posted on July 16, 2004 01:42:21 PM new
OK... I admit I do not use PayPal and in fact pretty much have no use for it other than the once in a billion years I use my account for a small online purchase. However, today I ran across an auction that stated that with PayPal you have the option of 12 months same as cash. Is this true? If so, I might have to rethink the whole PayPal thing as a payment option in auctions that are large ticket.
posted on July 18, 2004 09:16:43 PM new
It is true, but as a seller, I would have to think very hard if I wish to accept the risk of non-payment as PayPal refuses to state what will happen if that happens. You can bet PayPal will not take the hit. The poor seller will.
posted on July 18, 2004 10:14:46 PM new
Has the economy gotten so bad that now Paypal is offering credit ?
I mean,you can already use your credit card trhough Paypal, or debit your checking account. So is this new credit aervice for people whose credit cards are maxed out ?
posted on July 18, 2004 11:21:34 PM new
Reamond...You hit the nail on the head. The economy has nothing to do with it. This feature is for those who have maxed out their credit card. The big question is who will be hit when the buyer defaults? I'm going to side with Stone on this. It won't be Paypal. It won't be the buyer. Guess who is left to pick up the tab? I still feel it's incredible that people will submit their banking and credit card info in the form of a blank check to a company that is not subject to any regulatory oversight. It's about the same as answering a spoof email.
A $75.00 solid state device will always blow first to protect a 25 cent fuse ~ Murphy's Law
posted on July 19, 2004 04:54:43 AM new
if you sell large ticket items,such as pc .laptop,tv set,and you sell everyday,this is a good way to gain more buyers.
of course there is risk,like everything else in life.
Ask Mitsubishi motors for their zero zero zero program,they end up repossessing many of their cars.
-sig file -------we eat to live,not live to eat.
Benjamin Franklin
posted on July 19, 2004 06:17:33 AM new
When I read the info from Paypal at their site, it said that they turn over non-payers to outside collection agencies, just like other businesses do. They specifically said they do not charge back on the seller. Legally, I don't think they can. Paypal is financing the purchase, not you.
posted on July 19, 2004 06:29:43 AM new
If you go to the Paypal site and read the terms and conditions of the Paypal credit program for our customers, like I just did, Paypal itself does NOT offer the credit to them. GE Capital Consumer Card Co. does. The consumer must apply to obtain a line of credit with a standard agreement, just as if they were applying for a credit card.
The buyer/person applying for credit can't just bid on your auction and get credit "on the fly" at auction end. They must place an application (online, I am assuming) and be approved. Not every potential buyer, obviously, will get approval.
posted on July 19, 2004 06:41:02 AM new
Oops! Here's the part where a seller can get burned, when a buyer who got the item on credit decides to tell Ge Capitol or Paypal that the item delivered was "significantly different than described":
Buyer Protection
Full Buyer Protection with PayPal Buyer Credit is available on purchases made using the Credit Line. Buyer Protection from PayPal is in addition to any rights you have to dispute charges to your Credit Line with the credit issuer. As stated in the Billing Rights Notice provided with the Credit Line Agreement, if you have a problem with the quality of goods or services that you purchased using your Credit Line and you have tried in good faith to correct the problem with the merchant, you may not have to pay the remaining amount due on your Credit Line for the Advance(s) related to such goods or services.
Full Buyer Protection with PayPal Buyer Credit provides coverage beyond the existing PayPal protection programs (PayPal Buyer Protection and the Buyer Complaint Process) and helps buyers who pay with PayPal Buyer Credit recover the full purchase amount from eBay sellers who do not deliver the promised goods or who deliver goods which are 'significantly-not-as-described' in the eBay listing.
In addition, Full Buyer Protection with PayPal Buyer Credit helps buyers recover the full purchase amount for payments made with PayPal Buyer Credit from online merchants outside the eBay marketplace who do not deliver the promised goods.
Amount of Coverage. If your claim is granted for a transaction funded by PayPal Buyer Credit, PayPal will reimburse you for losses up to the full purchase amount, not just up to the $500 limit which applies to standard PayPal Buyer Protection for eBay transactions. Your reimbursement will be paid in the currency of the original PayPal payment up to the full purchase amount.
So as before, occasionally dishonest people will try to make your life hell whether they are using buyer crediot or their own funds through Paypal.
By no means is the above the entire agreement.
It comes down to "how can a seller ever prove they shipped the quality of item that was advertised"?
posted on July 19, 2004 06:59:20 AM new
Personally, I wouldn't offer it. I think we take a big enough risk when offering credit card payments though any merchant service not just PayPal.
How many sellers are going to get ripped off by allowing a buyer to use this service? That's really hard to say. I would hope that the bidders using this service are of a better class than those who bid and bid and bid only to rip off the seller by claiming non-receipt or not as described.
posted on July 19, 2004 07:05:39 AM new
hi meadowlark:
this thread has been posted several times already, and seems to be getting more complex each time...
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nowwwwwwwwwwwww....
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the following c/pastes are from paypal forum...the answers are from randall at paypal..paypalcredit..
[statement by paypal credit]
Full buyer protection with PayPal Buyer Credit is not a new protection program offered to buyers, but an extension of the existing PayPal protection programs. Even if you have opted-out of PayPal Buyer Protection, as long as a transaction is funded by PayPal Buyer Credit, then a buyer can file a claim which may be eligible for full buyer protection with PayPal Buyer Credit.
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QQQ asked>>>
Thank you for your response. It appears that all credit card chargebacks for ITEMS NOT AS DESCRIBED are passed directly through to the seller. It appears then that like claims (NOT AS DESCRIBED) will be handled in the same manner for Buyer Credit. I have to leave, but will check back later for more information provided in the workshop
Ans from paypal>>
Sellers have the opportunity to disagree with a buyer's claim of signifcantly not as described items and/or provide additional evidence to support their position.
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QQ aked>>>
once Randall, on a thread on the paypal board, said this will be an open end line of credit where bidders can continue to add purchases to it, how long with the "chargeback" rights of bidders be. Will it be for the entire lenght of the payments, extended each time the line is extended?
ANS>>>To answer #21, Buyers will have 30 days from the date of purchase to file a complaint through PayPal's complaint processes. As stated above, PayPal Buyer Credit is similar to a credit card, so the buyer also has rights to dispute a purchase with the credit issuer after the 30-day window.
end of c/paste paypal forum.
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my thoughts are:
[1] we all know "not as described," is like pandora's box -- EXCEPT THERE AINT NO HOPE LEFT!!
[2] the cost is so cumulative...on a $575 12 month extended credit sale...the cost to the seller is and additional 3.75%, or approx $52.00 total cost to sell...i realize that on a large sale, the dollar amount of profit is large enuff to "cover." my point, i feebly try to establish is: once again, the seller is left at the bottom of the chain..do we automatically add and additional 3.75% to our minimum bid-or what?
[3] everyone must understand, that they, the seller[s] have no control over extended credit..but i am no longer so sure we will be left out of the loop when a chargeback happens 3 months after the auction is over, and credit been extended, and we been paid..
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not saying you wrong, but i not sure we should be so happy with GECC...
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MHOofcurse
mot
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the way i read it, you wont have the choice on a qualified amount...seller completely out of the loop...
realize that on any auction that is $199, or more, the logo appears on your listing page...you have no power to default out of this...
so, i not trying to be smartA, but if the winning bidders wants to charge it on xtended program; then ebay[someone] sends you a payment less the fees and commissions..
posted on July 19, 2004 07:23:10 AM new
All I will say about this is.....Run, do not walk! I see no good reason for the seller to be stuck for this.
Let the credit company deal with the buyer that they approved, nothing to do with the seller.
Will never trust this kind of a deal where the seller is always held to account but never the buyer.
If its a big ticket item then its up to the buyer to make sure they have the funds.
posted on July 19, 2004 07:46:05 AM new
I agree with you guys now. I edited out my statement above that I thought the program is safe.
The way I see it now is that dishonest buyers can get line of credit, if approved, then buy a high ticket item, then dispute that it was as described. It turns into the seller's word against the buyer. The ssller can get a chargeback seemingly anytime after the sale until the credit on that item is repaid. the first 30 days via Paypal, the rest of the term through the CC company.
MOT,
I guess I didn't completely understand in the one earlier thread I read that this was the situation. I have been inactive here for a while, and only saw one other thread on this in recent weeks.
Anyway, my conclusion is that there have always been dishonest buyers. The credit plan gives them one more tool to attempt to rip us off. I do think most buyers are honest, but we have to protect ourselves from the inevitable loss if we leave ourselves open to those who will attempt to abuse it.
i not so sure the earlier thread[s] was in fact the same; it seems like every time it comes up, more is uncovered..which is good...
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i just know that on my furniture auctions, the extended credit box[it is not an icon size] is predominantly dsplayed...
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and the dishonest buyers statment you made is true...been here, will be here, etc.etc.,
the difference is that those kind of people can now effect US!
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mot
posted on July 19, 2004 08:21:33 AM new
what about dishonest sellers??
ITEM SIGNIFICANTLY NOT AS DESCRIBED- there are plenty of broken,chipped,crazed,dirty stuff on ebay paraded as good condition,excellent like new etc.
Some sellers dont know or dont want to know the difference between ivory and celluloid,original versus repros,synthetic versus genuine stones,the list goes on.
-sig file -------we eat to live,not live to eat.
Benjamin Franklin
I think the dishonest/careless sellers will continue to do what they do. I don't think the credit plan will affect their misdeeds. Some buyers will pursue a claim for misrepresentation. Some will just feel ripped off and think they can't do anything about it.
posted on July 25, 2004 10:19:52 AM new
I read all of this thread, but I am still a bit confused, is this buy now-pay later, a feature which the seller can op out of, and if so how?
If a buyer can’t afford the items I sell either on check or credit card, then personally I don’t want to sell to them.
We no longer handle furniture on line which might require or be used for such financing, as shipping just got too expensive.
Bottom line I don’t want this feature on my auctions, site, anywhere.
posted on July 25, 2004 12:39:22 PM new
Apparently this is offered through GE financial, just like Bestbuy's same as cash financing.
Miss a payment or are late or don't pay off in time, the borrower gets socked with 22% frinance fees from the time of purchase.
Minimum payments are also set so that the amount will not be paid off in 12 months.
I wonder what percentage of buyers don't get it paid off in 12 months and have to pay all that interest ?
I am also wondering how this works with Paypal. Ususally, GE pays the retailor a discounted price on the loan, e.g., if the buyer spends $1000 SAC, GE remits only $950 to the retailer as paid in full, and then finances $1000 to the buyer and hopes he/she has to pay the interest so they can make even more money on the transaction.
But who will GE discount the loan to ? The seller, Paypal ??
