cramer
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posted on May 7, 2004 09:13:32 AM new
Ok, so not directly related to eBay.... But,
yesterday I received a note from the IRS stating that I had to pay 69.75 in fines because they received my check late. I called the number and talked with someone and said, I sent it on the 15th. She told me I had to prove it....what???? And send the information to them.
Luckily I used Endicia so I can prove when I printed the postage.
Now, what if I was the average person who just used a stamp......I'd have to pay the fine? Unbelievable.
I want to write a nasty, well written letter and I have no idea how to do that. Right now, I'm just ticked and my letter would be emotional...Any suggestions?
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replaymedia
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posted on May 7, 2004 09:19:09 AM new
Shut up and pay the bill.
If they is ONE place on the entire planet you don't want to tell off or make mad at you, it's the IRS!!!
--------------------------------------
We do not stop playing because we grow old. We grow old because we stop playing -- Anonymous
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cramer
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posted on May 7, 2004 09:21:09 AM new
replay...I ABSOLUTELY disagree with you...why should I have to pay the bill when I sent it on the 15th. No Way.
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stopwhining
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posted on May 7, 2004 09:50:05 AM new
replay is right.think about it!!
-sig file -------we eat to live,not live to eat.
Benjamin Franklin
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sparkz
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posted on May 7, 2004 09:52:10 AM new
They will go by the postmark on the envelope. If there is no legible postmark, they go by the date of receipt. The only way to be 99% certain it will get postmarked the day it is mailed is to hand it to a clerk in person at the post office. Even then, you'll want to keep your fingers crossed. Sending it certified mail is about the only 100% foolproof method.
A $75.00 solid state device will always blow first to protect a 25 cent fuse ~ Murphy's Law
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cramer
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posted on May 7, 2004 10:10:33 AM new
Endicia states.....Ship dat 4/15/2004 Time 8:56 am
received 1:52 am April 18, 2004
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cherishedclutter
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posted on May 7, 2004 10:14:14 AM new
Cramer,
Worst case scenario - your letter gets read by a vindictive IRS worker who ties you up in indepth audits. (I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, assume you have nothing to hide and keep meticulous records - but still do you want to "waste time" on an audit?)
Best case scenario - your letter gets thrown out by an overworked IRS worker who doesn't care about your complaint.
In neither case will you have made any change to the system - it's not worth the risk.
JMO
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ladyjewels2000
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posted on May 7, 2004 10:23:45 AM new
Isn't there a $500.00 penalty for filing late? If you paid with your return and it wasn't late - how could the check be late? Anyway to check this out?
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cramer
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posted on May 7, 2004 10:29:30 AM new
lady...that's the whole point..it wasn't late and they are saying..prove it....I think Endicia and the USPS Prove it....am I wrong?
[ edited by cramer on May 7, 2004 10:29 AM ]
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ladyjewels2000
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posted on May 7, 2004 10:35:47 AM new
Yeah makes you wonder? If you pay the fine - will they turn around and bill you for filing late.
You may want to call and set up an appointment with your local IRS to discuss this. I understand they are very pleasant there. Of course you want to be as professional and polite as you can be!!!
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Reamond
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posted on May 7, 2004 10:52:04 AM new
$69.75 is pretty cheap to get the IRS off your back.
But if you want to contest this on principle, then ride the tiger.
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cramer
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posted on May 7, 2004 11:02:52 AM new
I have to say, I am completely amazed at the responses here. I was hoping for a well worded phrase or two not the advice to pay the fine, even though I don't deserve it. I guess that is why the IRS can do this, so many people just bow to it.
Here's my plan...I will send the documentation WITHOUT the payment and see what happens.....
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eauctionmgnt
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posted on May 7, 2004 11:09:21 AM new
cramer,
You say you want to write a nasty, well written letter to the IRS... and you're surprised by the responses??? I think people are giving you VERY good advice! I would think that your options are:
1) Pay the fine and move on.
2) Do what the IRS agent asked you to do... and send the proof that your item was mailed by the 15th. Keep it strictly professional with just the facts and no emotion.
In most cases, when items are mailed with just normal stamps... the IRS can verify the date it was shipped by viewing the postmark. But, as Sparkz says... this isn't always legibile.... and is probably what happened in your case. I just don't understand why you want to start something with the IRS.... 'cause guess what?! They'll win!!!
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sanmar
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posted on May 7, 2004 11:21:30 AM new
I will throw m,y 2 cents in. Talke whatever proof you to your local IRS agent. Work with them & for god's sake don't get uppity with them or you will be in a hell of a lot worse problem than you are now. As eauction says "guess who win the pXXing contest?"
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cramer
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posted on May 7, 2004 11:25:42 AM new
Thanks everyone for trying to help, I will indeed fight this, but I will be professional...
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ihula
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posted on May 7, 2004 11:56:53 AM new
Keep in mind that the Endicia receipt just states that you printed out the postage on that date - not necessarily that you mailed it.
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iareateacher
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posted on May 7, 2004 12:09:29 PM new
Ah see you got the usual blend of wrong answers and ill-informed opinion.
If cramer filed late and paid late, these are the penalties:
Combined late filing/late payment penalty of 5 percent of the amount due for each month or portion of a month the payment is late. This amount can be increased (or decreased) if you made mistakes on your return; i.e. if additional tax liability is found, you'll have to pay 5 percent of that, too. On the other hand, if you've overlooked credits or deductions you could have claimed, your penalty will be reduced.
There is also interest due on any amount paid late.
Should you fight it? Why not? Call the IRS 800 number, explain the issue and ask if interest and penalties will continue to accrue while you're disputing the penalty. In other words, is the clock still ticking? The IRS moves glacially. It'll probably take several months to get this resolved.
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stopwhining
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posted on May 7, 2004 12:44:14 PM new
cramer.
it depends on how much 67 dollars mean to you??
when you deal with a large bureaucracy like IRS,complaints and forms etc can get shuffled around and lost.
say if you call and they agree with you and say -you are right,dont send us any money.
and then nothing has changed as far as computer records are concerned and on the record,it said you owe them that much and it keeps snowballing.
thats what some of us are trying to tell you.
first i would always try to mail my return early,second i will not rely on endicia,i would go to a post office and hand it to the postal clerk.
-sig file -------we eat to live,not live to eat.
Benjamin Franklin
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parklane64
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posted on May 7, 2004 01:26:43 PM new
My sister shot herself over IRS harassment. Don't let them have one penny they can't document in quadruplicate. I have not had a reportable income this century and don't plan on it in the near future. Dirtbags.
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stonecold613
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posted on May 7, 2004 09:49:52 PM new
Oops
[ edited by stonecold613 on May 7, 2004 09:50 PM ]
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stonecold613
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posted on May 7, 2004 09:49:59 PM new
Did you get it post marked at the post office on the 15th? Just because you printed postage on endica on the 15th isn't good enough. It must have the Post office official stamp dated the 15th for it to be legal. That is no different than if we were to put a stamp on the envelope and put it in the mail box only to have the postal carrier pick it up too late to the official stamp. If did not get the official stamp the clerks at the PO put on the package, then you do owe the penalty.
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fenix03
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posted on May 7, 2004 10:50:07 PM new
Fight it. The worse thing that can happen is you lose and have to pay but that seems unlikely since the piece was recieve two days later.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
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mcjane
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posted on May 7, 2004 10:51:58 PM new
cramer I understand just how you feel & I too would want to fight it. But what the posters are saying is true specially stopwhining when he said there is a real possibility the information may not be entered in the computer, probably happens all the time.
A few years from now you may find yourself owing a couple of thousand dollars in fines & fees.
I have a friend who the IRS says owes 4000.00 in past corporate taxes, she says no way.
This goes back 5 or 6 years, the corporation is now dissolved & not long ago she tossed out all her old records, checks, everything.
She thinks the IRS will find they made a mistake & drop it.
That will never happen, she is in big trouble whether she paid or not.
parklane I am so sorry to hear that.
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sparkz
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posted on May 7, 2004 11:26:40 PM new
Go ahead and protest it if you feel that strongly about it. You may by some miracle win that $69.75 battle and walk away with a big smile on your face. One thing I will guarantee, they will wipe that smile off of your face during the full scale audit that will follow in about 6 months.
A $75.00 solid state device will always blow first to protect a 25 cent fuse ~ Murphy's Law
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cramer
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posted on May 8, 2004 09:34:15 AM new
I'll let you know what happens. The office told me they did not receive this until the 23rd and the USPS says it was delivered on the 18th. I realize it usually gets scanned at the PO...but still 5 days difference?
She told me to prove it...I sent the information in that I "think" proves it. If they decide that I still deserve the fine, I will pay, of course. But, I just couldn't let this one go. I may be sorry, we'll see.
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Reamond
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posted on May 8, 2004 09:58:14 AM new
But, I just couldn't let this one go.
If it's about the "principle" of the thing then our opinions don't make any difference and nothing will change your mind.
There is an old De Nero gangster movie where the gangster gives some advice about money.
The gangster's young protege starts to chase a guy that owes him $20. He goes on to tell the gangster what a jerk this guy is, and that he wants to collect the $20 based on the principle.
The gangster tells him to let it go. For $20 this jerk will never come around you again.
For $69 you can do the same with the IRS.
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stopwhining
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posted on May 8, 2004 10:49:30 AM new
i think cramer just wants to prove she is right!
question-
if it is stamped 18th,thats 3 days past april 15th,i thought the deadline is 15th??
if they said they did not receive it until 23rd,how do they receive it??were there any intra IRS routing going on??
is 23rd the day it shows up on someone's desk??
what if i use endicia on april 15 and mail it on april 18,which date is acceptable to IRS or my credit card issuer for mailing in my cc payment??
-sig file -------we eat to live,not live to eat.
Benjamin Franklin
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lindajean
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posted on May 8, 2004 11:25:42 AM new
Add me to those who think you should just pay the bill.
You may win the battle and lose the war.
They can audit you for any reason or for no reason. Do you really want that? For 3 years back? And 3 or 4 years forward?
I use Turbo Tax and I always wind up owing more than I pay in estimated taxes. turbo tax computes the penalty due and I submit it with my payment. Every year I get a bill from the IRS for $15 or $24 or some other small amount.
OK maybe they make a lot of money by us paying it. But, I just send them their money and go on about my way.
They are happy and I am happy if they are happy!
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cramer
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posted on May 8, 2004 11:26:04 AM new
Stop...It is stamped 15th and that is when it was mailed. They received it on the 18th according to USPS.
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cramer
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posted on May 8, 2004 11:28:40 AM new
"If it's about the "principle" of the thing then our opinions don't make any difference and nothing will change your mind."
If you read the original post, I DID want advice....but on the wording, not whether I should fight this or not.
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