posted on April 7, 2004 01:54:06 PM new
This is no super big deal but I'm just wondering what you'd do...
I have a person that has bought quite a few things from me over the past 4 months. This person has multiple buying names and one selling name (that I know of). They buy my items, put the price up 5 times or more, which I have no problem with, BUT when they resell the items, they misrepresent them, saying things such as - from the 18th century or were bought in France... to mention a few. Many times I've felt like writing the bidders and telling them the person's lying, but I haven't. The problem is, some of the bidders that buy from me also buy from this person because the items are in the same category, so I see them paying crazy prices for misrepresented items. I get a headache thinking about it. What would you do?
posted on April 7, 2004 01:55:46 PM new
Stay honest & mind your own business. The buyers will catch on to him/her eventually.
Then you'll benfit!
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We do not stop playing because we grow old. We grow old because we stop playing -- Anonymous
posted on April 7, 2004 02:00:46 PM new
Omigosh!!!! ... I've not heard of this exact type of thing before, but it sure must leave you gnashing your teeth! ...
I dunno ... why don't you 'ask question to seller', using your seller name, to have them verify their provenance/research on these items?
edited to add: well actually, my daughter who sells consignments on ebay noticed that one guy that dropped things off for her to sell, was bidding on his own items ... then she checked that ebay member name for items he had bid on, and it was the same items he had dropped off for her to sell, at a much higher price .... between a bit of tit for tat, she soon fired him from being a client.
[ edited by aintrichyet on Apr 7, 2004 02:05 PM ]
posted on April 7, 2004 02:39:10 PM new
Fortunately, eBay (just like "The Godfather"*) has a rule for every situation. And the rule in this case is: If you contact the bidders, that's auction interference.
posted on April 7, 2004 03:22:24 PM new
This is not your problem, best leave everything as it is as long as you are happy with price you are getting. In a sense it isn't any difference than what most of us do. We buy it for X$ & try to sell it for 2X$. Whether it is bought on an eBay auction or a local auction house, really no difference. I can see why your upset, because of the hype being used to increase the price.
posted on April 7, 2004 03:34:10 PM new
sanmar: "I can see why your upset, because of the hype being used to increase the price."
but gosh, sanmar, the 'hype' is misrepresenting ,,,,[ummm. lying about] the items, ... unless they are stating the same info they know from originally purchasing it. .. yes?
what i mean is, when my daughter was listing items that this guy consigned, he more than embellished the original owner's item ... he would state to her 17th century blah blah when the same item, he had purchased on ebay, said nothing to that effect.
When you sell, are you positive they are not '18th century' whatevers?
What I mean is, I have no idea what you sell, and if they are things you do pick up at estate sales or local auctions, and they told you one thing, and so you put it in your ad, and maybe this person *might* know more about it? I'm talking about antiques, and there is no way one person could know everything about all antiques.
But, if you are for sure what you have, then yeah, that is wrong, but I'd have to agree with these guys, it would be auction interference, and you may be loosing a customer, because of your honesty.
Did I make that as clear as mud
nice to see you up here in the EO
__________________________________
"Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known."- Carl Sagan
I know what you mean - could the items I'm selling actually be from France or the 18th century... no. And it's not just my items. I've checked on what this person has won. They always list the items immediately so it's easy to check. Something bought from Montana suddenly become something from an estate in Hollywood, and unbelievable things like this. I continued to check this person's auctions for entertainment, but feel sad for the people who buy into it all.
Here's something interesting. This person's Selling feedback is pretty good - they are well known in this field. Their Buying feedback is so-so. What's interesting, is they've never given feedback to their sellers - not me, not anyone!
You're all right - I won't get involved, but it's just interesting how some people choose to conduct business.
posted on April 7, 2004 04:28:23 PM new
wow. It does almost make you want to tell the buyers! I would be tempted to, but know its one of those ebay 'no no's'
Well, as long as your getting what you want when selling to them, then just let it go, course, the entertainment value, I would be doing the same thing! checking out what will they say this widget is this week
__________________________________
"Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known."- Carl Sagan
posted on April 7, 2004 06:01:16 PM new
Probably best to let the market sort things out, you shouldn't email their buyers. That could cause you problems. You can complain to ebay I suppose, but I don't think that is going to get them to act. Know what you're buying, and as always, Caveat Emptor...
posted on April 7, 2004 06:02:07 PM new
Well, you can't contact this person's bidders because that would be auction interference.
Since this sounds like the sort of person you don't want to do business with, you could block all their IDs, as someone else said, from bidding on your stuff.
You could also let eBay know hat this person is pulling, but I doubt they'd do anything. It's a "your word against theirs" situation.
Things being what they are on eBay, the onus is on the buyer to be up on what they are buying.
******
Censorship, like charity, should begin at home; but unlike charity, it should end there --Clare Booth Luce
posted on April 7, 2004 06:25:54 PM new
very doubtful ebay would do a thing. Look at how much listing and FVF's they are getting from the dishonest seller.
__________________________________
"Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known."- Carl Sagan
posted on April 7, 2004 06:32:42 PM new
It's too bad. I'd love to be able to hack into their auctions and ruin their business!
Seriously though, one thing I did think of, was to send them a list of some (faux) items I have for sale - all from the 16th century or earlier. For some pieces, I will let them know that I had to travel to the Europe to personally retrieve - AND luckily all are in the $50.00 price range.
posted on April 7, 2004 07:06:09 PM new
Not sure if it would work but you could maybe word something in your auctions like bidders to be aware that widgets like yours are being misrepresented on ebay as 18th century and from France, etc.
By doing that, you also can get keywords into the auction. Your buyer may no longer purchase from you though.
Or........ you could turn to the dark side and be like them. Just kidding...
posted on April 7, 2004 07:23:08 PM new
I don't understand your concern? They won your auction and paid didn't they?
Why should you care what they do afterwards... you have other auctions to run and take care of... So what if they are lying... either the bidders will catch on and stop bidding his auctions or they won't... look at the bright side you have someone that wants your items...
Let it ride and forget about it... you keep your auctions straight and let others run theirs... karma will catch them eventually...
posted on April 7, 2004 07:34:07 PM new
That's the thing. I know it's not really any of my business, but it's difficult to see someone misrepresenting things to your buyers and to everyone else. It's a gut instinct to want to warn the unknowledgable - that's why I continue talking to you Twelve.
Kiara, I would but it would be very obvious. Hopefully I'm not the only one that's figured this person out.
posted on April 7, 2004 07:57:48 PM new
Kraft, I know what you mean and it's just one of those things that most sellers have to deal with sooner or later.
The sad thing is that there is always another gullible buyer so it never seems to end.
I know some who have operated on the shady side for years and karma hasn't caught up with them yet......... I keep hoping.
posted on April 8, 2004 12:41:12 AM new
Going back to my original message, I still say that she should not get involved. She has done nothing wrong, & has nothing to gain or lose.
posted on April 8, 2004 11:03:22 AM new
The reason they are not giving the sellers feedback is because then any buyer from them could research what they are buying and make the connection.
They're not stupid, this way they are less likely to get caught.
posted on April 8, 2004 11:47:47 AM new
i agree with twelvepole,they bot from you,they paid for it and what they do is their business.
if it bothers you,then block them from bidding,altho they can always use another id.
there is a lot like this going on,one seller even offers certificate of authenticity,but bidders catch on .
-sig file -------we eat to live,not live to eat.
Benjamin Franklin
posted on April 8, 2004 04:28:11 PM new
It is all about Risk v Reward. The risk you would be doing to your business is far greater then the reward. First you would lose a customer. Second you are exposing yourself to a boat load of trouble from this person as they try to get back at you for threatening their livelihood. I would just keep it quiet unless someone asks your opinion. Remember, the burden of proof is on you and unless you actually see them list an item you sold them and you are absolutely can prove it is not what they say it is it would be a tough case.
___________________________________
If you build it they will come........
posted on April 9, 2004 08:46:13 AM new
Ahhhhhhh, ethical, the reason I'm not rich.
Inform the buyer that you are not comfortable with their business model and that for your peace of mind you have decided not to sell to them anymore. THEN block them. You can only do that which is legitimately within your purview, but do the most you ethically can within the eBay system.
posted on April 10, 2004 04:51:08 PM new
O.K. I'm curious - what's their eBay seller I.D.? I'd like to snoop around and see what's up!
As regards ethics:
Knowingly representing something as 18th century "whatever" that isn't 18th century, is fraud. Your being aware of this and not reporting it, makes you complicit in perpetrating fraud - which is why you are so uncomfortable with it.
But what to do? If there is a reporting mechanism in place for a situation like this, an ethical person would report it.
However, there are some caveats:
First, people can cause you a lot of trouble online - so your cautious approach to figuring out what to do about this is warranted.
I wouldn't do anything to tip them off that you're on to them. You can always block them as a bidder in the future.
And there may be a way to deal with this without exposing yourself to the possibility of undo harrasment.
Regardles - do not do anything without building a documented case. You really should build a case file of half a dozen or so auctions where they've clearly bought something and misrepresented it.
A bullet proof case file would be a folder on your hard drive where you have saved copies of these auctions including their photos. There'd be a copy of your closed auction and a copy of their closed auction for each of these items. After you have enough you could print them out and send hard copies to eBay asking they do something about this situation.
You might even want to have a third party send this info instead of you - i.e., they are complaining not you. That would reduce the chances of you being the target of the offenders ire.
posted on April 11, 2004 11:28:07 AM new
Go2cfi, you're right about how I feel - like I'm in collusion or an accessory because I know what they're doing. I do believe in karma though, and know that this person will get bit in the a$$ in the long run, so I'll just bide my time.
Thanks everyone for letting me unload - it's been bugging me for a couple of months and I needed to vent. Someday, if I get mad enough, I'll post one of their auctions here for everyone to laugh at.
posted on April 11, 2004 05:26:10 PM new
Re: bite you in the A$$.
I once heard a guy say that "Time will either expose you or promote you!"
Over time I've found that to be true. So, unless the house is burning down - it is good to take the time to gather information and to ask the opinion of others. When it comes to synergy 1+1 = 11.
And some problems solve themselves by simply waiting and taking no action. And if not, more time generally yields better solutions because there is less emotion and more thinking.
At tricky as it is though, we do have to take a stand against people who take short cuts. Left unchallenged they become emboldened.
In my recent research on eBay I've been surprised at how sophisitcated the scammers out there are. The tip about your guy never leaving feedback to the people he's bought from (to cover his trail) was a real eye opener to me.
Knowing that gives me one more tool for looking at the people I'm thinking of doing business with.
I understand the turmoil this situation puts you in. Have you considered contacting the buyer directly with our concerns and the implication that if he/she doesn't stop, further action will be taken?
posted on April 13, 2004 07:05:28 AM new
buyer beware is pasted all over ebay site,ebay does not care or investigate what you sell and what you buyer resell as.
remember great collectibles launched by ebay at one time with dealer guaranteeing what they sell and money refund for up to a year,that folded as most bidders would rather take their chance on regular ebay.
sending copies to ebay??how is ebay supposed to tell who is right by looking at some copies??
-sig file -------we eat to live,not live to eat.
Benjamin Franklin
