posted on April 19, 2002 02:02:51 PM new
mastercard is not going to ban any ligit third party company and risk losing a shot at 10 billion or more in interest and fee on purchases...
they may push for these companies to tighten security but not stop them..
also keep in mind that this news said that visa was not making any changes or announcments let keep in mind that visa and master card are basically owned by the same people.. http://www.Dman-N-Company.com
Email [email protected]
posted on April 19, 2002 05:04:00 PM new
Some may believe this will happen and go into some type of panic but its a good guess that internet is the future of alot more businesses to come not yet seen I dont believe master card will choose to be left out of the larger part of it.
posted on April 19, 2002 06:26:59 PM new
this could be a good opportunity for paypal to ask each seller to apply for a merchant account??
can paypal provide merchant accounts??
i am not surprised at how the landscape changes,stakes are rising as far as doing business on internet,marginal sellers will eventually be forced out of prime venues and prime services.
if you dont have good merchandise and deliver in a timely manner,ebay fees will eat you up,if you dont show you are financially strong,you dont get a merchant account(commercial checking,p& l statement).
take a look at bidville now,same old items listed and relisted,poor pictures,awful description,lousy merchandise.
posted on April 20, 2002 06:56:43 AM new
Ok I just read the usa today story.
From the looks of it and by theory companies like CCNOW and other mom and pop 3rd party card processors will be out of business as well.
[quote] According to MasterCard, its 15,000 members, such as banks and credit unions, won't be able to process credit card transactions using third-party services such as PayPal. They are used most often by small merchants who cannot afford to take MasterCard, other credit cards or checks.
They mention paypal by name, only because they are the biggest, but there are dozens of companies if not 1'000's of CCNOW type companies aimed to serve the mom and pop's without personal merchant accounts. CCNOW is a classic example of 3rd party processing.
I use CCNOW for my website.........YIKES!!
Luckily for me I am already working to get a real merchant account for my business and eliminate CCNOW from my life.......they can take their 9% commission and stick it......well I'll let you all decide where....
posted on April 20, 2002 08:00:58 AM new
what about propay-35 cents and 3.5 % with 30 dollars application fee??
you key the cc data your self or send a propay invoice to the buyer??
what is that service called??third party or what??
propay is owned by lake bank.
I have heard VISA slapped a big fine on paypal for being a bad boy last year.
posted on April 20, 2002 10:07:37 AM new
CCNOW is not out of business It was sold to someone else or in the process of being sold the site is still there and working fine..
http://www.Dman-N-Company.com
Email [email protected]
[ edited by dman3 on Apr 20, 2002 10:08 AM ]
posted on April 20, 2002 10:07:49 AM new
Most sites like Cdnow are not 3rd party pay sites, they are direct sellers and have an account with the actual card servicers.
Paypal et al are 3rd party servicers. Paypal doesn't handle the sale, or the merchandise, and the seller doesn't have a merchant account. The "3rd party" to the transaction is Paypal.
posted on April 20, 2002 10:58:56 AM newthis could be a good opportunity for paypal to ask each seller to apply for a merchant account?? can paypal provide merchant accounts??
When I read what the spokesperson from PP commented, I got the destinct impression the "deal" they were working on with Mastercard is just that. Setting sellers up with a merchant account. I gleemed that from the statement they could do it cheaper than other sources.
If you have a Yahoo Store and you do not already have your own Merchant Account, you can apply for one through an independant company that works with Yahoo. I have a friend that has a Merchant Account for their B&M but when they checked about using it for their Yahoo Store the fees (the bank apparently charges more for internet sales than B&M) were prohibitive. So they signed up with the company recommended by Yahoo.
Maybe something like this is what PayPal is talking about?
Of course, if that is what they are talking about, small timers like me won't find it useful. I don't do enough volume or gross to make it worth anyone's while to set me up a merchant account!
posted on April 20, 2002 11:41:03 AM new
Concerning merchant accounts as a solution to the Mastercard news:
Many, many ebay buyers are not going to like it if they have to send their credit card no. to some anonymous ebay seller everytime they win an auction. I know I wouldn't do it.
It's much more secure to send your money to Paypal.
posted on April 20, 2002 10:01:11 PM new
Besides, if each Paypal seller had to set up their own merchant account, why would you need Paypal to accept Master Card ?
The whole idea of the 3rd party payer like Paypal is to avoid the costs of setting up and servicing a merchant account.
The issues between Paypal and Master Card are security issues that are somewhat unavoidable with a 3rd party payers.
If VISA starts getting a large percentage of fraud on 3rd party payers, they too will discontinue with Paypal et al.
posted on April 21, 2002 08:49:28 AM newMany, many ebay buyers are not going to like it if they have to send their credit card no. to some anonymous ebay seller everytime they win an auction. I know I wouldn't do it.
As is the case with almost ALL online merchant accounts, your credit card number is not "sent" to the seller. I never see my customers credit card numbers. Chase, my merchant account provider, collects payment info, and notifies me of payment (just like PayPal).
Paypal doesn't provide any service different from any merchant provider, like Chase or Wells Fargo. The only difference is that when you pay someone through PayPal, it shows up as "PayPal" on your CC statement, whereas with a real merchant account, it shows up as your business name.
And no, it isn't more expensive to have a merchant account.
posted on April 21, 2002 09:28:45 AM new
revvassago
You are wrong about the cost of merchant accounts cost over paypal.
Not only is it dependent on the company as to what the monthly or yearly fee is for the account but it's depended on the persons credit rating how much must be paid to get the merchant account.
posted on April 21, 2002 09:46:55 AM new
A merchant account has many other charges that Paypal doesn't.
One thing is a software lease. There are also charges for your monthly statements, etc..
The charges for Paypal are much cheaper than a merchant account.
The reason the card servicers may also want to discontinue service to 3rd party payers is the amount of service problems/inquiries for the Paypal account. If each Paypal member had their own account, Master Card would generate far greater service charges from the account holders, rather than getting less revenue through Paypal, but get all the problems that come from all the transactions on Paypal.
posted on April 21, 2002 09:47:56 AM new
not so,stores or seller who have their own merchant accounts do see the cc data of their customers.
it works the same as b&m store where you swipe the card,the customer comes to your store and enter all that data and you can recall that data or make a paper copy and keep with you.
yahoo recommends paymentech which is part of banc one,when you have an online store you need the ability to allow customer to enter cc data,autorise and check addr etc online and then process it backend.if you go with paymentech,you get the whole process integrated-customer enter cc,authorise real time,then you ship the goods and sumit the charge to paymentech to be processed.in days they will deposit the fund in your bank account.
its features are built into yahoo store features very nicely,when you receive a yahoo order,you get email notifcation as well as fax notification,and the cc data are shown on both(email requires encrption software in place),
some shops choose wells fargo or costco,it is not as convenient as paymentech because you cannot submit the charge online right from the store.
yahoo store design is really first class,you have to use it to appreciate how good it is,it allows you to print invoice,packing slip ,confimation emails and tell you what your customer last looked at before he comes to your store.
posted on April 21, 2002 09:59:52 AM new
paypal can offer merchant account to powerseller or anyone who wants one and create a link at end of auction which will take the bidder to a special page of that seller where they either enter their cc data or like yahoo wallet,they store that cc data will paypal and just enter their email add,password and pin number and dollar amount.
under this arrangement,paypal can tell mc that sellers are now responsible for handling their own chargebacks,and the bidders can still pay the sellers without giving away their cc data as paypal has saved it for them.
but my question remains,can paypal offer merchant account,i thought only banks and other financial institutions can??
also another consideration is for the seller who chooses to have a merchant account,there will be more paperwork when it comes to chargeback,would paypal still offer seller protection,the reason is that by having your own merchant account,seller is now a big boy ready to solve his own problems when it comes to disputes,onething always puzzle me is how can usps dc be a good proof you have delivered the item,this piece of paper would not fly with most banks ??
with merchant account,paypal can debit and credit your bank account,what it deposits it can take away,no different than the other merchant account providers.
note that now paypal allows us to spend the money the minute the buyer pays with cc,most merchant accounts take at least a 1-14 days before you see that money.
posted on April 21, 2002 01:15:43 PM new
stopwhining; I am not sure of the exact definition of PayPal, but they are acting like a finacial institution. They have Money Market Account, they pay interest on monies left in your account. Without knowing exactly how they are structured, it is difficult to know what they really are.
[ edited by sanmar on Apr 21, 2002 01:16 PM ]
posted on April 21, 2002 01:44:42 PM new dman3 posted: You are wrong about the cost of merchant accounts cost over paypal.
So the monthly statements that I get from Chase are all lies????
I am not pulling this out of thin air. My percentage is less than PayPal's, my per-transaction fee is less than PayPal's, and my monthly fee is minimal ($5.95 / month). There are no software rental costs, no monthly statement fees. CHEAPER THAN PAYPAL! HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO SAY IT???
stopwhining posted: not so,stores or seller who have their own merchant accounts do see the cc data of their customers.
Ummmmm.... I thought this was "The eBay Outlook". I am not referring to B/M stores (which is why I specifically stated "online merchant accounts". I have conducted thousands of transactions with my merchant account, and have yet to see ANY ONE of my customers CC numbers.
The point is, if you do some research, you can find merchant accounts that either are the same cost (or cheaper) than PayPal. After all, all PayPal did was set up a merchant account, and allow others to conduct business on it (for a fee). The only way they can be making money is if their costs are less than what they are charging their users. Therefore, it is safe to assume that merchant accounts exist that are cheaper than PayPal.
BTW: PayPal is not a merchant account provider. They merely allow their users to "piggyback" their merchant account (for a fee.)
posted on April 21, 2002 04:21:41 PM new
rewassago,
i have a yahoo store and i use paymentech and i see the customer cc data whenever they use cc to place an order.
after all this is what the merchant account is all about,what you have sounds like amzn on click ,they take the credit card and deduct their fee and deposit your proceeds/
i have a merchant account number with paymentech and this is how i correspond with them,whenever i call them to get some info,the first thing they ask is my merchant account number to make sure i am a fee paying customer of theirs.
the whole reason behind the merchant account is besides a lower discount fee (can be under 2 %),you have more control over the order,you look at all the data and decide if you feel comfortable shipping the item.
overseas orders besides UK is not address verified,so do you want to accept the order??
look at his bill to and ship to addr,do a reverse lookup on his phone number and see whose name is it registered under??
which bank issues his cc,you may want to find more info about this person,so the first 4 digits of his cc is the issuer number,call your provider and ask who issued this card and call the issuer and chat with them.
see,if they want you to ship to a different addr say they are sending a gift,it is up to you to decide if you want to chance it and you need to do some digging by looking over every data he enters.
thats why i question this paypal seller protection program,once you go outside ebay where bidders bid for themselves and have the item shipped to their confirmed addr,buyers can ask you to ship anywhere,are you going to say i will only ship to you and you can ship whereever you want??
you cannot,so you need more data to analyse,starting with WHOSE CREDIT CARD IS THIS??
posted on April 21, 2002 04:32:24 PM new
i know some of us have bot paypal stock,what does it say in the prospectus??
if we all end up with merchant accounts at paypal and paypal will send ebay bidder emails with links to our paypal page to pay up,what is to prevent us from designing a shopfront on that page,by then we are out side the reach of ebay.
posted on April 21, 2002 09:24:54 PM new
As I posted earlier, I have a merchant account through Chase. I do have a merchant account number, but I never see the customer's CC numbers. My merchant service is processed through Quickbooks Billing Services.
posted on April 21, 2002 10:46:27 PM new
i assume chase is doing the verification and authorisation on your order,what happens if the customer gives you a bill to address which is different than the one he gave to his credit card company for mailing monthly statement??
we do a lot of psychic reading when we receive an order,we study the data to death!!
posted on April 22, 2002 08:32:54 AM new
okay,please tell me if i come to your shop with other people's cc data and place a large order,what happens??
lets say i am using my mother 's card and she is visiting right now from PA,i just sneaked into the bedroom,lifted her card from her wallet and i have all that good data including the cvv code.
posted on April 22, 2002 08:10:10 PM new
FYI,address verification goes like this-match the billto addr i give you to the bill to addr as stored with the cc issuer as to where the monthly statement is sent.
of course i know where my mother lives and where she wants her statement to be sent every month.
the way it does the verification,it only compares the numeric portion of the street address and the first 5 digit of the zipcode.
if we socialise in a bar and i lifed your credit card and found out from talking to you your street number is 1234 and your zip code is same as mine as we both live in the same neighborhood,then it does not matter if i know the street name.
so my order could make it thru ,are you going to shp to my cousin in moscow ,russia who dont mind having something nice from america??
. I have conducted thousands of transactions with my merchant account, and have yet to see ANY ONE of my customers CC numbers.