posted on December 28, 2003 05:25:45 AM new
I have a problem right now that I have never had come up before. I had a buyer from Germany purchase almost $400.00 of items from my store.
My auction pages CLEARLY state that I only accept PayPal, AuctionPayments.com, and PayingFast.com on international payments. Additionally I also note on every auction page to please email me if there are any questions.
I email this customer the total with s/h, and restate my payment terms on international auctions. He emails me back...
"I can´t pay it with PayPal. The easiest for me is a banktransfer. But then i need your banking details. I Hope you can send it me so that i can send the money too you. I hope my english is not too bad and you know what i want. BYE Xxxxx"
I email back, explaining that is not a payment option and that I do not give this information out to anyone. He emails me back this morning...
"I´ve got a problem now. I just ring the direktor of my bank out of bet and ask hin for PayPall und the others and he told me that they have many problems with it because of security. And he say that i shouldn´t get an account by one of them. So i can´t take the money to you. What should i do now. When i read the auktion page, i read it in the german translation and there ebay told me that you accept the transfer worldwide. I´m sorry but ebay told it to me. To send the money by post isn´t so good because i have to change it and that´s very dangerous beause that means i have to send more than 360 dollers. Bye Xxxxx"
Has anyone else had this problem? Suggestions anyone? This sale is for 20 items....20 non-paying bidder alerts, 20 requests for FVF, etc...not something I am particularly thrilled about!
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If you had one phone call to make before you died, who would you call, what would you say, and why are you waiting?
posted on December 28, 2003 08:21:34 AM new
There is nothing insecure about a bank transfer - You are giving the person no information that you do not hand over every time you write a check. Most banks do charge a fee for an international bank transfer (my banks is $15).
BTW - Never send an international bidder to Payingfast.com - They want faxed copies of their drvivers liscence, the credit card and I think a DNA sample - it's insane. Send them to AuctionPayments.com (formerly BidPay.com). You may also want to suggest thiss option to your German customer as I'm sure that the Western Union brand will help ease his security concerns (his bank director is an idiot but we can't solve that problem here )
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
posted on December 28, 2003 08:33:01 AM new
Thank you, fenix
I have just never had anyone ask for my banking information before - first thing I thought was scam. Thank you for explaining it - I will call my bank in the morning and see what fee they charge. For some reason, I just don't feel comfortable with that, though - don't know why, just a feeling.
I have been trying to get him to use AuctionPayments, explaining they are Western Union, formerly BidPay, etc. - and he flat refuses. He is very adamant that he will ONLY use wire transfer - that is one thing that is making me wonder about this transaction.
This ID hasn't had any transactions in a few months. From the previous transactions, this person is predominantly a seller.
LOL @ the bank director - sounds like a real jackass to me (stupid one at that!)...
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If you had one phone call to make before you died, who would you call, what would you say, and why are you waiting?
posted on December 28, 2003 09:29:55 AM new
This won't help you, I'm sure, but just yesterday, after a long couple of weeks, I traveled down our mountain to the nearest Western Union office (30 miles! snow! ice!)and picked up a payment of about $30 from a French buyer. She had ignored my payment instructions (or maybe it mistranslated in French, too!) She sent a wire transfer, not a money order. It was an item I wanted Out of Here so after much e-mailing back and forth I agreed to go get it eventually if she could wait.
NEXT time, no dice. No matter how much I want to get rid of an item, I will cancel the sale and relist. This was my first international problem. From now on my EOA will s-p-e-l-l out no wire transfers, etc.
I'm still thinking I may get a neg from her for slow shipment. . . .
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"I have resolved to allow my friends their peculiarities." -- Samuel Johnson
posted on December 28, 2003 09:31:13 AM new
I have had paypal payments for that amount and more from Germany, Italy and France. There were no problems with the payments at all through paypal. If he doesn't have an account with paypal ask him to use www.auctionpayments.com (formerly bidpay). Its relatively easy for both the buyer and seller to use.
My bank charges 35.00 for an international transfer and conversion (I live in the boonies). I can't afford those fees and rarely does a buyer agree to picking that up along with the purchase price and shipping.
Be very careful about giving out your banking information!!
posted on December 28, 2003 09:46:17 AM new
Roadsmith - hate that happened to you!
I have been trying to get this guy to use AuctionPayments, and he just refuses! He has a definite mindset that it's either wire transfer or 20 negatives for me (yes, he is threatening me with negative feedback now).
I would love to have this sale, but am just very uncomfortable giving out my banking information. I even offered to accept a Western Union wire like Roadsmith did - and this guy won't accept that. It's either send him my bank information or nothing.
Like I said before, I can't explain it...just a very bad feeling I get about this transaction. He is just too adamant about getting my bank information.
It really p!sses me off that now I have to sit and file for twenty auctions - that really bites! He's a seller, and he should know better.
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If you had one phone call to make before you died, who would you call, what would you say, and why are you waiting?
posted on December 28, 2003 09:55:15 AM newThere is nothing insecure about a bank transfer - You are giving the person no information that you do not hand over every time you write a check.
This is a scam. It is one of the latest ways that international crooks are getting access to bank accounts. You tell this deadbeat he is full of crap. There is no translation with any of your options that states you accept worldwide wire transfers. He is trying to gain access to your bank account for not so good reasons. Stick firm to your payment options except take paypal off of the table. If he cannot get your money, he will surely take your items and do a chargeback via PayPal. I would insist upon payment through auctionpayments. If he refuses, NPB-FVF and neg the hell out of him. Then relist.
posted on December 28, 2003 10:06:17 AM new
This was his third email to me, after I AGAIN explained what payment methods I accept (note the comment about feedback, which I haven't even mentioned)...
"In the translation you write that you accept the normal way of transfer bey bank. if you won´t accept these now thats not my problem. If you won´t sell the suits now that is your problem. I accept only the way of transfer the money and that is what i read in your auktion page. Remember that means 360 dollers. Im wount get an account at any of these three things. when you would have money from me than send me your banking details. When you send me 20 negative valuations to me you get the same from me. i don´t know where´s your problem. I´ve you wondn´t sell the suits tell it to me and then i forgett our deal. But i can´t see the problem. CYA Xxxxx"
and his fourth email...
"I´m sorry but i realy read the translations ebay give to me. And there it stand that you accept it. Why should i send you an email bevore because i confident ebay there. i´m sorry but i wound get an account at Paypal or the others. Because my bank say it´s to danger. I really would have the suits but i only can transfer ithe money to you. Sorry that i confident ebay. but i thought that it´s write. bye Xxxxx"
and fifth....
"I´m sorry but you can´t get the money on these way from me. Ebay germany tranlate it that you accept it an i accept what ebay say and i only accept the transfer. Sorry but this is the only way. I realy accept that you would have the money on the other ways but i can´t and i wound pay it on thes way because ebay told me something other. bye"
My last email to him was pretty much "what part of NO don't you understand?!", but nicer than that (and by this time it was extremely hard being nice to this bonehead!)...
Oh well, I hate I lost the sales but at least that's the only thing I have lost here
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If you had one phone call to make before you died, who would you call, what would you say, and why are you waiting?
posted on December 28, 2003 10:08:17 AM new
And filing the FVFs for all those items would of course get this buyer NARUed, right? I hope.
Here's what I think: If I wanted to operate a scam, I would definitely win lots of items from someone who would then want all the money for so many auctions and would be more likely to bend the rules for the buyer.
If he does leave 20 negs, wouldn't it be possible for you to get Ebay to remove those under the circumstances?
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"I have resolved to allow my friends their peculiarities." -- Samuel Johnson
posted on December 28, 2003 10:23:08 AM new
WGM..log into ebay DE (germany) and find your auctions...look to see if you can find the auction payment terms and paste them here...my husband is fluent in german and maybe he can see if the guy is telling the truth about the way they appeared on the site. If it is true then perhaps you need to contact eBay to see how the translation error occurred and what to do about it! In the very least they should be willing to remove the inevitable negs!
posted on December 28, 2003 10:35:23 AM new
thank you neglus!
I went to eBay Germany, and did find my auctions and store items - and my title, description, and terms are in English! I can't navigate the site too well though because everything else is in German LOL
I didn't log in, thinking that would make it appear in English, and took a lucky guess on search by seller...
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If you had one phone call to make before you died, who would you call, what would you say, and why are you waiting?
posted on December 28, 2003 10:36:28 AM new
Remember the saying. If it seems too good to be true it probably is!
He broke your TOS by bidding. File the NPB's on this guy and move on.
It is unfortunate that you can't just block International bidders. Just another pain from Ebay.
If someone does not want to follow my auction terms for payment, they don't get the items. In this case I think your lucky he does not want to use Paypal.
You have to be careful with the International buyer Scam's. They are out there.
posted on December 28, 2003 10:40:53 AM new
I don't think eBay will pile up 20 negs on the buyer. I think only one will count on his feedback number. But they may display all 20 feedbacks in his listing. You will have to file 20 npb and fvf forms...bummer
Reading your last posts of correspondence from this guy, its stinking like a scam.
posted on December 28, 2003 10:43:24 AM new
neglus, I translated the title of one of the items from English to German, and did a search using the German translastion - it didn't come up with anything.
Is it possible he is using a translator?
I agree, giftsforall. When I initially sent him the s/h to Germany, I added the fee for insurance and registered mail to the total if he were to use PayPal, just to make sure I was covered.
I went ahead and relisted the items, blocked him, and will file with eBay just as soon as I can. He purchased the items early yesterday morning. When I tried to file the Non-Paying Bidder Alerts, I got this message...
"You are unable to file an Alert at this time.
You have already filed alerts for this item or you must wait at least 7 days after each purchase to file a Non-Paying Bidder Alert.
Please come back and try again later."
__________________________________
If you had one phone call to make before you died, who would you call, what would you say, and why are you waiting?
posted on December 28, 2003 10:45:11 AM new
Stone - what scam do you think this person is going to perpetrate with the same information that appears on WGM's checks?
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
posted on December 28, 2003 11:01:20 AM new
I don't know about a translator but the language mistakes he is making in his emails to you are not translation mistakes ie: "write" for "right" and "wound" for "wouldn't". I also don't know what kind of scam he can pull with your bank info (this has been discussed before) but I wouldn't be too anxious to pay your bank's transfer fee.
I do know that in Switzerland (and I assume Germany too) - it is not common to have a checking account even. Bills are paid through the post office. I am sure this new fangled stuff like online payments can be baffling even to small town bankers! Perhaps cancel the deal by mutual consent and move on? The guy might have made an honest mistake in reading your terms.
posted on December 28, 2003 11:27:58 AM new
Couldn't you just open a new bank account unrelated to any of your other money and then tell him to go ahead and do his money transfer. I've had monies wired into my account but always from people I knew. In this situation I might open a stand-alone account..maybe even with a different bank.
The trouble with Italian food is that your hungry again in two or three days.
posted on December 28, 2003 05:52:27 PM new
Why don't you just give this lummox your banking info and let him do a bank transfer. It's common for Europeans to pay this way. There's absolutely no scam that anyone can do with the info you send him. If someone thinks there's a security problem, then you should stop writing personal checks. Every bit of info that the bidder needs is on every check that you write. Bank transfers and cash are the only 100% certain scam free ways of receiving your payment. Paypal is a big no-no on International business.
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.Either let him send the bank transfer or just let him out of the transactions. No negatives.
posted on December 28, 2003 06:28:57 PM new
To get the boot from e bay,,,, three ,,,,3,,,,,,Different,,,,,, people have to file,,,,,Npb's,,,,,,20 from one person means SQUAT TO E BAY,,,,,,,KINDO' LIKE HAVING A BAD HAIR DAY,,,,,,3,,,,,,DIFFERENT PEOPLE.....
posted on December 28, 2003 06:32:34 PM new
What difference does it make if it's a scam or not? A wire transfer was not shown in wgm's TOS as a payment option. Even if this is a common practice in Europe, wgm is in the United States where wire transfers for $400.00 are not common. He was offered the option to pay through AuctionPayments.com. He can take it or leave it. If you let him bully you into changing your tos after the auction because of a "language barrier" what's to keep him from saying his translation also says you are offering free overnight FedEx shipping? It's his responsibility to find someone at his endwho is fluent in English to read the description to him in German before he bids.
The light at the end of the tunnel will turn out to be an oncoming train.
posted on December 28, 2003 06:42:05 PM new
Thank you very much, sparkz!
As much as I hate to stereotype, the last five deadbeater buyers I have had have been from overseas - and every single one has had an issue with payment. Of the five, this is the third one from Germany. The other two were from Australia.
My terms are clearly stated on my auction page, my "about me" page, and also in my end of auction notices. Additionally I have in my terms - in nice BIG bold letters to email me prior to bidding if there are questions.
This jerk sells also - he can set the terms on the auctions he sells, not on mine
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If you had one phone call to make before you died, who would you call, what would you say, and why are you waiting?
posted on December 28, 2003 07:17:18 PM new
Absolutely. Actually, I have been considering it for a few weeks. I do have three very nice bidders from the UK that are wonderful to work with - what a shame they all can't be as nice.
I will probably cut international out starting with my next batch this week, but would very much like to keep the three UK customers.
It's just not worth the hassle.
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If you had one phone call to make before you died, who would you call, what would you say, and why are you waiting?
posted on December 28, 2003 07:36:32 PM new
WGM---USE THIS WEBSITE-world.altavista.com
I have delt with Germany on a monthly basis within the last 6 months.All you have to do is cut and paste and it will translate it in 5 seconds.In fact the website has many langauges you can translate.As far as this being a scam,I seriously doubt it.In the last 3 weeks in auctions that I won,2 people gave me their bank account numbers to transfer money to.I believe its standard practice in Europe.I did eventually sent them money in U.S.Currency as I still funny about giving out bank account numbers.
posted on December 28, 2003 07:38:56 PM new
WGM-also you can type a message in English,cut and paste it to the website I just gave you.Have it translated to German,then cut and paste it to your email and they will get the message in German
posted on December 28, 2003 07:55:59 PM new
Sparkz.....I was giving my opinion that a scam is not possible. I also said that if the seller feels like not doing a bank transfer, even though there is no security risk, and it's not in the seller's TOS to send a transfer, just let the lummox out of the transaction. I wouldn't suggest a neg, as it just invites 20 retaliatiory negs. This would look bad, even though it only counts as 1. The seller should just decide what he/she wants....send one last e-mail to the German.....and be done with it.
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.For me....I'd like to have every one of my seller's pay by bank transfer on large amounts. Between Paypal chargebacks or other scams, counterfeit cashier's checks, bad personal checks, etc.....this is the only truly safe way.
posted on December 28, 2003 08:23:26 PM new
Pointy...Actually I was commenting on the several posts before yours speculating on the possibility of a scam. This guy may be one of those that requests more information than necessary in order to access a bank account for nefarious purposes, especially if the seller is not familiar with bank transfers. But it's a moot subject since wgm does not offer that option in the TOS. The buyer improperly put that option on the table. I agree that wgm should send one last email offering to take Bidpay and complete the transactions or to "mutually agree" not to complete them and file for fvf. I would leave feedback out of it. My greatest worry would be that he would leave 3 negs. If he left 20, wgm could likely get them all removed under the "Feedback Bombing" provision. I personally don't think it's a scam. I think wgm got a thick headed and stubborn customer and should gracefully let him off the hook and move on.
The light at the end of the tunnel will turn out to be an oncoming train.
posted on December 29, 2003 01:27:14 AM new
I AM IN AUSTRALIA. WE SELL ALL OVER THE WORLD BOTH DIRECT AND INDIRECT THRU EBAY. THE COUNTRY WE HAVE THE MOST PROBLEMS WITH IS GERMANY. IN SAYING THAT , WE ALSO HAVE A LOT OF VERY GOOD CLEINTS WHO ARE VERY GOOD PAYERS. THE 2 SOLUTIONS THAT WORK BEST FOR ME ARE, WESTERN UNION. GET THE NAME OF THE TOWN YOUR CUSTOMER LIVES IN THEN GO TO WESTERN UNION SITE ON THE INTERNER AND FIND THE CLOSEST OFFICE TO HIM. THEN SEND THE DETAILS TO HIM OR HER. WORKS WELL.
I DO ALSO TAKE CREDIT CARDS DIRECT.
SECONDLY. SET UP A BANK ACCOUNT ESPECIALLY FOR ACCEPTING BANK PAYMENTS, OR AS WE CALL THEM HERE T.T.(TELEGRAPHIC TRANSFERS). TELL YOUR CUSTOMER THE TOTAL HE OWES YOU IN YOUR LOCAL CURRENCY. THAT WAY THEY PAY THE CURRENCY EXCHANGE FEES. WORKS FOR ME.
HERE IN AUSTRALIA, WE HAVE A SYSTEM CALLED PAYMATE. THE CUSTOMER DOES NOT HAVE TO JOIN IT TO MAKE PAYMENT. BUT IT IS ONLY FOR SELLERS IN AUSTRALIA. BUT WE CAN ACCEPT PAYMENT FROM MOST PLACES AROUND THE WORLD. SO LONG AS THEY HAVE A CREDIT CARD.
posted on December 29, 2003 04:30:22 AM new
I did send him a final email offering to accept the money wired to a Western Union office - and he refused. He will not pay unless he can wire transfer the money to my account.
Even if I wanted to set up a second account to accept a wire transfer, I wouldn't because this guy has been such a jackass. He is extremely rude and arrogant.
Live and learn
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If you had one phone call to make before you died, who would you call, what would you say, and why are you waiting?
posted on December 29, 2003 05:36:24 AM new
Neglus - I got an email from the buyer, and it's in German. All the others have been in English, so don't understand why the change. I tried to translate on the web, but some of it isn't translating - do you think your husband could help? I would appreciate it very much!!
"Ich weiß nicht wo dein Problem ist. Scheinbar hast du es immernoch nicht verstanden. Wenn ich deine Bezahlen Seite aufrufe dann steht da klar und deutlich das ich zwischen Paypal, Überweisen, und Check. Also kann ich da ohne Probleme zwischen wählen was ich gerne möchte denn es steht da nicht das ich es nicht kann als Nichtamerikaner. Wahrscheinlich verstehst du es nicht das wenn ich das unter Ebay Deutschland aufrufe das in Deutsch bekomme und nicht in Englisch so wie du meinst. Wenn du gerne Ebay schreiben möchtest dann tu das ich kann wiederlegen das es so ist wie ich das sage und ich bin auch nciht so arrogant wie du meinst und möchte es nciht bezahlen, sondern du bist so arrogant und versteht es nicht das ich deinen Spielregeln folge und die bieten mir ganz einfach an das Geld zu dir zu überweisen. Sollte ich deinetwegn jetzt irgendwelche Probleme mit Ebay bekommen kannst du dich drauf verlassen das du die auch bekommen wirst. Keine sorge auch in deiner Bewertung kommt es äußerst schlecht wenn da auf einmal 20 äußerst negative Bewertungen erscheinen. Mit freundichen Gruß und schönen Tag noch Andre
Ps: Solltest du es nicht verstehen was ich hier schreibe schließe ich das auch auf deine arrogante Art mit Käufern umzugehen"
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If you had one phone call to make before you died, who would you call, what would you say, and why are you waiting?
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