posted on February 25, 2002 10:52:54 PM new
Just bought an item with the dreaded Checkout feature. It's a thin magazine, and seller (10,000 or so feedback) says in TOS that shipping will be priority, $4! I e-mailed after auction close, said I was high bidder, gave my name and address, asked if media mail for $2 could be used instead.
Then I get the official EOA message from Ebay including the awful Checkout--which doesn't give me an option of working with the seller on the postage, and is now showing that my total is JUST the high bid, no postage showing. Duhhhhhhhhhhhhh.
So is the seller just too mighty to answer? Was I out of line asking for a break on the shipping? I know it was in the auction description, but sometimes it pays to inquire. The main thing is that I'll bet I don't hear from the seller, and I'm worried that this sale won't go through as it should.
I found the Checkout "forms" bulky and time-consuming.
posted on February 26, 2002 12:23:06 AM new
I always have problems dealing with the 10000+ crowd. They are super busy and many of them just dont answer e-mails.
posted on February 26, 2002 01:06:40 AM new
I agree. I used checkout for the first time the day. Very tedious to go page after page. To date I have yet to receive and end of auction acknowledgment from Ebay which I usually got prior to checkout. ( Obviously I don't buy much. Sell pretty much exclusively. ) I do not know if my seller even received a notice of the auction's end. Our only communication has been because I e-mailed him upon completion of the auction. I hated the whole process while I was going through it and wondered what "wunderkind" came up with *this* idea.
posted on February 26, 2002 01:44:14 AM new
As a seller, do you expect your TOS to be honored? Do you give breaks if asked? Just a thought. I have always just paid whatever the seller asked. I never thought of asking for a different mailing price.
posted on February 26, 2002 01:59:38 AM new
> I e-mailed after auction close
In my opinion, it is inappropriate to discuss shipping and handling prices after an auction closes. If you want media mail, ask the seller will ship discounted media mail before you bid on the item.
I once had a buyer comment that my s&h were too high because he lived in the same county. He felt I should only charge $2 of the $4 -- I said no to the $2. Its not like I forced you to bid on my product. He sent me $2 for s&h via Paypal anyway. What you gonna do?!
posted on February 26, 2002 08:04:51 AM new
Pmelcher: Yes, I DO give breaks to buyers occasionally. I occasionally refund shipping if I have overestimated the cost. I also offer a choice of shipping methods for light-weight paper items: 1st class or media mail. No buyer has ever begged for priority as a third option, for perhaps obvious reasons.
Yes, I'm slapping myself around for not paying attention to the $4 Priority mention in the auction description.
I must say, though, that this may be the last item I buy from a Power-Hungry Seller. I like personal service, and I GIVE personal service to my buyers. We'll see if I get a response to my e-mail. . . .
posted on February 26, 2002 08:15:20 AM new
May I respectfully suggest that whatever roadsmith's policies as a seller might be, they have no bearing at all on the transaction in which he was a buyer?
I see this on AW all the time and to be honest, I just don't get it. If I buy a book from Amzn, I don't expect Amzn to "work with" me on the postage. My own shipping policies as a business are irrelevant. Certainly Amzn doesn't care about them and I wouldn't expect anyone else I buy from to care about them, either.
posted on February 26, 2002 09:42:17 AM new
<b>road</b>, is the mag collectable or oversized? I know you mentioned thin, but I mean the "other" dimensions. Sometimes I sell mags and programs (not sure what you deal with and am not presuming to know more than you). While media often seems like a simple option for such things, if it's oversized then packaging is a hassle and it's just easier and sometimes just as cheap to go priority. If it's collectable, I'll opt for priority because of boxes and many collectors like to get their stuff fast. Also, I think it's been discussed before, but this is how some people make up a few dollars for listing items cheap cheap cheap. I tend to agree with "the crowd" here, if the shipping amount was an issue for you it should have been addressed before bidding. If you don't hear from seller in a couple days, I say go ahead and pay the extra couple bucks and be happy S&H isn't $10. I sometimes see such high S&H and it doesn't seem to stop bidders. But that's a whole other thread, isn't it! BG
`·. >(((º>`·.¸.¸>
ahwahneeliz
>(((º>¸¸.·.>((º>··.¸><((((ºcJ
posted on February 26, 2002 09:58:54 AM new
Some sellers may choose to stick with Priority rather than media mail because while buyers like the cheaper costs associated with medial mail, sometimes it takes longer to arrive and the buyers email the seller constantly, "the item should have arrived by now, when can I expect it?", "it's still not here"; "if I don't receive the item by tomorrow, I'm reporting you to ebay." Then the dreadful feedback, "great item but shipping was a little slow."
I've gone back and forth offering the Priority and media mail weighing which one causes less headache, and I realize that people want lower costs more than faster ship time, but I can understand why some sellers may not negotiate it.
posted on February 26, 2002 11:44:28 AM new
Okay, okay, everybody! I quit. I know I was wrong to ask for a shipping $ break.
ahwahneeliz: The item is a thin auction catalog for a line of pottery. It is about 8 x 10, perhaps 1/4" thick, and it is not collectable per se. Just educational for me. I've sold collectible paper items, like magazines, and sent them media mail (warning the buyer ahead of time that it'll take longer). I've just never heard of $4 shipping for a small magazine-type item.
The lesson for me, of course, is to ask the seller ahead of time if he'll accommodate my wishes. Live and learn!
posted on February 26, 2002 03:16:16 PM new
Considering the way bidders react to shipping quotes in auctions [factoring shipping into total amount willing to pay]; it is unfair to ask a seller to lower the stated shipping charge. Why? Because his/her final bid amount has already been reduced by the published shipping charges.
BTW, I do not understand the attitude of subtracting shipping from what you are willing to bid? It makes no sense to me. Imagine, I drive several miles to my favorite antique shop and purchase a $100 item, then tell the clerk "I'm only willing to pay $92 because I'm deducting my standard mileage charge."
posted on February 26, 2002 05:17:10 PM new
sun818-----
"I once had a buyer comment that my s&h were too high because he lived in the same county. He felt I should only charge $2 of the $4 -- I said no to the $2. Its not like I forced you to bid on my product. He sent me $2 for s&h via Paypal anyway. What you gonna do?!"
That would sure tick me off. What did you do?
I suppose if it was in the same county, you could have offered to meet at a public place to deliver the item, but you are certainly under no obligation to do this.
posted on February 26, 2002 05:24:37 PM new
As a seller I would have gladly complied with roadsmith's request to have the book mailed Media. What's the problem with that?
posted on February 26, 2002 11:16:14 PM new
I recently listed a very nice book of Winnie The Pooh quotations, with original artwork from 1964 ("Pooh's Birthday Book". Shipping was stated in the ad as $3. I figured (worst case) if the book sold for $1, I would still make back a buck to cover listing, FVF, etc.
Sure enough, the book sold for $1. I was disappointed because I thought the book was worth more, if only for the artwork.
Then came the email from the winner. "I live a few counties away, can you reduce the shipping?" I politely replied no. She emails me back suggesting my shipping is unfair. Again I reply politely. Another nagging email.
After a while, I emailed the bidder telling her that since her payment was overdue (three weeks), I was cancelling the deal. Bidder maintained that she "just asked" if I could work with her. Her "asking" was very much like a nagging wife, as in I'm just asking but I will make your life miserable until you agree.) We exchanged negative feedbacks over this stupid $1 auction.
I recommend if you don't hear from the seller, just send payment and consider yourself lucky. The time to ask for special shipping arrangements is before you bid.
posted on February 27, 2002 01:52:05 AM new
Maybe it's because it's late and I'm a tad tired....but I can't believe that all the above messages are about TWO HUNDRED PENNIES.
If the seller had to spend more than a few minutes handling this post-auction media mail request (to save $2.00) it could eat up any profits made on the sale.
posted on February 27, 2002 07:27:37 AM new
I don't know if it would pay to be honest in this case, but if twinsoft's buyer had e-mailed
me I'd be tempted to politely explain that
I had hoped to make at least $1.00 on the listing. Remind her about ebay fees and how that can quickly reduce profits etc.
Remind her that you are a seller and do this
as an attempt to make a little profit.
Sometimes I think buyers feel that if the
item is not new, it is garage sale material and the same time of behavior is exhibited.
Personally, I wouldn't think of arguing over such a petty amount especially when the Final Bid Price is already very low to begin with.
I feel that this explanation would be much nicer than simply replying with:
"When you placed a bid on this auction, you agreed to the X.XX shipping."
I might also tell her that if I was only interested in getting rid of the item, I could have donated it to X, Y, or Z.
Hopefully, she would understand my position
and pay the agreed amount.
Now, I did have an item a few months ago that
I sold to a lady.
She asked (after the auction)if shipping could be cheaper because she lived in the same state.
In this case, Priority and First class rates were nearly identical and I explained that
distance had no affect on the rates.
Then I thought about it for a few hours:
1. She seemed to be a very nice buyer.
2. She paid with a MO which saved me
the credit card fees that I might have had.
3. I already had made a nice profit
(around $10 for a $20 item).
After thinking about these things I e-mailed her back and told her that I thought she was a very nice person and "Oh what the heck, why not." I took around $1.00 off of shipping.
She replied and seemed to be very pleased, appreciating the compliments and "goodwill."
She promptly sent payment and left a very
nice FB comment afterwards.
You could argue that I lost a dollar on the deal, but I did gain a very happy customer in
the process. Plus, she had paid with a MO so I felt that I could justify the reduced
shipping.
posted on February 27, 2002 08:11:08 AM new
Well, shipping methods aren't usually flexible, IMO. If they gave a choice, then sure. But if they say Priority and you bid knowing this, you're obligated to what you committed to.
Remember that Priority Mail is used by many sellers because materials are free. I ship everything Priority possible because it's a no-brainer. I just seal a box and put the stuff in (packing where needed obviously). For someone to throw a monkeywrench into things asking for media mail would be a pain.
Besides for $3.50 Priority Mail, I would charge probably $3.00+ media mail due to the extra handling, supplies, etc. required. So it's not in anyone's best interests to make the change.
However, I agree about checkout. But I don't see the inability to "negotiate" a fixed term (in the sense that no options are offered) as being a problem with it.
posted on February 27, 2002 08:37:12 AM new
Hey, everybody! Please note that I DID cough up the $4 for the little item. Case closed?
My main beef was that Checkout seemed cumbersome and I disliked it intensely.
Rutabaga: HEY, $2.00 is $2.00! Don't you try to put the EXACT amount of postage on things you mail? Why don't you just throw an extra dollar or two on each package you send? A penny saved is a penny earned. I also must say that if the seller had been asking $3 instead of $4 priority for that item, I'd have paid it with no questions. I've just never seen $4 for a thin little booklet before. And Priority is only $3.50 minimum anyway, so in addition the guy was making another 50 cents' profit on the prohibitive shipping cost of a little booklet.
People at AuctionWatch sites are always worrying over shipping costs, as buyers and as sellers.
The one thing I can tell you is that the seller of this item (to me) won't be getting any more of my business.
posted on February 27, 2002 08:43:50 AM new
My minimum for Priority Mail is $5.00. This includes the postage ($3.50 or $3.95), delivery confirmation fee, and then small handling fee. It's stated up front and is not negotiable. You cannot ship a "small booklet" via priority for less than $3.50, so them's the breaks. He didn't make an extra $0.50 on the item, he simply recovered a portion of his expenses shipping the item to you.
Some buyers think they have a right to tell someone how to do business. Ebay is NOT a big garage sale or swap meat. It's an AUCTION and you're buying things from BUSINESSES. Some may be single-person operations who do this small scale. Others do this for a living. But if you go to Amazon or any other online business you don't get to dicate shipping terms to them. You pick what they offer and pay the costs they tell you.
posted on February 27, 2002 08:56:51 AM new
Of course it's not worth arguing over a buck or two. There's one item I sell that I always lose money on shipping, because the actual shipping cost is enough to scare away many bidders. So I just "absorb" the extra cost. If I'm making $10 or $20 bucks, it's no big deal.
But most of the items I sell are low end, and I do add a little extra handling because bookkeeping/packing takes 10 or 15 minutes per auction. The charges, including handling, are stated in the ad.
Since I'm making just a buck or two on the deal, it really isn't worth my time to answer a million questions before, during and after the sale. Usually there are plenty of bidders who know what they want and are willing to pay a fair price. It's just not worth my time to engage in back and forth emails. Again, high end items are a different story.
I don't mind emails so much. My issue is really with the contract itself. Ask your questions first, but when you place a bid, you enter into a contract as stated on the page. Don't try to change the terms after the auction ends. That is something I would never do. If the shipping is too high, I don't bid. I don't play games with sellers after I've already agreed to their terms.
If you think the debate I mentioned above is ridiculous, here's another one. I got into an email argument with one winner about the amount of sales tax. The dispute was over a quarter of a percent, or THREE CENTS. (My county also charges a tax.) After several back and forths, I finally replied, "either pay the tax in full or you will receive appropriate feedback." She finally agreed. Can you believe such a fuss over three lousy cents?
Apparently some bidders think sellers have nothing better to do than waste time arguing about pennies. My business is fine without these nincompoops, I don't need the aggravation. But really the issue is the contract itself.
posted on February 27, 2002 09:19:58 AM new
"so in addition the guy was making another 50 cents' profit on the prohibitive shipping cost of a little booklet."
I can't let coments like this pass by. I doubt the guy was making even a penny profit on this shipping. Driving to the post office two miles away may have cost him .60¢ gas,each way, so he actually lost money on shipping. Plus, he didn't charge the fair value of his time which may have added $8 additional to your handling. I wish buyers would realize that real costs to ship items are about triple than what they are charged, and sellers don't receive government subsidies to keep the prices low. It comes out of their pocket.
posted on February 28, 2002 07:52:52 AM new
My policy as seller is to give discounts to buyers when they buy multiple items. Nothing else. In fact, if I notice somebody bidding on several auctions, I will email them while the auctions ar going on.
BTW, I sell using media mail frequently. AS far as I can tell, AW has no way of saying I ship by media mail. The only choice that is close is 1st class. Although my auction terms say media mail, the template says 1st class. NObody has ever mentioned this as a problem, but I wonder. Any solution to this?
posted on February 28, 2002 05:18:20 PM new
I may be wrong, but I do believe that the "check out" feature when set up by the seller asks if you want the buyer to be able to change the total and thus allowing them to add the shipping charges-this is handy if you offer more than one method of shipping.
But, back to the subject I also dilike checkout and I do not use it. I am one of the die hards that still use PayPal and I just can't figure out how to use checkout and PayPal...just dumb of me I suspect!
afullbarn on eBay
posted on February 28, 2002 07:59:23 PM new
[i]I got into an email argument with one winner about the amount of sales tax. The dispute was over a quarter of a
percent, or THREE CENTS. (My county also charges a tax.) After several back and forths, I finally replied, "either pay the tax in full or you will receive appropriate feedback." She finally agreed. Can you believe such a fuss over three lousy cents? [/i]
Yes, since I received three negs over a similar fuss.
Apparently some bidders think sellers have nothing better to do than waste time arguing about pennies.
No, it's some bidders who literally have nothing better to do that waste time arguing.
posted on February 28, 2002 10:33:16 PM new
As a seller I offer shipping options and in some cases will work with the buyer to make sure they are happy with the deal. I guess I'm not quite as anal as some sellers are.
As a buyer, if I won an item and then noticed that the shipping was (in my estimation) unreasonable, I would smack myself for not paying attention when bidding and pay the fee without complaining.
Why whine about the seller when you were the one who didn't read carefully enough.
posted on March 1, 2002 10:17:43 AM new
As a seller, I try to be as flexible as possible with shipping, and I do not mind discussing it after the auction closes. If I sell something that COULD be sent in an envelope with a 34 cent stamp, I will do this if the buyer agrees to not holding me responsible for damage or loss. I still charge $1 for this though, as I have other fees to contend with like paypal and ebay, which I think is fair to get out of the shipping cost. Without insurance, or a bubble envelope, that could trim about $1.50 off the cost of this, so where as it would cost me $2.07 just to ship (57 cents for postage, $1.10 for insurance, and 40 cents for bubble envelope, and other minor expenses) and I would charge $3.00, if they agree to just the envelope, I would reduce the cost to $1. I've done it before, no problems.
A good seller tries to make their buyer happy if possible. It results in multiple sales...
posted on March 1, 2002 10:52:43 AM newA good seller tries to make their buyer happy if possible. It results in multiple sales...
Depending on which number you believe, there are anywhere between 19 million and 33 million registered eBay users. Yet seller desperation prevails in this forum. I don't get it.
A GOOD seller holds the buyer to the terms of the auction. A WEINIE seller, desperate for love and approval from his buyers, lets 'em have anything they demand. What a pushy buyer learns from this is that pushing gets results.
When the next seller isn't so amenable to having her TOS changed after the auction ends, sparks fly.
What's amusing is that the weinie seller prides himself on his 'excellent customer service' which is nothing more being too scared to enforce his TOS.
posted on March 1, 2002 12:15:02 PM new
Good customer service is not being a weinie or bending one's TOS. Customers should be able to ask about shipping options if they aren't given.
Sellers who do not offer any options should state it upfront. Then customers won't bother to ask and won't waste the seller's precious time with their questions or their business.
. Shipping was stated in the ad as $3. I figured (worst case) if the book sold for $1, I would still make back a buck to cover listing, FVF, etc.