gina50
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posted on April 27, 2003 08:28:08 AM new
Hi
I am the seller and auction ended yesterday for a widget on eBay.
In the auction, I clearly stated that I had no idea if item was original or not.
When I bought this item, I was under the impression that it was old but just to cover myself since I wasn't positive beyond a shadow of doubt, I said not sure if it was.
The high bidder emailed me right after auction ended to say that I was selling a fake and threatened me.
He bid this item way up and never emailed me with any questions at any time until it was over.
He wants me to remove his bid and claims that another eBayer emailed him to say it was a fake.
So, what do I do?
I also sold 2 similar items to others and had the same wording in my description. I sure don't want any problems.
Thanks in advance.
NOT gina50 on eBay
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Libra63
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posted on April 27, 2003 08:34:48 AM new
My opinion is he bid he wins. What happened is auction interference. The question is how did that other person get the email address of your bidder? I have a feeling he is feeling buyers remorse and if it was me I wouldn't let him out of it. I think you covered your self in your description and it was up to your bidder to write and ask about it. Did he feedback show any pattern of this?
Good Luck, this should be an interesting discussion.
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rarriffle
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posted on April 27, 2003 08:37:29 AM new
you email him and tell him his bid is a binding contract...you expect to get paid.
if he does not pay then follow through with NPB and FVF and NEGATIVE FEEDBACK.
you covered all your bases with your description, he was bidding at his own risk.
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gina50
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posted on April 27, 2003 08:47:30 AM new
He has less than 10 feedbacks and all are positive.
He just emailed me again and said that 2 other sellers had emailed him to say that it is a fake and he will give me their names after 60 days !!
He also said that those sellers are watching my sales of the widgets !
He said that he will pay my eBay fees if I let him off the hook.
I sold 2 others to other buyers.
One is mailing check and didn't recieve yet and the other used Paypal and item was mailed already, so waitng to hear from that buyer.
These are not items I usually sell and I think I'll stick to my normal things and forget about this stuff !
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Libra63
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posted on April 27, 2003 08:52:11 AM new
It is still auction interference for someone to email a winner of an auction and tell them any information. You need to do what you feel is right. If you are going to take ebay fees then add a little for your time and trouble. Don't let him off the hook to easy.
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trai
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posted on April 27, 2003 09:09:27 AM new
At this stage I would no longer bother with answering any emails with this bidder as its a lost battle. Treat this as any other deadbeat and file for your fees and move on.
Its their job to ask beforehand and not after the auction is closed. As others have stated this is by their own words auction interference.
I see no reason to let them off the hook as they did bid.By now they will never be happy no matter what you do, therefore just relist and block their email and bidding option so you do not have to deal with them again.
Be sure to file both npb and fvf on them as this will leave a mark on their user name and all it takes is two more from other sellers and they are gone.
As for this binding contract b.s. goes there is no such thing, just a load of crap from ebay. Remember ebay always states they are only a venue.
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gina50
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posted on April 27, 2003 10:36:53 AM new
The thing that really kills me, the more I think about it is~
I started all 3 auctions with an opening amount of $19.00 with no reserve!
The winners are the ones that drove the price sky high!
One went for $380. Now, that winner paid me through Paypal and I mailed with Delivery Confirmation to make sure he gets it.
What if he complains to me? It said the same exact words in my description.....now sure if original. Can he complain to Paypal and if so, would they do anything? I don't want my acct. to be frozen.
Thanks guys & gals 
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ahc3
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posted on April 27, 2003 11:09:32 AM new
I think this is a lost battle as well, you are not going to collect from this guy. What I would do is be really nice to him, and tell him he is off the hook IF he gives you the information of the people who wrote him. Tell him that you just want to contact them to talk about their concerns, whatever BS line you want to use. Then, I would contact ebay with their info and get them in trouble for auction interference. You aren't going to collect from this guy, you might as well try to use him to get rid of these troublemakers...
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kiara
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posted on April 27, 2003 11:42:10 AM new
gina50, It sounds like you did your best to describe them and you started at a low bid. You have no control over what people choose to pay. The others may be very happy so try not to worry about it and hope for the best.
Do some investigative work. Are any other items presently for sale on ebay that are like the ones you sold? Is your problem bidder bidding on just this type of item? Does he leave feedback too? Maybe he's just trying to intimidate you into offering it to him for a lesser price. And perhaps he does this to other sellers for all you know.
Contact ebay and forward the threatening e-mail he sent you. Maybe no one else even e-mailed him and he's just bluffing. You can let him out of the deal and perhaps send a personal offer to the next runner-up if his bid price was close.
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neonmania
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posted on April 27, 2003 11:47:46 AM new
There a more than a few of these vigilanties on ebay that pull this. There is one item where auction interference used to be so bad that all sellers had to resort to private auctions because the sellers of the fakes would contact people bidding on originals, half of the originals sellers were contacting bidders of the fakes and the other half were placing deadbeat bids on the fakes to drive out their sellers (ignoring that in the meantime they had doubled the going price of the fakes enabling some sellers to capitalize using BIN auctions). It got to a point where it became one of the more entertaining spectator sports on ebay.
As for your previous buyer - he can complain to PayPal all he wants but if you used delivery confirmation they are not going to do anything unless he bought their insurance.
BTW - I like AH3s idea except for one minor detail. Having their actual emails would be much better than just their identities.
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gina50
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posted on April 27, 2003 12:59:08 PM new
kiara,
Can you tell me where to go on eBay to forward the threatening emails?
There are others similar to mine on ebay all of the time and the prices go way high!
He said he'll give me the guys name after 60 days !!! A lot of good that will do me now.
Thanks in advance,
gina
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kiara
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posted on April 27, 2003 01:29:03 PM new
It's really difficult to find anywhere to report things to ebay. Even though he didn't threaten bodily harm I did find a report button on the bottom of this Help page and it says:
Report listing violations or problems with another eBay member. and you just click on "report". You can send his e-mail and headers I would think or ebay may ask for them when they get back to you.
http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/everyone-threats.html
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mcjane
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posted on April 27, 2003 03:23:47 PM new
I'm not convinced anyone emailed him that what you sold him is a fake. Those emails usually are sent before the auction ends.
I think it's 100% buyers remorse. I would take him up on his offer to pay expenses with the provision no FB is to be exchanged.
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hotcupoftea
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posted on April 27, 2003 05:08:28 PM new
I think sellers need to show more diligence when selling items. Saying "not sure if original" isn't sufficient.
There is an ongoing brouhaha among a group of collectors and a few sellers right now. They all made contacts with each other via eBay initially, which would be construed as auction interference. I've stayed out of the controversy, but several of the collectors forward all of the email correspondence to me, so I am conversant with the story.
Several sellers in the Southwest are china painters. They purchased antique white ware on eBay, mostly 19th century Limoges or Haviland, but some 19th century German makers too, along with gold and white, thus there is a decorating mark for the gold. The sellers painted the china in the fashion of the 19th century Limoges artists (i.e. large pink roses or other flowers). The sellers listed the china on eBay, said the piece had the factory mark and the decorating mark, and it is signed by the artist. The sellers did not state the piece was painted by them, in the year 2003. The bidding went high, over $300 on some auctions, because the bidders "assumed" the artist painted the pieces during the date range of the factory and decorating marks. Also, when there is a decorating mark, the assumption is the artist worked for the studio aligned to the decorating mark.
When the collectors discovered they had been cheated, they were so enraged they started contacting each other through eBay (auction interference.) Several of the collectors got together and hired an attorney, a lawyer who had knowledge of antique porcelain and what legally constitues an antique.
The brouhaha is still ongoing.
I relate this story because when collectors get cheated, they get mad. If a seller is not sure about what they are selling, then don't sell it until identification is confirmed.
Remember too, that if a collector pays over $300 for an auction, most likely the collector is a professional, well educated and affluent, and will take legal remedies for redress of damages. The winning buyer will not be a person who makes idle threats.
I am not hotcupoftea on eBay.
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neonmania
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posted on April 27, 2003 05:52:43 PM new
Hot - the difference is that in your scenario the seller made no mention that pieces may not be authentic. If the it is clearly stated in the auction that the item may not be an original and the starting price is far below value for an original with no reserve to imply a higher actual value, any complaint is going to be thrown out as buyers remorse. The buyer set their own value on the item on the chance that they would be aquiring an original. They rolled the dice and truth be told, no one yet knows if they won or not.
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neglus
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posted on April 27, 2003 06:03:38 PM new
I agree with Neon..seems like the seller in hot cup's scenario MEANT to defraud or at least to lead buyers on...gina on the other hand was very upfront about not knowing authenticity. Naive sellers are the very thing that bring some buyers to eBay in the hopes of finding that "diamond in the rough"...
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kiara
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posted on April 27, 2003 06:15:19 PM new
I agree with neonmania and neglus. It sounds like the Limoges sellers had intentions to defraud and Gina didn't.
I sell a wide variety of items and there is no possible way I can know about them all. I don't live close to "experts" and anything I am unsure about I admit it in the auction and start the bidding low and invite the buyers to ask questions.
On occasion someone more knowledgeable will contact me and give information that is useful and some bidders do ask questions first. I have seldom had a problem.
It would be great to deal in just one item and be an expert on it but it's not possible for many of us.
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hotcupoftea
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posted on April 27, 2003 07:35:12 PM new
Point taken.
Though sellers who think there is a possibility that their item is not authentic, should say so in more than one phrase and make that portion of the text at the beginning of the description. The seller should give numerous photos, so that the collectors can attempt to determince authenticity, not just one itty bitty photo that isn't even clickable. It is better to get a lower price and save oneself a lot of headaches by giving prospective bidders as much information as possible.
BTW, without starting a new thread, I heard on the grapevine, originating from another replacement service, that China Replacements has laid off 300 people due to the dramatic fall in demand for dinnerware replacement. About two years ago I restructured my eBay business to evolve away from china replacement because I could see the trend of diminishing prices. I evolved to selling my very rare porcelain off-eBay directly to the collectors and selling the unique, but not-so-rare, on eBay. However I still see eBay sellers buying sets on eBay and piecing back out over time in their auctions, and losing money by doing so. Interesting.
I am not hotcupoftea on eBay.
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