posted on August 23, 2002 02:51:19 PM new
I read alot of things in this message board that have helped me alot in this business. So I wanted to pass along this information to help someone else. The actual story behind all of this is extremely long and painful, but the gist of what I wanted to warn you about is as follows:
Had an auction end which did not meet my reserve of $500.00. Buyer contacted me and wanted to go ahead and purchase. Buyer was in Canada. This was not my piece, but a client of mine. Buyer wants to pay with CC and wants me to ship using her FedEx account number, wants me to value it at $100 & wants it shipped via their 2 day service. I comply with all requests, except the valuation on the customs form.
Buyer gets package and claims misrepresentation (not at all, in my opinion), but I offer a refund of the purchase price (not the shipping, as I did not choose the method). Buyer says they are sending it back via Ground service. Three days later I email buyer and she indicates she is keeping the piece, however, she believes I misrepresented and goes on an on about this. I reply with what I believe was a professional statement - I offered a refund upon return to me - I will not argue with you. If you want to keep it, please let me know, so I can advise my consignor - I will assume this transaction is complete if I have not received the item back by X date.
Figuring I would never hear again from this person, the X date comes and the package is not back. However, a week later, I receive a bill from Fed Ex for $263.00 for the shipment of this item (note: UPS would have charged me $50 to send via ground). The buyer refused to pay the shipping charges, so Fed Ex comes after the "shipper". The buyer of course knew this - so in her mind, she got a reduction of the price of the item. Her reply back to me was "you said this matter is complete by X date & it is complete". I will deal with her in my own way, but that is another story.
My main point is to warn any of you who have been asked to use the buyer's shipping account when sending a package. I was not aware that I would be held liable for this amount. I, of course, will fight it tooth and nail, but ultimately I lose according to Federal Express.
I am sure there is a solution around this for any future transactions. There are some people out there who use their own account because they get better discounts. Maybe when filling out the Bill of Lading or, the shipper should be the actual buyer's name and address. Anyways, I think the policy stinks and I do intend to fight it.
In the meantime, be forewarned, so the same thing doesn't happen to you.
posted on August 23, 2002 04:13:00 PM new
I ship USPS Priority Mail= PERIOD!!!
Don't like it don't bid!
What we do is what we do!!
And we do what we do, no more or no less!
I will never kiss a Customers butt again!!
I've done it in the past only leads to problems!!!
posted on August 23, 2002 04:40:57 PM new
You can be sure I have learned my lesson. Every time I veer off of my terms, I get stung. It really is too bad, because I am just trying to be accomodating to the buyer.
My next course of action should be to contact customs and include a copy of the email in which I am asked to value the item at $100, "as it would be a more EFFICIENT shipment", in this persons' words. If Federal Express pushes the issue, they will get copies of the emails which indicate she directed me to charge her account.
I feel terrible for my consignor. He feels guilty about the whole thing, because I won't take the $263 from him. I told him not to feel guilty, as I will take care of this issue.
If I am forced to pay this bill because it will affect my credit, then I will have to contact customs and make life miserable for this person, who transacts ALOT of business through customs. I hate operating like that, but I feel like I was defrauded. I gave her the opportunity to return the item, she chose to scr*w me by refusing the shipping charges.
posted on August 23, 2002 04:48:24 PM newI hate operating like that, but I feel like I was defrauded.
Don't feel bad; you WERE defrauded! What a really underhanded thing to do. Fight it to the end and don't hesitate to reveal her slimy dealings to anyone.
posted on August 23, 2002 06:14:35 PM new
Rainybear - Thanks for the encouragement. I felt it was slimy too.
I wish I could warn others, but since it was an off Ebay transaction, there is not much I can do. I wouldn't wish this person on my worst enemy & that should speak volumes about my transactions to date with this winner.
posted on August 25, 2002 01:25:15 PM new
That is horrible! Especially from a repeat customer!
Help my brain wrap itself around this concept:
You used her account, but then she refused to pay the shipping, so FedEX can go after you. Why can they do that? Was that the actual shipping? Holy mackeral!
If you put the correct value on the package then I guess she also had to pay fees on that, too.
Why can FedEX go after you and not USPS or UPS?
Thanks for your patience, I am a small potato in this but just hate to read about this...
Japerton
posted on August 25, 2002 05:21:43 PM new
But your deal wasn't done in X days. It was a week after that you said. I would refuse to pay a bill I did not authorize, tell them to take it to the person that aurhorized the sending of the bill. Good Luck
posted on August 25, 2002 07:15:47 PM new
Japerton - This was not a repeat customer, this was a first time customer. I was selling a piece of another customer's. The buyer requested special shipping (other than ground UPS) - the box was 35 x 22 x 22 which is oversized, so the price goes up, but since she wanted 2 day express shipping, the price really goes up. Thus the $263.00. The buyer paid the customs fee, but refused to pay the shipping fee. Per Federal Express rules, if the buyer refuses to pay, the shipper is then responsible for payment.
Libra63 - I am most definitely refusing to make payment to Federal Express. When I called Federal Express, I was told that once the invoice is sent to the buyer, their computer cannot rebill that person if they refused payment. So I told them that I refused too, so now they can't bill anyone - LOL.
Personally, I think the whole thing stinks, as the only notification you get from Federal Express that you are ultimately responsible is when the driver is picking up the package, tapping his foot anxiously, as you are filling out the waybill. Do you think he would have a stroke if I told him I needed to read the tiny print on the back of the waybill? I think the only way they should be able to bill the shipper is, after calling for a pick up, using another persons account number, the operator should say - "Did you know that if that person refuses to pay, you are stuck with the bill?" If I had been told that, I would have immediately contacted the buyer and told her to cough up the money for UPS (which would have only been approximately $50 my way) or I wasn't shipping it.
I am for now waiting to see if Federal Express rebills me. If they do, then I will back up my denial of payment with the documentation of emails authorizing me to charge her account. Then I will proceed with contacting the appropriate authorities in Canada.
alwaysbroke - If and when this ever ends, I will update this post. I have this thread bookmarked to do just that. By the way, your name fits me to a tee - LOL
slabholder - Great pic of Meg. Thats what I get for going outside of eBay - its my punishment.
posted on August 25, 2002 09:31:38 PM new
I went through that same dreadful experience where the buyer declines the charges to his account and the shipping company comes hounding me for payment claiming I am the shipper. Fortunately the buyer coughed up the money.
It's doubtful if the contract you sign is enforcable anyway, if you're not given ample time to read through it before signing the shipping papers you can't be bound to it.
posted on August 25, 2002 10:10:52 PM new
At first I didn't understand the post, but it sounds like you did not collect for shipping and sent it collect. Meaning the buyer pays for shipping upon receipt of the item. That is a big mistake on your part. And unfortently, you are liable for the shipping cost if the receiver delines the shipment. It would be the same way with UPS and any other shipping company that offers that kind of service. Next time, Use the online sites to figure the shipping costs or even take it to the companies shipping hub to have the freight calculated for you, then always collect the freight in the payment to you and send it freight prepaid. Then if the package is refused, you would have the option of having it returned to you (for a fee) or the shipping company scraping the package at no extra cost to you. Remember, if you ship a package prepaid, it becomes the responsibility of the cosignee (buyer) once the shipping company takes possesion of it. If you send a package freight collect, it is your responsibiliy until the buyer takes possesion. Kind of ironic that it was a Canadian giving you this problem. You would not have this trouble with any other country.
Good luck in this situation. Hope you can conclude it favorably.
posted on August 26, 2002 02:11:42 PM new
caffetalia - The buyer has taken possession of the item already - she did not refuse the shipment, only the shipping charges on her Fedex account.
I always ship using the online calculators & then add that to my invoice. I have been doing it that way for over 3 years. However, this particular buyer asked if I could bill her fed ex account, as she gets a discounted rate because of a high volume of shipping. I told her that would be no problem - she then requested that I put on the waybill, that she wanted 2 day service from Florida to Toronto. Thus, the $263 charge.
She received the item, complained that I misrepresented the item (which I did not). She was offered a refund of the purchase price, she said she was sending it back. Three days later she tells me she is considering keeping the item. To which I replied (cuz I am getting sick of her emails), if I do not have the item back by "x" date, I will consider this transaction complete. After this period of time, I am assuming she received her FedEx invoice and declined the shipping - to which FedEx promptly billed me.
I hope that explains it a little more. Normally, I have no problems with Canadian buyers, except for this one & another recently who had zero feedback and wanted to check my integrity for a $34 item before he paid me. That was back in late July, I am still waiting for his payment (yeah right!). His first feedback is definitely going to be a neg!
quickdraw29 - I agree that I should not be held to this waybill, considering I wasn't given any time to read it, nor was I told I could be held responsible if the buyer stiffed me when I called for the pick up of this item. The buyer will NEVER pay for this shipment, as she has figured out a way to get a reduced price for this item, based on what she feels was misrepresented about it.
An idea of the misrepresentation is she mentioned the piece was 1/2" shorter than it was supposed to be, indicating it had been cut down. She then proceeded to tell me she had 6 others like it, so she was "an expert". Obviously, she didn't read the description which CLEARLY stated the dimensions. This is the type of lunacy I have dealt with throughout this matter.
posted on August 26, 2002 04:26:57 PM new
Ok, I guess I understand a little better now. I think you do have a leg to stand on for this item. The driver screwed up. If the buyer, even on her account, does not want to pay for the freight, the driver should not have given the parcel to the buyer. In this case, what I would do is tell them that you are the buyers agent and was authorized by her to use your account to send her the parcel and all shipping charges are to be paid with that account. If they refuse to accept that, you may end up in court, but you have a leg to stand upon since they did deliver a freight collect parcel without collecting the freight.
posted on October 17, 2002 01:31:53 PM new
Just a quick update for those that were interested. Federal Express is now threatening to sue me for this disaster. This is after I sent them a letter with copies of the emails from the Buyer authorizing the use of the Buyers' account number.
Their reason - their computers cannot rebill the original person after they have refused. No, but they can keep billing me incessantly.
The greatest part of the letter, was that they were no longer letting me use my Fed Ex account. (I am so disappointed - said sarcastically). I stopped using them a year ago when a fork lift went through a mirror I shipped through them. Their service was also terrible & delivery took too long on some items. I use UPS or the Post Office exclusively now.
Oh well, we shall see what the end result is here. My letter specifically stated that "I wouldn't pay a dime of this bill."
posted on October 17, 2002 02:09:59 PM new
xenainfla
Take FEDEX to court in your state, sue them in small claims or even a lawsuit for harassment and while you are add it take your scamming customer to court also
Sean
You can accomplish more with a kind word and a shillelagh than you can with just a kind word.
posted on October 17, 2002 03:14:20 PM new
with your email proof, if you could take them to small claims court, you could pay the FedEX bill and sue the buyer for 3 times your losses. Not sure how that works when buyer is in another country???
I know a repair shop once fixed an item for me without first giving me a requested estimate...the repairs were more that the item was new...they had to pay me 3 times the value of the item.
posted on October 17, 2002 04:41:14 PM new
Tell fed ex that YOUR computer cannot bill a client account, so niether of us can pay.
And since the client accepted the package on her account, the deal is complete. You owe nothing. They accepted her contract number to deliver, and the package was accepted, along with charges once accepted.
Small claims court will cost them a fortune to fight you.
posted on October 17, 2002 10:54:24 PM new
What you should have done in the first place was make the buyer email you a prepaid label to print, that way there is no possibility that you could be charged.
