one bedroom - her dad and the boys had the other. I asked her how in the world her folks had any time to make all those babies and she smiled and said "Dad went home for lunch a lot".
posted on February 12, 2009 02:26:59 PM new
I wonder if this is where it comes from (maybe the Dr Phil person misspoke):
"For a single mother, the cost of raising 14 children through age 17 ranges from $1.3 million to $2.7 million, according to the U.S. Department of Agriculture." http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5ilIx-PXnXPpwF1a_nlRYF00fzBIQD969P20O0
$1.4 million is cost of raising 14 children to age 17 - not per year.
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posted on February 12, 2009 05:52:29 PM new
Pixia--I am aware that the Dr. Phil show is not the last word in facts, but I don't think they were looking at this from an accountant's point of view. It is show biz, you know--probably a little dramatic license. However, there is no denying that this family needs somewhere to live and $400,000 is not an exhorbitant amount for a house. There is no way they can stay where they are so it is a real expense---unless the state picks up the tab.
Neglus--I saw the same statistic as your link and I don't think the Dr. Phil list of expenses comes from that. They have their own researchers apparently and that is what they came up with. I can count on the fingers of one hand the times I have watched this show. I don't think it is very helpful to the people on the show or particularly educational. I watched this show because I was interested in the topic.
[ edited by coach81938 on Feb 12, 2009 06:11 PM ]
posted on February 12, 2009 06:07:50 PM new
Here is the doctor Phil list. The only thing that seems way out of line to me is transportation (don't remember what they included in that.) Clothing seems a little high, but not if diapers, blankets, baby wipes and the like are included.
Food $22,000
Housing $500,000
Transportation $225,000
Clothing $90,000
Health Care
$125,000
Day Care 150,000
I do not vouch for the accuracy of this list, but even if the total is half that, it is completely out of reach for most people.
posted on February 12, 2009 06:23:10 PM new
Doesn't Housing seem "a bit" high ($500k per year)? Will they trash 1 house per year and require a new one the next year? Ditto transportation. Are they traveling by private jet? Day care, clothing and food are in line. Edited to add: Daycare seems in line because 13 years ago, I paid $750/mo for one baby full-time (even though I only used them 3 days per week). If I had 14 kids, I would probably opt for a troop of 4 full-time nannies, should still be covered by the $150k per year. As far as healthcare expenses, I'd guess Dr Phil is assuming no health insurance. I sincerely hope that Obama's vision of affordable health care will be a reality- even if the rest us of carry the burden of the less than insurable. Almost $10K per child per year not considering extraordinary health issues is totally unacceptable.
[ edited by pixiamom on Feb 12, 2009 08:15 PM ]
posted on February 12, 2009 08:37:21 PM new
I believe housing was a one-time expense (I'm relying on my memory, which can be dangerous) however, they have it listed as if she would be paying cash for the house Transportation---can't think how they came to that number. The rest seems pretty much in line. All this is moot, since the Suleman family will probably be provided for by the state and donations.
I believe they were using this list as part of an illustration of her impaired judgment, ie that she was not capable of appreciating what it takes to raise 14 children, monetarily, physically and emotionally.
posted on February 12, 2009 08:41:50 PM new
Is this more realistic?
Food $22,000
Housing $40,000 (including mortgage and all utilities)
Transportation $17,000 including insurance + gas
Clothing $90,000
Health Care $30,000 including insurance + not covered deductibles (not for extraordinary health issues)
Day Care $150,000
The total is $349,000/year. Still beyond the reach of almost all Americans, but far less than Dr Phil's figures.
posted on February 13, 2009 05:15:38 AM new
Somehow I can't see the mom milking with those French manicured nails! But here's a link to make the donation profe: http://www.thenadyasulemanfamily.com
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posted on February 13, 2009 07:38:07 AM new
Yes, Pix, I think that is much more realistic. However, it might as well be $3 million a year for most of us. The difference is that we have an idea how much it would cost to raise 14 children and the octo-mom hasn't a clue in that La La land where she resides.
posted on February 13, 2009 08:45:58 AM new
Who was the first on this board to call the Jolie connection? I didn't see it then, but now reports are that besides trying to emulate her through surgery, octo-mom has been writing letters to Jolie and that Jolie is creeped out by her (huh? Jolie creeps me out)! Can this whole debacle be chalked off to FAN OBSESSION?
posted on February 13, 2009 09:14:35 AM newAccording to a statement from the Calvary Chapel:
"In response to recent inquires and media reports, Calvary Chapel Golden Springs is issuing this statement regarding several inaccurate assumptions regarding our involvement with Nadya Suleman, the Whittier mother of octuplets.
Nadya Suleman has recently commented she attends Calvary Chapel Golden Springs, which prompted several media follow up inquires concerning her attendance. Since our church is not membership-driven, we are unable to confirm or deny whether she actively attends this fellowship.
We can say, however, that she is not personally known to our pastors or staff. And to the best of our knowledge, Ms. Suleman's only contact with us was a minor inquiry regarding our Children's Ministry.
Ms. Suleman has also been credited with commenting that our church is in someway involved with the establishment of a foundation for donation distribution, providing her with financial assistance, and helping her locate a new residence. Our church is not involved in any of these activities.
Although we are not condoning the circumstances surrounding the births, we are excited Ms. Suleman did not choose abortion as an alternative. Because of the strain these new-borns will place on her family, they will need both spiritual and child care assistance from volunteers within the community.
Since Calvary Chapel Golden Springs will not be involved with the organization or handling of these assistance programs, individuals who are interested in assisting Ms. Suleman may contact her directly through her web page."
posted on February 13, 2009 10:46:37 AM new
She, who is not associated with the church tries to use the church to advance her fund raising base and the church, while disassociating themselves from that agenda tries to use her to advance their anti abortion agenda.
posted on February 13, 2009 12:09:23 PM new
Okay, it's a little snarky, but IMHO funny. My favorite line: "I think Angelina Jolie is trying to look like ME."
posted on February 13, 2009 01:02:51 PM new
Yesterday a follow-up to this issue on Dr. Phil had a plastic surgeon on, who scrutinized a close photo of the mom's face now compared with an older one. He said definitely the lips have been done, and some cheek and chin work, etc. Estimated cost: $20K - $30K.
I watch Jon and Kate Plus Eight frequently; they have a van large enough to transport all eight of the kids; at the beginning they had 6 car seats plus the two older girls. This mother will need 8 car seats and a vehicle large enough to hold them plus the other six--or will there be no family outings?!
_____________________
"Here in America we are descended in blood and in spirit from revolutionists and rebels - men and women who ***dared to dissent*** from accepted doctrine. As their heirs, ***may we never confuse honest dissent with disloyal subversion."*** --Eisenhower
posted on February 13, 2009 01:13:21 PM new
----"Every piece of news that comes out about this woman adds to the pile of oh-no-here-comes-the-train-wreck.
Not a single piece of news that makes me say, "gosh, maybe I was too harsh"----
Cash: This reminds me of the time in the early 90s when my mother, the very prim minister's wife, then a widow, married a con man. She called to say she was in love. We were happy for her. As each new fact emerged about him, "con man" was writ large on our brains. It was like peeling the onion. The marriage lasted 2 years, and she had the guts, at age 75, to divorce him, move away, and get on with her life.
I've told all my friends that if it could happen to my mother, who was always suspicious of men, it could happen to anyone's mother. I think she was really lonely, living in another state from us and saying she didn't want to travel or have visitors.
_____________________
"Here in America we are descended in blood and in spirit from revolutionists and rebels - men and women who ***dared to dissent*** from accepted doctrine. As their heirs, ***may we never confuse honest dissent with disloyal subversion."*** --Eisenhower
posted on February 13, 2009 01:38:38 PM new
I heard she's received death threats. That makes me think the subject is deeper than just her and her stupidity. I think she represents a culmination of all the mothers and children society supports. Because people are afraid to address the subject, it just festers under the rug until someone like Miss Suleman comes along and pushes everyone over the edge.
posted on February 13, 2009 01:55:06 PM new
Still laughing! Thanks for the link to the video, Cash. I had to watch the sequel as well. Too funny.
I suppose we should feel sorry for her, but somehow I can't. I do feel sorry for the children - not the Mom. What's to become of them?
I know! Maybe they could all move up to the governor's mansion in Alaska! Sarah can teach the mom how to shoot moose and polar bear to feed her brood! They could sell off Sarah's RNC supplied clothing to support them for a couple of months ... Sarah's church could adopt them since Nadia's church has denied knowing of her. IT would extend each woman's 15 minutes of fame for another half hour at least.
I don't think I will ever be able to look at Angelina again without thinking of Nadia.
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posted on February 13, 2009 02:15:31 PM new
Neglus,
I suppose at some level I do feel sorry for her, but it's a bit like the whacky contestants on American Idol. There are some that I think the producers should have avoided putting on air; maybe referred to a mental health clinic but definitely sent on their way.
In that case, the people are themselves bearing all the risk: they risk appearing foolish, and as painful as that can be, it's not dangerous. I've wondered if some of the people auditioning might be driven to self-destructive acts, but my guess is that the producers have enough sense to weed those out.
In the Suleman case, she has risked the health of at least 9 people and the happiness of 16 or more. The fact that her health and happiness were at risk also doesn't generate much sympathy with me; she's the only one who had a choice and the ratio is huge.
I don't have any shame in laughing at her, in being angry with her or her doctors, or in hoping for (at least) civil charges against the doctors.
I do feel sorry for her, but no more than I do for the crazy guy on the street who plays harmonica and sings about the lost love of his life. He smells bad, but that's the extent of his intrusion on other people's lives.
[ edited by cashinyourcloset on Feb 13, 2009 02:16 PM ]
Transportation---can't think how they came to that number. The rest seems pretty much in line. All this is moot, since the Suleman family will probably be provided for by the state and donations.