posted on November 24, 2001 03:29:04 PM new
My first big item, I have the buyer responsible for shipping arrangements and costs. I give him exact dimensions plus estimated weight of 150-200 pounds, before end of auction.After he won, he says, "are these dimensions..xxx.. right? I responded they are close to being right. I believe he was only off by an inch or so. Lo and behold, actual shipping was almost twice what he was quoted, and the buyers card does not go through with the shipping company. After emailing buyer, he wants me to split the difference. He says the weight was 200 pounds, not 100 that I told him. I said, I quoted him 150-200 pounds, and it was 75-100 per piece. (Top & base).Now the shipping company is billing me, saying I am the shipper, and am responsible.So far buyer hasn't even paid the amount he was supposedly quoted.The shipping company is not getting a dime out of me. Anyone with more help with this, I'd appreciate it. Is the buyer considered the shipper under this arrangement? How do I go about filing fraud if it comes to it? He lives over 1000 miles away and it's too costly to show up for court if need be. Would safeharbor help me out?Thanks for any help.
posted on November 24, 2001 04:10:25 PM new
If you stated in your TOS that the buyer is responsible for shipping then it should be the buyer.
If the buyer contacted a shipping company and arranged shipping then it is his responsibility to pay all the costs as he was the one that hired them, right?
Who first contacted the shipping company? You or the buyer?
posted on November 24, 2001 04:43:09 PM new
I do not think safe harbor would get involved. You can try using square trade, I do not know if there is a cost just for mediation, I do know there is a $15.00 fee for feedback removal. If the buyer is in agreement to use this service, I have heard that there has been some very sucessful meeting of the minds, once square trade has entered into the picture. I believe you contact them first, they in turn contact the buyer and it goes on from there.
Reenie
posted on November 24, 2001 05:11:50 PM new
where is the buyer located,1000 miles away in what state,what country??
the 2 of you could both get on the phone and try to find a cheaper shipper/freight forwarding company.
some company does enough business to get a discount from shipper,if you or him know someone in the city,see if they will let you piggyback.
one source is your local wholesaler who does business with someone in his town,of course the third party has to be trustworthy,tell us more .
posted on November 24, 2001 05:19:07 PM new
I assume the item has been shipped and received by the buyer?
However, if you arranged shipment with the shipping company, and you signed the paperwork, they I am afraid you are probably responsible to pay them. If the buyer arranged with the shipping company and signed the paperwork, it is not your problem.
If you end up getting stuck with the shipping bill, your most likely resource would be a small claims lawsuit. I hope you have everything documented! Good luck.
posted on November 24, 2001 05:44:05 PM new
the author said,
and the buyers card does not go through with the shipping company. //////////////
i assume shipper has not been paid because
one question- the buyer card is no good,so where is the goods??????
on the topic of shipping,i visited ups site the other day and tried to get a quote on shipping,they give me 2 day air and express,no ground service and i am shipping to north carolina from texas?why no ground service??
posted on November 24, 2001 05:47:09 PM new
Doesn't Matter who hired the shipping company the seller is the shipping agent.
Item was picked up at there location shipped to the buyer, If the buyer made the arangements with the shipping company you should never have had to quote anything fees would have to be paid on there end no matter what they were the auction states buyer is responable for shipping costs period.
best thing to do is send the bill from the shipping company with a note that gives the billing address of the buyer who is supose to pay them upon delivery of goods http://www.Dman-N-Company.com
Email [email protected]
posted on November 24, 2001 06:18:49 PM new
lesson learned -amateur buying from amateur,and we are all amateurs in the world of retail sales.
nasty surprises hit pocket book and now what??
if seller is an established business which deals with these items before,he would have done a better job quoting measurement,shipping etc.
he may even have an account with a shipper and receives good rates.
but he is not.
now the buyer saves some money buying from individual seller and now he has to pay big time shipping fee.
may be he should have gone to a local store and buy from them?of course we dont know what is the item??
posted on November 24, 2001 07:18:31 PM new
kiara, the buyer hired the shipping company, and arranged to have it picked up at my house. I'd understand that to mean the buyer is the shipper. My TOS says buyer is responsible for shipping arrangements.
It was the buyer that mistook my email when I said 75-100 per piece (Top & bottom). His second inquiry stated 150 pounds, which was my minimum, that's why I responded that's close, so I don't know why he told the shipper 100 pounds.
wowwow, he's already received the item, and I already was paid in full for the win amount. Shipping has not been paid to the shipping company. He lives in the U.S., and I meant to say 1500 miles away from me.
From a legal standpoint concerning fraud, I coudn't file fraud charges because he didn't commit fraud against me, it is against the shipping company.
Another point is, if the shipping costs are higher than the quote, wouldn't the company need to tell the shipper, or buyer in this instance?
posted on November 24, 2001 07:39:33 PM new
it sounds like you are off the hooks,financially and legally.
buyer blames you for misinforming him on wt and measurement,he passed on to shipping company and get a lower rate.
now it is a lot more and he is not pleased.
do you still have the emails sent to him and his responses to you?
all you need to do is produce these emails.
there is no way shipper can contact the buyer and say the piece is bigger and heavier and so shipping would be a lot more.
when their men come to your door to pick up the piece ,they have an order what they should pick up and assume payment and fee has been arranged.
years ago i sold a lacquered 4 panels screen to someone using drop shipment,my vendor does not have the exact screen and send something similar.buyer is not pleased and asked us to pick it up at his office.
to make things worse ,my vendor underquoted me on shipping.
buyer finally agreed to keep it ,but my vendor keeps bugging me and asked me to split the difference in shipping with him,the long distance phone calls must have costed him 10 dollars while my share is 17.
i paid him and he went out of business 2 years ago.
posted on November 24, 2001 07:46:19 PM new
I would think if the buyer hired the company the costs would be his responsibility. You are just the pick-up place.
Another point is, if the shipping costs are higher than the quote, wouldn't the company need to tell the shipper, or buyer in this instance?
If the shipping costs are higher than the quote the shipping company probably never told him because the weight was more than the quote given them.
If the shipping company feels that they may not get paid by the buyer of course they will try to go after you next.
How did the buyer pay you? Hopefully he can't do a chargeback.
posted on November 24, 2001 07:58:37 PM new
no,shipper cannot go to the place where they pick up the item and try to collect the deficiency.
it will have to keep going after the customer aka the buyer who contacts them and request the service.
it will be turned over to collection agency .
if buyer still wont pay,then it will be the last time they will do business with him.
there is really not much else the shipper can do,it is not worth the efforts of taking him to court,so they just have to write it off .
at least they have partial payment from him.
posted on November 24, 2001 10:07:39 PM new
Sounds like the buyer hired them, signed the paperwork, you were just the pickup location. I can't see how the shipping company would have any right to come after you, they need to go after the person who signed the paperwork with them
posted on November 25, 2001 12:56:46 AM new
This sounds like it was a common carrier shipment. Did you make out a bill of lading? If so, did you check the freight collect box??
I can't see how this problem should have occurred in the first place. Any trucking company with a freight collect bill would never even have left the item if the receipient did not have an account with the company.
posted on November 25, 2001 07:29:21 AM new
the seller said-----the buyer card did not go through with the shipping company??//
is the shipping company trying to charge the difference/whole amount to his credit card??
if so,he must have left enough info with the shipper,like opening an account with them.
is it possible that the buyer contacted shipper,gave them his cc info,shipper does not charge until service is rendered.
whch gives the buyer time to nullify his cc like reporting the card lost to the cc company,so when the service has been rendered,aka delivered to his home,shipper charged the high bill to his card and found out the card is no good.
so shipper is out of the whole freight charge,not just the difference.
shipper will try to collect from seller if they could,,it does not hurt to try,but there is no legal recourse with seller,they have to keep going after the buyer.
it sounds like the buyer is willing to pay the shipper if the seller agree to split the bill with him.
someone needs to decipher the email correspondence to see how it is misinterpreted by the buyer,is there misrepresentation,is there adequate disclosure to make buyer understand there are 2 pieces and the measurement given should be multiply by two.
posted on November 25, 2001 07:38:58 AM new
buyer could try to negotiate with shipper and ask to pay less than 400.
it is better to collect a smaller sum than to collect zero sum,if they turn this over to the collection agency,they only recover a certain percentage and it will take time to do so.
posted on November 25, 2001 08:13:20 AM new
The shipping company is DHL. The buyer told me he has to approve the charge before he can be billed, even though his card is on file with them. When DHL arrived for pickup, the driver asked about the billing and went and called headquarters for billing info from the buyer before he even put the item in his truck. I did sign the airbill which only states about liabilty if item is damaged.
Overall though, buyer agreed to pay actual shiping charge whether he got misquoted or not, I shouldn't have to split the difference with him as per his request.
I believe the buyer in his mind thought if we combined the top & bottom as one piece, the weight would be 100 pounds total, because he made a case with me that he thought the item would be shipped as one, but I responded he did not advise me to do so because I specifically stated he needs to tell me if it needs to be shipped that way, but he did not so I shipped seperated. Still, his last inquiry asked if 150 is right.
I told buyer he should at least pay the amount he was quoted, and negotiate the rest later with DHL.
posted on November 25, 2001 08:50:06 AM new
you mean there are 2 shipments??and the total is 400 dollars.
and buyer is under the impression there will only be one combined shipment for 200 dollars??
DHL is a reputable firm,i have dealt with them for shipment coming from east and west(asia and europe),on issues such as us customs duty,broken pieces ,inquiry on shipment status and re delivery ,they were all resolved satisfactorily.
i doubt if dhl would let buyer pay less as there are actually 2 physical shipments and they did their job of delivering the goods.
DHL has the resources to go after your buyer if he does not pay.
you have to decide whether you want to help him pay the difference,i assume it is 200 dollars??
do you make enough on this sale to pay him 200 dollars??
do you want to use a third party like square trade and let them decipher the emails and figure how the buyer comes to the conclusion shipping is less?
have you consulted a lawyer -if he files suit in small claim court,in what state?
posted on November 25, 2001 09:54:02 AM new
Quick McD - Buyer is responsible, and should have made darn sure he understood the shipping charges. Don't back down, unless you want to spend your Christmas gift money straightening out this "misunderstanding." No way.
posted on November 25, 2001 10:10:46 AM new
it is hard for third party to know who is at fault??
sometimes a seller may prmote his item by misleading buyer it costs less to ship.sometimes it could the seller himself does not have a good handle on weight and shipping cost.
this is the problem buying from individual,if this is an established retailer,it has all that info on shipping and weight ,it should have shipped many identical items in the past and there should be no shipping surprises,note mail order catalogs which sell big items like screen tv or exercise machine do charge more for non first floor delivery,set up etc.
individual who is selling an item from home,we dont know what the item is,lets say it is his furnace sitting around for years,and there is no way he can lift an 100 lb item and weigh it on his kitchen scale??
shippers do not just go by weight or measurement,they go by both-you can have a large light item which takes up more room on their airplane,or a small item which weighs a ton to carry.
if i were the seller,i would pay for half the difference as i feel somehow i must have failed to communicate properly to cause the surprise and learn from the experience that i need to learn more about shipping big items.
