posted on April 28, 2002 01:46:14 PM new
Alright heres my problem. I recently bid on and won a set of rims from yahoo auctions. At the time the buyer had no feedback, positive or negative. The price was $2000 and the guy seemed nice enough after talking to him and he seemed legit. So I send him a paypal payment via eCheck ( i meant it to be a direct transfer but accidently sent an eCheck ). I wait about 5 days for it to clear and then it gets rejected. I call up PayPal and they say that the user has rejected payment. I ask them if their is anything wrong with the user and they say no. I then email the seller and he tells me that someone had been hacking into his account and that paypal informed him to create a new account which he was awaiting verification. When his new account gets verified I send him a 1$ payment to make sure it is verified and then send him the full balance. I come back about a week later, the guy has not sent me the tracking number for the goods and he now has -2 feedback on yahoo auctions for ripping people off with Sony Viao's. So now im really scared. I call up PayPal and they say to file a buyer complaint which will freeze both accounts, but what if the funds are not in his account anymore? The funds were taken from my bank and not a credit card so im not protected through that. The only protection I have is the yahoo one which is only 200$ and PayPal. PayPal Damon or anyone else please give me some advice on what to do. Should I file the complaint immediatley? Please let me know. Thx.
posted on April 28, 2002 02:35:30 PM new
wow,if he has no money in his paypal account,paypal will say sorry,no money in his account.
but i though after oct last year,all new accounts have to agree to let paypal dip into their bank accounts?or may be not the word DIP,but someone can explain better.
posted on April 28, 2002 02:41:19 PM new
What good will that do if he has no money into his bank account. I am just stressing out right now because that is a huge chunk of my savings down the drain. When i called them up they said that they would attempt to get it from his account if he had withdrawn all the money from paypal. This has just ruined my weekend.
posted on April 28, 2002 03:37:04 PM new
have you called him,is his phone disconnected??
usps mail fraud-call 1 800-222-1811 and ask to speak to their fraud investigation dept.
when you file fraud complaint with usps,a copy goes to his police station.some folks seem to have luck going to their bank and asked them to get the money back,may be someone can explain better,it is like your bank going thru the clearance system and ask for that money back from his bank,and his bank goes dipping into his bank account,even though it has cleared.
everyone is at din din right now,hope they will come back after dinner and help you
posted on April 28, 2002 04:02:48 PM new
Thanks man. Ill try everything to get the money back. The sad part is I was doing this for a friend who wanted the rims but does not have the net. So now I’m out the cash because I’m not going to rip off my friend. I just sent him a letter appealing to his sensitive side (if he has one =() Hopefully I can get something. I called PayPal again and after convincing the lady that I was only speaking in hypothetical terms I asked what would happen if there was no money in his PPal account and I was informed that no action would be taken towards his bank account. I will go speak with my bank tomorrow. Will also file with usps. If I can’t get any money back, I’m going to find some way of taking this guy down. Please keep the suggestions coming, they offer a lil hope I guess =).
posted on May 2, 2002 05:52:43 PM new
Thats right, PayPal won't go into the seller's bank account if it's a buyer complaint, only a credit card chargeback (and only if their account was opened after October 11, 2001), so unfortunately, a buyer complaint won't work if he has no money in his account.
What I would do, is completely empty your PayPal account, then go to your bank. It seems that the bank is one of your best hopes in this situation. Explain the situation to them and they might reverse the debit to your bank account. However, you must empty your PayPal account prior to doing this, because once you do it, eventually, your account will most likely be restricted and they might (this happened to many other users from what I have seen on these boards) require that you sign forms giving them legal permission to debit your bank account. If your account is at 0, then you can just go away from PayPal and forget about your restricted account (you wouldn't really be able to use PayPal again).
Also, you might scare the seller enough if you file complaints with the USPS and other agencies, as stopwhining suggested.
posted on May 2, 2002 07:12:35 PM new
If Paypal even reads this thread they will put your account in restricted mode.
Then you are up the creek without a boat or a paddle. Seems like the seem to think they are above the law.
What can I do while my account is restricted?
While your account is restricted, you CANNOT:
send or request money
electronically transfer funds to and from your account
close your account
However, you CAN continue to use the following features:
receive payments
place logos into your auction listings or on your website
update your account information
Basically you are screwed and Paypal can use your money howevere long they want to
posted on May 2, 2002 07:53:02 PM new
Alright, for some reason PayPal still has not restricted my account, so I’m assuming they haven’t even touched his account. I contacted the bank and they told me to file a stop payment, which I proceeded to do. Well the thing seems to have worked. Checked my account balance had increased by $2000. Seems the deducted the amount from paypal’s account or something. Now I’m just afraid that paypal will dip back into my bank account and take the money back. I’m transferring the money to another account that they don’t have access to. Sound like a good idea? Thanks for all the help people, the bank idea is something I wouldn’t have thought of. I really appreciate it =).
posted on May 2, 2002 07:55:10 PM new
Oh btw. I never keep an account balance of $10 + in my paypal account. As soon as i get it I throw it straight into my bank. Glad I did that =).
Something seems a little off here. We wouldn't tell the user to open a new account if they had an issue with their account.
Yes, you should have filed a Buyer Complaint asap once a problem was apparent. However, our process takes 30 days to advise if we were able to recover from the party (no guarantees of recovery). Filing with the bank to stop the ach transfer will more than likely lead to an account restriction once it comes back.
(As a reminder to users, PLEASE use discretion when sending payment to another party for an expensive purchase)
My apologies for the delay in responding, as I have been out of the office for about a week.
posted on May 3, 2002 10:48:44 AM new
Damon, if a user files a buyer complaint, it will take 30 days from the date it was made for the buyer to know whether he will get all his money back. By the time the buyer would get a response from PayPal about the complaint (either giving the user's money back or saying they won't), it will sometimes be past the date that a stop payment could have been made.
In addition, because of the sellers bad feedback record (-2) with the auction service, it seems that chances are high in this case that the user would have taken all the money out of his account as soon as he got it, so even if there was no time limit on stop payment with ach transactions, a buyer complaint might not get his money back anyway.
What you should do is tell buyers immediately whether the seller has enough money in their account to pay the buyer if after 30 days the complaint is resolved in the buyer's favor.
Interxl, if PayPal tries to take the money again, put a stop payment on the new transaction. However, the best thing to do is to take the money out of the bank account PayPal has information for and put it in another bank account, as you were going to do.
posted on May 3, 2002 06:49:12 PM new
I had a 6 month Stop Payment placed against paypal today and intend to move my balance to another account ASAP. Thanks for the help people, I really appreciate it.
posted on May 4, 2002 02:42:57 PM new
Smart move. Its amazing what people have to do to protect themselves from such a company. With all the fraud out there it would be nice to know that you wouldn't have to stop payment against an organization that is SUPPOSED to protect you and not steal from you.
posted on May 4, 2002 07:16:27 PM new
Well there goes my paypal account. They finally figured out that the bank had pulled out the money and restricted my account. Good thing i dont have any cash in there =). They cant pull it from my account without my consent correct? I have a 6 month stop payment but need to figure out what to do after that 6 month period so I dont wake up and find the money missing. Thanks again.
posted on May 6, 2002 04:30:39 PM new
if you sign uo for paypal after october ,2001,you have agreed to give paypal the right to debit your bank account in case of chargeback .
if you have asked your bank to block paypal for 6 months,you can renew the blocking after 6 months is up.
posted on May 6, 2002 06:06:51 PM new
Dont I have to agree to arbitration? Also, i signed up over 2 yrs ago so I have not signed an agreement letting them debit my bank account, they have no access to it, nor will they get any. However can they bring down my credit rating? At this point that is all im afraid of. Thanks again.
posted on May 6, 2002 08:33:19 PM new
i dont think they will report you to credit agency,but they will try to recover the money.read some of the posts of how accounts get locked up because ex hubby used it and ex hubby owed paypal money etc.
posted on May 7, 2002 01:57:42 PM new
All I can say is don't make the same mistake I made. At the first sign of trouble with them seek legal advise. You can read my story in congradulations paypal wins.
posted on May 8, 2002 07:29:09 PM new
I believe PayPal will recover from the seller, so I don't think your credit would be affected as they probably have the money. I am not sure of this, maybe Damon will provide clarification here. I don't think PayPal will try six months down the road to debit the account again, but just to be safe file another stop payment in 6 months.
As for the restricted account, PayPal will probably send you a form you have to fill out giving them permission to debit your bank account (I've heard about that happening to other people on the boards) if you want your account unrestricted. Just don't do it, stop using PayPal, and everything will probably be fine.
