posted on October 28, 2001 12:20:32 AM new
So who can we safely give our money to to help causes? Geez. And I am so saddened to read this board will no longer be monitored in a few days. I hope it does not slip down to 'Who's in the room?' and 'Let's make smiley faces' mentality like other chat boards. If it does I am outta here.
posted on October 28, 2001 07:36:55 AM new
People, give yourselves dope slaps, maybe that will bring your senses back.
Even if we take the rumoured numbers to be fact...
50% of the 500 million to go to the victim's FAMILIES (note that this means that the survivors of the people who were KILLED, since dead people cannot receive money and it would do them little good right now anyway). NOTE: the 250 million that the families will receive from the Red Cross is far from being the only help that they will receive.
NOTE: the families of the people who died in the WTC or on the flights, are NOT the only ones suffering from this attack. Hundreds of people are homeless, or jobless, as a result. I see nothing wrong with them getting help from the Red Cross as well. Improving their infrastructure so they can better help these people IS a good use of this money.
posted on October 28, 2001 08:03:20 AM new
Peter -
I think the point is accountability. Healy has asked that the funds raised through their 9/11 campaign be tracked in a separate fund. That is not the same thing as advocating that the money only go to families. It means that the board would need to be above board about how they use the money. If the money is comingled with all other Red Cross funds, then how it is used is not open.
I don't know about parties - those dinners raise funds, and the wealthy that attend are not really looking at the events as all that much fun. However, the RC is talking about upgrading communications infrastructure, and that should be decided with regards to this money in the open.
Frankly, I think if the money was set aside for use in current and future terrorist related relief, that the donors would feel just fine about it.
And, face it, part of the problem here is that the RC already has a history of issues in this area. They need to listen to their donor base and be willing to be more accountable to the community.
posted on October 28, 2001 08:38:17 AM new
I am all for accountibility. Yes, they should open their books for all to see. Nobody has provided any evidence that they will not open the books on this money.
posted on October 28, 2001 08:55:32 AM new
You're still not getting the point. They have presented every intention to use the funds for purposes not originally intened by the donors. When people donate money to a fund which states it will be used to help the victims and families of the events of Sept 11, that does not mean buy an upgrade to the telecommunication system and figure out new blood handling methods.
When the Red Cross will not voluntarily particpate with the program the NY Attorney General's office has set up for funds accountability, then there is something wrong. In the past I have done work for government agencies and very high profile "charitable" organizations. It was horrifying to see how little of the money going through the system was never reaching it's intended purposes. The original comment about dinners and events was not too far off the mark at all.
Several years ago I was laid off from a job and the state unemployment system paid to put me through an entrepreneurial business program. About a year after it was over I received papers in the mail to fill out about the state of my business and review of the program I went through. Only then did a learn that the funds used to create and operate that program were federal funds specifically designated to benifit workers who had either been reduced in hours or lost jobs as a result of NAFTA. My layoff had absolutely nothing to do whatsoever with NAFTA in any form.
[ edited by avaloncourt on Oct 28, 2001 08:56 AM ]
posted on October 28, 2001 09:02:02 AM new
It's not that I think they won't open their books. It's just if they mix the 300M they have with the 500M they collected, then there's no way to say "we spent the money we collected related to 9/11 on xxxx."
Personally, I don't want to slam the RC or anything, and I think they are a fine organization. I'm more concerned that the clumsy handling of the money, and the unwillingness to keep the process 'in the sunshine' will hurt the organization and fund raising efforts. It's a political error that they did not need to make. And, I think Healy is acting with integrity (JMO, with no real knowledge of the inside of it. For all I know, she was an unethical monster the whole tenure - it just doesn't read that way in the papers).
However, I donated my money to the Sept 11 fund, since it is run by the NY United Way. I have more confidence in their orientation to the community. Not that United Way (national) hasn't had it's problems. But, that's how I saw it, long before this arose.
posted on October 28, 2001 09:49:08 AM new
My mother never would donate to the RC, I finally asked her why a few years ago. She told me that her older brother was a POW during WWII. When he was released, the RC was standing there with coffee and donuts, fine and dandy, right? Then had him sign a form deducting the cost of their coffee and donuts from his military pay.
No way will I EVER donate to the RC.
Not my name on ebay.
posted on October 28, 2001 10:08:13 AM newThen had him sign a form deducting the cost of their coffee and donuts from his military pay
Wow, can't imagine that....my Dad saw a lot of action in Italy and Germany with the 8th Army and never shared any stories but good ones about the RC.
I worked for them as a volunteer on the local level for a few years about a decade ago and all I can say is that, if they're not giving money to recipients, then there's some folks at the top getting fat on the donations....we ran an office on a shoestring and I don't ever recall even seeing money...
All I did was hand out vouchers for food, lodging and living essentials to families who were burnt out or otherwise displaced from their homes..... I recall we had a deal worked out with Goodwill for clothing in those situations..... I also spent a little time being a "good listener" for those same victims...
I eventually left because I thought my skills weren't being utilized and I tired of the politics of the organization...but, although I don't contribute, prefering to give back in a more personal way, I'll wait until all the facts are in before I pass judgement on their ethics regarding this tragedy...
Just think, after Oct. 31, this little pearl of wisdom will never make it here.......that's too bad..
Well, we won't see you here, but all the online traders are on the web elsewhere & I already know I'll see you there!!
So, most of us will not miss your pearls of wisdom. Maybe the mods will join us at another place, too.
[ edited by gr8ful2bhere on Oct 28, 2001 11:15 AM ]
posted on October 28, 2001 11:43:14 AM new
Gr8 said-
---However, I donated my money to the Sept 11 fund, since it is run by the NY United Way. I have more confidence in their orientation to the community. Not that United Way (national) hasn't had it's problems. But, that's how I saw it, long before this arose.---
Whoa there. Gr8- the United Way/september 11th have been one of the worst if not THE worst culprit in the WYC charity mess.
#1. It took them 5 weeks to even appoint a board, much less an allocation committee..
#2. As of the point they had collected 120+ million 3 weeks ago, they had only disbursed less than 6 million of that.
#3. They may be using 100% of the funds donated for disbursemnet for other specific 9/11 related charities (or they may not), but they as always are robbing Peter to pay paul, as they are siphoning funds from their other chapters (UWNYC as an example) to pay administrative costs.
#4. As they are only an intermediary charity, they are actually PREVENTING money from getting where it's supposed to go. The Red Cross is a front line charity that actually DOES stuff. The United Way is a charity money laundering machine.
#5. As of their last updated stats (10/15 below), the Septmeber 11th Fund claims to have over 170 million in the kitty, and another 150 million in pledges. THEY HAVE ONLY DISBURSED 16 MILLION. This is OUTRAGEOUS, if not criminal.
posted on October 28, 2001 08:12:26 PM new
Hi Valleygirl !
My mother never would donate to the RC, I finally asked her why a few years ago. She told me that her older brother was a POW during WWII. When he was released, the RC was standing there with coffee and donuts, fine and dandy, right? Then had him sign a form deducting the cost of their coffee and donuts from his military pay.
She was right in what she told you. My mother had 2 brothers wounded in WWII, one was in the Navy and the other in the Army. One was taken care of and sent home by the RC and the other received about the same amount of care from the Salvation Army. The one taken care of by the Salvation Army received continued care at home and got a "God Bless You Brother" when their job was done. The one taken care of by the RC received a bill exceeding his military pay for almost $1,400 and it took years for him to pay them back. That was a huge amount of money back then.
I never have and I never will contribute to the RC for this reason alone. My husband was in the 11th Airborne and has his own reasons for never giving them a dime. We both are as generous as we are able to be to the Salvation Army. They have always done wonderful things in our community and appear to be, as usual, an under rated help in the 9/11 relief effort.
posted on October 29, 2001 08:18:14 AM new
The situation isn't bad enough with the "charities" admitting that 100% of the funds are NOT going to DIRECT help to the victims & families; but don't you find it almost pathetic that "benefits" and pleas for MORE FUNDS are continuing in the name of 9-11?
There must be a point that we STOP with the "fund raising" for new computers, and TAKE CARE OF THE BUSINESS ECONOMY!
....unless the RC & others plan on passing out coffee and donuts to the coming unemployment lines!
posted on October 29, 2001 12:30:30 PM new
The mother is coming out in me when I say, "boys, girls, please if you don't settle down, you all will go into time-out."
I mentioned it on another thread where I read an article in the KS Star where one man who had given quite a bit of money was upset because he found out that 11 people were flown across the country to a funeral. As I also said if they were immediate family, that would be one story, but these were not. Without accountability, the donations are mighty tempting to some of those high above. Who would know if they scimmed a little off the top? No one would. Meanwhile, the mother of the single mother that was killed in the WTC will have to take custody and raise the grandaughter(s) and that probably wasn't in her budget.
Kudos to Dr. Healey for having some honor and integrity.
posted on October 29, 2001 04:27:59 PM new
All I can say is that the American Red Cross has the best public relations of any organization I have ever known.
They can take peoples money and use them for anything they please and the very people who are being defrauded will defend them.
The only other organization I have even seen come close is the ARAP. They poll their members as to what they want and then fund politicians doing just the opposite and still people join.
I guess there really is a sucker born every minute.
Over on the Round Table people have given personal experiences of how the RC came in after a disaster and set up to offer coffee and sandwitches to workers and residents and then they have the nerve charge $1 a cup like a catering service.
...that's too bad..