posted on February 26, 2005 03:48:08 PM new
Hi gang! I can't remember who can read Japanese or knows Japanese stuff, but I know there's somebody here that does. If you could give me just a little help, I would greatly appreciate it. I got this stuff at an estate sale today. First is a pair of silver with gold wash inside sake cups (I think). They were in the box with the little dish, but the lid wouldn't close (they had it taped together), so I don't think they originally were together. Anyway, the inside top of the box has "Mitsukoshi", which I have learned was a high-end department store in Japan. Each of the cups has the same inscriptions on the bottom and, of course, I have no clue! I would appreciate any help at all. Here they are:
As you can tell, I polished one of the cups, but not the other and not the little dish.
These other little beauties are in a little wooden box and are not satsuma, but my question is what were they used for? They're not quite 2-3/4" long and about 1" at the center. Here they are:
posted on February 26, 2005 04:13:13 PM new
On second thought maybe they were to wear in your hair. The picture on one on them looks like ppl are wearing something similar. I sure someone will reveal what they are soon. I am only guessing.
posted on February 26, 2005 04:26:32 PM new
Thanks, Helen! It's that backslash thing I left out. I'm writing it down and putting it my desk drawer so I don't forget again! John, I think they're too heavy to wear in the hair. They're porcelain - what if they fell out? Major breakage! I do appreciate your thoughts, though.
posted on February 26, 2005 05:10:54 PM new
they could be chopstick rests,if they are ,then they are old.
place a pair of chopsticks over it and see how they fit
-sig file -------Life is one big happy 'All You Can Eat' buffet .
posted on February 26, 2005 05:15:52 PM new
My first thought was chopstick rests. But rests are normally concave and they appear curved. That's why I haven't got a clue!
There was someone here though who is excellent with the Japanese stuff. Can't remember who??? Sanmar, was it you?
posted on February 26, 2005 05:29:09 PM new
Well, I don't actually have any chopsticks. But, I just did an ebay search for chopstick rests and none of them have the holes like this on the back. My gut tells me they're something involved with wearing apparel, but of course, I'm just making that up. Maybe it is Sanmar that knows the Japanese stuff - I know somebody here does, but I just can't remember who it is. Keep the guesses coming, though, maybe we'll come up with it. You guys are great!
posted on February 26, 2005 05:39:53 PM new
You're right, Fenix! Maybe I'll have that for lunch tomorrow. We just finished dinner! I did learn to use chopsticks for the first time a couple of years ago. I took right to it, to my surprise! I expected to fling food across the restaurant - especially after a glass of sake! But I didn't. I was quite proud of myself!
posted on February 26, 2005 06:32:21 PM new
they could be netsukes with the 2 holes on the back to be used on kimono,purse or tobacco pouch.
let me know when you list them as i may bid on them
-sig file -------Life is one big happy 'All You Can Eat' buffet .
[ edited by stopwhining on Feb 26, 2005 06:32 PM ]
posted on February 26, 2005 07:07:16 PM new
I lived in San Francisco while I was going to college, and frequented Chinatown. I became quite proficient in eating with chopsticks, and it was very easy to learn. I don't use them too much anymore though. It's too big of a hassle having to take out my pocket knife to whittle the ends to a sharp point to spear the food.
A $75.00 solid state device will always blow first to protect a 25 cent fuse ~ Murphy's Law
posted on February 27, 2005 04:23:26 AM new
This is a tough one! Not chopstick rests. They'd roll right off. I don't think they'd be used in the hair. All of those I've seen are curved. Besides, porcelain would be a heavy thing to wear in the hair. But, then I look at the man in the top one. He's wearing something in his hair. A clue?
Netsuke would be my next guess, but the only ones I've ever seen are figural. Look through a magnifying glass to make sure they are hand painted. I see some "misses" and some color going outside the lines. It may be both hand painted and transfer decorated.
I looked for the mark in my book, but it wasn't there. Unfortunately, my book deals with antiques. Nothing 20th century. The funny thing about orientalia is that it's not considered a real antique unless it's 18 century or earlier. That's where the serious collectors are. If your serious collectors are smart, they stay away from eBay. There are tons of fakes out there and the only way to tell is to actually see and feel the piece.
I love them whatever they may be. Do let us know when you list.
Cheryl
"No drug, not even alcohol, causes the fundamental ills of society. If we're looking for the source of our troubles, we shouldn't test people for drugs, we should test them for stupidity, ignorance, greed and love of power." ~ P.J. O'Rourke
posted on February 27, 2005 05:37:49 AM new
They are not hair ornaments,as the picture shows 3 men conversing,not an attractive scenario for woman hair,besides how do you put them on your hair,run a thread thru the holes??
Gift giving is serious business in Japan,thats why you see most gifts presented in wooden boxes.
The back of the piece said 'nine valley made',nine valley is the artist.
-sig file -------Life is one big happy 'All You Can Eat' buffet .
posted on February 27, 2005 06:00:12 AM new
Thank you all! I was thinking they would be used the same way the netsukes are, but haven't seen anything like these either. I think they're handpainted, but I don't know how to tell if there's any transfer involved. Looking through the magnifying glass, they appear to be handpainted. Thanks for identifying the artist for me! I'll list them this week if I can figure out what to call them.
Any ideas about the silver cups and little dish and all the inscriptions on the bottom of them?
Thanks again so much! You guys are so helpful! Jenny
posted on February 27, 2005 06:14:27 AM new
as you all know "classic" is an expert on the Japanese language.I can tell you exactly what that writing says:
posted on February 27, 2005 06:16:26 AM new
the bottom said the company continues in business??
(good for them as many have gone out of business)
it is pure silver something something.
You need to show the year better,it is year 25 after??
These are wedding cups and probably used as wedding gift
-sig file -------Life is one big happy 'All You Can Eat' buffet .
posted on February 27, 2005 06:26:01 AM new
Thank you so much, Classic! I appreciate your translation! Hehe. Stop - I've taken the silly watermark out and cropped it a little. Of course, I can do a closer shot if I need to. The box these cups are in is very old. The store name was Mitsukoshi, which is embossed on the inside lining of the lid of the box. Thanks again!
posted on February 27, 2005 06:53:12 AM new
stopwhining
I know there not for the hair. I was trying to be funny. I guess it wasn't a good attempt especially for a Sunday morning. Japanese is one thing I cannot even begin to read. Chinese is a bit easier. I'm still learning, though.
Wedding cups would have been my guess. I have a set of porcelain ones from Vietnam (the silver was made in Vietnam, the porcelain was made in China). Also came with a matching ashtray. Do polish them up. From what I've been told, tarnish can ruin silver over time. They'll sell much better shined, IMO.
Cheryl
"No drug, not even alcohol, causes the fundamental ills of society. If we're looking for the source of our troubles, we shouldn't test people for drugs, we should test them for stupidity, ignorance, greed and love of power." ~ P.J. O'Rourke
posted on February 27, 2005 06:53:45 AM new
the date is TAISHO year 12.
Taisho is 1912-1926,so this is made in year 1924.
how tarnished are the pieces??
-sig file -------Life is one big happy 'All You Can Eat' buffet .
posted on February 27, 2005 07:16:35 AM new
That's great to know the year!! Thank you! Like I said before, I polished one of them lightly and not the other. They'll shine up nicely, I think. I also didn't polish the little dish thing that was with them because of the paper label. What do you think? If I polish it, it will probably come off. I don't know if it matters that much or not. Also, what do you call the dish thing and what is its purpose? At this same sale, I also got a very nice silver box with a wooden divided interior that was almost black (the silver, I mean). I liked the weight of it and thought it was good, so I bought it. When I got it home and polished the lid a little and got to looking for marks - I think it's pretty fabulous. It's marked "Silver 970" then a triangle with the letters CPO inside, then "TOYOKOKI". The wood is a dark mahogony color. Very nice.
posted on February 27, 2005 07:23:44 AM new
that paper tag is just for the dept store to write the price in.
i would not polish all the way,as most collectors or dealers want to do it their way,esp dealers in japanese antiques.
i will find out what the small dish is for later.
-sig file -------Life is one big happy 'All You Can Eat' buffet .
posted on February 27, 2005 10:41:11 AM new
Okay, thanks for the advice. I'll just polish enough so you can tell they're not damaged and not worry about that sticker. Thanks again! Jenny
